J.I.A.H.N Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Trade #1 Ekblad + Tippett for Boeser + Gaudette + 2022 1st + Jasek + and the rights to Tanev Trade #2 Tierney for Virtanen 2020-2021 Roster Forwards=$38.85 Million Defense=$25.00 Million Goalies=6.5 Team=$70.35 Million Miller(5.2) Pettersson(1) Toffoli (5.0) Hughes (1) Ekblad (7.5) Markstrom (5.5) Pearson(3.75) Horvat (5.5) Tippett (1) Edler (6) Myers (6) Demko(1) Rousell(3) Tierney (3.5) MacEwen (1) Juolevi (1) Tryamkin (2.5) Motte (1.5) Beagle (3) Sutter (4.4) Fantenberg (1) Leivo (1) None Roster Costs LTIR..................Ferland ($3.500,000) Utica.................Baertschi (3.366,000-1,025,000= Cost $2,341,000) Utica.................Eriksson (6,000,000-1,025,000= Cost $4,975,000) Utica Total = Cost $7,216,000 Let walk.........................Tanev Trade.............................Stecher and Benn Luongo Penalty ............$3,000,000 Spooner Buyout.............$1,000,000 Other above Expenses = Costs$4,000,000 None Roster Costs Above.................................................$11,216,000 Total Team Expenses Roster Costs $70,350,000 + None Roster Costs $11,216,000 = $81,566,000 On Deck Podkolzin, Hoglander, Lind, Rathbone, Woo, DiPietro, 2021 1st, 2021 2nd It is tight and Hughes and Pettersson's bonus's are deferred until 2021, but with the players on deck just waiting to get their chance and Sutter, Pearson, Baertchi, Edler and Spooner coming off the books (Approx. $18,000,000) we should be able to cover all expenses............ I am thinking Hughes and Pettersson will sign 3 year bridge deals of approx. $7,500,000 (Covid induced!) The year after (2021-2022) Sutter, Beagle, Eriksson, Luongo's Penalty are all off the books in time for Miller and Horvat to be resigned! (Approx.$15,000,000) This also gets us out of Boeser's next contract, which I believe will be north of $8,000,000 per (Correct me if I am wrong!) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyCuddles Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Florida probably says heck no, but I am not entirely sure how high they are on Tippett anymore. Also a first rounder two years from now? Why would they want that? They have traded a few D-men lately so they will likely prefer bringing a young d-man back in a Ekblad deal. Ekblad is rounding into a stud. Defensively he's not great but he's decent enough and is only getting better. Hedman needed Ohlund to really come into his own. Might be a similar situation with Ekblad. Ekblad interests me cause he could become a Pietrangelo type player, maybe just needs a bit of mentorship. Not sure if Edler could fill that Ohlund role for Ekblad but I'd be willing to roll the dice on that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Make it so Janis! Tippet is still an A prospect ... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil_314 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Must be the homer in me but I feel like we overpaid in the first trade. Boeser plus small add probably gets Ekblad in my books, then what are we paying for Tippett? Gaudette and 1st and Tanev's rights? Don't want to just throw out old toys and keep buying new ones without repurposing the old guard for assets -- that's how contenders stay well stocked. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldoescobar Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Panthers hard pass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Hi Janisahockeynut, Why would you think the Panthers want to trade Ekblad? In my readings of their situation they want to clear SALARY this season. Ekblad is only owed $2m in salary (he has been paid his $4m signing bonus for this season already). On top of that he is their best defenseman, young, big and a large piece of their core. Tippett, whilst not yet performing to the level he was touted to be, is on an ELC for the next two seasons. Their total salary owed for this coming season is only $2.9m. What are you offering in order to help the Panthers with their salary problem? Boeser + Gaudette + Jasek. Even if the Panthers were interested in trading their #1D man they would be taking on around $5.5m in actual salary, while only shedding $2.86m. This doesn't even account for the fact that they need to sign Tanev to replace Ekblad, for perhaps another $4-5m. While a 1st round pick is always good, 2022 is so far off, it is not worth that much right now. This trade doesn't address the Panthers needs. I think your second trade is fair value for both teams. And I like Tierney as a target for VAN. I would guess that OTT would rather keep Tierney than take Jake though. Tierney fits their need at 3C and they can probably find good cheap wingers in their system or on the free agent market (without arbitration rights). I like your proposed roster for 2020/21, but I can't see the $1.7m in performance bonuses from last season, which MUST be paid this coming season. I noticed you did mention the $4.55m performance bonuses likely to be earned by Pettersson, Hughes and Juolevi in 2020/21 - good that you