Time to End the Bash Jake Comments

[Mackcanuck]

6 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

 

Isnt that pretty much what Virtanen said though?

 

I think what Benning is saying is, The time line is when you make me have to call you back up by tearing up the AHL!

This is a prime example of why 1st round draft picks and only the 1st rounders from the CHL should be eligible for the AHL.

Putting them back in Junior impedes their development and playing in the NHL impedes their development 

[Kokanee king]

vrt is plus 1 for the season! i think the people bashing him are just idiots!!!!!!!!!!! plus Willy Shakes is just bad for him 

\

Erik Gudbranson - 12

Ben Hutton - 11

Brandon Sutter -11

Markus Granlund -10

Loui Eriksson -10

Alexander Edler -8

Philip Larsen - 8

[wallstreetamigo]

2 minutes ago, Mackcanuck said:

 

I think what Benning is saying is, The time line is when you make me have to call you back up by tearing up the AHL!

 

I get that part. I just thought Virtanen said that he was down there to play and practice lots etc. The part where Bennings says he told Virtanen what to say to the press. It sounds like pretty much what Virtanen had said is what I meant.

[ice orca]

Sound's like Benning has had enough of this kid's attitude and antics if he said he wasn't sure if he should take Virtanen's phone call.

[guntrix]

I think the biggest issue in this thread is the general misconception that those who think Jake isn't going to succeed want him to fail. That's not the case nor has it ever been the case. 

 

25 minutes ago, chickenman92 said:

Anyone wondering if Prust is to blame?

 

I mean, I talked to Jake a few times when he was in Calgary, and Hitmen staff about him and he always came across as a likable, hard working, honest guy. 

 

Last year he seemed to spend a lot of time in camp with Prust, who in my opinion, has grown a bit too big for hid britches and has gotten too cool for school in the past 3-4 years - honestly hockey doesn't seem to be Prust's top priority. 

 

Now Jake seems to kind of come across as a bit arrogant or Prust-like. 

Do you have a source for this or is it pure apologetics for Jake?

 

We might as well add this to CDC's favourite shoulder excuse.

[komodo0921]

41 minutes ago, Mackcanuck said:

 

Bennings response

 said Benning. “Jake has a good heart, but he’s a young player and sometimes a little naive. I told him not to worry about it, but now when guys ask you the plan, here it is: ‘You’re there to practise and play hard a lot in games and keep improving and there’s no timeline as to when you’re going to be up.’

“Every player’s path to the NHL is different. We want to do what’s best for Jake’s development because he’s an important guy for us. He understands that and I think we’re all on the same page. We’re going to be patient with him.”

So, what you're really saying is?

[Mackcanuck]

30 minutes ago, Mackcanuck said:

 

I think what Benning is saying is, The time line is when you make me have to call you back up by tearing up the AHL!

This is a prime example of why 1st round draft picks and only the 1st rounders from the CHL should be eligible for the AHL.

Putting them back in Junior impedes their development and playing in the NHL impedes their development 

 

Jake even said it himself, that he should have been in the AHL last season, but the stupid CHL rules hinder the development of 1st rounders by not allowing them to go to the AHL

 

Jake said.

"Playing 20 minutes a night almost is pretty nice," he said. "You’ve got to get that feeling back from junior, that’s what I’m trying to build off. I was playing all the time in junior and I want to come down here and play lots of minutes and get that confidence." 

Virtanen admitted his game likely would've benefitted from a season in the AHL prior to making the jump to the NHL. However, as a 19-year-old last season the Canucks had just two options: either return him to Calgary or keep him with the NHL club.

"For the development, I bet you Vancouver would’ve wanted me come down here for a year, just for the experience," Virtanen said.  "But with the whole 20-year-old thing, they had to send me here this year. Obviously my goal is to get back to Vancouver as quick as possible and that’s what I want to do." 

