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More Kesler AV controversy?

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#31 Kesler's Nose

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:10 PM

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Haha This. **
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"It's an opportunity, we don't look at it as a last chance... We look at it as an opportunity to do something great. We are going to take it period by period, shift by shift. You just have to be better than the guy across from you... Every guy in this locker room I can say believes we can do this." - Ryan Kesler

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#32 NuxFan09

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:11 PM

Coach says player is medically cleared and ready to go. Player says it's just a step and there's no timeline. Pretty cut and dry that there's a contradiction there. There may be no controversy and if there isn't, cut the BS already. That's the way I feel.
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#33 Aladeen

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:16 PM

What people are finally realizing that AV has lost the room and players have lost respect for AV.
Keslers and other know they need a coach with offensive ideas and why AV needs togo.
They've already devolped the offense as far as they can on their own.

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#34 DooBie604

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:20 PM

Coach says player is medically cleared and ready to go. Player says it's just a step and there's no timeline. Pretty cut and dry that there's a contradiction there. There may be no controversy and if there isn't, cut the BS already. That's the way I feel.


Or coach states a fact that he is medically cleared to play and has yet to tell the player when he wants him back in the line-up so player says there is no timeline yet. That's my take on it. But everyone sees things differently.
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#35 NuxFan09

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:24 PM

To sum up, I think controversy is the wrong terminology. There is no big dramatic controversy going on in the Canucks' lockerroom between AV and Kesler. However, the coach and Kesler have consistently contradicted - aka more than once - eachother regarding Kesler's health status, which suggests that there is something going on. If there wasn't, the two would have gotten themselves on the same page and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Fair?
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#36 NuxFan09

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:28 PM

Or coach states a fact that he is medically cleared to play and has yet to tell the player when he wants him back in the line-up so player says there is no timeline yet. That's my take on it. But everyone sees things differently.


Again, both have been on the ice together for practices multiple times already and AV has already stated previously that Kesler is medically cleared and that he believes Kesler is ready to play. I am simply not naive enough to think there have been zero opportunities for the two to get on the same page.

I mean, come on, THINK about it for a second.

Again, I am not one to try to stir up a controversy that doesn't exist. I just get frustrated with other fans that try to claim there is nothing going on when at least people like me are using quotes, facts and logic to back up what we say.

Edited by NuxFan09, 14 February 2013 - 03:31 PM.

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#37 Mr. Ramsay

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:32 PM

When AV says that's he's ready to go and Kesler says he's not and that it's a small step, clearly, both sides have different points of views. AV thinks and feels that Kes is ready to go which is why he's saying it. That's his belief. Kesler, wants to take more time to make sure he's 110% because from years past, he's rushed his rehab and look what happened. I'm sure Kesler wants to play it safe now and knowing that the team is 8-2-2, he can take more time coming back, getting more practices in with the guys, and then he'll finally say he's ready to go.

It's mis-communication. Just because the coach thinks he's good to go doesn't mean that the player is actually ready to play.
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#38 tottenhamninja

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:36 PM

Can't believe I waisted 4 minutes readin this idiocy..
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#39 oldnews

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:38 PM

I like Kesler, but he is still working on taking criticism - last year when AV suggested that he could use his linemates a little better, it was a fair enough comment imo. I think Kesler is also a headstrong guy and that attribute has very positive aspects (ie his drive and competitiveness) but sometimes not always so constructive.
In either event, I look at these a hiccups - I think both Kesler and AV are pretty reasonable in the end, and probably rethink things a little and let go of them.
I don't see much of a controversy here - but I also don't see Provost as the type of poster who attempts to stir any up - just an opinion/concern expressed here that we'll all infer different levels of meaning from.
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#40 SEAN HARNETT

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:40 PM

There very well could be a rift between coach and player here, but that doesn't necessarly mean Kesler wants out or the team wants to trade him. I'm sure Kesler loves being a Canuck, but maybe he isnt 100 % happy with the coach and management.
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#41 BuretoMogilny

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:41 PM

What people are finally realizing that AV has lost the room and players have lost respect for AV.
Keslers and other know they need a coach with offensive ideas and why AV needs togo.
They've already devolped the offense as far as they can on their own.


Yes that's why they are honing his system to a "T", they are 1st in the league in goals against, and 3rd overall in their conference. Yes they have tuned him out...

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#42 MJDDawg

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:43 PM

What I don't understand is why AV, a veteran coach in this league, in talking about a core player and one of the leaders of his team, would say anything other than something like..."Kes has been medically cleared to play by our doctors, and when he's 100% comfortable with the strength of the shoulder and feels he's ready to play, he'll be in the lineup."

