Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

If he can be resigned to a contract that's not going to suffocate the team, I'm completely in favor of keeping him, but I'm becoming less believing that it's possible. If it's not possible, we trade him to whoever can offer the best overall return. Ideally, I would like to move him at or before the draft and get another 1st this year. I think it's probably the best overall time as we have the most teams to talk to and work out a deal with. Teams who are close, know who they are and know that they have the rest of the summer to reorganize their team to spread out for any assets the lose in acquiring Miller.

 

Overall, I'm about 60% sure that Miller will get moved this summer, about 40% that either OEL or Myers will get moved, really depends if OEL is willing to waive again. 

 

Boeser is likely about 25% chance of being moved

Garland I'd put about 40%

Pearson about 10% (I think management like him)

Dickinson I'd say about 50%

Poolman about 20% if we trade Myers, if we don't trade Myers, I think he jumps up to about 75%

Ferland's contract, about 50% chance that we shuffle it off to Toronto or Tampa.

 

NOW, keep in mind that ALL if this is maybe 5% chance as I'm usually full of S%!&

 

The same concerns you point out we have extending Miller are the same ones other teams have.  It’s why he’s only a rental in value.  A very good rental, on a great contract number, but still a rental.  

[VegasCanuck]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

The same concerns you point out we have extending Miller are the same ones other teams have.  It’s why he’s only a rental in value.  A very good rental, on a great contract number, but still a rental.  

Yes, but retaining him past next season, becomes their problem. With the summer to deal with moving cap space around, teams will likely pay more to acquire him this summer than at the deadline. There are more teams interested, including ones that know that if they can't keep him and their team flops, they can always deal him at the deadline at a premium rental.

[Nucker 67]

JR said something like  - they need to gauge whether the first 3 years of his contract would outweigh the last 3 years of his contract, so my guess is Miller gets 6 years max. They might only be offering him $7.5 though, but I think he accepts it. Miller seems like a blue-collar kind of guy who wants stability and a good working environment with good guys.

 

Sounds like they also plan on qualifying Boeser (short term), so somethings got to give?  Thinking Garland and Pearson are gone. That's $8+ right there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

Let me just draw this out a little further.....................

 

So, let's go with the "Miller for Ottawa's 2022 - 1st # 7 + Ottawa's 2022 - 2nd (39th)" trade.......................

Add a Garland to LA trade, that is often talked about (Including with LA fands)...Garland for Helge Grans and LA's 2022 -2nd (Value for garland = 2 X 2nds + Garlands Cap)

 

Now, these types of Trades definitively do not make you stronger long term, but it gives you the Cap flexibility JR was taking about, plus assets, that you more align with your core

 

Are you weaker? Absolutely! But is that a short term problem or a long term problem, to which I say it is a short term problem...................................

 

You go into the 2022 draft with..............

 

Ottawa's 2022-1st (7th)

Vancouver's 2022-1st (15th)

Ottawa's 2022-2nd (39th)

LA's 2022-2nd (51st)

Vancouver's  2022-3rd (79th)

 

I am moving the 7th  OA + 2024 - 2nd round pick for Phili's 5th OA and hoping like hell Jiricek or Nemec are available..................

 

Just for $&!#s and giggles that translates into.................My picks

 

 

Phili's  2022-1st (5th)......................................David Jiricek        RHD      6'3"     190 lbs.........this guys ceiling is a #2 physical offensive/defensive RHD

Vancouver's 2022-1st (15th)...........................Marco Kasper        C         6'1"     185 lbs.........this guys is supposedly a 200 ft, center with good speed and tenacious

Ottawa's 2022-2nd (39th)................................Lian Bichel          LHD       6'5"     216 lbs........ Big raw, projectable top 4 LHD, with a physical side

LA's 2022-2nd (51st).......................................Noah Warren      RHD       6'5"     216 lbs.........another big physical RHD, who can skate

Vancouver's  2022-3rd (79th)..........................Tyler Brennan        G         6'4"     184 lbs.........Number 1 ranked north American Goalie

 

Now, I know this is pie in the sky talk, but this is a great draft and very realistic, and with no reaching!

