iceman64 Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 On 4/30/2017 at 11:00 AM, TheGuardian_ said: So much disappointment over the lottery. The team slips to number 5. The odds have been shifted, tanking is not as assured. The league, while this system could allow for easier manipulation, probably doesn't need to now and will change the odds for next year again, this seems to be a work in progress. In the last three years, three different draft systems/odds. You have to understand that it wasn't the bottom teams that wanted the lottery changed, it wasn't even because of Edmonton's prowess in collecting #1's. It was because of McDavid, Eichel, Mathews and the others in those two draft years. Top "losing" teams wanted a better chance at those players and they wanted to make sure past practices of doing "what's best for the franchise moving forward" didn't occur as often and as transparently as it had become. To the point where team's were openly stating they were going after high draft spots early in the season. They couldn't change the rules just for those drafts so they now have a system that doesn't help the bottom teams out of the basement as quickly meaning teams will have to be very active in trading and using each team's strengths for improvement. The lottery, the Canucks got 5th again, it should not have been unexpected or surprising, the top three selections were all diminished by 10% due to Vegas's entry into the draft while the rest had improved odds, it remains to be seen how much the system is altered now that this draft is done. In this draft the top two suggested prospects would be the equivalent of #'5 to 8 in last two year's drafts, a good chance that Tkachuk would have been 1rst overall if he was in this year. So now there is the expansion draft to come and the wheeling and dealing that could create, the pick is an asset to some teams needing cap room, just being a number five overall in the first round can be sold in some markets. This wasn't the year to get the number 1 overall, 2019 will be, a couple of 15 year olds have been "noticed" This is a year when draft picks should be packaged and traded for past high draft picks of the last two years not yet in the NHL. What and who do you think the Canucks will do? Another "safe" pick like a dman, they can always take years to develop so judging how good the pick was is postponed, a forward? most first rounder's can at least be on the bottom three but that is not the need, so risky if sold wrong, Size? watch the playoffs, no whistles, big is good, big and fast, better. Or package the pick for a player like Dylan Strome, Jesse Puljujarvi, Josh Ho-sang, Tyson Jost, Alexander Nylander, you get the idea, there are prospects with a high pedigree that may be made available if the right offer made or offered enough. I dare say that those mentioned would/could all be "upgrades". We can always pick up dmen in trades so why not get the biggest physical centermen who has skill and solve 2 issues in one shot.. toughness and scoring... strange idea hey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 I feel like the Canucks have a decently strong cupboard add say Drouin and E Kane to the line up which wouldn't be inconceivable. Virtanen matures into a man. Juolevi transitions to the NHL smoothly. Tryamkin doesn't bolt to mama's home cooking KHL. If some things just went right we could maybe see the Canucks winning a playoff round in 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted May 22, 2017 Author Share Posted May 22, 2017 12 hours ago, hammertime said: I feel like the Canucks have a decently strong cupboard add say Drouin and E Kane to the line up which wouldn't be inconceivable. Virtanen matures into a man. Juolevi transitions to the NHL smoothly. Tryamkin doesn't bolt to mama's home cooking KHL. If some things just went right we could maybe see the Canucks winning a playoff round in 2020 With regards to Drouin and Kane, to quote your avatar, "don't touch that" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 On 5/18/2017 at 7:28 PM, canucksnihilist said: Well, besides your ad hominum itch against the generic idiot poster, I agree with your points. Remember the idiots run the world, so we have to placate them to some extent... The point I want to talk about is the trading of the D mentioned. Certainly there is nobody to replace them right now, is that what you mean? And given the fact that a D will take a few years to get into the game, we would be left with a completely inept defense for a few years? And how can we develop forwards properly without a decent defense? On the other side of the coin - as by definition coins have 2 sides - in all likelihood those 2 won't be around in peak form the next time the team is competing for a cup - or probably not anyways. So I think the desire is to get something for them while their value is high. Perhaps this isn't the time to do it, but it does seem like a decent idea, if we have the personnel to fit in and still enable the defense to be adequate enough to support a proper development path for the rest of the team. Certainly you can see that logic as well - perhaps it has a place in 2/3 years? Basically my point is we need to maintain a strong team core, especially a strong D in order to provide the kind of base which will allow our young players to thrive. Without that imo we get a situation where we will struggle every night and the knock on effect will be that players like Bo, Sven, Hutton Granny etc will be overpowered and start to lose confidence. Add to that the young rookies coming in will be worn down and it could set back their development. Many people on here are going to get a surprise if they think that Green will coach this team much differently from WD. He will want to win, it is the only way he can stay in the game and so imo he will NOT just sit back and let rookies influence the winning prospects for his team. If they perform and learn they will stick, if not they will be back to Utica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messier's_elbow Posted May 22, 2017 Share Posted May 22, 2017 12 hours ago, hammertime said: I feel like the Canucks have a decently strong cupboard add say Drouin