NFL thread

[TheRussianRocket.]

wtf man, I'm so pissed off!

Despite the win, it's just awing at how horrible we've played and yet we're lucky to be sitting 2-0. The only bright spot on the team is the defense - which has been under the radar but deserves a hell of an applause - and Brady.

...the receivers are the worst in the NFL, plain and simple. It's so annoying that a guy like Peyton has had a group of excellent WRs throughout his career and he's considered one of the best. Then you have Brady who is better than him who's considered one of or the best and he's had medicore receivers throughout his years and has still got it done. Despite '07 where he had Moss, other than that, that was it. He's had no one else really, Welker yea, but 1 receiver doesn't say anything....Brady has never had a group of solid WRs and it's amazing how much he'a accomplished without them. If he were given all the WRs Manning has had throughout the years, no doubt he would have 5 SBs and possibly more.

....I get BB wants to rebuild and wants youth learning for WRs but it's clearly just not working! ...I never question a move BB makes being the greatest coach in history, but why is it so hard to realize this: Give Brady good wide receivers, and he'll single handily win games.

It's so simple yet he's never done it. Who cares if you get caught up with the cap; shed some other players and bring in a group of solid WRs and Brady will win another Super Bowl guaranteed. Plus this just made me remember that also, Brady has only had 1 deep threat throughout his career and that was Moss, and you can arguably say Brown but he was more of a midfield guy. Manning has had deep threats countlessly, every year he has them, but Brady is always sold short with a cr@p group of receivers and it really pisses me off. No one realizes this but it's the truth and it comes to show why he is the GOAT,

...Give him a good slot receiver, a mid range receiver, a deep threat, and I guarantee he wins a SB. Mad too we let go of Welker, all we had to do was pay him 1 extra million ffs, and Brady took a paycut to get better receivers and yet they demolish the WR group and leave him empty handed with a bunch of rookies who couldn't catch a pass if their life depended on it. Plus Amendola is injured which really sucks though he is good, and Gronk is recovering. If things don't change, I see them losing 1st round of the playoffs easily.

...Love Belichick and all the decisions he's made, but 1 I will never get is why he hasn't given Brady good WRs to work with just boggles me. Give the man a good receiving corpse, and you'll win - it's not rocket science! Just an example of what you give Brady and the Pats win hands down as Brady will lighten up the scoreboard every single game: slot receiver (Welker), mid range receiver (Emmanuel Sanders), deep threat (Greg Jennings), and it's over, no competition...

[Cyril Sneer]

I feel sorry for Brady. First couple plays already pissed off. We need to get get a receiver that'll actually catch the ball. Boy I miss Gronk

Brady is finally exposed

[Bruce Boudreau]

wtf man, I'm so pissed off!

Despite the win, it's just awing at how horrible we've played and yet we're lucky to be sitting 2-0. The only bright spot on the team is the defense - which has been under the radar but deserves a hell of an applause - and Brady.

...the receivers are the worst in the NFL, plain and simple. It's so annoying that a guy like Peyton has had a group of excellent WRs throughout his career and he's considered one of the best. Then you have Brady who is better than him who's considered one of or the best and he's had medicore receivers throughout his years and has still got it done. Despite '07 where he had Moss, other than that, that was it. He's had no one else really, Welker yea, but 1 receiver doesn't say anything....Brady has never had a group of solid WRs and it's amazing how much he'a accomplished without them. If he were given all the WRs Manning has had throughout the years, no doubt he would have 5 SBs and possibly more.

....I get BB wants to rebuild and wants youth learning for WRs but it's clearly just not working! ...I never question a move BB makes being the greatest coach in history, but why is it so hard to realize this: Give Brady good wide receivers, and he'll single handily win games.

It's so simple yet he's never done it. Who cares if you get caught up with the cap; shed some other players and bring in a group of solid WRs and Brady will win another Super Bowl guaranteed. Plus this just made me remember that also, Brady has only had 1 deep threat throughout his career and that was Moss, and you can arguably say Brown but he was more of a midfield guy. Manning has had deep threats countlessly, every year he has them, but Brady is always sold short with a cr@p group of receivers and it really pisses me off. No one realizes this but it's the truth and it comes to show why he is the GOAT,

...Give him a good slot receiver, a mid range receiver, a deep threat, and I guarantee he wins a SB. Mad too we let go of Welker, all we had to do was pay him 1 extra million ffs, and Brady took a paycut to get better receivers and yet they demolish the WR group and leave him empty handed with a bunch of rookies who couldn't catch a pass if their life depended on it. Plus Amendola is injured which really sucks though he is good, and Gronk is recovering. If things don't change, I see them losing 1st round of the playoffs easily.

