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The ridiculous US - Canada consumer goods price difference investigated


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#31 hudson bay rules

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 11:43 AM

The dairy industry is also heavily subsidized in the US, hence the lower prices on cheese, milk etc.


Add to that the Dairy boards and the like in Canada that limit producers and keep prices high.

http://en.wikipedia....airy_Commission
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#32 key2thecup

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:29 PM

So the taxes in Canada/Bc are too high?
Want equal prices with the States?
It can be arranged just do the following:

get rid of universal medical care
get rid of ICBC
get rid of bc Hydro
grow Canada's population by 10 times.

Feel free to add to the list of things that need to go to become our southern neighbours.


Seriously? Our taxes cover those things.

These tariffs go back decades, when it was more expensive logistically and our dollar was worth 0.60 cents US.
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#33 Electro Rock

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 02:15 PM

The price that has to be paid for living in a wonderful Country :wub:


I would rather pay less and live in a better one.
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#34 SkeeterHansen

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 02:21 PM

I would rather pay less and live in a better one.


Canada.
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#35 Mr. Ambien

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 02:37 PM

I would rather pay less and live in a better one.

You can here in Canada, it just requires both research and the ability to drive to the states occasionally.

Edited by zaibatsu, 14 February 2013 - 02:37 PM.

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#36 22Sedinery33

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 02:41 PM

Keep in mind regarding food quality in the States is disgustingly low compared to ours.
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#37 MrsCanuck

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 02:53 PM

Ridiculous prices here. I go down to the States to do most of my shopping (aside from food and everyday essentials).
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#38 J.R.

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:06 PM

Keep in mind regarding food quality in the States is disgustingly low compared to ours.


Indeed. I'd ONLY buy organic milk down there. The stuff they put in their "regular" milk... :sick:
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#39 Electro Rock

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:07 PM

Keep in mind regarding food quality in the States is disgustingly low compared to ours.


Maybe at those trashy roadside all-you-can-eat buffets, but not otherwise.

You can buy only the premium versions of any given food or drink in the U.S. and STILL come out cheaper than Canada.
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#40 Aladeen

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 08:53 PM

I would rather pay less and live in a better one.

there are a lot of countries you can live in paying less!! Some off the top of my head would be Syria, Iran, North Korea, Burma... not sure how good their public libraries are though.
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#41 hudson bay rules

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 08:57 PM

Keep in mind regarding food quality in the States is disgustingly low compared to ours.


They have more variety. From top notch to utter crap.
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#42 Electro Rock

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 08:37 AM

there are a lot of countries you can live in paying less!! Some off the top of my head would be Syria, Iran, North Korea, Burma... not sure how good their public libraries are though.


This is Canada vs the U.S., not Canada vs the 3rd world.

Anyway, its a fact that, with the exception of NYC and a few other areas, an average income in the U.S. will allow you to live what would be basically considered an upper middle class lifestyle by Canadian standards.

For me I'd have to take home another $20K per year or have my housing costs paid for to cover the difference, and that still wouldn't compensate for the fact that the U.S. simply has a lot more to offer, for the competent at least.
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#43 Lockout Casualty

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:03 AM

This is Canada vs the U.S., not Canada vs the 3rd world.

Anyway, its a fact that, with the exception of NYC and a few other areas, an average income in the U.S. will allow you to live what would be basically considered an upper middle class lifestyle by Canadian standards.

For me I'd have to take home another $20K per year or have my housing costs paid for to cover the difference, and that still wouldn't compensate for the fact that the U.S. simply has a lot more to offer, for the competent at least.


What is holding you in Canada?
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#44 Electro Rock

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:30 AM

What is holding you in Canada?


The huge difficulty of getting a long term work visa and ultimately permanent resident status, especially with the economy being the way it is now.

It sucks because I had it all in the palm of my hand years ago, before the laws changed and made it very difficult, however some of my family members went and sabotaged it for me.

Now I have major health issues, and am not sure if I'm I'm going to make it, however I'm going to make damn sure that I don't die in Canada!


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#45 taxi

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:36 AM

The dairy industry is also heavily subsidized in the US, hence the lower prices on cheese, milk etc.


Don't believe the BS from the Canadian dairy board monopoly. The USA does receive subsidies, but they are small when compared to the industry as a whole. Subsides in the USA vary wildly by year, they range from 1 million to 1 billion dollars a year:

http://farm.ewg.org/...&progcode=dairy

There are, however, 300 million people in the USA. Even during the years with the highest subsidies you are talking about $3 per person. Is that really going to impact prices? Consider how much each person spends every year on dairy. Include milk, cheese, yogourt, cream, butter, ice cream, etc...

The real reason prices are so high in Canada is the Dairy Board. It started out as way to protect small dairy farmers, but has now become a way to enforce a monopoly. They limit new people from entering the business. They fix prices. They fix supply. They control imports.

