Parents getting paid for children under 13 during the strike

[Remy]

I wouldn't say teachers are greedy, but I don't think there should be any holding out for a raise if it's one percent then bight the bullet.

I'm sure the union would do that easily if was the only sticking point. No one is holding out over 1%, that's as ridiculous as it sounds.

Too many people are struggling to raise a family, provide proper nutrition and clothing, etc for their child, not too much sympathy from the regular Joe for the teachers here.

What level of training or education do you have for your job? How about most people? Teachers have 6-7 years of university, minimum. At this point, I wish I had those 6-7 years of earnings from a full time job, I'd be much further ahead than I am now, I guarantee that. Like babych said, a lot of teachers are struggling, so it's not an "us versus them" when it comes to that.

My daughter potentially has to miss the beginning of the school year because teacher X needs that little extra, maybe a signing bonus ? give me a break, a complete joke and it's about time people start appreciating what they have. Which I thought was a reliable schooling system for my daughter.

Well, don't go crying then when your daughter is stuck in a crowded classroom with 30 + students, many of which have severe behavioural or learning disorders that take significant time away from your daughter's learning. I would think you'd want the best for her. Again, the money that goes directly to teachers is not really the part that's being disputed between the two parties. It runs a lot deeper than that, but some people can't see past the surface level.

Class size may be a major issue today, but its such a number that varies, class size and registration will always vary you cannot get past that.

Of course it will vary, but so what? You can still plan and staff accordingly. Besides, don't you think it's a bit counter-intuitive that class sizes are increasing while enrolment has dropped?

[ilduce39]

I wouldn't say teachers are greedy, but I don't think there should be any holding out for a raise if it's one percent then bight the bullet.

Too many people are struggling to raise a family, provide proper nutrition and clothing, etc for their child, not too much sympathy from the regular Joe for the teachers here.

My daughter potentially has to miss the beginning of the school year because teacher X needs that little extra, maybe a signing bonus ? give me a break, a complete joke and it's about time people start appreciating what they have. Which I thought was a reliable schooling system for my daughter.

Class size may be a major issue today, but its such a number that varies, class size and registration will always vary you cannot get past that.

I'm not sure if it's willful ignorance or a fantastic display of spin-doctoring by the Government, but for the millionth-time the strike action is about class size and composition being illegally stripped from the last contract. (A contract in which teachers accepted ZERO raise in order to get, since it was for the good of the system.)

As Remy pointed out, Gov't is already offering signing bonuses and raises.. if teachers walked away from class size and composition they could probably get even more on that angle.

Teachers are stuck between a rock and a hard place - either sell out, take a raise and let the Gov't continue to strip the system or strike and have every aspect of their job and compensation picked apart by the biased and uninformed. Oh, and skip a few paychecks.

[TheRussianRocket.]

I lawled

It actually can, like literally all the material..

[Monty]

Since you're an expert on what teachers deserve, can you tell me the last time teachers got a raise? Can you please also explain to me how any profession does not deserve a cost of living increase? Do you even understand what a cost of living increase is?

Teachers have effectively lost salary, in real spending terms, over the last fifteen years. That's how inflation works, and that's what the raises are meant to compensate for. It's not a "we deserve more" it's a "we don't deserve less".

You're out of your element, Donny.

I'd plus you twice for this post if I could. Even if I disagreed with everything you said, you managed to slip in one of the best Lebowski quotes.

[Kragar]

It actually can, like literally all the material..

Just because the material is on the internet doesn't mean that a child will be able to learn it. Same reason why you can't expect to learn everything from reading textbooks. Don't get me wrong... you can learn a lot. But some kids need extra guidance or different perspectives, and I am not referring just to special needs kids.

While not a fan of unionization, I respect the job teachers do, and appreciate the work that many teachers put into my own education.

The idea of online classes worries me. IMO, you need the interaction between students and teachers to have lessons sink in and actually be learned. Burying your head in a book or computer screen to absorb knowledge might get you through an exam, but how much will you take away from it after it is all done?

