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Typical slow starts for Luongo


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#1 danjr

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 05:50 AM

We all know Luongo has pretty slow starts each year. What are your opinions on what the team should do this year. Seeing as a strong start is a must.

In my opinion I really think they should pull an even rotation for the first two weeks and then go with the hot hand.

Notice this is not a who is better thread, I love them both. Just Roberto has those brutal starts, that could put us out of the playoff picture and struggle to get back in.
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#2 nuck nit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:02 AM

Luo is now the backup and should play one in three or one in every four games.

I don't see how he could be interested in over exerting himself for a team that pushed him out and down the road.

If Luo gets hurt there is a rapidly diminishing trade market,especially if it is in the groin area.

No matter what type of nonsense Gillis perpetuates in the media ,the reality is almost the complete opposite of what he has been painting.

Edited by nuck nit, 15 January 2013 - 06:14 AM.

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#3 CanuckCup1316

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:19 AM

In a perfect world, with a condensed shortened season, we keep both goalies split duties and win the cup. Luongo's trade value triples with his name on the cup and we get max value in return. My guess is the exact opposite will actually happen.
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#4 DownUndaCanuck

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:21 AM

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Schneider has not done enough to become a full-time starter in my opinion. He played 3 games in the playoffs last season and won 1 game, sorry but that's not enough to overthrow a consistent 30-win goalie.

If Luongo is still with the Canucks when the season starts I want Schneider to have to win the starting position off him. That means, start the season as a tandem and whoever has the better starts and plays better gets to continue playing. Simple a few games at a time.

Luongo should and deserves to play the first game and the team should go from there. Take it one or two games at a time in terms of who's in net.
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#5 Baggins

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 06:45 AM

Luo is now the backup and should play one in three or one in every four games.

I don't see how he could be interested in over exerting himself for a team that pushed him out and down the road.

If Luo gets hurt there is a rapidly diminishing trade market,especially if it is in the groin area.

No matter what type of nonsense Gillis perpetuates in the media ,the reality is almost the complete opposite of what he has been painting.


....because you have his office bugged?
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#6 Nino

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:06 AM

Schneider has not done enough to become a full-time starter in my opinion. He played 3 games in the playoffs last season and won 1 game, sorry but that's not enough to overthrow a consistent 30-win goalie.

If Luongo is still with the Canucks when the season starts I want Schneider to have to win the starting position off him. That means, start the season as a tandem and whoever has the better starts and plays better gets to continue playing. Simple a few games at a time.

Luongo should and deserves to play the first game and the team should go from there. Take it one or two games at a time in terms of who's in net.


Wish they did that last year, oh they did and Cory had a much higher winning % and wine the job in the end.
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#7 one-x

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:23 AM

Based on the playoffs, it seems like Luongo's not starting anyways.
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#8 Moonshinefe

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:52 AM

Schneider has not done enough to become a full-time starter in my opinion.


Thanks for letting CDC know, we weren't sure what your opinion was.
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#9 debluvscanucks

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:53 AM

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I stick by my thinking that, as the starter, it's a much tougher gig and a guy coming in to back up a perceived floundering or struggling goaltender does so with nothing to lose. The starter is the goat (at least in Vancouver). The freedom in that means his mind is clear to simply play the game....if he loses, well, they were already losing. If they win, he's the hero. But, to face that pressure and have to come through losing streaks (everyone will encounter them at some point) with an entire city (and media) on your back is the true test. This market grinds people down here - there is no escaping it in order to clear your mind. So right now it's the honeymoon stage, but in the day to day routine, I hope people do understand that Cory will (also) lose. Lu wasn't afforded that luxury (mostly due to his paycheque).

I equally support both goaltenders but agree with Down Under...I fear the Big Yellow Taxi scenario. You can criticize Lu all you want but the fact remains that, with him as our goaltender, we've been a top team. And people are quick to forget that.
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#10 Primal Optimist

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:58 AM

I am a fan of Lu. I am a fan of the Canucks, and I am a fan of Schneider. History aside, if your going with Cory as the starter, then you play Lu 1/3 of the time. If your platooning them, which I would do to keep them both fresh and give recoup time to either one then they split games. Its not rocket science: Goaltenders are hockey players who wear a lot of pads and stop pucks. That is primary..secondary is 'assets to be considered for trades'. Use accordingly.

EDIT: I usually rant longer, but Deb said most of what I would have to say just above my post.

Edited by Primal Optimist, 15 January 2013 - 08:59 AM.

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#11 Primal Optimist

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:15 AM

In fact, if you pull up the calendar view you can see we open with back to backs...then two games mid week with a day off between em and then back to backs again.