The USA's system is much much better than ours. We need to axe the board immediately. It would increase revunues, and, thereby, taxes. We could then afford to give a small portion of those taxes back via subsidies, if need be. We've recently axed the wheat board and need to do the same for dairy.
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#46 Lockout Casualty

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:39 AM

The huge difficulty of getting a long term work visa and ultimately permanent resident status, especially with the economy being the way it is now.

It sucks because I had it all in the palm of my hand years ago, before the laws changed and made it very difficult, however some of my family members went and sabotaged it for me.

Now I have major health issues, and am not sure if I'm I'm going to make it, however I'm going to make damn sure that I don't die in Canada!


Stupid Obama and his pre-existing conditions coverage, amirite.

Well, I guess enjoy that socialist healthcare in Canada until you're ready to kick the bucket, what can I say. Oh, and don't appreciate it. :rolleyes:
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#47 J.R.

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:44 AM

The huge difficulty of getting a long term work visa and ultimately permanent resident status, especially with the economy being the way it is now.

It sucks because I had it all in the palm of my hand years ago, before the laws changed and made it very difficult, however some of my family members went and sabotaged it for me.

Now I have major health issues, and am not sure if I'm I'm going to make it, however I'm going to make damn sure that I don't die in Canada!


And you want to leave a country with socialized medicine....?
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#48 Aladeen

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:46 AM

Stupid Obama and his pre-existing conditions coverage, amirite.

Well, I guess enjoy that socialist healthcare in Canada until you're ready to kick the bucket, what can I say. Oh, and don't appreciate it. :rolleyes:

Classic
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#49 Electro Rock

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:34 AM

And you want to leave a country with socialized medicine....?


I wouldn't have made it this far if it wasn't for me paying out of pocket for better doctors and health care facilities in the U.S.

In fact I may well have not gotten sick in the first place.

The other thing is I probably would have been easily worth an extra $800K by now if I had been allowed to emigrate, that buys a lot of extra health care.
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#50 J.R.

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:37 AM

I don't know what your ailment is but I nearly died a few years ago from cancer and our apparently sub-par medical system managed to turn that around for me....
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#51 Wetcoaster

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:49 AM

I don't know what your ailment is but I nearly died a few years ago from cancer and our apparently sub-par medical system managed to turn that around for me....

I can also put my Big C diagnosis and treatment in the same category. Heck I was even considered terminal at one point and was placed in an experimental drug program that worked.

My uncle in Texas was virtually bankrupted with heart problems whereas my father here in BC who had serious heart issues as well saw no effect on his personal finances.
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#52 Electro Rock

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:49 AM

I don't know what your ailment is but I nearly died a few years ago from cancer and our apparently sub-par medical system managed to turn that around for me....


Its great for easily identifiable problems, but it sucks for issues that are not, my not being suffiently fluent in speaking "Canadian" when describing symptoms doesn't help I'm sure.
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#53 J.R.

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:57 AM

I can also put my Big C diagnosis and treatment in the same category. Heck I was even considered terminal at one point and was placed in an experimental drug program that worked.

My uncle in Texas was virtually bankrupted with heart problems whereas my father here in BC who had serious heart issues as well saw no effect on his personal finances.


What a terrible system we have :rolleyes:
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#54 jmfaminoff

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 02:40 PM

The dairy industry is also heavily subsidized in the US, hence the lower prices on cheese, milk etc.

Absolutely. Another factor is that wages are significantly higher in Canada.

Energy prices are also way cheaper.

Land is cheaper.

There is a greater distribution network established, and it is closer to the point of manufacture/distribution.

Wages are lower. A clerk working at Wal-mart in US after two years may only make $10.00 an hour whereas a clerk at Save on Foods who works two years makes $22.20--that is over $46,000 a year.
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#55 jmfaminoff

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 02:42 PM

The dairy industry is also heavily subsidized in the US, hence the lower prices on cheese, milk etc.

Absolutely.

Energy prices are also cheaper.

Land is cheaper.

There is a greater distribution network established, and it is closer to the point of manufacture/distribution.

Wages are lower: A clerk working at Wal-mart in US after two years may only make $10.00 an hour whereas a clerk at Save on Foods who works two years makes $22.20--that is over $46,000 a year

Edited by jmfaminoff, 15 February 2013 - 02:43 PM.

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#56 jmfaminoff

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 02:56 PM

What a terrible system we have :rolleyes:

The healthcare system is fast if you have good insurance and a means to pay. I had a medical problem earlier this week. On Tuesday I went to ER, had a CT scan, was stabilized, and then sent home with instructions to see my family doctor the next morning. I saw my family doctor on Wednesday who then sent to me the specialist on Thursday. I saw the specialist and last night I had surgery in a private hospital. I am at home doing okay. Too bad I have to go in for another surgery in two weeks. At least I will still be able to go and see the Canucks play next Thursday in Dallas. Without insurance this would cost at least $60,000 before all is said and done. Thank God we have good medical insurance with very low copays.
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#57 J.R.