This, if the picks are successful pulls us right back into the 10 ten prospects rankings

 

Now, if we look past this years draft into next years draft, we are looking at wingers and centers to  fill in a very good prospect list.....Sure always BPA, but

positioning yourself in a draft, can make a world of difference.

 

It is not only our prospects that would majorly improve but our Cap space would be in the 10 million area, and off the list of UFA's, we would still be able to, either sign solid replacement to short contracts, or as JR want, weaponize our Cap and pick off some nice players from Florida and Vegas................

 

I have never though that 1 trade would fix our problems, and IMO, Aqualini brought in JR to do what Benning would not, even if that means taking a step or 2 back...............

[J.I.A.H.N]

51 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Maybe we actually keep Miller?  55 million?  7 years at 7.75?

we trade Garland for picks and cap room.  

Alf, have you actually been watching the NHL playoffs, and seen the size and speed these guys are? Never mind the pedigree, through out each team............the teams are riddled with first round picks of all ages.........in most cases there is plenty of IQ and speed.............

 

Yes, Miller is awesome, but do you honestly feel like trading Garland along, fixes our problems? I do not!

[hammertime]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Maybe we actually keep Miller?  55 million?  7 years at 7.75?

we trade Garland for picks and cap room.  

I would be all aboard this. 

 

[nameci]

Don’t think Miller is going to get us anybody’s early first round picks.  I honestly think a lot of posters are going to be disappointed with the return we receive for Miller.  Hope I’m wrong, but I think many folks here are overestimating how attractive one year of cost controlled JT Miller is to other teams.

[Alflives]

1 hour ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Alf, have you actually been watching the NHL playoffs, and seen the size and speed these guys are? Never mind the pedigree, through out each team............the teams are riddled with first round picks of all ages.........in most cases there is plenty of IQ and speed.............

 

Yes, Miller is awesome, but do you honestly feel like trading Garland along, fixes our problems? I do not!

We have Demko.  The time is now and the next four years.  

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, nameci said:

Don’t think Miller is going to get us anybody’s early first round picks.  I honestly think a lot of posters are going to be disappointed with the return we receive for Miller.  Hope I’m wrong, but I think many folks here are overestimating how attractive one year of cost controlled JT Miller is to other teams.

Yup.  Miller is pretty much worth half of what he was prior The this past TDL.  I think we sign him.  

[J.I.A.H.N]

14 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We have Demko.  The time is now and the next four years.  

So, you are saying that we have enough cap for the next 2 years, and we have the ability to improve our team, so we compete with the top 8 teams in the Stanley Cup today?

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

So, you are saying that we have enough cap for the next 2 years, and we have the ability to improve our team, so we compete with the top 8 teams in the Stanley Cup today?

We have Demko.  Hughes and Petey (our next two most important players) only going to improve.  We either go all in over these next four years, or we might as well KABOOM it.  

[Fanuck]

4 hours ago, BigTramFan said:

I think LA is an ideal trade partner for Miller. They are entering their contending window, they are looking for scoring, they have the cap space now, and with Quick's $5.8m contract ending in 2023 they will have the cap space to resign Miller long term. Kopitar is aging and may retire in 2 years allowing them to pay their upcoming prospects. They have Danault and Byfield as long term centers, but Miller would complement those two nicely (could play wing with Byfield as a mentor until Kopitar retires, then they have Miller and Byfield as 1C/2C).

 

In addition, and most importantly, they have plenty of C and RD depth and prospects that they could exchange for Miller - which is what we need. Perhaps Roy + Turcotte + Grans for Miller. Roy is a known piece, top 4 defensive Dman, and would be an ideal partner for Hughes right now. Grans is a big 20 year old RHD, a potential Myers/Schenn replacement. Turcotte is a big question mark at this stage, but has the pedigree and could turn out to be the best player in this trade.

I've been saying LA for a while now as a logical landing place for Miller for many of the same reasons you mention - except I'd be targeting Clarke and their 2nd.  Makes sense in terms of both team needs and cap situations of both teams.

 

We don't need these multi-player trades involving 3 different organizations like CDC loves to make up nor do we need to rob another team blind like CDC often suggests to make any deal fair. 

