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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 6.0


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#91 Edlerberry

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:53 AM

Tanev: I watch this kid and still shake my head. Not big enough, just a matter of time before he gets tagged, hasn't happened.


i have yet to see Tanev make a mistake. In fact, he pretty much is 100% on playing the pucks he needs to play effectively. He uses good positioning and good decision making more consistently than any other member of our blue line this year. He has been adding an extra gear to his jump and it hasn't affected his defensive play at all - something that cant be said about the Bieksa or the Edler.

Also the guy who said Boyes, "Harmonic" AND a (top 5)first for Luongo... lol
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July 7-2013

Toronto will take a step back next year.
Feel free to quote me.


July 8-2013

Wow I can't believe peoples replies...
Im done here. You people are disgusting..


#92 elvis15

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 11:12 AM

Just have to say this...YUCK!!! Nino Niederreiter has "Filatov" disappointment all over him. Didn't he also want out, just like Nino does? He has played 64 NHL games has 3 points and is a -30. THAT'S THE MEAT AND POTATOES IN YOUR DEAL?! :picard:. The first isn't going to even be that great. However valuable picks are going to be in this draft, it's not worth it.

That being said, I do believe RW depth is needed, just like you mentioned. There are better ways of getting said depth though. I would personally like to get Teddy Purcell from Tampa. That one would take one of our goalies for sure! Any better ideas for RW depth?

Fair consideration regarding Niederreiter, he was used primarily as a depth forward last year and played a fair amount on the 4th line. His stats suffered as a result but he has shown at international competitions he can be one of the better players on the ice.

As far as his asking out, he wasn't even invited to camp by the Isles. That was after he'd been performing quite well in the AHL this season, and to not even give him and invite and then send him back down after a few days due to roster space limitations isn't exactly a vote of confidence from the team.

Having said that, I wouldn't think of him as a centerpiece in any deal. If we were to get their 1st round pick, or another reasonable significant prospect or roster player as another part of the deal, I wouldn't have any issue with Niederreiter being included in a Luongo deal. I'd ask for even a little more if it was Schneider they were asking for back, of course.

Roberto isn't going anywhere. He has an NTC and won't waive it. End of thread... or rename thread to Schneider trade thread.

It's best for the team. Shcneidner will get a better return than luongo will. We need to win the cup this year. Luongo is the better goalie right now and w.e we can get in return for Schneider will get us over the hump

So, just to clarify, you've unearthed proof that Luongo won't waive his NTC for any trade despite all the interviews since the playoffs last year when he's been saying he's open to a trade to help the team? And you have more rumours about Schneider being traded floating around that would warrant changing this thread from Luongo speculation to Schneider speculation as it's main focal point?

I thought so.

Schneider isn't going anywhere, MG has paid that clear, Luongo is the one going, we need to win a cup, and it's Schneiders time.

Unequivocal statements form one side don't warrant the same from the other. Gillis has said he'll look at any deal that improves the Canucks, regardless of the player involved. He did say he hasn't been fielding offers for Schneider and Luongo is the one currently involved in the discussions with other teams, but both sides of the argument could use a little bit of wiggle room to allow for the opposite to happen.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#93 oldnews

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 11:46 AM

Isles gonna bite the Dipietro bullet - cue the mystery team and player to do something with...

Luo, Ebbett for Cizikas, Nelson, Pokka, Nabokov.
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#94 Boudrias

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:25 PM

i have yet to see Tanev make a mistake. In fact, he pretty much is 100% on playing the pucks he needs to play effectively. He uses good positioning and good decision making more consistently than any other member of our blue line this year. He has been adding an extra gear to his jump and it hasn't affected his defensive play at all - something that cant be said about the Bieksa or the Edler.

Also the guy who said Boyes, "Harmonic" AND a (top 5)first for Luongo... lol

He has a real ability to fish the puck out of a scrum and then move it. I made a crack about his size but he isn't any smaller than the young kid in Ottawa, Karlsson.
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#95 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:36 PM

Very good point. If AV has his way, Tanev will never be traded. He is such a safe player. I am curious to see what he will do with Edler after a few games.

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#96 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:49 PM

Fair consideration regarding Niederreiter, he was used primarily as a depth forward last year and played a fair amount on the 4th line. His stats suffered as a result but he has shown at international competitions he can be one of the better players on the ice.

As far as his asking out, he wasn't even invited to camp by the Isles. That was after he'd been performing quite well in the AHL this season, and to not even give him and invite and then send him back down after a few days due to roster space limitations isn't exactly a vote of confidence from the team.