This tells me that there is a natural 5-2 split right there for the first half month of the season, maybe even 4-3 is conceivable before a much harder to judge February kicks in. 12 games in Feb...9 and 3 if we they decide who is a starter but i would again hedge that and say closer to 7-5 keeping both fresh. There is only one back to back in Feb.

3 back to backs in a 16 game March. Only once in march are there two days off between games. This is rough for anyone with 'home, away, home, 3 away, 4 home, 3 away, 2 home and finish the month away. If we have both tenders and both are healthy and performing like we know they can I would almost guarantee 8 and 8 this month. Worst case would see 13-3 but i just don't see the logic.

April starts with the 2nd half of back to back road games and has just one more back to back set, and a 5 game road trip. a couple more games here for a backup at minimum.

Not eating your icecream because you want icecream later is just idiotic when it comes to pro sports and ice cream is a human being. So if we have 9.33 million in net this whole season we will play 9.33 million in net.

So with that, my guess is a 'backup' would play 10 games minimum, leaving 38 for a 'starter' but common sense when it comes to tied up money is to play even bonafide starter/backup splits closer to 18 and 30...and if your in like that, you may as well go a few more games deeper on the backup, whichever one it is considered to be and hit up 21-27 which gets you into platooning territory, which is where I would aim to be. Is 27 games enough to warm up for the playoffs? Yes. 16 wins is needed in the playoffs if a team is to make it to the Cup win. a 24 game warm up is enough for either one of them to do very well in the playoffs and be at peak stride. Also, by then we will have a clear picture of the stats for both. B)
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#12 Moonshinefe

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:18 AM

I stick by my thinking that, as the starter, it's a much tougher gig and a guy coming in to back up a perceived floundering or struggling goaltender does so with nothing to lose. The starter is the goat (at least in Vancouver). The freedom in that means his mind is clear to simply play the game....if he loses, well, they were already losing. If they win, he's the hero. But, to face that pressure and have to come through losing streaks (everyone will encounter them at some point) with an entire city (and media) on your back is the true test. This market grinds people down here - there is no escaping it in order to clear your mind. So right now it's the honeymoon stage, but in the day to day routine, I hope people do understand that Cory will (also) lose. Lu wasn't afforded that luxury (mostly due to his paycheque).

I equally support both goaltenders but agree with Down Under...I fear the Big Yellow Taxi scenario. You can criticize Lu all you want but the fact remains that, with him as our goaltender, we've been a top team. And people are quick to forget that.


People are going to criticize every goaltender in Vancouver, period. It isn't just poor ol' Luongo, Schneider will be too. The thing is, they aren't idiots, they knew/know that when they take the job in a Canadian city with an elite hockey club, that's what happens. They're professionals, and if they didn't want to get paid millions of dollars to play a highly scrutinized position, they would have asked for a trade to a non-contender.

Schneider has been here long enough to see how Luongo is treated, and he still wants the job, period. That being said, I doubt fans will jump all over Schneider as much as Luongo unless he has several meltdowns in the playoffs like Luongo did. That's the way it goes, if you let in 6+ goals in a bunch of games in the playoffs people get pissed.

Edited by Moonshinefe, 15 January 2013 - 09:19 AM.

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#13 elvis15

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:31 AM

....because you have his office bugged?

OMG! Did we find out the true identity of HockeyyInsiderr?

But on topic, we'll do what we always do: play the goalie that's playing best. Since there's not a defined starter at this point (Cory is the future, but Luongo's still here) they'll let them play to decide who gets the starts.

Here's hoping the team is ready to play in front of them, as that's usually a big contribution to our slow starts.

Edited by elvis15, 15 January 2013 - 09:33 AM.

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#14 smurf47

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:59 AM

I stick by my thinking that, as the starter, it's a much tougher gig and a guy coming in to back up a perceived floundering or struggling goaltender does so with nothing to lose. The starter is the goat (at least in Vancouver). The freedom in that means his mind is clear to simply play the game....if he loses, well, they were already losing. If they win, he's the hero. But, to face that pressure and have to come through losing streaks (everyone will encounter them at some point) with an entire city (and media) on your back is the true test. This market grinds people down here - there is no escaping it in order to clear your mind. So right now it's the honeymoon stage, but in the day to day routine, I hope people do understand that Cory will (also) lose. Lu wasn't afforded that luxury (mostly due to his paycheque).

I equally support both goaltenders but agree with Down Under...I fear the Big Yellow Taxi scenario. You can criticize Lu all you want but the fact remains that, with him as our goaltender, we've been a top team. And people are quick to forget that.

