[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, Fanuck said:

Is he great though?  Or would he just be better/cheaper than what we have other than QH? 

Depends on how you define "great". He has the potential to be another "Tanev". While that's certainly nothing to sneeze at, it's no Hedman etc.

[Nucker 67]

NYI are going to be left out,  but they're in a really tough division.

 

to NYI - Miller and 1st (say #13)

to VAN - Barzal,  1st (say #14) 

 

Would you?

 

Edit - the 1sts might actually be irrelevant here. Maybe this is just a player-for-player trade

Edited April 13, 2022 by NUCKER67

[Canucks Curse]

I would do this in a heart beat NYI would not given the age difference

[Bobby James]

I'm very excited for the playoffs to start. 

 

Vancouver will likely be looking to move 1-2 of Miller, Boeser, Garland and I think the best trading partners won't be known until after the first round. Some teams who are planning on going on a decent run will naturally lose in the 1st round and I think those will be the best targets for a trade with Vancouver. 

 

Boston feels like a good choice (right now looking at their current roster and age range) for Miller or Garland but they will need to give up something (especially for Miller). Carlo would be the piece I want and even though he is a really good player on a great contract, I would say Boston might be open to moving him. If offense in the playoffs are an issue I think Carlo is the piece they move out where they get something excellent back. Mcavoy is their #1 and now they signed Lindholm long term and it could be argued is their #2, so sometimes you gotta move your next best asset. 

 

But if Boston goes on a great run here then they may not feel they need such a big change in the offseason and look for smaller adjustments for next year's run. I guess we'll see who needs what out of the contending teams after the playoffs. 

[Bobby James]

9 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

NYI are going to be left out,  but they're in a really tough division.

 

to NYI - Miller and 1st (say #13)

to VAN - Barzal,  1st (say #14) 

 

Would you?

 

Edit - the 1sts might actually be irrelevant here. Maybe this is just a player-for-player trade

Oh for sure yes to this trade based on age alone, but no way NYI do it. Doesn't make any sense for them. 

 

If they are lacking offense we should trade them Miller for a defensemen like Dobson

[aGENT]

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

That article is purely speculative.

 

Yeah... That's what media does there Tips. If you wanted McCrimmon's private notes (nothing I remotely suggested)... Good luck to you.

 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

 

The fact is the article incorrectly states that Martinez has a NTC.  He has an m-NTC.  That's a major difference, especially when there's only 12 teams on his list next year.

A modified trade clause, is still a trade clause. You also may recall from Vrbata, that even a modified one can put a hell of a wrench in things by only opening your list to teams who's have zero interest.

 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

Also, did you actually watch Dadonov last night?  He has plenty of gas left in the tank.  It won't cost an arm and a leg to move him.  ESPECIALLY when he's entering the last year of his contract. 

No GM's are going to do them any favours. It's going to cost them.

 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

Bottomline is if you know what kind of player Theodore is, or heck, even watched last night's game, it would be idiotic to even think for a moment that Vegas would move him over all of the other options on the table.  Like I said, it would be like the Canucks moving Hughes.  In your dreams if you think Theodore would be moved for scraps and that the Canucks would be able to take advantage of it. 

I never said they'd move him over other options or for scraps. Less than normal circumstances, if they get a better return than paying to move Dadanov.... Perhaps unlikely, not impossible.

 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

If you want Dadonov or Martinez for cheap, then sure, trade Miller away for them.  I'm sure that would help this franchise.

Nobody suggested trading Miller for Dadanov... 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

Like other posters have asked of you, why don't you come up with some trade options for Miller that actually make sense for both teams.  Then we can have an actual intelligent debate over it. 

There's been a million suggested packages. Reiterating them would just be redundant.

 

5 hours ago, HKSR said:

 

Making it sound like you can get Theodore from VGK for a 2nd round pick is a fantasy.

I never suggested we'd get him for a second.

And again, I'd happily take Hague as an alternative.

 

Regardless, the larger point stands that we'd need the cap space available to take advantage of moves like these, that do in fact happen pretty regularly. We don't have that space with an extended Miller.

Edited April 13, 2022 by aGENT

[Nucker 67]

Just now, Bobby James said:

Oh for sure yes to this trade based on age alone, but no way NYI do it. Doesn't make any sense for them. 

 

If they are lacking offense we should trade them Miller for a defensemen like Dobson

I'd love to get Dobson, but I doubt they let him go. 

 

Miller - 86 points (29 goals) in 72 games....but he's 29

 

Barzal - 49 points (14 goals) in 63 games...and he's 25 (could fit with young core)

 

Just looking at this, I think NYI would have to actually add.    

[HKSR]

On 4/12/2022 at 8:00 AM, aGENT said:

There's already rumors that Shea Theodore might be the one made available to make room for Eichel this summer as they hope/assume Hague can take a step.

 

Anybody want Theodore for cheap?

 

Nah! We should probably extend a 30 year old to a retirement deal before our window is even open instead, and just continue to ignore the glaring issues on our D...

