(Proposal) Van to CAR and NJD

[Nuxfanabroad]

^Well if we use some of that cap to sign substitutes like Franson, I'd say we could tread water, yet collect more futures.

[Phil_314]

I'd make those trades. Larsson could be turning a corner in his development, he played more and better last season.

I'm not sure how serious Shero may be about rebuilding (at least with the group up front) so maybe we could switch Higgins out for Vey+ to get them their desired youth. Adam should be worth it though.

As for the Tanev deal, I'd agree on sending Sbisa back as part of the deal. Would probably still do the deal even if it meant taking Semin's contract though. The only thing I don't like is how weak our top 6 would be physically, we better get another big boy to play and add the physicality. We saw how even the slightest amount of grit affects team morale, and we'd need guys with push-back.

[goblix]

I'd make those trades. Larsson could be turning a corner in his development, he played more and better last season.

I'm not sure how serious Shero may be about rebuilding (at least with the group up front) so maybe we could switch Higgins out for Vey+ to get them their desired youth. Adam should be worth it though.

As for the Tanev deal, I'd agree on sending Sbisa back as part of the deal. Would probably still do the deal even if it meant taking Semin's contract though. The only thing I don't like is how weak our top 6 would be physically, we better get another big boy to play and add the physicality. We saw how even the slightest amount of grit affects team morale, and we'd need guys with push-back.

Glad to hear that no-one going full bash mode on my thread

so far good suggestions and points being made.

I think Higgins is underrated on CDC, had a bad year overall but he does alot of other things well that makes a coach like him.

The only 'grit' we are trading off the team is Kassian in my proposals. We definitely need some decent push back but maybe thats where Virtanen / Cassels / Gaunce can step up, big boys that can play with an edge.

Besides that we are going to need Burrows, Bieksa and Dorsett to take most of that kind of role.

[Warhippy]

Glad to hear that no-one going full bash mode on my thread

so far good suggestions and points being made.

I think Higgins is underrated on CDC, had a bad year overall but he does alot of other things well that makes a coach like him.

The only 'grit' we are trading off the team is Kassian in my proposals. We definitely need some decent push back but maybe thats where Virtanen / Cassels / Gaunce can step up, big boys that can play with an edge.

Besides that we are going to need Burrows, Bieksa and Dorsett to take most of that kind of role.

we've also pedan tryamkin virtanen gaunce and grenier soon.

We can survive I'm sure in the crash and bash dept

[Monteeun]

You're wrong. Only $950k of his cap hit would come off the books if he was sent to Utica and not claimed

I'll only do that trade if we can get rid of his contract right away

[DrChill]

Like the first trade, rather send Carolina a vet dman and say corrado and a pick than tanev personally.

But they probably wouldn't do that. Either way, interesting ideas

Really hoping for big changes this summer, vets out, youth in.

[SaintPatrick33]

Alex Semin? I would stay away from him at ALL Costs! i think he makes 7 mill a year and is one of those russians who plays once every 25 games. He is like a poor mans Kovalev lol.

I wouldn't want to trade any 1st round picks this year, this class is stacked and Benning has been putting in the time to scout, I have faith in his scouting.

[goblix]

Alex Semin? I would stay away from him at ALL Costs! i think he makes 7 mill a year and is one of those russians who plays once every 25 games. He is like a poor mans Kovalev lol.

I wouldn't want to trade any 1st round picks this year, this class is stacked and Benning has been putting in the time to scout, I have faith in his scouting.

no-one is saying semin is good or worth his contract...

You also say the class is stacked and wouldn't want to trade out the picks so would you take on a semin contract if it helps adds a pick to the top 5 draft club?

[SaintPatrick33]

no-one is saying semin is good or worth his contract...

You also say the class is stacked and wouldn't want to trade out the picks so would you take on a semin contract if it helps adds a pick to the top 5 draft club?

That is a tough call, I mean top 5 pick we can grab Hanifin, that kid is exactly what we need. I mean if Semin's contract expires after the season though, it may be worth it, but exactly for that reason is why Carolina would not trade him and give up top 5. Semins contract is not a long termer, and its not like Carolina will need to free up cap in order to do so.

[Baer.]

Larsson bustville ? he's 22, and had 24 points this year... on NJD...

Semin is someone i'm reluctant on picking up but if it's needed to get the 5th overall may be worth it...