didn't ignore those, because most people on CDC do. What you say is that we can push the $4.55m into 2021/22. Yes we can do that but the $18m cleared by losing Sutter, Pearson, Baertchi, Edler and Spooner will need to be used to pay that $4.55m, then some roster replacements for Pearson and Edler (let's say best case this is Hoglander $0.9m and Juolevi $2m). This leaves about $10.5m to put towards EP and QH's pay rises. Even if they take a "covid discount" we will need more than that! I have said it many times on CDC, but I am in favour of paying as much of the performance bonuses in 2020/21 as possible. This will add $4.55m to the $10.5m available, giving us more like $15m space for pay rises, then we could sign Pettersson to say $9m on a long term contract and Hughes to a $7.5m bridge contract. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKNuck96 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 cannot see Florida being interested, also adding in more prices doesn’t make the trade better it’s not EA NHL. florida want to keep costs down not take it on. Plus none of the pieces address any of the roster needs for Florida. Plus a first two years from now isn’t worth as much now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patel Bure Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, janisahockeynut said: Trade #1 Ekblad + Tippett for Boeser + Gaudette + 2022 1st + Jasek + and the rights to Tanev Trade #2 Tierney for Virtanen 2020-2021 Roster Forwards=$38.85 Million Defense=$25.00 Million Goalies=6.5 Team=$70.35 Million Miller(5.2) Pettersson(1) Toffoli (5.0) Hughes (1) Ekblad (7.5) Markstrom (5.5) Pearson(3.75) Horvat (5.5) Tippett (1) Edler (6) Myers (6) Demko(1) Rousell(3) Tierney (3.5) MacEwen (1) Juolevi (1) Tryamkin (2.5) Motte (1.5) Beagle (3) Sutter (4.4) Fantenberg (1) Leivo (1) None Roster Costs LTIR..................Ferland ($3.500,000) Utica.................Baertschi (3.366,000-1,025,000= Cost $2,341,000) Utica.................Eriksson (6,000,000-1,025,000= Cost $4,975,000) Utica Total = Cost $7,216,000 Let walk.........................Tanev Trade.............................Stecher and Benn Luongo Penalty ............$3,000,000 Spooner Buyout.............$1,000,000 Other above Expenses = Costs$4,000,000 None Roster Costs Above.................................................$11,216,000 Total Team Expenses Roster Costs $70,350,000 + None Roster Costs $11,216,000 = $81,566,000 On Deck Podkolzin, Hoglander, Lind, Rathbone, Woo, DiPietro, 2021 1st, 2021 2nd It is tight and Hughes and Pettersson's bonus's are deferred until 2021, but with the players on deck just waiting to get their chance and Sutter, Pearson, Baertchi, Edler and Spooner coming off the books (Approx. $18,000,000) we should be able to cover all expenses............ I am thinking Hughes and Pettersson will sign 3 year bridge deals of approx. $7,500,000 (Covid induced!) The year after (2021-2022) Sutter, Beagle, Eriksson, Luongo's Penalty are all off the books in time for Miller and Horvat to be resigned! (Approx.$15,000,000) This also gets us out of Boeser's next contract, which I believe will be north of $8,000,000 per (Correct me if I am wrong!) I would definitely do #1 but I’d let them keep Tippet. Keep the deal to Boeser++ for Ekblad. I’d also keep our 2021 1st and use someone like Rathbone instead if it’s possible/fair. As for the Virtanen deal, I’d keep Virtanen for now. Let him increase his value and give him a legit shot on the 2nd line with Boeser gone. Give him a chance to increase his value. When Podkolzin arrives in a year’s time, the Canucks can then decide what they want to do with Jake. Virtanen has his warts, but he still produced at a 20 goal clip last season with limited minutes. The guy is worth more than a 4th line center. Edited October 3, 2020 by DarkIndianRises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 4 hours ago, BigTramFan said: Hi Janisahockeynut, Why would you think the Panthers want to trade Ekblad? In my readings of their situation they want to clear SALARY this season. Ekblad is only owed $2m in salary (he has been paid his $4m signing bonus for this season already). On top of that he is their best defenseman, young, big and a large piece of their core. Tippett, whilst not yet performing to the level he was touted to be, is on an ELC for the next two seasons. Their total salary owed for this coming season is only $2.9m. What are you offering in order to help the Panthers with their salary problem? Boeser + Gaudette + Jasek. Even if the Panthers were interested in trading their #1D man they would be taking on around $5.5m in actual salary, while only shedding $2.86m. This doesn't even account for the fact that they need to sign Tanev to replace Ekblad, for perhaps another $4-5m. While a 1st round pick is always good, 2022 is so far off, it is not worth that much right now. This trade doesn't address the Panthers needs. I think your second trade is fair value for both teams. And I like Tierney as a target for VAN. I would guess that OTT would rather keep