 

21 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Yeah... That's what media does there Tips. If you wanted McCrimmon's private notes (nothing I remotely suggested)... Good luck to you.

 

A modified trade clause, is still a trade clause. You also may recall from Vrbata, that even a modified one can put a hell of a wrench in things by only opening your list to teams who's have zero interest.

 

No GM's are going to do them any favours. It's going to cost them.

 

I never said they'd move him over other options or for scraps. Less than normal circumstances, if they get a better return than paying to move Dadanov.... Perhaps unlikely, not impossible.

 

Nobody suggested trading Miller for Dadanov... 

There's been a million suggested packages. Reiterating them would just be redundant.

 

I never suggested we'd get him for a second.

And again, I'd happily take Hague as an alternative.

 

Regardless, the larger point stands that we'd need the cap space available to take advantage of moves like these, that do in fact happen pretty regularly. We don't have that space with an extended Miller.

"There's already rumors that Shea Theodore might be the one made available to make room for Eichel this summer as they hope/assume Hague can take a step."

 

NO, there's no rumors.  There is speculation by some uneducated tool in the media that it's something VGK would do.  It's no different than saying Edmonton could trade McDavid to create cap space and build depth since he's worth the most.  It's just stupid, and you know it.  If you posted a thread in this forum that there is a rumour that Theodore would be traded, it would be locked up and shut down.  Why?  Because it lacks substance, and is simply speculative.  Not a rumour, and definitely not one that is all over the media in Vegas

 

"Anybody want Theodore for cheap?" -- so there you go, you literally insinuated that Theodore would be had for cheap... NOT. GONNA. HAPPEN.  Theodore would cost as much as what we'd expect for Hughes.  Just stop trying to make it out that cap space would automatically provide an opportunity to acquire franchise players for peanuts.

 

And btw, cap space can be created in other ways.  You don't need to trade a Top 10 1st line centre in his prime to do it. 

 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

I'm with DeNiro. Aim higher.

OK, for instance? 

[JM_]

2 hours ago, Fanuck said:

Is he great though?  Or would he just be better/cheaper than what we have other than QH? 

I think so, given how hard it is to draft these guys and/or trade for them. 

[Canucks Curse]

yes to shea Theadore, some of the guys on 650 keep saying this but I think it is more them speculating/dreaming then anything based in reality, they would let Reilly smith go and trade dadonov again before moving Theo

[HKSR]

2 minutes ago, Canucks Curse said:

yes to shea Theadore, some of the guys on 650 keep saying this but I think it is more them speculating/dreaming then anything based in reality, they would let Reilly smith go and trade dadonov again before moving Theo

All pure speculation and fantasy.  I'm sure there's media and fans in NJ speculating and dreaming that the Canucks could move Hughes to them to save cap space cuz we have Rathbone moving up and OEL has shown he can still play big minutes and produce offence. 

[HKSR]

1 hour ago, NUCKER67 said:

I'd love to get Dobson, but I doubt they let him go. 

 

Miller - 86 points (29 goals) in 72 games....but he's 29

 

Barzal - 49 points (14 goals) in 63 games...and he's 25 (could fit with young core)

 

Just looking at this, I think NYI would have to actually add.    

I think the best move the Canucks could make with Miller is to move him for a young top 6 established centre like Pierre Luc Dubois, or Barzal in this case.  The Canucks have a competitive advantage over most teams because of their centre depth.  Don't EFF with it!

[Canucks Curse]

Miller to WPG, lol that would be amazing. PLD+ Heinola 

[Gawdzukes]

On 4/12/2022 at 9:07 AM, HKSR said:

What?  Where are these rumours you speak of?  Moving Theodore to make room for Hague is like the Canucks moving Hughes anticipating that Rathbone will replace him.  I call BS on that rumour.

 

On 4/12/2022 at 12:35 PM, aGENT said:

Been all over Vegas news reports.

 

On 4/12/2022 at 12:36 PM, HKSR said:

I can't find a single article on it.  Can you?

 

On 4/12/2022 at 12:50 PM, aGENT said:

Literally the first article that came up when I googled it... Jesus you guys lol

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehockeynews.com/.amp/news/how-will-the-golden-knights-manage-the-salary-cap-in-the-long-run

 

"Shea Theodore is excellent, but Alec Martinez has a no-trade clause and Alex Pietrangelo has a no-move clause, so Theodore (unfortunately) may be the odd-man out, especially if the Knights commit to Hague and think he can bring offense with his heavy shot. "

 

Fwiw, I'd happily take Hague for cheap as well if they don't want to give up Theodore  probably not as good of a player (though that's debatable long term) but arguably a better fit for our needs. And cheaper.

 

On 4/12/2022 at 12:54 PM, HKSR said:

That's as speculative as it gets lmao.  There's no substance to it at all. 

First of all, the guy doesn't even realize that Martinez has a modified NTC.  Not a full NTC.  By this offseason, Martinez can be moved to 20 teams in the league and have no say about it. 

