Dazzle Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, stawns said: It means they gave up a drafted prospect who plays a very Tocchet kind of game for a couple months of a player who didn't play much and then bolted. Yeah, some of management's trades and acquisitions have been good, but they also have made some pretty questionable moves. Kratvsov was a worthwhile gamble I guess, but he really didn't do much while he was here, so maybe he knew that he wasn't cut out for the NHL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Just now, Dazzle said: Yeah, some of management's trades and acquisitions have been good, but they also have made some pretty questionable moves. Kratvsov was a worthwhile gamble I guess, but he really didn't do much while he was here, so maybe he knew that he wasn't cut out for the NHL. I don't think it's a huge deal and though I didn't like the deal at the time, I did say I thought it was a reasonable risk. It's unfortunate that it backfired and cost them a good prospect. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Can we all agree that a 4th line grinder isnt worth all this squabble? you can buy 4 more lockwoods if Boeser and Myers were at correct contracts True moneyball now is finding really good 3rd and 4th liners at a good price. (Vets that are still good but getting squeezed out by younger players who are marginally cheaper. For instance, we complained that losing Motte was a travesty until he went on to get more injuries. My guess is that you can sign him this year for 1m I would take him over lockwood at 250k-350k more. Those kinds of deals (250k swing) arent what screws a team. Its the Boeser type contracts where they re getting paid 2-3m more than their worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, CanucksJay said: Can we all agree that a 4th line grinder isnt worth all this squabble? you can buy 4 more lockwoods if Boeser and Myers were at correct contracts True moneyball now is finding really good 3rd and 4th liners at a good price. (Vets that are still good but getting squeezed out by younger players who are marginally cheaper. For instance, we complained that losing Motte was a travesty until he went on to get more injuries. My guess is that you can sign him this year for 1m I would take him over lockwood at 250k-350k more. Those kinds of deals (250k swing) arent what screws a team. Its the Boeser type contracts where they re getting paid 2-3m more than their worth. Who said it screwed the team. It's a thread about him signing in Russia, isn't it reasonable to look back at the original deal and discuss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted Lasso Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 26 minutes ago, stawns said: It means they gave up a drafted prospect who plays a very Tocchet kind of game for a couple months of a player who didn't play much and then bolted. I’m asking if there’s a cost to retaining VK’s rights going forward. Not interested in wallowing over Lockwood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Just now, stawns said: Who said it screwed the team. It's a thread about him signing in Russia, isn't it reasonable to look back at the original deal and discuss? Well you were crying about losing Lockwood for him.. I just don't think it's a big deal at all. I still think it's worthwhile to qualify Kravy and hope he has an amazing 2 years in the KHL and perhaps mature a bit and comeback to take another run at the NHL while we retain his rights. If he never comes back, it really only cost us a 4th line prospect... Im ok with these types of gambles but you seem to want to collect 4th liners at the expense of potential top 6 guys. If Kravy was a surefire top 6, it wouldn't have cost us Lockwood and a 7th. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 6 minutes ago, CanucksJay said: Well you were crying about losing Lockwood for him.. I just don't think it's a big deal at all. I still think it's worthwhile to qualify Kravy and hope he has an amazing 2 years in the KHL and perhaps mature a bit and comeback to take another run at the NHL while we retain his rights. If he never comes back, it really only cost us a 4th line prospect... Im ok with these types of gambles but you seem to want to collect 4th liners at the expense of potential top 6 guys. If Kravy was a surefire top 6, it wouldn't have cost us Lockwood and a 7th. Are you able to discuss without personal insults? As I said at the time of the trade, Lockwood was the better prospect at the time, but it was a reasonable gamble on VK's potential. It's unfortunate they gave up the better player and a pick and it backfired on them 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sell.the.team Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, stawns said: Are you able to discuss without personal insults? As I said at the time of the trade, Lockwood was the better prospect at the time, but it was a reasonable gamble on VK's potential. It's unfortunate they gave up the better player and a pick and it backfired on them i mean, i agree with you for the most part but i don't really see anything 'unfortunate' here... we gave up nothing for slightly more nothing. Ya there is no point in just trading away 2026 7th round picks for the sake of it but we took a flyer on a former 9th overall knowing there was a very good chance he would not be on our roster in a year's time. At least this way it appears he can try to develop for a couple years in Russia. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 1 hour ago, higgyfan said: Elite teams get past the 1st round of playoff games. They need their (Laff and Kakko) high draft picks if they want to move into the elite level. Last season they made it to the conference finals. And the Devils were a very good team and elite in their own right too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 1 hour ago, qwijibo said: It helps when elite players like Fox and Panarin are literally coming to you and refusing to play elsewhere. Well Canucks had OEL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Crossbar Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 53 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said: We never recovered from giving up Corrado either. The crying over losing an easily replaceable player is absurd. Emphasis on the crying ... again! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 (edited) No more drafting Russians please. Just too risky to waste a high pick on a player who might struggle and misses home. Podz has worked out okay, but not great. EDIT: I know VAN never drafted Krapsoft, but he's a young NHL player/prospect. Same dif. I want a NA player with some edge taken with the #11 Leonard Moore Barlow Wood These are the types of players the Canucks could use up front. Gamers who feel right at home. Edited May 23, 2023 by NUCKER67 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Just now, NUCKER67 said: No more drafting Russians please. Just too risky to waste a high pick on a player who might struggle and misses home. Podz has worked out okay, but not great. I want a NA player with some edge taken with the #11 Leonard Moore Barlow Wood These are the types of players the Canucks could use up front. Gamers who feel right at home. Our top 3 players last year were Petey, Miller, Kuzmenko. Russians are fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said: Our top 3 players last year were Petey, Miller, Kuzmenko. Russians are fine. Peteykov and Millerchenko? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Sell.the.team said: i mean, i agree with you for the most part but i don't really see anything 'unfortunate' here... we gave up nothing for slightly more nothing. Ya there is no point in just trading away 2026 7th round picks for the sake of it but we took a flyer on a former 9th overall knowing there was a very good chance he would not be on our roster in a year's time. At least this way it appears he can try to develop for a couple years in Russia. I don't think it's a huge deal either......it's a discussion thread about VK signing in Russia, so I'm offering my thoughts about it. I don't think he'll be back in NA Edited May 23, 2023 by stawns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said: Peteykov and Millerchenko? Just with how the season played out there is an argument for all 3 as our best player. Regardless a Russian was arguably our best player, and if we have a shot at Michkov at 11 they 100% need to go for it imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 17 hours ago, King Heffy said: There's something seriously wrong with a guy who voluntarily gives up a shot at the NHL to play in that barbaric hellhole. Let him rot wit the rest of the orcs. Not at all, he gave NHL his best shot but his greatest chance of carving out a good hockey career is in the KHL. Nothing wrong with his decision, it was the best course of action for him. I wouldn't have offered him more then a 2-way deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 17 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said: No more drafting Russians please. Just too risky to waste a high pick on a player who might struggle and misses home. Podz has worked out okay, but not great. EDIT: I know VAN never drafted Krapsoft, but he's a young NHL player/prospect. Same dif. I want a NA player with some edge taken with the #11 Leonard Moore Barlow Wood These are the types of players the Canucks could use up front. Gamers who feel right at home. This has nothing to do with him being Russian, and all to do with him not being good enough. I'll be you anything that he wasn't even offered a one way NHL deal by us, if any deal at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 Just now, canuck73_3 said: Just with how the season played out there is an argument for all 3 as our best player. Regardless a Russian was arguably our best player, and if we have a shot at Michkov at 11 they 100% need to go for it imo. If the Canucks drafted Michkov, I would become a big fan for sure, but I'd also be nervous that it wouldn't work out for him, as a young, undersized Russian. I mean, come on, when was the last time the Canucks drafted a Canadian kid with some size with their high 1st? Oh, wait, that was Jake. Never mind But seriously, that was in 2014, a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Crossbar Posted May 23, 2023 Share Posted May 23, 2023 I really liked Lockwood's game and physicality but wish he was bigger. I came to the realization before he was traded that he likely wouldn't crack our lineup and we needed to move on. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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