[Industrious1]

It always blows my mind that there is a segment of the population out there that thinks teachers should get paid so little when they are a cornerstone of civilized society and provide a future for the next generation.

Having a wage keep up with inflation isn't just a nice perk...I'd say it is a requirement for most professionals with any sort of university education (that most paid good money for).

It's like the detractors have some sort of hate on for a teacher that didn't coddle them like their parents did when they were growing up.

Some teachers were hard on me when I was in school and guess what? It made me a better person and it had the added bonus of making me better equipped to the join the workforce after graduation. Not a bad deal for a little wear and tear on the mind, something you get in spades later on in life anyways.

[William_Clarkson]

Where do opinions like this even come from? You are factually incorrect. The government and the teacher's union are, for all intents and purposes, on the same page when it comes to the wage increase. They are 1% off on that, which can easily be resolved. Class size and composition IS the issue. Yeah, I guess that costs more money, but it's not money that goes into teacher's pockets.

BC teachers want 8% and the government is offering 7%. Teachers want the raise over a shorter term than the government's offer by one year. Easy issues to resolve. For comparison, Saskatchewan teachers, which already made more than BC teachers, just got a raise of 9.5% over four years.

So please, can the "teachers are greedy" indignation.

The government doesn't want to set the precedent that they can't strip legally bargained contracts. They want to make it retroactively okay in the new contract. That's why this is still happening. They've also avoided mediation and have had documents leak proving that they wanted to provoke the teachers into a strike. So there's that.

Thanks for the information, I wasn't completely informed about the strike (going mainly based off what I heard, so that's my fault for lack of research).

Since you're an expert on what teachers deserve, can you tell me the last time teachers got a raise? Can you please also explain to me how any profession does not deserve a cost of living increase? Do you even understand what a cost of living increase is?

Teachers have effectively lost salary, in real spending terms, over the last fifteen years. That's how inflation works, and that's what the raises are meant to compensate for. It's not a "we deserve more" it's a "we don't deserve less".

You're out of your element, Donny.

As time has gone on not only has inflation occurred, but also the Internet was invented. I'll admit I wasn't completely informed about the strike, but I still they think they don't deserve a raise (regardless of what they make in other provinces). My reasoning is that I don't think their job is worth what it use to be. For example a math high school math teacher is perhaps one of least needed professions currently in my opinion (given there would be a proper reform), in its current state. There are countless sources to learn math now on the Internet. High school math is easy enough as it is, so now you don't even need someone to show you how to do it. Prior to the Internet, there were a lot less sources students could access to learn it outside of class. The government could start a reform to start phasing out having so many teachers and start running more things online, just as an example.

This is such an ignorant and uninformed post. Teachers in BC want to be paid similar to what teachers in other provinces make.

Your other point about being able to learn complex subjects for free via the internet is just as ridiculous. There is simply no substitute for having a qualified professional's help.

Again, I think teachers deserve a raise for the reasons I already stated.

Also, when I said "complex" I was being sarcastic. High school is really easy, even honours classes are really easy. Anyways, all the information can be found online and there are numerous sources on the Internet that also allow you to ask people for assistance. I don't think there shouldn't be teachers, but I still think that they are nearly as important as some people think they are.

[Tangelos]

If I was still in high school I'd be thrilled at the idea of not going to school in September. Wish I was born 5 years later...

[MJDDawg]

As most of you know school will prob start pass September possibly pass October. It is rumoured we go back mid October. During that time Parents with children under 13 will be paid $40 / day. It's devastating for the teachers to not have negotiated a contract. The longer the strike goes the less learning time we get mediators from the BCTF and BC govt haven't even met yet which things are getting interesting as a new school year edges closer

Pass September??

[Remy]

Thanks for the information, I wasn't completely informed about the strike (going mainly based off what I heard, so that's my fault for lack of research).