Tierney than take Jake though. Tierney fits their need at 3C and they can probably find good cheap wingers in their system or on the free agent market (without arbitration rights). I like your proposed roster for 2020/21, but I can't see the $1.7m in performance bonuses from last season, which MUST be paid this coming season. I noticed you did mention the $4.55m performance bonuses likely to be earned by Pettersson, Hughes and Juolevi in 2020/21 - good that you didn't ignore those, because most people on CDC do. What you say is that we can push the $4.55m into 2021/22. Yes we can do that but the $18m cleared by losing Sutter, Pearson, Baertchi, Edler and Spooner will need to be used to pay that $4.55m, then some roster replacements for Pearson and Edler (let's say best case this is Hoglander $0.9m and Juolevi $2m). This leaves about $10.5m to put towards EP and QH's pay rises. Even if they take a "covid discount" we will need more than that! I have said it many times on CDC, but I am in favour of paying as much of the performance bonuses in 2020/21 as possible. This will add $4.55m to the $10.5m available, giving us more like $15m space for pay rises, then we could sign Pettersson to say $9m on a long term contract and Hughes to a $7.5m bridge contract. Thanks BigTramFan, Solid Retort I have read that Florida would move Ekblad, if the offer was right, and I wanted to put something together that may entice them, but further more, I was also demonstrating that there is a way to work the budget, with not too many moving parts and still move ahead, without taking a step back. I do not think that Benning would go after Ekbland, but the economics is there to go after someone of his ilk, and not sell the farm. Which was one of my main points. You and I do not know whether Florida or Vancouver would do this, but again, it shows you how it could be done, with numbers that are close to being correct. (I don't think I forgot too much) But the premise remains that there are young players around the league that could be gotten for a payment like that. It is a good argument that it may not be enough, to get an Ekblad, but teams like NYR and Carolina may like the package with some tweeks.......maybe we add another 2nd or a Lind or something, maybe it is New Jersey? But the main point is our cap situation is not dire, nor would we have to take a step back.... The point is that it "could" be done, not that it would be done. (after all, Benning and whom ever won't be calling me! LOL) I will wonder out loud what Severson and Foote out of NJ might cost? Could it fit into the same scenario + or - ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 One of the objectives of my proposal was to replace Boeser with a younger solid prospect in the trade...... Above I discuss this with BigTramFan Ekblad and Tippett Severson and Foot Peace and Necas or Domi and ? even Dobson and ? Seider and ? Soderstrom and ? The point is there are options out there, that fit the scenario, and we can make it juicy enough, they will bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 4 hours ago, janisahockeynut said: One of the objectives of my proposal was to replace Boeser with a younger solid prospect in the trade...... Above I discuss this with BigTramFan Ekblad and Tippett Severson and Foot Peace and Necas or Domi and ? even Dobson and ? Seider and ? Soderstrom and ? The point is there are options out there, that fit the scenario, and we can make it juicy enough, they will bite. Ok I see what you are trying to do. I think that it might be easier to make two separate trades to achieve that. Examples: Trade 1: Boeser one-for-one to get a top pairing Dman, my preference is Pesce. I think CAR might do that too. Trade 2: Gaudette + Woo for Nolan Foote. NJD may do this to get talent at both center and RD in return for one LWer. And to add my 2c worth, I reckon if we are trading Boeser for help on D, we should look at adding a player like Craig Smith (UFA) for $3m x 2 years. He would work well on Horvat's right side, would fill that 2RW spot as others develop, and could be just as effective at 3RW if Podkolzin progresses quickly enough to take that spot within 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 2 hours ago, BigTramFan said: Ok I see what you are trying to do. I think that it might be easier to make two separate trades to achieve that. Examples: Trade 1: Boeser one-for-one to get a top pairing Dman, my preference is Pesce. I think CAR might do that too. Trade 2: Gaudette + Woo for Nolan Foote. NJD may do this to get talent at both center and RD in return for one LWer. And to add my 2c worth, I reckon if we are trading Boeser for help on D, we should look at adding a player like Craig Smith (UFA) for $3m x 2 years. He would work well on Horvat's right side, would fill that 2RW spot as others develop, and could be just as effective at 3RW if Podkolzin progresses quickly enough to take that spot within 2 years. I think Carolina would do your deal in a minute, as I think Boeser has more value....not alot but some I