Alflives Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: He has had 3 straight years of regression. He has been supplanted by Chychrun. And if his team playing poorly explains away all his regression, why are we expecting him to step onto an equally bad at best team that plays even worse defensively and suddenly recapturing his glory days from 5 years ago? Yup. OEL is now a 20-30 point D man who is always a minus player. For the role we need, he’s not the guy. And his contract is actually worse than Loui’s. Loui is done in one more year. OEL has six more at 8.5. Getting him will kill any chance of our young core having success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Alflives said: Yup. OEL is now a 20-30 point D man who is always a minus player. For the role we need, he’s not the guy. And his contract is actually worse than Loui’s. Loui is done in one more year. OEL has six more at 8.5. Getting him will kill any chance of our young core having success. Why would it hurt the young d core from having success? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 26 minutes ago, aGENT said: In really do have to wonder how much of that so called 'regression' is ARZ being a complete disaster organization/team, never mind the mental aspect of signing a clause filled, long term deal and having the team you thought was dedicated to you, turn around and tell you they want to dump your ass? I can't imagine there's a lot of love in that relationship right now That doesn't tend to lend itself to players performing their best. So sure, lets acquire a player with a contract like that while assuming his regression has nothing to do with his age or any individual factor but that its all about his team. Taking a best case scenario will always happen outlook has already proven to be a very costly strategy by Benning in many signings and trades. This would likely easily eclipse Eriksson as his worst move to date. Too much risk for a guy who doesnt make our D any tougher to play against, is more of the same that we already have too much of, and is another left dide D on a team that needs an upgrade to its RHD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Bertuzzipunch said: Why would it hurt the young d core from having success? Because he just isnt the shutdown guy the left side needs - if it truly needs anything. He is not physical and we already have Hughes, Rathbone, and Juolevi who dont fill that particular need. If we are acquiring anything for the left side, it needs to be more like Hamonic and less like Edler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 9 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: So sure, lets acquire a player with a contract like that while assuming his regression has nothing to do with his age or any individual factor but that its all about his team. Taking a best case scenario will always happen outlook has already proven to be a very costly strategy by Benning in many signings and trades. This would likely easily eclipse Eriksson as his worst move to date. Too much risk for a guy who doesnt make our D any tougher to play against, is more of the same that we already have too much of, and is another left dide D on a team that needs an upgrade to its RHD. FWIW, I doubt we trade for him at this point. But as we agreed earlier, there IS a price that makes sense. And it doesn't have to rely on some 'best case' scenario where he returns to Norris calibre (though that would be nice ). But I do think he'd be a better playing outside of the mess that is ARZ and the dysfunctional relationship that likely exists there now with management. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 14 minutes ago, Bertuzzipunch said: Why would it hurt the young d core from having success? The OEL contract at 8.5 for six years could make it very hard to fill out a good supporting cast. If he was a legit #1 D, then fine. But he’s not that guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: FWIW, I doubt we trade for him at this point. But as we agreed earlier, there IS a price that makes sense. And it doesn't have to rely on some 'best case' scenario where he returns to Norris calibre (though that would be nice ). But I do think he'd be a better playing outside of the mess that is ARZ and the dysfunctional relationship that likely exists there now with management. I dont disagree he could be better elsewhere. I just would not bet the farm on it. If we are paying a guy 10.5 mil real cash each of the next 3 years while at an 8.25 mil cap hit for 6 years, given the financial realities of the Canucks in this depressed financial era, he better damn well be a Norris quality guy that actually fills a need we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 32 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: He has had 3 straight years of regression. He has been supplanted by Chychrun. And if his team playing poorly explains away all his regression, why are we expecting him to step onto an equally bad at best team that plays even worse defensively and suddenly recapturing his glory days from 5 years ago? I don't agree with any of that 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 Just now, wallstreetamigo said: I dont disagree he could be better elsewhere. I just would not bet the farm on it. If we are paying a guy 10.5 mil real cash each of the next 3 years while at an 8.25 mil cap hit for 6 years, given the financial realities of the Canucks in this depressed financial era, he better damn well be a Norris quality guy that actually fills a need we have. Who is suggesting we do this? You're arguing against a worst case scenario that I don't think anyone has actually suggested, where there's no retention, minimal salary going back and we giving up prime assets in the trade. Nobody, as far as I've seen, is suggesting we do anything of the sort. IF we can trade for him for 'peanuts', with retention and cap going back... Great. If not, than no thanks. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 I dunno if we aint gonna take any chances to improve and keep the same d core we might as well go on a full rebuild and trade miller horvat and demko for a ton of picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 We are finally almost out of the cap hell Benning put us in. Why would we want the risk of another 6 years of it if things dont go perfectly according to plan? Use the cap next summer to actually improve the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 32 minutes ago, Alflives said: Loui has to go the other way for sure. And there has to be at least that much retention. Maybe it’s better to wait for next summer, and go after a guy like Parayko? maybe, he'll also be nearly 30 then too. tempus fugit. I think its easy for us all to speculate on this or that deal, but I think when a real chance come along to improve your team a GM has to look at it. I like OEL ~6 mil. My guess is Arizona doesn't like that, and ultimately ends up keeping him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: maybe, he'll also be nearly 30 then too. tempus fugit. I think its easy for us all to speculate on this or that deal, but I think when a real chance come along to improve your team a GM has to look at it. I like OEL ~6 mil. My guess is Arizona doesn't like that, and ultimately ends up keeping him. Nah they will trade him somewhere. Not to the canucks but they will get rid of that contract somehow. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Bertuzzipunch said: I dunno if we aint gonna take any chances to improve and keep the same d core we might as well go on a full rebuild and trade miller horvat and demko for a ton of picks. Taking chances does not equal taking huge, unnecessary long term risk. People are so desperate to move one meaningless year of Eriksson that they are willing to change it for 6 years of OEL. Remember how most assumed the best case scenario when Eriksson was signed? If OEL were to crash like he did, would it still have been a good chance to take? I say go with Juolevi or Schmidt on the left side and acquire a top pairing RHD instead. This team is just bot very good and is not an OEL away from being much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, aGENT said: Who is suggesting we do this? You're arguing against a worst case scenario that I don't think anyone has actually suggested, where there's no retention, minimal salary going back and we giving up prime assets in the trade. Nobody, as far as I've seen, is suggesting we do anything of the sort. IF we can trade for him for 'peanuts', with retention and cap going back... Great. If not, than no thanks. yeah no one is thinking full pop here, "not at any price" doesn't apply here either. What does concern me a touch is if AZ is willing to retain 2 mil, they are going to want the 9th oa for that for sure. That makes me a little queasy. I'd rather look at something around Reinhart and Risto If thats a thing. I wonder if Pitsburg takes a look, maybe send Letang back the other way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, aGENT said: Who is suggesting we do this? You're arguing against a worst case scenario that I don't think anyone has actually suggested, where there's no retention, minimal salary going back and we giving up prime assets in the trade. Nobody, as far as I've seen, is suggesting we do anything of the sort. IF we can trade for him for 'peanuts', with retention and cap going back... Great. If not, than no thanks. No chance Arizona retains enough to make any trade for him worth it. He is significantly overrated so someone will probably trade for him at his full hit hoping to catch lightning in a bottle. Better not be Benning though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Taking chances does not equal taking huge, unnecessary long term risk. People are so desperate to move one meaningless year of Eriksson that they are willing to change it for 6 years of OEL. Remember how most assumed the best case scenario when Eriksson was signed? If OEL were to crash like he did, would it still have been a good chance to take? I say go with Juolevi or Schmidt on the left side and acquire a top pairing RHD instead. This team is just bot very good and is not an OEL away from being much better. Yeah we are not close whats the point of going for a stud dman this year on next? Why not take the draft picks now and just wait till we become good again when they are ready to join petey and quinn when both are 26-27 right now we are just wasting miller and horvats prime years Edited June 20, 2021 by Bertuzzipunch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: yeah no one is thinking full pop here, "not at any price" doesn't apply here either. What does concern me a touch is if AZ is willing to retain 2 mil, they are going to want the 9th oa for that for sure. That makes me a little queasy. I'd rather look at something around Reinhart and Risto If thats a thing. I wonder if Pitsburg takes a look, maybe send Letang back the other way? In no world should our 9OA be traded for OEL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 Just now, Bertuzzipunch said: Yeah we are not close whats the point of going for a stud dman this year on next? Why not take the draft picks now and just wait till we become good again when they are ready to join petey and quinn when they are 26-27 Taking on 6 years of OEL at 6.25-8.25 mil cap hit doesnt scream patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said: Taking on 6 years of OEL at 6.25-8.25 mil cap hit doesnt scream patience. I agree. We dont need OEL or his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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