...I guess we can agree to disagree Deb. The starter is relaxed because he knows he has the job as #1. The backup has to come in and prove himself every game, more so when he starts. Lou has been great for the Canucks but last year was not a good year for him. His stats were way down and he was middle of the pack on a first placed team. The difference in stats between our 2 goalies is enormous and yet both played under similar circumstances. Your starter, Lou, got pulled once every 10 games, a disturbing stat. I;ve said it before, any NHL goalie with a SP of over .900 could have played goal for Canucks and had his stats improve. Lou was tied for 12th and was 16th in SP and GAA....hardly stellar on a team like the Canucks. Schneider was top 4 in both categories.The defense rests !
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#15 cmpunk

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:20 PM

People are going to criticize every goaltender in Vancouver, period. It isn't just poor ol' Luongo, Schneider will be too. The thing is, they aren't idiots, they knew/know that when they take the job in a Canadian city with an elite hockey club, that's what happens. They're professionals, and if they didn't want to get paid millions of dollars to play a highly scrutinized position, they would have asked for a trade to a non-contender.

Schneider has been here long enough to see how Luongo is treated, and he still wants the job, period. That being said, I doubt fans will jump all over Schneider as much as Luongo unless he has several meltdowns in the playoffs like Luongo did. That's the way it goes, if you let in 6+ goals in a bunch of games in the playoffs people get pissed.


What hockey player is going to say, no I don't want to play here because of the fans?! Get real
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#16 Riviera82

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:38 PM

In a perfect world, with a condensed shortened season, we keep both goalies split duties and win the cup. Luongo's trade value triples with his name on the cup and we get max value in return. My guess is the exact opposite will actually happen.


Do you really think Luongo's value will increase 3x if he wins a cup sitting on the bench?
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#17 Ugli Fruit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:51 PM

CDC is not the place for hockey talk. A large part of people's opinions here are either warped by the media or simply the media.

How does Luongo have brutal starts in October? This was suggested by the media. He is at his best in January and December, I agree, but does that mean this team dies or lives by his hand? Is our offense and defense just that bad?

It's way more logical to conclude that the team is shabby early in the season in general. I'm not talking about wins and losses, I'm talking about each player contributing. The forwards don't play well early on either.

You thrust on Luongo all the responsibilities of a goaltender (which is probably worse than being captain) and then give him the breathing room of a 4th liner expected to score 25 goals.

Defense doesn't win games, that's just a cliche saying. Offense does. And if our team only can score to their potential during January and Decemeber, what's the point of addressing everything but that?
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There we have it folks, we have literally blamed everyone for everything at this point


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#18 sharnhayre

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:53 PM

Put Lu in rotation every 3rd game. The Canucks are basically playing every other night, it will help keep both Lu and Schneider fresh.
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#19 Ugli Fruit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 02:57 PM

Do you really think Luongo's value will increase 3x if he wins a cup sitting on the bench?


His value can only fluctuate. As you may have forgotten, he managed to get to 1 win from the finals (with 1.14gpg over 7), posted at least 31 wins since 05-06, took over the starter job from Brodeur and won Gold, and showed he has the passion and willingness to win that he didn't even utter a single whiny phrase as his career was shipwrecked by a bunch of dimwit fans and a goaltender who played about a tenth of Luongo's caps.

The only thing a Cup would do is show the world how dumb we were to ship him out, because he sure won't win one here.
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There we have it folks, we have literally blamed everyone for everything at this point


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#20 Noheart

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:40 PM

When I got to the bottom of this thread I felt like I accomplished something because I didn't barf.

Why is it that some people can say Kassian is ready to play with the Sedins and Schroeder can take Keslers spot.

Yet a Goaltender that we drafted 10 years ago that has gone through all the right steps and performed superbly doing so is not ready to be a starter

This is exactly what these same people criticize AV about

Playing favorites or Romerisium

Not that I really care what you people think I just find it comical.
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#21 oldnews

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:44 PM

When I got to the bottom of this thread I felt like I accomplished something because I didn't barf.

Why is it that some people can say Kassian is ready to play with the Sedins and Schroeder can take Keslers spot.

Yet a Goaltender that we drafted 10 years ago that has gone through all the right steps and performed superbly doing so is not ready to be a starter

Not that I really care what you people think I just find it comical.


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#22 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:50 PM

When I got to the bottom of this thread I felt like I accomplished something because I didn't barf.

Why is it that some people can say Kassian is ready to play with the Sedins and Schroeder can take Keslers spot.

Yet a Goaltender that we drafted 10 years ago that has gone through all the right steps and performed superbly doing so is not ready to be a starter

This is exactly what these same people criticize AV about

Playing favorites or Romerisium

Not that I really care what you people think I just find it comical.