And then he follows up with the fact Hague has a heavy shot, so that can replace Theodore

 

You gotta admit, that's a REALLY weak argument to move one of the premiere young defencemen in the entire league ROFL.

 

On 4/12/2022 at 12:56 PM, aGENT said:

 

 

 

On 4/12/2022 at 4:50 PM, aGENT said:

You asked for a link to an article where it had been discussed when I'd noted it had been discussed in the media. I gave you one. Then you proceeded, as usual, to start moving goalposts when information doesn't fit your tiny view. 

 

How tiresome.

 

On 4/12/2022 at 4:57 PM, HKSR said:

So I'm not allowed to respond to an article that clearly has misleading information in it?  One of us has a tiny view of things... and it isn't me. 

 

But yes, please do carry on touting that the Golden Knights are gonna move Theodore before Dadonov or Martinez

 

On 4/12/2022 at 5:03 PM, aGENT said:

It didn't actually have misleading onformation in it. It was quite balanced. I didn't say they will move Theodore, I said it's being discussed as a possibility.

 

Guys like Dadanov will cost them an arm and a leg to move and they have limited options as to who they can move between clauses, contracts etc. The article brought up real, actual issues that might cause a guy like Theodore to shake lose. Or if not him, potentially Hague.

 

Either way, they're going to need to give up big time assets (prospects and picks) to move guys like Dadanov, or lose guys like Theodore, Hague etc. The canucks being in position to take advantage of either of those scenarios is a good thing. But that doesn't fit your little view, so you're still yelling at clouds.

Wow, talk about hard to have a conversation with a guy. 

 

@aGENT suggests players may be available according to media. Asked to provide an article does so promptly and then HKSR completely moves the goalposts and starts attacking the article. Well that's fine in and of itself. However, can't it just be acknowledged he has a fair point without just attacking the poster himself at every turn?

 

Teams can and have made cap room for good players. Why wouldn't they? Teams such as Vegas, Tampa, and others do lose or sacrifice players due to cap constraints and a wealth of assets. If teams have available cap space good players can sometimes be found for very good prices. 

 

Why even argue that, wouldn't it be better to have a basic understanding of both sides of the argument?

[HKSR]

13 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wow, talk about hard to have a conversation with a guy. 

 

@aGENT suggests players may be available according to media. Asked to provide an article does so promptly and then HKSR completely moves the goalposts and starts attacking the article. Well that's fine in and of itself. However, can't it just be acknowledged he has a fair point without just attacking the poster himself at every turn?

 

Teams can and have made cap room for good players. Why wouldn't they? Teams such as Vegas, Tampa, and others do lose or sacrifice players due to cap constraints and a wealth of assets. If teams have available cap space good players can sometimes be found for very good prices. 

 

Why even argue that, wouldn't it be better to have a basic understanding of both sides of the argument?

The part I think is inaccurate is that he makes it sound like franchise players like Theodore can be had for cheap just cuz you have cap space.  That's entirely untrue.  Could you get a good player for less than usual?  Yep.  But no way in hell is a guy like Theodore gonna come cheap.

[Gawdzukes]

1 minute ago, HKSR said:

The part I think is inaccurate is that he makes it sound like franchise players like Theodore can be had for cheap just cuz you have cap space.  That's entirely untrue.  Could you get a good player for less than usual?  Yep.  But no way in hell is a guy like Theodore gonna come cheap.

It's exactly how we got Miller. You have no idea what the price would be in reality. The point you keep trying to ignore is it's quite possible a good player like Theodore becomes available, and at a reduced rate. That's it, end of story. Just because it doesn't fit your narrative it doesn't mean you have to stomp your feet and pretend it's not true. You can still argue to keep Miller at the same time as admitting obvious truths in order to facilitate the conversation. The thought of getting a good player on the cheap for once would be swell.

[HKSR]

4 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

It's exactly how we got Miller. You have no idea what the price would be in reality. The point you keep trying to ignore is it's quite possible a good player like Theodore becomes available, and at a reduced rate. That's it, end of story. Just because it doesn't fit your narrative it doesn't mean you have to stomp your feet and pretend it's not true. You can still argue to keep Miller at the same time as admitting obvious truths in order to facilitate the conversation. The thought of getting a good player on the cheap for once would be swell.

Theodore is an established franchise defenceman.  Miller was a 3rd line, border 2nd line forward at the time.  Completely different scenarios.

[Gawdzukes]

Just now, HKSR said:

Theodore is an established franchise defenceman.  Miller was a 3rd line, border 2nd line forward at the time.  Completely different scenarios.

So childish. Again you're missing the point entirely just to bomb the conversation. Congrats. Whatever carry on. Gawd it's annoying and petty.

[HKSR]

9 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

So childish. Again you're missing the point entirely just to bomb the conversation. Congrats. Whatever carry on. Gawd it's annoying and petty.

I think you miss the point.  That's why you've resorted to personal attacks again as usual.