[komodo0921]

4 minutes ago, Mackcanuck said:

 

Jake even said it himself, that he should have been in the AHL last season, but the stupid CHL rules hinder the development of 1st rounders by not allowing them to go to the AHL

 

Jake said.

"Playing 20 minutes a night almost is pretty nice," he said. "You’ve got to get that feeling back from junior, that’s what I’m trying to build off. I was playing all the time in junior and I want to come down here and play lots of minutes and get that confidence." 

Virtanen admitted his game likely would've benefitted from a season in the AHL prior to making the jump to the NHL. However, as a 19-year-old last season the Canucks had just two options: either return him to Calgary or keep him with the NHL club.

"For the development, I bet you Vancouver would’ve wanted me come down here for a year, just for the experience," Virtanen said.  "But with the whole 20-year-old thing, they had to send me here this year. Obviously my goal is to get back to Vancouver as quick as possible and that’s what I want to do." 

As a GM, JB still needs to do what's best for his prospect's development. He should've been sent back to Junior where he gets to play big minutes on a top line for one more year. No one may like it but better to put him in a successful situation than to set him up to fail. I only hope a lesson is learned here for the future. 

[Nucker 67]

JB has confirmed he will not trade Virtanen. I know BUF has been scouting Utica, but wouldn't that be funny if they were there to watch Subban and Pedan.

 

Jake needs to focus on Utica and getting better, not worrying about the opportunities Nylander etc are getting. He could be a great player in a few years, nice that the Canucks have a Virtanen card in their back pocket.  

[Mattrek]

All sides carry blame for Virtanen. It's not just one or the other. It was a confluence of factors that ended up with what we have now.

 

Management shouldn't have rushed his development. Power forwards take much much longer to develop then the average player  and Benning should have realized this. I'm a big Benning fan, but this was a mistake. He should have stayed with the Calgary Hitmen playing top line minutes continuing to tweak his game then spend a year or two in the AHL before the NHL. Having him being passed back and forth between Utica and Vancouver was also mishandled. There is no point in having Virtanen on the team unless he was playing the minutes needed to develop. They took way too long to send him down for good.

 

After the decision was made to bring him up here the situation was made worse by Willie and his decisions. A power forward if brought into the NHL can't develop having an average of 10 minutes on the ice each game and every mistake Virtanen made seemed to get him stapled to the bench. This predictably resulted in a loss of confidence and timidity on the ice for fear of screwing up. He needed a long leash to be able to have a chance at success and he didn't. The "get his stuff" comment was also a dumb head scratching comment.

 

Virtanen himself also made the situation more complicated by his multiple comments. Even if you are stapled to the bench or not getting enough time you're supposed to bring this up privately with the coach. That's how things change. Talking to the media has no point and causes an unnecessary headache for the team you're apart of.

 

The media has also undoubtedly blown this way out of proportion. Asking probing questions you know a young top draft prospect might mess up by answering is taking advantage. In a hockey obsessed city they can turn a mole hill into a mountain as we've seen time and time again.

 

There wasn't any silver bullet from any parties involved that caused this mess. Jake is now finally where he needs to be so he can develop properly. The route he took to reach his proper place was mishandled by all involved.

 

Now he can concentrate on only hockey and develop into the stud of a player we know he can be.

[The Bookie]

Am I the only one who finds #stuffgate hilarious?

 

Like, I get that for people who already have a beef with Willie and want him fired this is a great chance to yell out "Willie. He's playing head games with our prospects. So sad!" but, otherwise, c'mon - "He needs his stuff. Y'know, his stuff!" is comedy gold.

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, The Bookie said:

Am I the only one who finds #stuffgate hilarious?

 

Like, I get that for people who already have a beef with Willie and want him fired this is a great chance to yell out "Willie. He's playing head games with our prospects. So sad!" but, otherwise, c'mon - "He needs his stuff. Y'know, his stuff!" is comedy gold.

 

I don't think he was trying to play head games. I just think he had a total brain fart moment and didn't know what to say.

