What would you have done to restore order mr Lennon?, sang imagine or friends.
I totally agree with the OP. Sometimes I wish I could just be on the ice to restore some order. How can a teammate not retaliate after something like that? I would have grabed Keith and beat the living hell out of him!!! It makes me so mad that we didn't destroy this piece of crap..
Edler's Friendly Discussion With Keith!
Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:24 AM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:26 AM
I like Chris Neil alot, wish Canucks traded for him last year when Sens were in the tanker but a legal solid hit like that does not deserve having someone come after you at all.
The more I watch the highlights of the hit, the more I'm disgusted by the boys lack of immediate reaction to the cheap shot.
No immediate reaction by any Canuck player is really disheartening. Part of me is willing to give the boys the benefit of the doubt in that maybe none of them saw the hit. Yes there was some targeted push back for a while, but sometimes a team just has to say "WE'RE NOT GOING TO TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!" and deal with the situation immediately.
To make matters worse, watching Edler standing there talking to Keith while one of his teammates and best players in the league is down on the ice just makes me froth at the mouth.
This isn't a one time issue either. Remember the rat's low bridge hit on Salo in Boston that again drew no reaction from the Canucks...other than again some friendly talking.
I just can't fathom the lack of reaction...especially when our powerplay has gone down the tubes. What would there be to lose??
Maybe I'm reading to much into it, but I can't think of another solid team with cup aspirations that would be as passive as this after cheap shots to their top players. To me this is a big warning signal that this team isn't as together chemistry wise as we'd like to believe and that something is not right with this team.
Why have we not called up Bitz and Duco again?
Edler's nice discussion (at 20 second mark): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M25I5rtFjiA
Kess & Henrik's pleasant discussion with the rat (at 20 second mark): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGD5DbljtfE
As a comparable, here's Chris Neils reaction to simply a solid hit tonight on Erik Karlsson from the Habs Mike Blunden (at 1:17 mark):
God I love Chris Neil!!!
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Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:28 AM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:29 AM
If you shoved your fingers in my mouth I'd bite them too!!!!!!
Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:02 AM
I'd rather have Steve Ott but...
Kassian will eventually be that guy ++++
No he won't, nor should he be.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:32 AM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:49 AM
And to the op what would you expect, truly tough teams will fight back when they have too. This turn the other cheek crap just gives them an excuse to be s bunch of p*****s. Can't expect edler to defend someone else when he won't even make eye contact with someone coming after him when he's just done throwing a dirty hit.
Fighting back seems like a solution in the short-term but in the end it's the culture of the sport that's the issue here. Maybe it's simple for me to say but there won't be this need for tough guys to "defend" other players (fact of the matter is it's not possible to "defend" someone when they've already been attacked and injured-- it's more the matter of just PROVING that the aggressor will receive "an-eye-for-an-eye" style of treatment as a DETERRENT) if the dirty hitters (and teams/ coaches e.g. *cough* Boston *cough*, *cough* ClaudeJulien *cough*) who are noted repeat offenders on two or more injurious instances, or who have had history of committing head shots, high hits or hits from behind, slew foots, submarine hits, elbows, Marchanding,... etc. are suspended on EACH instance, without pay, for as long as the injured player is out for (with their ejection immediately following the injurious hit), plus they have to cover the injured player's medical bill for the duration of their treatment.
I think something that's adequately heavy would be punishments like:
If the hitter commits more than two (i.e. on their 3rd occasion) of these dirty hits they should be suspended for the rest of the season. When they've made their fourth they should be permanently banned. Coaches who, following a dirty play, send out their goons/ agitators to stage fights also get tossed and fined heavily, and the team should be warned and also fined heavily if it's made known that they're encouraging these kinds of plays (I mean if the NFL could enforce something like this for deliberate head shots on opponents' stars, and football's a far more dangerous sport, I don't see why the NHL shouldn't: http://bleacherrepor...t-will-help-nfl.)
My reason for this is that we're not only talking about an individual's livelihood here but possibly their health over their lifetime. I think these punishments need to be so heavy because it would be motivation for the dirty players to wake up, smell the coffee and clean up their game and forces them to realize that there's absolutely no tolerance for their dirty plays. Also, coaches and management also need to be made to realize that these types of plays will simply not be tolerated but that they will be met with stiff penalties and fines so that they don't offer these dangerous players with such expensive contracts as incentives to basically be weapons on the ice for the team. In the end, these guys end up making these dangerous maneuvers with absolute disregard and neglect of other peoples' health simply to save their own playing time and role on the team.
What's worse is that right now the league hands out these minor, inconsistent punishments (some dirty hits (like the Lucic-Miller hit) get nothing, some get a minor penalty for 2 minutes in the bin and even severe hits like these only get 5 game bans with no future repercussions to deter these guys from being absolute idiots with 200+ pound weapons in the future after their suspensions, when their couple-game bans become merely afterthoughts in their rear view mirror. Fact of the matter is, anger in the moment, great salaries and knowing that they can make these dirty hits without suspension AND that they'll be more valued on the team as "bodyguards" which solidifies their spot and contract on the team gives the Marchands, Lucic's, Carcillo's, etc. more incentive to run around at full speed and basically headhunt their opponents and hit and ragdoll them in many ways.
