Do You Have Confidence In The Canucks Front Office..?

[spur1]

2 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

It has nothing to do with the person, he's missed the playoffs for what? 5 years and this team is somehow in cap trouble, pretty inexcusable.  The best this team has ever looked?  Whatever man thought we're going to have a legit discussion about management.  Never said he was bad at drafting, that to this point has been his only saving grace but for the last time:  There is more to being a successful GM than drafting - and to add to that each GM doesn't make every pick on their own, even the first rounders. 

 

Funny you should mention  'its about the big picture' about a GM that spends $12 million on the fourth line and now has to scrounge to get Boeser signed.  Spent a first rounder to a team in cap trouble and now is in cap trouble himself.  He still to this day doesn't strike me as someone that understands how to manage a cap in today's NHL and though not a big issue, his interviews and how he conducts himself in front of the mic, is , well, you know, um, you know, um, pretty subpar.

 

I'll give Benning a pass when it comes to dealing with the slumlord owners and maybe there was interference in some moves he wanted to make earlier but do I have faith in him and ownership?  Hell no and if I was a wagering man I put a few down on him being canned by January.  

 

 

And if you were a betting man I would take your money.

[Chickenspear]

2 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

It has nothing to do with the person, he's missed the playoffs for what? 5 years and this team is somehow in cap trouble, pretty inexcusable.  The best this team has ever looked?  Whatever man thought we're going to have a legit discussion about management.  Never said he was bad at drafting, that to this point has been his only saving grace but for the last time:  There is more to being a successful GM than drafting - and to add to that each GM doesn't make every pick on their own, even the first rounders. 

 

Funny you should mention  'its about the big picture' about a GM that spends $12 million on the fourth line and now has to scrounge to get Boeser signed.  Spent a first rounder to a team in cap trouble and now is in cap trouble himself.  He still to this day doesn't strike me as someone that understands how to manage a cap in today's NHL and though not a big issue, his interviews and how he conducts himself in front of the mic, is , well, you know, um, you know, um, pretty subpar.

 

I'll give Benning a pass when it comes to dealing with the slumlord owners and maybe there was interference in some moves he wanted to make earlier but do I have faith in him and ownership?  Hell no and if I was a wagering man I put a few down on him being canned by January.  

 

 

 

We aren't really in any cap trouble, if you do the math... this is from the CBA.

 

Teams do not receive full cap relief when a player on a one-way NHL contract is reassigned to the American Hockey League, or is loaned to a team in another professional league. The players salary cap hit, minus the sum of the minimum NHL salary for the respective season and $375,000, still counts towards the team’s salary cap total. 
The cap hit relief is therefore equal to the minimum salary of the respective season + $375,000:

 

2014-15: $550,000 + $375,000 = $925,000

2015-16: $575,000 + $375,000 = $950,000

2016-17: $575,000 + $375,000 = $950,000

2017-18: $650,000 + $375,000 = $1,025,000

2018-19: $650,000 + $375,000 = $1,025,000

2019-20: $700,000 + $375,000 = $1,075,000

2020-21: $700,000 + $375,000 = $1,075,000

2021-22: $750,000 + $375,000 = $1,125,000

 

So our roster says 24 players under contract on our main roster (remaining cap space ~$5.05m), and we still have to sign Boeser and Goldy, which would bring us up to 26 players. If we sign Boeser at $7m, and Goldy on a 2 way contract at, say, $1.1m (hasn't really shown he's worth much more than that), that's a total of $8.1m, leaving us at $3.05m over the cap. Roster limits are between 21(lower) and 23(upper).

 

Players we can afford to send down + cap savings:

Louie ($1.075m)

Schaller ($1.075m)

Biega ($825k)

Goldy ($1.1m) 

=$4.075m - $3.05m = $1.025m in cap space with a 22 man roster.

 

With Roussel's cap hit starting the year on LTIR, that's $3m that doesn't count against our cap until he returns,(rumored Decemberish) back up to $4.025m in space, 21 man roster.

 

Seems pretty managable IMO. 

 

[TheRussianRocket1994]

2 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

It has nothing to do with the person, he's missed the playoffs for what? 5 years and this team is somehow in cap trouble, pretty inexcusable.  The best this team has ever looked?  Whatever man thought we're going to have a legit discussion about management.  Never said he was bad at drafting, that to this point has been his only saving grace but for the last time:  There is more to being a successful GM than drafting - and to add to that each GM doesn't make every pick on their own, even the first rounders. 