As time has gone on not only has inflation occurred, but also the Internet was invented. I'll admit I wasn't completely informed about the strike, but I still they think they don't deserve a raise (regardless of what they make in other provinces). My reasoning is that I don't think their job is worth what it use to be. For example a math high school math teacher is perhaps one of least needed professions currently in my opinion (given there would be a proper reform), in its current state. There are countless sources to learn math now on the Internet. High school math is easy enough as it is, so now you don't even need someone to show you how to do it. Prior to the Internet, there were a lot less sources students could access to learn it outside of class. The government could start a reform to start phasing out having so many teachers and start running more things online, just as an example.

Again, I think teachers deserve a raise for the reasons I already stated.

Also, when I said "complex" I was being sarcastic. High school is really easy, even honours classes are really easy. Anyways, all the information can be found online and there are numerous sources on the Internet that also allow you to ask people for assistance. I don't think there shouldn't be teachers, but I still think that they are nearly as important as some people think they are.

Impressive post, in all honesty. Very rare for people to concede much, especially when it's online. I can respect that.

Just something to consider though, you said that high school is easy, but it's not for everyone. I'm glad it was for you, but there are many that struggle. Besides which, like some others have said, you miss out on a lot of social interaction when you're behind a computer screen.

[CanadianLoonie]

So the government is paying parents to keep their children away from the government's own indoctrination centres?

The government is doing something right here!

Having a wage keep up with inflation isn't just a nice perk...I'd say it is a requirement for most professionals with any sort of university education (that most paid good money for).

Every university in the West teaches Keynesian economics so graduates won't know the proper definition of inflation anyway.

I'm willing to bet you don't either...

Some teachers were hard on me when I was in school and guess what? It made me a better person and it had the added bonus of making me better equipped to the join the workforce after graduation. Not a bad deal for a little wear and tear on the mind, something you get in spades later on in life anyways.

[Gross-Misconduct]

This is old news already.

[Where's Wellwood]

Jesus Chr*st. I am oging into grade 12 and have no idea what im going to ed up doing for school.

My grade 12 courses are quite different from my grade 11 courses, so i didnt put any effort in in grade 11 as i didnt need any of it.

When i step it up i do real well, but my grade 11 marks wont get me anywhere if thats what i HAVE to apply with. fml. fu govt of bc

That's your own damn fault. I also had a teacher strike during my grade 12 year and I had to use my grade 11 courses to apply. Maybe this'll teach you not to slack off just because you didn't HAVE to try.

What post-secondary program has grade 12 pre-requisites, that don't have similar grade 11 pre-requisites?

[Kragar]

^^ +1

DefendParis, failure to plan properly on your part does not make it an emergency on mine. I made similar kinds of mistakes in the past, but it all came down to my own laziness. Blame who you want if you think it makes you feel better, but it won't do you any good. Better off to learn from your mistake and choose better the next time you have a decision to make about postponing something important.

[Balls of Bure]

1 This goes to show that teachers need to be declared an essential service. The gov is paying parents so they can afford daycare, in lieu of their kids going to school, so that the parents can go to work thus allowing BC's craptacular economy to keep on slowly treading along.

2 This shows that teachers (especially elementary school teachers) are essentialy glorified babysitters, not god's gift to children as they proclaim.

3 This needed a new thread?

[soshified]

Jesus Chr*st. I am oging into grade 12 and have no idea what im going to ed up doing for school.

My grade 12 courses are quite different from my grade 11 courses, so i didnt put any effort in in grade 11 as i didnt need any of it.

When i step it up i do real well, but my grade 11 marks wont get me anywhere if thats what i HAVE to apply with. fml. fu govt of bc

You should have realized that post-secondary will look at gr.11 and gr.12 marks.

Also, if you didn't do well in math 11 or eng 11, you better retake those because math 12 and eng 12 will be the most important courses in the grade 12 year.

[Tortorella's Rant]

Secretaries never get a raise; teachers had no problem putting them out of work over their little tirade several weeks ago. My mum was docked something like half a day's pay and of course will get nothing out of this in the long run.

So when I hear teachers crying about their issues, I'm just like..