Kes has earned the right to determine on his own timeline when he thinks he's ready. I mean we're not talking about a loafer here...we're talking about a guy who came back way too soon last season and paid the price again...a guy who during our cup run told the trainers to cut off his finger so he could get back on the ice.

Why AV would create a perception, intentionally or not, that they are not on the same page boggles my mind.
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#43 kilgore

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:43 PM

If this hasn't happened before this wouldn't be much of a controversy.

But it has.
AV publicly questioning Willie Mitchell being ready to play in 2008
AV publicly questioning Cody Hodgson being ready to play in 2009

Both of these players were then turfed out of town. We all know which side of the hammer Gillis comes down on when a player dares to contradict their coach in the media.

Now I'd be shocked if it resulted in a trade but it doesn't help in AV and Ryan's relationship. From history we can see that AV is an Olympian grudge holder and handles these things like a 4 year old whose candy is taken away. As he said in a recent scrum about his players "they know my moods".
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#44 DeNiro

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:43 PM

Really?

Gallagher? Botchford? Pratt?

Is that you? Trying to find something that isn't there again?

Edited by DeNiro, 14 February 2013 - 03:44 PM.

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#45 Aladeen

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:44 PM

Again, both have been on the ice together for practices multiple times already and AV has already stated previously that Kesler is medically cleared and that he believes Kesler is ready to play. I am simply not naive enough to think there have been zero opportunities for the two to get on the same page.

I mean, come on, THINK about it for a second.

Again, I am not one to try to stir up a controversy that doesn't exist. I just get frustrated with other fans that try to claim there is nothing going on when at least people like me are using quotes, facts and logic to back up what we say.

And you know what else is frustrating? Other fans jumping to conclusions that there are rifts and conflict in dressing rooms due to a couple of press releases, or sports columnists opinions they are force fed, that they read. You are not in the dressing room, you are not privy to player meetings and team meetings. You are not a psychic, you are not friends with any of the parties and thus have inside information... please correct me if I am wrong and you are infact one of those things.

My hallucination is that you have zero basis for your theory, therefore its not a theory it is just a gut feeling... nothing more.
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#46 CanucksJay

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:45 PM

I'm sick and tired of AV being in the middle of controversies.
He's the fricking coach but he's too busy hamming it up in front of the cameras and not caring about his players.

A coach should be the one to put out the fires and stick up for their players and their well being.

I'm ok with coaches sometimes calling out players for bad play but what I CAN'T stand is the unnecessary conflicts like suggesting

1) Hodgson was using the injury as an excuse for his poor play. How about rushing Mitchell back from injury

2)Trying to rush Willie Mitchell back from injury

Medical reports suggested that Mitchell’s injury couldn’t get any worse from playing, which lead head coach Alain Vigneault to suggest that Mitchell would be back sooner than later.

"He [Vigneault] wants me in the lineup," Mitchell said following Tuesday’s skate at the Pacific Coliseum. "He's a coach. He doesn't know how I feel, he doesn't feel my pain, he doesn't feel those things.But at the end of the day he knows if I'm out on the ice I'm going to help the team win, so he wants me out there.

3) Trying to rush Kesler back before he is ready

These kinds of actions results in the trust between player and coach being broken. Why would a player do what he's told when he knows the coach does not care

AVs actions can be seen as being cancerous to team chemistry.

If after all of these examples, AV was still a brilliant hockey coach, I might just ignore the other issues but problem is, he also gets outcoached in the playoffs.

I really think this season should be his last chance.
I'd rather AV go then Kesler if it came down to it
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#47 BuretoMogilny

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:45 PM

I like Kesler, but he is still working on taking criticism - last year when AV suggested that he could use his linemates a little better, it was a fair enough comment imo. I think Kesler is also a headstrong guy and that attribute has very positive aspects (ie his drive and competitiveness) but sometimes not always so constructive.
In either event, I look at these a hiccups - I think both Kesler and AV are pretty reasonable in the end, and probably rethink things a little and let go of them.
I don't see much of a controversy here - but I also don't see Provost as the type of poster who attempts to stir any up - just an opinion/concern expressed here that we'll all infer different levels of meaning from.


He needs to mature. Part of becoming the best at your vocation is being able to take criticism and to improve from it. Kesler is a 41 goal scoring selke winner. AV see's a guy who has the ability to influence a game like a poor man's Messier if he can start using his linemates better, cut the diving/whining and elevate his play from 2nd line to a legitimate 1st liner.

AV is also not stupid, he knows he will NEED that out of Kes in 3-4 years when Hank slows down, so start getting him to focus on developing into a 1st line guy NOW.

Kes is headstrong, arrogant, and cocky. Part of this makes him a terrific hockey player and tough to play against, the other part is immature and holds him back.