[alfstonker]

23 hours ago, dpn1 said:

Even if you think he didn't handle things well, what do you expect from a 20 year old kid.  Not everyone matures as quick as Bo did.

 

Many 20 year old "kids" are putting their life on the line in some godless desert somewhere, are married with kids or are holding down responsible jobs. He needs to grow up and people like you making excuses for him are the last thing he needs.

 

If he is SO immature he is not ready to play in the NHL.

 

As long as people resolve him of responsibility for HIS EFFORT, he will continue to give reporters the kind of drivel he is quoted as saying on the other thread and further affect/delay his chances of success.

[alfstonker]

7 hours ago, Kokanee king said:

vrt is plus 1 for the season! i think the people bashing him are just idiots!!!!!!!!!!! plus Willy Shakes is just bad for him 

\

Erik Gudbranson - 12

Ben Hutton - 11

Brandon Sutter -11

Markus Granlund -10

Loui Eriksson -10

Alexander Edler -8

Philip Larsen - 8

 

Did that look good in your mind?

[wallstreetamigo]

7 minutes ago, alfstonker said:

 

Many 20 year old "kids" are putting their life on the line in some godless desert somewhere, are married with kids or are holding down responsible jobs. He needs to grow up and people like you making excuses for him are the last thing he needs.

 

If he is SO immature he is not ready to play in the NHL.

 

As long as people resolve him of responsibility for HIS EFFORT, he will continue to give reporters the kind of drivel he is quoted as saying on the other thread and further affect/delay his chances of success.

 

There is no difference between giving him a free pass and endlessly slagging on him about it though too.

 

Both sides need to just give him a chance to show that the message has been received.

[alfstonker]

21 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

Coach Green will help him find his game.

 

Well if he is that good can you tell him to help Cassels and fix Suban's defence so we can get them up here?

[alfstonker]

3 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

 

There is no difference between giving him a free pass and endlessly slagging on him about it though too.

 

Both sides need to just give him a chance to show that the message has been received.

 

He is actually bringing it on himself though by trying to embarrass management and the coach. No one including myself did anything to cause him to lack fitness or indeed perform in such a lazy fashion.

 

There are no "both sides" here imo. There is Jake and the Club and they are on the same side and the sooner Jake realises that the better. Personally I would rather not read anything about him and just look forward to the player we all thought he could be coming up fresh and ready to go.

[Alflives]

9 minutes ago, alfstonker said:

 

Well if he is that good can you tell him to help Cassels and fix Suban's defence so we can get them up here?

Green can start by helping the kid eat a healthy diet.  Was it Hansen last season who made a comment about Jake's eating habits?  

[Team Bagues]

23 hours ago, canuck2288 said:

Wrong

 

Jake didn't handle himself well 

 

I hope he turns it around for himself but I for one am not impressed with him at this point 

 

 

Agreed. It is hard to know the whole story given how the media likes to make a mountain of a mole hill, but the way that he is being reported and what he is reported to have been saying do not shed a favorable light on him.

No offense to city folk, but he seems to be a big town kid with a big town attitude; or he's just a teenager and a millennial, two things working against him that he'll have to figure out if he wants to stick and be successful in the show.

[Team Bagues]

23 hours ago, SILLY GOOSE said:

And I wouldnt say management and coaching havn't handled him well.  OK so they didn't babysit him or try to favor him anymore than anyone else, pretty normal if you ask me.  It's kind of nuts to think a young developing player like him, who has been praised NUMEROUS times by both the coach and management hasn't been given proper direction.  So he's not quite ready for the NHL yet, no biggie.  AHL under Green is excellent for his development.

Agreed, he was given a chance and he was not ready.

Fair enough.

Jake even mentioned in the interview that his age was working against him, in that he could not be sent straight to Utica.

No big deal, he played in the show for a year (instead of going back to junior, which makes a lot of guys look real good) when he should have been in the A, now he's in the A and can develop, figure things out then come up and contribute with the big club.