 

Keep things simple:

 

Miller to LA for Clarke and 2022 2nd round pick. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Fanuck said:

I've been saying LA for a while now as a logical landing place for Miller for many of the same reasons you mention - except I'd be targeting Clarke and their 2nd.  Makes sense in terms of both team needs and cap situations of both teams.

 

We don't need these multi-player trades involving 3 different organizations like CDC loves to make up nor do we need to rob another team blind like CDC often suggests to make any deal fair. 

 

Keep things simple:

 

Miller to LA for Clarke and 2022 2nd round pick. 

Otherwise is zero chance we get Clarke for Miller.  If we do trade Miller, which I doubt will happen, we will get no where near a grade A right shot D prospect.  More likely it’s a hockey trade for a guy like Marino.  

[J.I.A.H.N]

19 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We have Demko.  Hughes and Petey (our next two most important players) only going to improve.  We either go all in over these next four years, or we might as well KABOOM it.  

Well, sure.....show me how to do it.

[VegasCanuck]

2 hours ago, NUCKER67 said:

JR said something like  - they need to gauge whether the first 3 years of his contract would outweigh the last 3 years of his contract, so my guess is Miller gets 6 years max. They might only be offering him $7.5 though, but I think he accepts it. Miller seems like a blue-collar kind of guy who wants stability and a good working environment with good guys.

 

Sounds like they also plan on qualifying Boeser (short term), so somethings got to give?  Thinking Garland and Pearson are gone. That's $8+ right there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why would Pearson and Garland automatically be gone? Not that there isn't a reasonable chance of trading one of them next season, but Miller being signed at 7.5 million leaves more than enough room for them. If we move either of those guys, it will be for close to the same salary in, rounding out the lineup, not just dumping out.

[Fanuck]

24 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Otherwise is zero chance we get Clarke for Miller.  If we do trade Miller, which I doubt will happen, we will get no where near a grade A right shot D prospect.  More likely it’s a hockey trade for a guy like Marino.  

Even Giroux who was a pure rental and a far lesser player at this stage of his career than Miller got more than what you're suggesting, way more.   We're not getting Lafrenier,  plus a 1st plus a blue-chip prospect like people thought a few months ago,  but we're certainly not going to settle for a second pairing d-man in a one-for-one, that's a joke Alf and you know it.

[VegasCanuck]

1 hour ago, nameci said:

Don’t think Miller is going to get us anybody’s early first round picks.  I honestly think a lot of posters are going to be disappointed with the return we receive for Miller.  Hope I’m wrong, but I think many folks here are overestimating how attractive one year of cost controlled JT Miller is to other teams.

For a team that thinks they are a player or two away next season, they will give up a 1st and then some. There are very few impact players that will get you the production that Miller is capable of for the cap hit he carries, makes him a really attractive addition.

 

If he had any trade protection, it would limit us, but he doesn't.

[Alflives]

23 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Well, sure.....show me how to do it.

We were doing “it” under Bruce.  Play .650 during the year.  Make the playoffs.  And ride Demko to the parade down Georgia. 

[wildcam]

I really think teams like LA kings lots of prospects and there key veterans are older Kopitar 35, Doughty 33, Quick 34..Miller would get them that veteran edge in playoff run..Faber 21 RD, 6'1, Vilardi 23, 6'3 C , Lemieux 26, 6'2, 215 W,  2nd rounder 2022

 

NYR-- 1. Schneider 20, 6'2 RD.   - Chytil 23, 6'3 C.   Kravtsov 

           2. Lundvist 5'11 RD - Chytil 23, C  -6'3 -- Kravtsov 23,  6'2, W --Robertson 20, 6'4 LD-- 

 

Colorado-- Kadri will be a UFA this summer...Miller will fill big hole..

 

                1. Newhook 22, 5'11, C-- Byran 22, 6'1 LD

 

Columbus, Boston, NJ Devils,  are the other teams that will be interested in Miller....

                 

           

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

34 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We were doing “it” under Bruce.  Play .650 during the year.  Make the playoffs.  And ride Demko to the parade down Georgia. 

Silly Alien

 

Stop with the BS

 

If you are going make statements..............actually put some substance and thought into it!