Having said that, I wouldn't think of him as a centerpiece in any deal. If we were to get their 1st round pick, or another reasonable significant prospect or roster player as another part of the deal, I wouldn't have any issue with Niederreiter being included in a Luongo deal. I'd ask for even a little more if it was Schneider they were asking for back, of course.



Oh, neither would I. He is a bit of a relclaimation project though. By comparison, Filatov was traded for a 3rd and still didn't make the NHL. He is also a plus player in the games he has played in the NHL as well. By that approximation, Nino is probably worth a 4th at best now. Maybe a 3rd, but that's a stretch and only because he seems to want to stay in the NHL. Either way though, the point is that the equivalent of a 4th round pick is not the meat in any deal for either including our goalies. And the only reason I would say we take a flyer on him is that he is a RW and the Wolves need more offense.
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#97 The Bookie

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:51 PM

Isles gonna bite the Dipietro bullet - cue the mystery team and player to do something with...

Luo, Ebbett for Cizikas, Nelson, Pokka, Nabokov.


Sold.
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#98 elvis15

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:00 PM

Oh, neither would I. He is a bit of a relclaimation project though. By comparison, Filatov was traded for a 3rd and still didn't make the NHL. He is also a plus player in the games he has played in the NHL as well. By that approximation, Nino is probably worth a 4th at best now. Maybe a 3rd, but that's a stretch and only because he seems to want to stay in the NHL. Either way though, the point is that the equivalent of a 4th round pick is not the meat in any deal for either including our goalies. And the only reason I would say we take a flyer on him is that he is a RW and the Wolves need more offense.

But I'm saying I don't think they're directly comparable just by their stat lines. Filatov had better opportunity at top 6/top 9 minutes where Niederreiter hasn't. He still has good upside where people had started to see enough of Filatov in a similar role to what he was projected for to understand he was going to be a project.

The debate about what he is worth is interesting, and I'm not sure he is worth more than your suggesting, just that I don't think we can calculate his value based on what Filatov has done. Interesting discussion though, and if he's a worthy return for a potential goalie trade.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#99 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:24 PM

Well, is Kyle Turris when he played on the 4th line in Phoenix a better comparison?
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#100 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:26 PM

But I'm saying I don't think they're directly comparable just by their stat lines. Filatov had better opportunity at top 6/top 9 minutes where Niederreiter hasn't. He still has good upside where people had started to see enough of Filatov in a similar role to what he was projected for to understand he was going to be a project.

The debate about what he is worth is interesting, and I'm not sure he is worth more than your suggesting, just that I don't think we can calculate his value based on what Filatov has done. Interesting discussion though, and if he's a worthy return for a potential goalie trade.

I forgot to add the quote. Question still stands though. Is Kyle Turris when he played in Phoenix a better comparison?
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#101 oldnews

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:31 PM

Well, is Kyle Turris when he played on the 4th line in Phoenix a better comparison?


Perhaps - and Turris went for Rundblad (a first round pick) and a 2nd - which is a comparison of what you'd have to give up for Neiderreiter, who isn't the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th - if he was, every GM in the NHL would be lined up for the pole position on that deal.
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#102 elvis15

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:36 PM

Well, is Kyle Turris when he played on the 4th line in Phoenix a better comparison?

Perhaps - and Turris went for Rundblad (a first round pick) and a 2nd - which is a comparison of what you'd have to give up for Neiderreiter, who isn't the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th - if he was, every GM in the NHL would be lined up for the pole position on that deal.

Comparison's are tough at any point, but I agree that's closer.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#103 Truckin

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 01:38 PM

I doubt we would get Nino Niederreiter in any trade without overpaying. The hype around him is on par with say Turris last year.
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#104 TmanVan

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 02:40 PM

What's with these Nino - Filatov comparisons? One is a whiny, soft Russian, who bolted pretty much as soon as he was sent to the Ahl. Nino is a power forward, former Whl player, who plays like a Canadian and isn't a threat to flee, he just wants a fair shot.
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#105 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 04:38 PM

Isles gonna bite the Dipietro bullet - cue the mystery team and player to do something with...

Luo, Ebbett for Cizikas, Nelson, Pokka, Nabokov.


I don't think they are going to buy him out, as it's not realistic for there franchise. Rather just send him down and give Poulin a chance since Rick is playing bad.

Just my opinion though, hopefully I am wrong, maybe that will open up a possibility at a Luongo deal to NYI.
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#106 Garrison

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 04:51 PM

Nino's trade value has decreased significantly. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go for a 2nd round pick. his numbers in the NHL are awful.