I'd say it's much better if the league took action as the invigilating force than for a bunch of guys to take out their frustrations on each other and basically pummel each other when it doesn't do justice for their injured teammate, nor does it actually realistically prevent the repeat offenders from doing what they did again. If you think about it, policing doesn't actually work knowing how guys like Marchand and Chara will be defended by the McQuaid's, Boychuk's, Lucic's and Thornton's and how the Bruins actually encourage this kind of play. Furthermore, who will actually get the revenge they believe they deserve for themselves if the aggressor's someone like John Scott of Chara, who'll only fight someone who he can beat or at least wrestle down? Ceremonial fights don't really cut it if the player who did the dirty play (e.g. Marchand) didn't even have to stand up for himself fairly (i.e. not defended by goons). If the league really brought the hammer down on the repeat offender that'll be the best justice for the injured player and team who lost their player.
Sorry for the long post
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Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:55 AM
Sedins have been playing "their" way ever since they got drafted, but I don't see how hard it is to at least face wash the guy or push him against the boards.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:55 AM
time to move on use this as motivation to prove they can win with out Daniel this team has been playing with no motivation for a month now this could be a spark to unite the boys. that being said i hope danny isn't out to long.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:00 PM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:04 PM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:05 PM
At least 2 of his points came while on the ice with the Sedins, so not exactly as a 4th liner. He didn't impress the team enough to risk losing Weiss on waivers in order to open a roster spot.
Weise is useless if you ask me. And yes he did get 2 points with the sedins even still the sedins were struggling during that stretch until bitz came in. Weise got for 4 points over the 74 games he played. If people wont give bitz credit for sedin points he still had 2 points in 5 games which is much better then weise. Again in 8 games bitz accumulated as many points as weise in 74.
It baffles me what you guys expect from a 4th liner.
But thats not even the point, were discussing sticking up for teammates, would you rather have bitz on ice to fight, or dale weise???
Also dale did nothing that night against kieth, i have no doubts bitz would have tried to do more to get someone to fight.
Edited by Ghostdivision, 24 March 2012 - 12:21 PM.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:06 PM
There is not way in hell that you can complain about the response.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:07 PM
It's time for MG to call up Bitz!
Nobody would go up against this line:
Bitz - Lapierre - Kassian - scary looking.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:09 PM
I am extremely aware we are talking about a fourth liner that's why what he did with the Sedins is irrelevant and how many points he put up is irrelevant.
Byron Bitz can actually fight? He didn't answer that during his eight games. He fought Cody McLeod, the worst fighter in the NHL after Dale Weise, and that's it. He had the opportunity to fight guys who are decent fighters like Cam Janssen, Tim Jackman, Brad Staubitz, etc.
Could you say he was a menace on the forecheck in the eight games? Did he intimidate the opposition? Was his presence felt on the fourth line?
I struggle to pinpoint anything to warrant the hype.
Cody mcleod as mentioned by myself is not the best fighter, but hes miles ahead of dale weise.
Hes a 4th liner, is there any hype? I would take him to be our fighter over weise in a second. And as for what he did you keep saying you understand the role of a 4th liner, I would say he was definitely physical and noticed on ice while here, there was alot of talk about him especially for a 4th liner.
We can keep going around in circles but i would take bitz to fight for me over weise without question.
Weise would loose to mcleoad by the way, his fight last night in dallas was one of the worst i have seen in awhile.
Edited by Ghostdivision, 24 March 2012 - 12:16 PM.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:17 PM
To many gawkers on the bench and on the ice...wtf was anyone looking at if they missed the hit??? Lame excuses. The refs arent calling crap -- AV has to start protecting asserts --- not being niave to think the ref will call the game.
In retrospect the team is not one --- coaching is the biggest part of this, people called this that one of the twins would be hurt because of the lack of the team sticking up for them.
THE WORST move to make by coach AV would be to take Kassian off the same line as Henrik ... this should have been done games ago to protect the twins....fking bllshiat that AV does NOTHING to help the star players on this team....fking bllshiat the league still condones headshots...
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:18 PM
Everyone is mad at the league but if it aint taking care of buisness the way you see fit....Police the game yourself. I think the canucks first priority in the offseason is to get a guy to play with sedins, who will score 20+ goals and police situations to ensure this crap dont happen. OTT, Neil, Hartnell...This is honeslty disgaceful that, keith didnt have to pay on the ice after this happened.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:25 PM
i don't mean a dirty revenge hit, but someone had to drop the gloves. if another team is taking liberties and you let that keep going, it's gonna keep happening. taking a 2 min instigator penalty is a lot cheaper than dealing with concussions and people not respecting your team. if i'm a player and i see anything out of the corner of my eye on a teammate that seems like it might not be kosher, i'd rather take the risk of fighting someone who didn't deserve it than the risk of not standing up for a teammate.
O Ville Lumière, Sens la chaleur, de notre coeur
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:30 PM
1. Chara and the 2 linesmen quickly jumped in to protect Marchand, cornering him so nobody could get to him. All 5 guys could pile in and nobody would lay a finger on him. What would be the point of that? The only thing that would've accomplished was shortening that Major PP.
2. Unlike us, the players do not have a bird's eye view of most of the ice rink while watching the game. Seeing as how the puck wasn't on Daniel's stick at the time, it's clear most of them missed it. Ray Ferraro even called it a High Stick before the first instant replay.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:31 PM
Future Canucks top 6:
Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:20 PM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:21 PM
On the Keith hit, forget challenging him to a fight. Challenging is for when you want to pick a game up or to resolve borderline play. When a player takes a shot like that at your #1 player don't give him the choice, just jump him, no hesitation, no negotiation, just do it.
Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:13 PM
Posted 24 March 2012 - 10:30 PM