This, Schneiders more then ready to take the starting job, I don't understand how he can prove anything more? The only way he can is if he gets to be the starter...

Edited by TheGame., 15 January 2013 - 03:51 PM.

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#23 Ugli Fruit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:54 PM

This, Schneiders more then ready to take the starting job, I don't understand how he can prove anything more? The only way he can is if he gets to be the starter...



When I got to the bottom of this thread I felt like I accomplished something because I didn't barf.

Why is it that some people can say Kassian is ready to play with the Sedins and Schroeder can take Keslers spot.

Yet a Goaltender that we drafted 10 years ago that has gone through all the right steps and performed superbly doing so is not ready to be a starter

This is exactly what these same people criticize AV about

Playing favorites or Romerisium

Not that I really care what you people think I just find it comical.


Are you suggesting that the responsibility for a forward is the same for a goaltender? Surely CDC of all people must know this. Oh, what am I saying, CDC may be the only place in the world that does not know the pressure of being a goaltender, especially in a city where playing well actually means playing badly.
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There we have it folks, we have literally blamed everyone for everything at this point


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#24 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:58 PM

Are you suggesting that the responsibility for a forward is the same for a goaltender? Surely CDC of all people must know this. Oh, what am I saying, CDC may be the only place in the world that does not know the pressure of being a goaltender, especially in a city where playing well actually means playing badly.


No, but how is Schneider ever supposed to become a starter if we just keep saying he's not proven, when he's proven that he is ready. Atleast AV and Gillis think he's ready....

Schroeder hasn't played an NHL game yet and people think he can become the 2nd line center, atleast Schneider played in the
NHL and he played better then Lu last year in the regular season AND the playoffs.

The only real knock I have against Lu is his mental toughness in the playoffs, something that Schneiders shown he can handle better so far.
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#25 nuck nit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:05 PM

One NHL playoff game for the Schneids.

32W 27L 59 NHL playoff games played for Luo.

Schneider $4 million
Luo $5.3 m

Edited by nuck nit, 15 January 2013 - 04:07 PM.

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#26 CanuckCup1316

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:07 PM

Do you really think Luongo's value will increase 3x if he wins a cup sitting on the bench?


I suppose you didnt see that I wrote that the goalies would split duties. I also said that Luongo's name on the cup would triple his value. You dont get your name on the cup if you sit on the bench.
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#27 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:12 PM

One NHL playoff game for the Schneids.

32W 27L 59 NHL playoff games played for Luo.

Schneider $4 million
Luo $5.3 m


If they were close to the same age I would keep Lu no doubt, but Schneids is a lot younger and has room to get even better.
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#28 Noheart

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:13 PM

Are you suggesting that the responsibility for a forward is the same for a goaltender? Surely CDC of all people must know this. Oh, what am I saying, CDC may be the only place in the world that does not know the pressure of being a goaltender, especially in a city where playing well actually means playing badly.


What is wrong with you man!

I am using that as an example of Romerisium. The guy has taken all of the steps to become an NHL starter one cannot argue that.

Do people really not recognize the odds Cory has overcome to even be in this discussion?

Did anyone on CDC think we would be having this conversation 4 years ago?

If you prefer Luongo that is fine, you are entitled to your own opinion. Just don't try to convince me, yourself or anyone on CDC that the man is not a starter


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#29 nuck nit

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:19 PM

If they were close to the same age I would keep Lu no doubt, but Schneids is a lot younger and has room to get even better.


I see your point.
If this team were healthy with Kes and with a healthy Booth and Kassian ready to step up and play big minutes protecting the likes of Mason Raymond and the Twins I would keep Luo for this year.
As GM knowing that Kes was hurt last year -since February-I would have quietly gone to Luo and told him I needed to trade him,ask him to give me a short list of teams he was willing to go to and in general get his feelings on the issue of leaving.
If Luo did not want to leave I would have ended it right there and honored the contract I gave him.
I would not have pushed him out using the media,something MG seems to be quite happy doing.
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#30 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 04:27 PM

I see your point.
If this team were healthy with Kes and with a healthy Booth and Kassian ready to step up and play big minutes protecting the likes of Mason Raymond and the Twins I would keep Luo for this year.
As GM knowing that Kes was hurt last year -since February-I would have quietly gone to Luo and told him I needed to trade him,ask him to give me a short list of teams he was willing to go to and in general get his feelings on the issue of leaving.
If Luo did not want to leave I would have ended it right there and honored the contract I gave him.
I would not have pushed him out using the media,something MG seems to be quite happy doing.


Yeah true, I didn't like how he handled the Hodgson situation either.
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