[Remy]

Secretaries never get a raise; teachers had no problem putting them out of work over their little tirade several weeks ago. My mum was docked something like half a day's pay and of course will get nothing out of this in the long run.

So when I hear teachers crying about their issues, I'm just like..

So help me understand your point here. You're going to play a sarcastic violin because the strike affected your Mom for half a day. All the big issues at hand are suddenly unimportant, okay then. It sucks when it has an impact on anyone, but damn man, big picture here.

By the way, do you have any data to support that secretaries NEVER get a raise? Or were you just using hyperbole to make it sound like big bad teachers go out of their way to trample on your poor mom?

[Tortorella's Rant]

So help me understand your point here. You're going to play a sarcastic violin because the strike affected your Mom for half a day. All the big issues at hand are suddenly unimportant, okay then. It sucks when it has an impact on anyone, but damn man, big picture here.

By the way, do you have any data to support that secretaries NEVER get a raise? Or were you just using hyperbole to make it sound like big bad teachers go out of their way to trample on your poor mom?

Half a day's pay for two weeks. And nowhere did I say the issues are not important but if you're going to jerk us around, who are in no way involved and in no way benefit, just so you can get what you want then you deserve no sympathy or support from me. Are you going to make up the difference in pay here since you have such a hard on for what the teachers are trying to accomplish? Of course not. In fact, they do get raises - about 70 cents every four or five years. Now we can count those fat stacks.

[ilduce39]

Secretaries never get a raise; teachers had no problem putting them out of work over their little tirade several weeks ago. My mum was docked something like half a day's pay and of course will get nothing out of this in the long run.

So when I hear teachers crying about their issues, I'm just like..

?

CUPE got a raise this year. Their deal also included a clause where support staff would get back-pay for any days missed due to strike action. Good for CUPE - Gov't trying to divide and conquer as usual.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/b-c-school-support-staff-reach-5-year-deal-1.2669442

As B.C.'s teachers prepare to vote on a full scale strike, the government has reached a tentative deal with 34,000 education support staff in the province.

• Read more about the B.C. Teachers' strike vote

The deal includes a wage increase of about five-and-a-half per cent over five years, increased hours for education assistants and improvements to extended health benefit plans through standardization.

CUPE spokesman Rob Hewitt says the deal also includes guaranteed full pay if staff choose to not cross a teacher picket line, but said he doesn't want to compare his negotiations with those of B.C. teachers.

"All I can say is our committee worked very hard, and the other side worked extremely hard at meeting us in the middle," said Hewitt.

"I'm not sure if that's happening at the teacher table or not, but certainly that's what happened at our table. We were able to reach an agreement that hit the issues that our members wanted us to hit."

Hewitt says one of the big victories was securing funding from the province to cover the wage increases. In the last agreement, school districts were left to pay for wage and benefit increases causing widespread protest from school board trustees.

Union members and the B.C. Public School Employers Association still have to ratify the five-year deal, but the government says it provides wage increases "in keeping with its economic stability mandate."

That means bus drivers, education assistants and custodial staff could see more money if the province's economy exceeds annual forecasts.

B.C.'s Minister of Education Peter Fassbender said "both sides were realistic, flexible and willing to find solutions at the table."

Economic Stability Mandate

According to a government news release the 2014 Economic Stability Mandate applies to all public-sector employers whose collective agreements expired on or after Dec. 31, 2013.

• "If the province's real GDP growth exceeds forecasts over the terms of these agreements, the agreements provide for the sharing of some benefits of that growth with the public sector employees who work on behalf of British Columbians and help make that growth possible."
• "Under this proposal, employees would receive a conditional, incremental wage increase equal to half of any percentage point gain in real GDP growth above the Economic Forecast Council's forecast published in the budget.
• "For example if real GDP growth is one percentage point above forecast real GDP growth, then a 0.5 per cent wage increase would result, beyond whatever wage increase had been negotiated in the contract.
• "There are ratified agreements in place between the BCGEU and the Public Service, with Community Health, Community Social Services and the Health Science Professionals Bargaining Association."