and E Kane to the line up which wouldn't be inconceivable. Virtanen matures into a man. Juolevi transitions to the NHL smoothly. Tryamkin doesn't bolt to mama's home cooking KHL. If some things just went right we could maybe see the Canucks winning a playoff round in 2020 If we can get Kane as a UFA thats not insanely overpriced then sure. Otherwise pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 On 2017-5-22 at 10:15 AM, TheGuardian_ said: With regards to Drouin and Kane, to quote your avatar, "don't touch that" Your right a goal scoring PF with a mean strak and an elite skilled kid Horvats age would not be good for the club what was I thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 No team of Ted Lindsay's ever won anything. This team has no teeth with the loss of Hansen Burr Kes Tryamkin. Sbisa Gud Dorset? Virtanen? Aren't pushing back against anyone! I hope JB has his sight set on someone mean in our top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistolPete13 Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 On 2017-04-30 at 0:45 PM, TheGuardian_ said: The Oilers had to clean house and get experienced people in place before they made the really big step. Management is responsible for hiring one of the best coaches available, best exec's, cap people. For being daring and not afraid in making a one sided trade that improved the team, signing a big strong leader in Lucic, same horrible contract but he is way more effective than Eriksson, getting a big strong 3rd liner like Maroon, taking a chance, albeit small, on Kassian. Their team isn't just the result of a decade of top picks any longer, in three years their management got what they needed and didn't trade away numerous picks for AHL players. With this management group as they have been going so far you may be optimistic in your estimation. This group appears to be content with attempting to be 14th or 15th in the league. The next big sell.......a playoff spot, once in the playoffs anything can happen, right, tell that to the bookies in Vegas. Edmonton's window of opportunity might slam shut after next year. Right now they've got $40m of cap space tied up in eight guys not named Draisaitl or McDavid. Draisaitl's next contact comes up next year and McJesus comes up the year after that. Combined those two might need to be paid $20m. Chia's got his work cut out for him as he will have to try and unload some over paid non-productive players. Good luck finding takers for those guys. He might get lucky and find a team that just wants to get to the cap floor and doesn't care if the player is mister October and only scores in the early season. Or maybe McJesus or Draisaitl takes a hometown discount to play in Edmonton . Or maybe the cap goes up. If the Oilers get more than one cup out of this group it's only because Chia will somehow manage to pull a Chicago and is able to find complimentary players seemingly out of nowhere. I'll save any gushing praise for Edmonton until I see something like that happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted May 28, 2017 Author Share Posted May 28, 2017 On 5/23/2017 at 11:52 PM, PistolPete13 said: Edmonton's window of opportunity might slam shut after next year. Right now they've got $40m of cap space tied up in eight guys not named Draisaitl or McDavid. Draisaitl's next contact comes up next year and McJesus comes up the year after that. Combined those two might need to be paid $20m. Chia's got his work cut out for him as he will have to try and unload some over paid non-productive players. Good luck finding takers for those guys. He might get lucky and find a team that just wants to get to the cap floor and doesn't care if the player is mister October and only scores in the early season. Or maybe McJesus or Draisaitl takes a hometown discount to play in Edmonton . Or maybe the cap goes up. If the Oilers get more than one cup out of this group it's only because Chia will somehow manage to pull a Chicago and is able to find complimentary players seemingly out of nowhere. I'll save any gushing praise for Edmonton until I see something like that happen. Numerous teams have most of their cap tied up in the "core" 5 or 6 players, I often wondered how Pittsburgh managed with 18.5 mil in Crosby and Malkin, 6.8 for Kessel, funny about this one, lists his cap hit at 8 mil on his contract but 6.8 on the team page, 7.25 for Letang and 5.75 mil for Fleury. With four others over 3.7 mil a season. Now when Gretzky and Messier, oooppps, McDavid and Draisatl get there deals done Chia has already got complimentary players in Kassian, Marroon, Letstu.......what 3rd/4th liner won't want to be on that team? If he can get Tanev as well the Edmonton defence takes a giant step forward. There are a few dmen that could help out there but Tanev might be the most attractive financially. Edmonton's rise was just and example of what some teams that turned it around dramatically did. Sometimes it is just hiring a new GM like Columbus did, which ended up being a slower process of the same thing, clean house of management. Another reason I mention is that Edmonton is often used as an example of a failure of management before the scourge and how much the similarities of the present Canuck group resemble that old group. Fan favourites running the show, old pals in critical management roles, rookie coaches, it is almost like a formula to help sell seats in a losing market in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canucksnihilist Posted May 28, 2017 Share Posted May 28, 2017 please remember that without tanking we still wouldn't have won the lottery. we would be picking 10th or 12th. How does that sound? And: as I've said before, tanking is not a goal, it is a description. The canucks will tank the next few years because we don't have the players to compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 On 2017-5-28 at 9:21 AM, TheGuardian_ said: 6.8 for Kessel, funny about this one, lists his cap hit at 8 mil on his contract but 6.8 on the team page, Toronto agreed to retain Kessel's cheeseburger allowance as part of the trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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