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 02:57 PM

Don't believe the BS from the Canadian dairy board monopoly. The USA does receive subsidies, but they are small when compared to the industry as a whole. Subsides in the USA vary wildly by year, they range from 1 million to 1 billion dollars a year:

http://farm.ewg.org/...&progcode=dairy

There are, however, 300 million people in the USA. Even during the years with the highest subsidies you are talking about $3 per person. Is that really going to impact prices? Consider how much each person spends every year on dairy. Include milk, cheese, yogourt, cream, butter, ice cream, etc...

The real reason prices are so high in Canada is the Dairy Board. It started out as way to protect small dairy farmers, but has now become a way to enforce a monopoly. They limit new people from entering the business. They fix prices. They fix supply. They control imports.

The USA's system is much much better than ours. We need to axe the board immediately. It would increase revunues, and, thereby, taxes. We could then afford to give a small portion of those taxes back via subsidies, if need be. We've recently axed the wheat board and need to do the same for dairy.


Who said I was quoting the Dairy board?

FWIW, I'm not disputing that what you said does have an effect on Canadian prices but did you also include the massive corn subsidies (feed) in the US and their effect on dairy prices in your "calculations"?
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#58 Wetcoaster

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 03:37 PM

Keep in mind regarding food quality in the States is disgustingly low compared to ours.

Perhaps not?


There are now 75 people from across the country who have joined a $17-million class-action lawsuit against the company that was behind Canada’s largest beef recall.


Last fall, at least 18 cases of illness from E. coli contamination were linked to tainted beef that came from the plant in Brooks, Alta.


The suit was launched in October by an Edmonton man, Matthew Harrison, who got sick after eating the tainted beef at a friend’s home in September.


The lawsuit, which has been picked up by an Edmonton law firm, is now asking for $17 million in damages for emotional and physical trauma, loss of income and other expenses by plaintiffs.


The lawsuit alleges that the XL plant knew of poor quality control and concealed that information from consumers and regulators.


The allegations have not been proven in court.


Lawyers are expected to appear before the court on the matter in October.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/story/2013/02/15/edmonton-xl-foods-lawsuit.html
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#59 silverpig

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 03:53 PM

So the taxes in Canada/Bc are too high?
Want equal prices with the States?
It can be arranged just do the following:

get rid of universal medical care
get rid of ICBC
get rid of bc Hydro
grow Canada's population by 10 times.

Feel free to add to the list of things that need to go to become our southern neighbours.


Our healthcare is cheaper to run than for-profit health care in the US.

I paid slightly less for insurance with ICBC in Vancouver than I did with State Farm in Toronto. Same car and everything.

As for BC Hydro, go look at the price of electricity across North America. The only place that has prices even close to BC Hydro is Hydro Quebec (they are slightly cheaper, and are a crown corp too). BC Hydro rates are ~9c/kWh. In NYC it's something like 30c/kWh. Most places pay 70-100% more than people in BC do.

Examples:

-Regular gas at a Shell station in Burnaby cost $1.36 per litre on Tuesday, but went for the equivalent of $1 per litre at a Tesoro station in Bellingham.

-The price disparity between a Safeway in downtown Vancouver and a Haggen grocery store in Bellingham reveals why: Roughly $3 vs. $2 for a two-litre carton of milk, $10 vs. $8 for 454 grams of chicken breasts, $3 vs. $2 for the same weight in broccoli and an incredible $18 vs. $6 for 900 grams of cheddar cheese, taxes not included.

-A 750-ml bottle of Black Velvet Canadian Whiskey costs less than $14 at a Bellingham liquor store, but nearly $25 at a B.C. Liquor store in downtown Vancouver, taxes included. Cross-border customers could shell out $10 for a bottle of Columbia Crest Chardonnay and just over $8 for a six-pack of Budweiser cans in Bellingham, instead of about $16 and $13 north of the 49th parallel for the exact same products, respectively.

-A hardcover copy of Fifty Shades of Grey costs about $16 before tax at a Bellingham Barnes & Noble, but $32 at a Vancouver Chapters.

http://www.vancouver...5723/story.html


Most of those have nothing to do with the manufacturer. The difference in gas is almost entirely taxes. You can see this by checking prices in Langley (in the GVRD) and Abbotsford (not in the GVRD). There is a GVRD tax that adds a few cents to the price. Also, because gasoline is a commodity, the margins are insanely low and gas stations make most of their margin on the stuff you buy in the store.

Milk prices here are subject to heavy government regulations. There is an artificial price floor set by the government that the price of milk can never drop below.

The price of liquor is also heavily affected by taxes.

If you want to complain about Safeway, check prices at the Safeway on 10th avenue in Vancouver just off UBC campus and compare them to a Safeway out in Surrey. Same stuff, different prices.

The book thing is a good one though.
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#60 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 03:55 PM

Its great for easily identifiable problems, but it sucks for issues that are not, my not being suffiently fluent in speaking "Canadian" when describing symptoms  doesn't help I'm sure.


Somebody's been watching way too much "House"....
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