For those talking about Tanev: he is a true defense man. He is almost like Lidstrom (obviously not as good) but he plays that sort of way. He makes barely any mistakes!! His only fault is his shot. He often fans and it isn't very hard. Hopefully he can work on that.
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#107 elvis15

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 05:34 PM

I don't think they are going to buy him out, as it's not realistic for there franchise. Rather just send him down and give Poulin a chance since Rick is playing bad.

Just my opinion though, hopefully I am wrong, maybe that will open up a possibility at a Luongo deal to NYI.

Well, they don't want to pay him for the duration of his contract to sit in the minors either. If it came to that or a regular buyout, they'd choose the buyout. They're hoping someone will pick him up though, either off waivers or somehow in a trade where they sweeten the pot.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#108 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 06:02 PM

Perhaps - and Turris went for Rundblad (a first round pick) and a 2nd - which is a comparison of what you'd have to give up for Neiderreiter, who isn't the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th - if he was, every GM in the NHL would be lined up for the pole position on that deal.

Lol, you missed the point. Kyle Turris played on the 4th line for Phoenix and managed 20 and 25 points, respectively in his full seasons there. In that situation, there's an argument for potential. Which is why Ottawa paid that much for him. As it turns out, probably too much. And he is a plus player as well.... What has Nino done with his chance at the NHL level 3 points and -30. Makes sense, right?
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#109 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 06:05 PM

Well, they don't want to pay him for the duration of his contract to sit in the minors either. If it came to that or a regular buyout, they'd choose the buyout. They're hoping someone will pick him up though, either off waivers or somehow in a trade where they sweeten the pot.


Would rather pay the duration that pay it all up front though probably.
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#110 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 06:38 PM

Bertuzzi was a bust as well, and we gave up Linden for him?

Not saying Nino = Bert.

What I am saying is you have to take risks in trades. Some will be busts, but some have yet to be given the development they need and used correctly.

Some other guys: Higgins was a bust, Kassian was becoming a bust, Lapierre was a bust, Naslund was a bust... Risks do pan out, some guys also get over being frustrated that they are no longer top line guys and suddenly realize they have to work their arse off just to stay in the league... Malhotra, Bernier, Torres... All have some value still.

A former 43 goal scorer, a number 5 overall pick (6'2" 208 lbs) and a first rounder in a deep talented draft, even with risks, is a pretty good haul!

Just have to say this...YUCK!!! Nino Niederreiter has "Filatov" disappointment all over him. Didn't he also want out, just like Nino does? He has played 64 NHL games has 3 points and is a -30. THAT'S THE MEAT AND POTATOES IN YOUR DEAL?! :picard:. The first isn't going to even be that great. However valuable picks are going to be in this draft, it's not worth it.

That being said, I do believe RW depth is needed, just like you mentioned. There are better ways of getting said depth though. I would personally like to get Teddy Purcell from Tampa. That one would take one of our goalies for sure! Any better ideas for RW depth?


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#111 oldnews

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 07:00 PM

People here thinking Neidereiter will be a giveaway are taking his numbers last year out of context.
He played 10 minutes a game on the fourth line, as a 19 year old, and the bulk of his minutes were with Jay Pandolfo, who had 3 points in 62 games, and Tim Wallace, who had a single point. When you look at his underlying numbers, he was only a -4.5 relative corsi, while getting only 46% offensive zone starts, and 49.3% finishes. It was an extremely odd way to use a highly skilled bluechip prospect, but his lack of production and +/- say very little about the young player.
He's still a tremendous talent, and if the Isles are prepared to dump him for a 2nd, there would be a hell of a lot of suitors. I'd be shocked if he could be had for that, and would chalk that up to idiotic player management.
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#112 Noseforthenet

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 11:49 PM

People here thinking Neidereiter will be a giveaway are taking his numbers last year out of context.
He played 10 minutes a game on the fourth line, as a 19 year old, and the bulk of his minutes were with Jay Pandolfo, who had 3 points in 62 games, and Tim Wallace, who had a single point. When you look at his underlying numbers, he was only a -4.5 relative corsi, while getting only 46% offensive zone starts, and 49.3% finishes. It was an extremely odd way to use a highly skilled bluechip prospect, but his lack of production and +/- say very little about the young player.
He's still a tremendous talent, and if the Isles are prepared to dump him for a 2nd, there would be a hell of a lot of suitors. I'd be shocked if he could be had for that, and would chalk that up to idiotic player management.