Yes agree on the cap situation, JB and Gilman will have to do some work around there, but maybe a young guy steps up throughout the year and makes Vrbata redundant for a trade... or maybe Semin snaps back to being a good dynamic offensive forward.

Who knows either way we have 15m in cap space freeing up in 2016.

What are peoples opinions is Tanev on his own worth 5th overall and contract dump ? I could see Carolina rating Tanev highly

I'm just saying with the hype coming out of the draft behind him, he could be doing better. Granted he had injuries, I just remember a lot of people were calling him a bust...Maybe bust is too strong a word. On a side note Dougie Hamilton was picked after him. For some reason I thought Larsson was older.

[BI3KSA-]

I'd do both. But I'd much rather keep our 1st in the NJD trade. We have to add on the Carolina trade for sure. They wont trade a a potentially franchise level prospect for Tanev and a cap dump.

[VanGnome]

I think both deals are pretty well in the ballpark, and might be something we'd see Trader Jim do. The Jersey deal I can see for sure, they get a young project PWF in Kassian, current defensive help in Higgins and an additional 1st round pick in a good draft to help rebuild their prospect pool.

Canucks get a good young RHD and a high 2nd.

The 2nd deal I think Tanev's value is at an all time high, he's re-signed at good term and money, and taking on Semin in exchange for the 5th overall is where the Canucks need to be. Tanev is replaced immediately by Larsson, and we can draft Hanifin/Provorov/Barzal etc, perhaps even trade down a pick or two from 5 to 6-7 and get some additional picks out of it for later in the draft.

I like 'em both.

[underrated]

Very interesting and good ideas. I would personally do both these trades. I am not sure NJD would part with Larsson at this point but it's a good offer and I'd happily go for it.

As for Semin, I know he's a primadonna, but what have the Canucks needed for the past six years? A natural goal scoring winger for our second line! So we can take on Semins salary with the fact that we get goal scoring on our second line as well as a top prospect! If Carolina is desperate to dump his contract than maybe try to trade Sbisa rather than Tanev, but I doubt they'd go for that

[tyhee]

That is a tough call, I mean top 5 pick we can grab Hanifin, that kid is exactly what we need. I mean if Semin's contract expires after the season though, it may be worth it, but exactly for that reason is why Carolina would not trade him and give up top 5. Semins contract is not a long termer, and its not like Carolina will need to free up cap in order to do so.

Semin has 3 years left at $7 million per.

I may be more wary of some, but to me the negatives to the Carolina deal far outweigh the positives. A 5th overall is still just a prospect. The prospect could turn out to be anywhere from a star to a bust though 5th overall selections normally get enough opportunity that they get in at least a couple of seasons in the NHL.

Semin could turn back the clock but the chances are he'd be a huge liability for little production. Even waiving him leaves a cap hit of $6 million+.

I don't think the Canucks are in a good position to be taking a cap dump.

There are some issues with the original poster's cap figures.

1. The poster has shown Sbisa at his 2015-16 salary of $3.2 million rather than his cap hit of $3.6. That difference alone puts the Canucks over the projected cap of $71 mill.

2. Horvat in addition to his salary has performance bonuses in his contract. I don't know what they are but the maximum shows on hockeyscap as $850K and I think we can assume at least a fair amount of that will be earned and count against his cap hit.

3. Virtanen also has performance bonuses in his contract.

4. The original post assumes Corrado and Baertschi get no raises at all, at $600K and $900K respectively. Baertschi had a contract that gave performance bonuses which could have raised him to $1.4 mill at the NHL level. I don't know if those assumptions are going to be reasonable or not.

5. It also seems, from adding the figures, that the original post assumes Clendening and Weber sign for a combined $2.05 million. No breakdown is given. They made a combined $1.6 mill at the NHL level this past season. Again, I don't know whether that's reasonable but would expect that Weber at least is due a raise.

6. The original poster noted that Larsson will be due a raise. I don't see that the Canucks would have room to give him one.

Also, rather than get into a goalie discussion the poster assumed Canucks would keep all 3 goalies on the roster. Obviously a goalie move, putting a skater on the roster instead of one of the goaltenders, would change the cap situation. fwiw I think the original poster was reasonable to not deal with that-moving Lack or Markstrom will make only a small difference once a skater is added back in and the chance that Miller is moved is small enough that it shouldn't be counted on.