 

Funny you should mention  'its about the big picture' about a GM that spends $12 million on the fourth line and now has to scrounge to get Boeser signed.  Spent a first rounder to a team in cap trouble and now is in cap trouble himself.  He still to this day doesn't strike me as someone that understands how to manage a cap in today's NHL and though not a big issue, his interviews and how he conducts himself in front of the mic, is , well, you know, um, you know, um, pretty subpar.

 

I'll give Benning a pass when it comes to dealing with the slumlord owners and maybe there was interference in some moves he wanted to make earlier but do I have faith in him and ownership?  Hell no and if I was a wagering man I put a few down on him being canned by January.  

 

 

Because I’m tired of it.....people only seeing one side of things!!! You mention multiple things in your post that would effect the job he’s done, yet they’re not taken into account for some reason?! And as I said, even the best gm’s aren’t perfect! Also, all these people want a rebuilt...what does that entail??? Not having a good team and missing the playoffs for years (some teams it’s way more than 5 years)!!! How else would you get high draft picks? And some people still want to be bad / get more high draft picks after 5 years! Yet, we are in the rebuild stage & people are mad we’ve missed the playoffs for 5 years??? People can’t have it both ways!!! You have to transition out of it at some point with the help of trades / free agency ect. When the dust settles, the cap will sort itself & not all of that was in his control. 

 

Anyway, people can twist the facts and be negative to be negative / fit their agenda. 

[ilduce39]

10 minutes ago, Chickenspear said:

 

We aren't really in any cap trouble, if you do the math... this is from the CBA.

 

Teams do not receive full cap relief when a player on a one-way NHL contract is reassigned to the American Hockey League, or is loaned to a team in another professional league. The players salary cap hit, minus the sum of the minimum NHL salary for the respective season and $375,000, still counts towards the team’s salary cap total. 
The cap hit relief is therefore equal to the minimum salary of the respective season + $375,000:

 

2014-15: $550,000 + $375,000 = $925,000

2015-16: $575,000 + $375,000 = $950,000

2016-17: $575,000 + $375,000 = $950,000

2017-18: $650,000 + $375,000 = $1,025,000

2018-19: $650,000 + $375,000 = $1,025,000

2019-20: $700,000 + $375,000 = $1,075,000

2020-21: $700,000 + $375,000 = $1,075,000

2021-22: $750,000 + $375,000 = $1,125,000

 

So our roster says 24 players under contract on our main roster (remaining cap space ~$5.05m), and we still have to sign Boeser and Goldy, which would bring us up to 26 players. If we sign Boeser at $7m, and Goldy on a 2 way contract at, say, $1.1m (hasn't really shown he's worth much more than that), that's a total of $8.1m, leaving us at $3.05m over the cap. Roster limits are between 21(lower) and 23(upper).

 

Players we can afford to send down + cap savings:

Louie ($1.075m)

Schaller ($1.075m)

Biega ($825k)

Goldy ($1.1m) 

=$4.075m - $3.05m = $1.025m in cap space with a 22 man roster.

 

With Roussel's cap hit starting the year on LTIR, that's $3m that doesn't count against our cap until he returns,(rumored Decemberish) back up to $4.025m in space, 21 man roster.

 

Seems pretty managable IMO. 

 

Yeah, the whole “we’re a cap team that hasn’t made playoffs... blah blah blah” doesn’t hold water when we just added 

 

6 - Myers, 5.5 Miller, 3.5 Ferland, 2 Benn (17 mil) plus Boeser’s contract will push that into the mid 20s.

 

”We just added 23 million in salary and we’re at the cap!? And these players haven’t gotten us into the playoffs yet????” Terrible management!!”

 

I also disagree with the “poor development” angle.  I think we just hype our prospects too much and look for reasons why they aren’t superstars beyond they just aren’t good enough yet.  I actually really like the club’s approach to this since rushing Virt and McCann.  It will pay off long term.

[Chickenspear]

7 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Yeah, the whole “we’re a cap team that hasn’t made playoffs... blah blah blah” doesn’t hold water when we just added 

 

6 - Myers, 5.5 Miller, 3.5 Ferland, 2 Benn (17 mil) plus Boeser’s contract will push that into the mid 20s.