don't think by itsself Foote would be available, if that were the trade......it has to be some type of over payment, or the appearance of one. Meaning that we are walking away from Tanev and giving them first dibs at him.... Which is why there is that over payment.......personally, it's more a bride, but I honestly think that Foote will be a top 2 line player, somewhere down the road, and will make up for the loss of Boeser To me, it is about building from the top down, and top 2 lines and top 2 defensive pairing is where a large part of your game is played Now the Virtanen for Tierney is just a hockey trade.....maybe we could do better there, but budget is based on talent, so yes we could get better with an additional asset added, but what would the cost be? Both in terms of budget, and loosing another young player? I am not sure that is the route to take..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 3 hours ago, janisahockeynut said: I think Carolina would do your deal in a minute, as I think Boeser has more value....not alot but some I don't think by itsself Foote would be available, if that were the trade......it has to be some type of over payment, or the appearance of one. Meaning that we are walking away from Tanev and giving them first dibs at him.... Which is why there is that over payment.......personally, it's more a bride, but I honestly think that Foote will be a top 2 line player, somewhere down the road, and will make up for the loss of Boeser To me, it is about building from the top down, and top 2 lines and top 2 defensive pairing is where a large part of your game is played Now the Virtanen for Tierney is just a hockey trade.....maybe we could do better there, but budget is based on talent, so yes we could get better with an additional asset added, but what would the cost be? Both in terms of budget, and loosing another young player? I am not sure that is the route to take..... I think you are right about Foote (and any other top young prospect) being generally unavailable. Most teams don't want to let a young player go until they've assessed his potential and have an idea of what they actually have. The only exception may be for a real position of need where they swap a top prospect for another top prospect. I don't know NJD situation well enough to comment, but I think they'd need it to be an "overpayment" as you say, to consider moving Foote. We are more likely to allow our crop of forward prospects develop than trade for a Boeser replacement IMO. In the mean time, if we are trading Boeser then signing Toffoli would be a smart move. A 2RW is also necessary. Leivo could do this role for cheap. I wasn't happy with Virtanen's playoff performance, so I would let him go. And, as previously mentioned, I would consider a UFA like Smith on a cheap ($3m) 2 year deal. Nice way to stay competitive but keep costs low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 4, 2020 Author Share Posted October 4, 2020 2 hours ago, BigTramFan said: I think you are right about Foote (and any other top young prospect) being generally unavailable. Most teams don't want to let a young player go until they've assessed his potential and have an idea of what they actually have. The only exception may be for a real position of need where they swap a top prospect for another top prospect. I don't know NJD situation well enough to comment, but I think they'd need it to be an "overpayment" as you say, to consider moving Foote. We are more likely to allow our crop of forward prospects develop than trade for a Boeser replacement IMO. In the mean time, if we are trading Boeser then signing Toffoli would be a smart move. A 2RW is also necessary. Leivo could do this role for cheap. I wasn't happy with Virtanen's playoff performance, so I would let him go. And, as previously mentioned, I would consider a UFA like Smith on a cheap ($3m) 2 year deal. Nice way to stay competitive but keep costs low. I think we are in general agreement, but again, I made the thread to illustrate the economics, as well as who I would like. I know that in the past, I had created a thread on HF Boards, which was Boeser for Severson, Foote.... the NJ fans were not aghast, but mentioned that they just got Foote, and were not really ready to see him go.............If I remember rightly, they countered with Severson, Woods, and a pick...I can't remember the whole offer, but there was a decent amount of interest. But it did underline exactly how much value Boeser has, and I am not going to let him go cheaply Boeser is a blue chip player, and want a premium back for him, even if we have to add......... I know that in our asset management scheme, he will cost too much at next contract, so lets exploit that now With Covid, and expansion and such.................. Maybe it is Boeser and Stecher for Severson and Foote? Or another teams similar package???????? But I do feel, there is a deal to be made somewhere like that??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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