AV knows what he's doing, Kes just needs to understand it and grow up. If he does, AV will turn him into a true beast.
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#48 CanucksJay

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:48 PM

What I don't understand is why AV, a veteran coach in this league, in talking about a core player and one of the leaders of his team, would say anything other than something like..."Kes has been medically cleared to play by our doctors, and when he's 100% comfortable with the strength of the shoulder and feels he's ready to play, he'll be in the lineup."

Kes has earned the right to determine on his own timeline when he thinks he's ready. I mean we're not talking about a loafer here...we're talking about a guy who came back way too soon last season and paid the price again...a guy who during our cup run told the trainers to cut off his finger so he could get back on the ice.

Why AV would create a perception, intentionally or not, that they are not on the same page boggles my mind.


That's the exact issue I have. it's almost like he sadistically enjoys drama and being in the middle of this crap.

There are so many better ways to say things that would eliminate ANY controversy but it's like he picks the absolute worst things to say to be in the spot light
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#49 Kulikov

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:53 PM

There's quite obviously some issues between Kes and AV. Kes was my favorite player for years, but I hate the way he's acted since winning the Selkie. AV was right on the money to call him out about not using his teammates, all he did last year was hog the puck and take that stupid wrister 25 times a game.

Still love the guy, but not sure what happened to the Kesler that was the heart and soul of the Canucks. We need that guy back.
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#50 DooBie604

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:03 PM

Again, both have been on the ice together for practices multiple times already and AV has already stated previously that Kesler is medically cleared and that he believes Kesler is ready to play. I am simply not naive enough to think there have been zero opportunities for the two to get on the same page.

I mean, come on, THINK about it for a second.

Again, I am not one to try to stir up a controversy that doesn't exist. I just get frustrated with other fans that try to claim there is nothing going on when at least people like me are using quotes, facts and logic to back up what we say.


I'm not trying to pick on you by quoting you nor did I ever say there was never a rift between the two. I'm just saying that this time I don't think there is anything wrong with what was said. I just seems like AV stated a fact that Kes was medically cleared to play and Kes has yet to receive confirmation from the coach that he is playing. It would be worse if Kes said he was cleared and going to to play soon before even getting confirmation from his coach.

I mean there have been times where my coach has said to someone coming back from an injury "how about we decide how you feel when we get closer to the game". For Kes to say he is playing would seem pretentious even if he was cleared to play.

I don't think you have said anything wrong but you read into it one way and I read into it another. A difference of opinion.

Edited by DooBie604, 14 February 2013 - 04:07 PM.

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#51 Aladeen

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:05 PM

I'm sick and tired of CanucksJay being in the middle of threads of controversies.
He's a frickin Canucks fan but he's too busy bitching and whining on the boards and not caring about his fellow poster.

A fan should be the one to not start the fires and stick up for all Canucks and their well being.

I'm ok with Fans sometimes calling out Coaches for a bad game but what I CAN'T stand is the unnecessary bitching and whining like suggesting

1) Hodgson matters in this scenario in the slightest. How about rushing Mitchell back from injury

2)Trying to tie in Willie Mitchell coming back from injury somehow

Medical reports suggested that Mitchell’s injury couldn’t get any worse from playing, which lead head coach Alain Vigneault to suggest that Mitchell would be back sooner than later.

"He [Vigneault] wants me in the lineup," Mitchell said following Tuesday’s skate at the Pacific Coliseum. "He's a coach. He doesn't know how I feel, he doesn't feel my pain, he doesn't feel those things.But at the end of the day he knows if I'm out on the ice I'm going to help the team win, so he wants me out there.

3) Trying to rush Kesler back before he is ready is sort of like using the topic to add to a list of points that aren't relevant to make it seem like an opinion has some merit.

These kinds of actions results in the trust between Poster and the reader being broken. Why would CanuckJay make this post when he knows that everybody does not care

CanuckJay's actions can be seen as being cancerous to logic and reason.

If after all of these examples, CanuckJay was still a brilliant post writer, I might just ignore the other issues but problem is, he also writes crappy posts in the playoffs.

I really think this thread should be his last chance.
I'd rather CanuckJay go then King of ES if it came down to it

Fixed it for you man, you're welcome.
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#52 Vancanwincup

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:12 PM

So, what the hell is the point of this post?
Only thing I care about is Kesler is close to returning.
So what if Kes and AV have contradicted each other to the media.
Is the point of this post to suggest that the fans should not be surprised to see a trade involving Kesler!
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#53 Kassian's Face

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:20 PM

The only controversy in this thread is how long will it be till Aladeen is banned. Obviously he is either a King of BS dupe account or just a King of BS fanboy. Either way, its all bad.
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#54 debluvscanucks

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:22 PM

We only allow one controversy at a time on this site.

(Plus, the Kesler thread is already in progress)
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