 

”We just added 23 million in salary and we’re at the cap!? And these players haven’t gotten us into the playoffs yet????” Terrible management!!”

 

I also disagree with the “poor development” angle.  I think we just hype our prospects too much and look for reasons why they aren’t superstars beyond they just aren’t good enough yet.  I actually really like the club’s approach to this since rushing Virt and McCann.  It will pay off long term.

Yeah, sure didn't help us to have bottom 6 wingers playing on our top 2 lines when Baertschi was injured too. The Virtanen rush job ended when TG took over from "real good". I've liked his defensive development the last couple years, only gonna get better at 22 years old. Just needs to drive the net a bit more to start putting up some points.

[189lb enforcers?]

10 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

You will fail more times than you win. In selecting assets, drafting, making trades.

 

There are only so many players good enough to make a difference!

 

It is fair that we made some odd pro scouting backed acquisitions in particular. And some, Eriksson, just did not work out. Gudbrandson? But Benning was only designing the team to soften the fall.  Some debate, we should not have tried to do so?    

 

We signed Megna, Chaput, Bartkowski, etc...

 

We did embrace the rebuild.  And this was before we told the public. But you still fail & especially then more times than you win.  Many of our poor earlier decisions, were money puck decisions. What did we pay for Pouliot? Now we have some cap room, some assets, the decisions also need to start reflecting that.

 

But value compounds when you draft a winner like Horvat. Exponentially when you draft a Pettersson.

 

If Hughes is as advertised? We could be on our way.  Even if not, we're only a step behind Toronto and Winnipeg.  

I appreciate the flip-side of the coin and your comments concerning luck, especially Canucks Luck, and the rebuilding of the team. 

 

There are subtle variations in our perceptions of the supposed plan, hidden behind the results. It’s difficult to not fall victim to placing a measure of subjective spin on our amateur assessments of the Canucks’ management. I know many writers can make a decent living at doing that, but certainly not myself. Probably only The Guardian and Tomatoes would subscribe to my blog, etc. Not bad company, but I’d starve to death! 

 

As as far as Toronto or the Peg, you may be right, but there are great prospects in their pools too, while they contend(ed). 

 

I was an all-in Tanktard, ready for pain for as long as it took, but I changed my mind when I looked in JB’s cupboards and saw what he had to make a team out of.

 

 

 

 

I was glad he went shopping with AF’s money, serves the family right for their apparent interference in the direction JB seemed forced into, initially. If that’s what it costs to buy a spine transplant for the Canucks, money-well-spent, IMO.

 

Lastly, FTR, no, I don’t have faith in Benning, primarily, and count the days until we get our own Dumbas-dweeb millennial version of a GM. I think we are in for a long, middling ride similar to what Calgary has been up to, minus a Norris Dman (no offence to QH). Ultimately, this is MY year to finally be happy to watch them again and that’s down to JB. 

 

I must be the happiest poster on these boards. Over the past few season I’ve received everything I’ve asked for, as a fan, minus a Blake/Chara/Pronger on D. 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by 189lb enforcers?

[189lb enforcers?]

33 minutes ago, IRR said:

Because I’m tired of it.....people only seeing one side of things!!! You mention multiple things in your post that would effect the job he’s done, yet they’re not taken into account for some reason?! And as I said, even the best gm’s aren’t perfect! Also, all these people want a rebuilt...what does that entail??? Not having a good team and missing the playoffs for years (some teams it’s way more than 5 years)!!! How else would you get high draft picks? And some people still want to be bad / get more high draft picks after 5 years! Yet, we are in the rebuild stage & people are mad we’ve missed the playoffs for 5 years??? People can’t have it both ways!!! You have to transition out of it at some point with the help of trades / free agency ect. When the dust settles, the cap will sort itself & not all of that was in his control. 

 

Anyway, people can twist the facts and be negative to be negative / fit their agenda. 

Quite the emotional rant, no offence. 

You may not realize that you are the yang to the ying which you keep harping about here. It takes two to tango, remember. 

E=MC2 or something... 

[TheRussianRocket1994]

4 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Quite the emotional rant, no offence. 

You may not realize that you are the yang to the ying which you keep harping about here. It takes two to tango, remember. 

E=MC2 or something... 