This Carolina proposal is obviously a high risk, potentially high reward proposal. Unless whomever the Canucks get with the #5 pick turned into a star, the negatives outweigh the positives imo. It isn't a risk I'd be taking.

[stuman491]

Would there be any way to do the Carolina trade without giving up Tanev? After all we need to get younger. Other than their NTC working against us would Hamhuis or Edler not be better peices to part with? Is there value not higher than Tanev's?

[goblix]

Semin has 3 years left at $7 million per.

I may be more wary of some, but to me the negatives to the Carolina deal far outweigh the positives. A 5th overall is still just a prospect. The prospect could turn out to be anywhere from a star to a bust though 5th overall selections normally get enough opportunity that they get in at least a couple of seasons in the NHL.

Semin could turn back the clock but the chances are he'd be a huge liability for little production. Even waiving him leaves a cap hit of $6 million+.

I don't think the Canucks are in a good position to be taking a cap dump.

There are some issues with the original poster's cap figures.

1. The poster has shown Sbisa at his 2015-16 salary of $3.2 million rather than his cap hit of $3.6. That difference alone puts the Canucks over the projected cap of $71 mill.

2. Horvat in addition to his salary has performance bonuses in his contract. I don't know what they are but the maximum shows on hockeyscap as $850K and I think we can assume at least a fair amount of that will be earned and count against his cap hit.

3. Virtanen also has performance bonuses in his contract.

4. The original post assumes Corrado and Baertschi get no raises at all, at $600K and $900K respectively. Baertschi had a contract that gave performance bonuses which could have raised him to $1.4 mill at the NHL level. I don't know if those assumptions are going to be reasonable or not.

5. It also seems, from adding the figures, that the original post assumes Clendening and Weber sign for a combined $2.05 million. No breakdown is given. They made a combined $1.6 mill at the NHL level this past season. Again, I don't know whether that's reasonable but would expect that Weber at least is due a raise.

6. The original poster noted that Larsson will be due a raise. I don't see that the Canucks would have room to give him one.

Also, rather than get into a goalie discussion the poster assumed Canucks would keep all 3 goalies on the roster. Obviously a goalie move, putting a skater on the roster instead of one of the goaltenders, would change the cap situation. fwiw I think the original poster was reasonable to not deal with that-moving Lack or Markstrom will make only a small difference once a skater is added back in and the chance that Miller is moved is small enough that it shouldn't be counted on.

This Carolina proposal is obviously a high risk, potentially high reward proposal. Unless whomever the Canucks get with the #5 pick turned into a star, the negatives outweigh the positives imo. It isn't a risk I'd be taking.

I agree I didn't really want to mess with speculated salaries, I think I noted that Larsson was due for a raise. And yes there are definitely cap considerations to work with.

Sbisa was a typo, the whole thing was calculated by nhlguru.net but doesn't copy paste properly so i quick formatted myself. Essentially the Estimated cap space is correct and yes the RFAs to be signed are assuming they take similar contracts (which likely not the case)

Bonus's are hard to predict... I'm not sure how they work out exactly but I believe Horvat is locked in for 2 years at 980k- ish

I'm pretty torn overall, mainly because I think this year would be the only issue, Bieksa / Hamhuis UFA next year that is 9m-ish free. Cap likely goes up creates a bit more room and who knows maybe Semin actually produces with the Sedins

[tyhee]

I agree I didn't really want to mess with speculated salaries, I think I noted that Larsson was due for a raise. And yes there are definitely cap considerations to work with.

Sbisa was a typo, the whole thing was calculated by nhlguru.net but doesn't copy paste properly so i quick formatted myself. Essentially the Estimated cap space is correct and yes the RFAs to be signed are assuming they take similar contracts (which likely not the case)

Bonus's are hard to predict... I'm not sure how they work out exactly but I believe Horvat is locked in for 2 years at 980k- ish

I'm pretty torn overall, mainly because I think this year would be the only issue, Bieksa / Hamhuis UFA next year that is 9m-ish free. Cap likely goes up creates a bit more room and who knows maybe Semin actually produces with the Sedins

That Sbisa was a typo means there was an assumption that Clendening and Weber sign for a combined total of $1.65 mill rather than the $2.05 I'd said earlier-or essentially no combined raise. I agree with your statement that is likely not the case.