I thought good players made people around them better....
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#113 sampy

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 12:14 AM

Does McPhee really think his job will be safe if he places in the bottom of the Western Conference with the owner spending to the cap? The goaltending is the obvious issue and Lu would help the Caps greatly on and off the ice. How long will McPhee wait before he does something?

Realistic Fair Trade:
Lu and Ballard
For
Carlson and Neuvirth

Dream Trade:
Lu, Ballard, Connaughton, 2nd, 3rd
For
Neuvirth, Carlson and Forsberg
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#114 Truckin

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 01:57 AM

I think we would do better not packaging Ballard with Lou,for some reason I feel like we get more trading them individually to different teams. If it ends up being the Capitals or Isles I honestly would be happy with young promising players.

Nino Niederreiter,Ryan Strome, Griffen Reinhart,Kyle Okposo for the Isles. Say 2 of them and a draft pick.

Filip Forsberg,Evgeny Kuznetsov,Tom Wilson and Marcus Johansson.Same deal as with the Isles 2 and a pick.
Much more willing to take a goalie back from Washington than the Isles.

I think we need to start building for the future and the idea that our window is closing because our core is older is not something I buy into as much as the media likes to play it up. I know they love to see us go for broke and then laugh when we sold our future to get it.

As for Ballard we can swap him for a plug this year near the trade deadline or keep him till draft,not to critical for me. The forward surplus of say Higgins,Raymond and Hanson is more of a worry. I think we need to dump one in a package,just not to sure who..lol
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#115 Spoosh

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 02:11 AM

Luongo is hot (5-0-1, 1.12, .953 in last 6 GPI).
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#116 RockNroLLa.

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 02:35 AM

Luongo is hot (5-0-1, 1.12, .953 in last 6 GPI).


Trade him while the stock is hot...good thinking.
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#117 The Bookie

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 02:56 AM

Luongo is REALLY hot (36-24-36)

See a goalie walkin' down the street
Just the kind of goalie that I'd like to meet
It ain't his hair, his clothes, his feet
Somethin' much more discreet
Now I ain't loud Cory I ain't proud
I just want what I'm not allowed
Movin on up & help myself
Do a world of good for my tender health
36-24-36
Something's broken' that needs to be fixed
I don't know how to tell you this but
I'm getting bored and I need some sticks
Like 36-24-36
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#118 RunningWild

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 03:51 AM

Franson is the same player he's been for the last few years - he's just being utilized this yr like he was in Nashville. That's why he 'appears' successful. He's a guy with a good shot, a PP guy, but eats weak minutes. He's always played incredibly sheltered minutes, low even strength TOI, high PP mins, low SH mins, and against really weak competition. Carlyle know how to use him, Wilson didn't.

In AV's system, no way he replaces any d-man in the Canucks top 6, unless they're injured. He's not the type of d-man AV covets. If AV has to 'design' ice time for a defenseman to be successful, he'll be gone quicker than you can say Hodgson.
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#119 sampy

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 04:08 AM

I wonder if Stevie Y is ready to admit Lindback was a terrible trade. His.895 SP and 3.12 GA is among the leagues worst stats for starting goalies. Add to the fact that he has an arthritic disease, the trade was a poor one. TB can't wait as they are on the playoff bubble and St. Louis and Lecav only have a couple years left.
You don't have Lidstrom Stevie, you can't get away with mediocre goaltending like the Wings did.
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#120 higgyfan

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 05:18 AM

Nino's trade value has decreased significantly. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go for a 2nd round pick. his numbers in the NHL are awful.

For those talking about Tanev: he is a true defense man. He is almost like Lidstrom (obviously not as good) but he plays that sort of way. He makes barely any mistakes!! His only fault is his shot. He often fans and it isn't very hard. Hopefully he can work on that.

Nino's trade value has decreased significantly. I wouldn't be surprised to see him go for a 2nd round pick. his numbers in the NHL are awful.

For those talking about Tanev: he is a true defense man. He is almost like Lidstrom (obviously not as good) but he plays that sort of way. He makes barely any mistakes!! His only fault is his shot. He often fans and it isn't very hard. Hopefully he can work on that.


Kind of an ignorant remark, Garrison. The kid is the same age as Jensen, so seeing as Jensen hasn't even played in the NHL, does that mean he's only worth a 2nd?

Besides, Nino's numbers in the AHL are pretty good. 22g 17a in 49 games. He's a big boy that plays hard. And only 20yrs old!
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