Lol! Indeed...it’s been a morning! Maybe I need more coffee...or beer for that matter! The difference is, although I’m being on the positive side of things, I can admit that things / they haven’t been perfect. That they’ve made mistakes! I don’t agree with everything they do, but the positives outweigh the negatives and if people can see that, then they can see the team overall is in a much better spot. 

 

Others ONLY want to see the negative and can’t even give credit where credit is due...that’s where I have an issue if that makes sense?! 

[189lb enforcers?]

4 minutes ago, IRR said:

Lol! Indeed...it’s been a morning! Maybe I need more coffee...or beer for that matter! The difference is, although I’m being on the positive side of things, I can admit that things / they haven’t been perfect. That they’ve made mistakes! I don’t agree with everything they do, but the positives outweigh the negatives and if people can see that, then they can see the team overall is in a much better spot. 

 

Others ONLY want to see the negative and can’t even give credit where credit is due...that’s where I have an issue if that makes sense?! 

Without our going back and forth like a bunch of Time Vampires, all of us, the site would be so dry and dull. It’s when things get serious and we die on the hill, it gets kinda tedious.

 

It’s been a good summer, but a strange one on CDC for sure. 

[Chickenspear]

1 minute ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Without our going back and forth like a bunch of Time Vampires, all of us, the site would be so dry and dull. It’s when things get serious and we die on the hill, it gets kinda tedious.

 

It’s been a good summer, but a strange one on CDC for sure. 

I think that everyone was nervous last year with the Sedins retiring, seeing as they were responsible for most of our offense for years. Seeing what this team can do without them last season got us excited about our emerging young core, then Hughes rolled around, drafted Podkolzin, aquiring Miller, + higher end UFA signings has us as one of the more improved teams this off season. It hasn't looked this good since the 2011 playoff run, 2012 regular season. Lots to talk about this year, for sure. 

[ktcy2]

Our team is a playoff team with the additions but is it a championship? That’s the greatest question mark. Benning has done a great job overall but there is no satisfaction unless we win a cup!

[TheRussianRocket1994]

25 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Without our going back and forth like a bunch of Time Vampires, all of us, the site would be so dry and dull. It’s when things get serious and we die on the hill, it gets kinda tedious.

 

It’s been a good summer, but a strange one on CDC for sure. 

Fair enough for sure!

[fecklund]

Time will tell if the "minimalist" approach works. 

The Canucks "front office", is really just a big desk with a couple of laptops, a phone, and a blackboard. It's Benning and Weisbrod, with Stan Smyl on speed dial if they run out of coffee.
That's really it.

Compare the Canucks management staff, with say, Tampa Bay.....

https://www.nhl.com/canucks/team/coaches-and-staff

https://www.nhl.com/lightning/team/front-office

[-DLC-]

Yes.

 

Based on the excitement I feel for the upcoming season, the players that are currently in place who have helped me get over/forget my last team.

 

Plus, who am I to judge?  I'm just some hockey hack fan who's along for the ride.  Good or bad, but I feel good about this team....the skill, the fact that it's a young team who all seem to be on the same page and are already developing a comradery and chemistry together.  A group full of integrity and good character.

 

Someone behind the scenes is picking them right and fostering this climate of excellence.  It hasn't been perfect....but if mistakes = lessons learned and changes in direction then they've served a purpose.

[fecklund]

2 hours ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Quite the emotional rant, no offence. 

You may not realize that you are the yang to the ying which you keep harping about here. It takes two to tango, remember. 

E=MC2 or something... 

Actually, E=MDMA 

[the grinder]

11 hours ago, lmm said:

but Pouliot didn't suck, so he got signed by the Stanley cup champ?

I'm not sure how this helps your point made.

 

OH REMEMBER when Guddy got here and was supposed to be our next captain?

What happened to that? 

kmao   and where did  you get that notion from ?   if any thing it was always bo to be a captain  ,  pouliot is terrible  c'mon   

[ilduce39]

22 minutes ago, fecklund said:

Time will tell if the "minimalist" approach works. 

The Canucks "front office", is really just a big desk with a couple of laptops, a phone, and a blackboard. It's Benning and Weisbrod, with Stan Smyl on speed dial if they run out of coffee.
That's really it.

Compare the Canucks management staff, with say, Tampa Bay.....

https://www.nhl.com/canucks/team/coaches-and-staff

https://www.nhl.com/lightning/team/front-office

To be fair, Tampa is listing the plumbing/HVAC guy for the arena among literally everyone who does anything related to the club.  As wonderful as the TB accounts payable lady is, I’m sure Van has someone for that as well.

 

Their hockey ops is pretty similar to ours.  One GM, 3 AGMs (Scouting, Development and Personnel) and a director. 

 

We have a GM, one AGM, Smyl in an advisory role and head of collegiate scouting.  Then there’s John Wall, a director of ops and analytics and a VP (Gear) and Johnson who does development and GM of Utica.

 

On the other hand, I see 16 scouts on the payroll for TB and Van has 19.  

[fecklund]

2 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

To be fair, Tampa is listing the plumbing/HVAC guy for the arena among literally everyone who does anything related to the club.  As wonderful as the TB accounts payable lady is, I’m sure Van has someone for that as well.

 

Their hockey ops is pretty similar to ours.  One GM, 3 AGMs (Scouting, Development and Personnel) and a director. 

 

We have a GM, one AGM, Smyl in an advisory role and head of collegiate scouting.  Then there’s John Wall, a director of ops and analytics and a VP (Gear) and Johnson who does development and GM of Utica.

 

On the other hand, I see 16 scouts on the payroll for TB and Van has 19.  

I guess "If you have it, flaunt it" 
If the Canucks Management were that significant, they'd post more than a few high res images of 2 or 3 guys that actually do anything for the Canucks. (I'm not counting Utica/Johnson)
You've got Benning/Weisbrod/Smyl as our "axis of evil" lol, then some guy who's your #4. Nobody's ever heard of him. His job title is "general counsel" (backup covfefe boy when smyl takes a sick day) 

Is this some kind of media ploy to make the front office look more "unified" or "strong/tight"? 

I don't really care one way or the other, so long as they get it done. Just having some fun with it, as it has been mentioned that Vancouver is really shy to most teams when it comes to management staff. 
Talk lately of Gillis making a comeback in more scientific role has brought those topics back around. And while I'm mentioning Gillis, love him or hate him, the guy was on the cutting edge of new ideas and methods to make our team better - and he did. 
I say if we can get him back here and let him turn all of our players into the Six Million Dollar Man (except Erik$$on), then I'm all for it. 

[fecklund]

32 minutes ago, the grinder said:

kmao  ....

[Tre Mac]

1 hour ago, ktcy2 said:

Our team is a playoff team

We are?  When will the playoffs tickets go on sale?  Lol, look no doubt I like our chances but this type of blind homerism is why it's impossible to criticize anything about the team without a handful of users twisting words and name calling.  Case in point:

 

2 hours ago, ilduce39 said:

”We just added 23 million in salary and we’re at the cap!? And these players haven’t gotten us into the playoffs yet????” Terrible management!!”

So who typed this?  No one did, you just making arguments in your head as fact.  This team is in cap trouble(trouble meaning they have to sign at least one player to a hit higher than they currently have), I don't know how you can even refute that, the extra 2-3 million for Luongo's caphit though not JB's fault, really hurts what he can do contract wise.

 

VANCOUVER CANUCKS

PROJECTED CAP HIT : $76,441,539

PROJECTED LTIR USED : $0

PROJECTED CAP SPACE : $5,058,461

 

$5mil cap space with Boeser impending contract, who will want, and deserves, more than $5mil/yr.  Eriksson/Beagle/Schaller = $9.9 caphit next year, not ideal.  I admit I don't know the ends and outs of the CBA and why should I?  Unless I am getting paid for it I'll just use what this website tells me.  Roussel on LTIR isn't going to drastically change that outlook imo. 

 

I mean this thread is about if we have confidence in management - to me it's a pretty simple yes/no opinion so I don't get why everyone has to try to justify why their opinion is right and mine isn't.  Now I said if I was a betting man I'd put money on JB being gone by Jan.  and here's why.  Let's say this team is 50/50 to make the playoffs, well for that to go right(this team making the palyoffs) this team will have:

 

Avoid injuries

Play better

At least two playoff teams from last year to poop the bed

 

Right now I only see one of those things coming into fruition and that's overall playing better.  Once injuries start happening in November, this team will hit a funk in December and JB not having a contract get's simply let go by Jan.  Or this team plays well and my favorite team makes the playoffs, whatever lol.... 50/50.