...Love Belichick and all the decisions he's made, but 1 I will never get is why he hasn't given Brady good WRs to work with just boggles me. Give the man a good receiving corpse, and you'll win - it's not rocket science! Just an example of what you give Brady and the Pats win hands down as Brady will lighten up the scoreboard every single game: slot receiver (Welker), mid range receiver (Emmanuel Sanders), deep threat (Greg Jennings), and it's over, no competition...

Don't know why you are complaining about the wide receivers since traditionaly the Patriots like to run 2 tight end sets instead of 3 wide.

Belichick won't invest in getting good receivers because he thinks his system can make up for the lack of talent. He has that smugness that he can make up for mediocre talent just with his system.

Same with the defence for years he neglected because he thought the offence would outscore their problems until he finally realized to address the issue the past 2 years by adding Adrian Wilson and Talib.

Edited September 13, 2013 by Chip Kelly

[THERETOOL]

i could use some advice .. Ive got rg3 and russel wilson .. who you guys think i should play this week ? im leaning towards rg3 , cause hell be playing a weaker d .. help ?

[Strawberries]

i could use some advice .. Ive got rg3 and russel wilson .. who you guys think i should play this week ? im leaning towards rg3 , cause hell be playing a weaker d .. help ?

Rg3

[pdc]

wtf man, I'm so pissed off!

Despite the win, it's just awing at how horrible we've played and yet we're lucky to be sitting 2-0. The only bright spot on the team is the defense - which has been under the radar but deserves a hell of an applause - and Brady.

...the receivers are the worst in the NFL, plain and simple. It's so annoying that a guy like Peyton has had a group of excellent WRs throughout his career and he's considered one of the best. Then you have Brady who is better than him who's considered one of or the best and he's had medicore receivers throughout his years and has still got it done. Despite '07 where he had Moss, other than that, that was it. He's had no one else really, Welker yea, but 1 receiver doesn't say anything....Brady has never had a group of solid WRs and it's amazing how much he'a accomplished without them. If he were given all the WRs Manning has had throughout the years, no doubt he would have 5 SBs and possibly more.

....I get BB wants to rebuild and wants youth learning for WRs but it's clearly just not working! ...I never question a move BB makes being the greatest coach in history, but why is it so hard to realize this: Give Brady good wide receivers, and he'll single handily win games.

It's so simple yet he's never done it. Who cares if you get caught up with the cap; shed some other players and bring in a group of solid WRs and Brady will win another Super Bowl guaranteed. Plus this just made me remember that also, Brady has only had 1 deep threat throughout his career and that was Moss, and you can arguably say Brown but he was more of a midfield guy. Manning has had deep threats countlessly, every year he has them, but Brady is always sold short with a cr@p group of receivers and it really pisses me off. No one realizes this but it's the truth and it comes to show why he is the GOAT,

...Give him a good slot receiver, a mid range receiver, a deep threat, and I guarantee he wins a SB. Mad too we let go of Welker, all we had to do was pay him 1 extra million ffs, and Brady took a paycut to get better receivers and yet they demolish the WR group and leave him empty handed with a bunch of rookies who couldn't catch a pass if their life depended on it. Plus Amendola is injured which really sucks though he is good, and Gronk is recovering. If things don't change, I see them losing 1st round of the playoffs easily.

...Love Belichick and all the decisions he's made, but 1 I will never get is why he hasn't given Brady good WRs to work with just boggles me. Give the man a good receiving corpse, and you'll win - it's not rocket science! Just an example of what you give Brady and the Pats win hands down as Brady will lighten up the scoreboard every single game: slot receiver (Welker), mid range receiver (Emmanuel Sanders), deep threat (Greg Jennings), and it's over, no competition...

This is exactly why everyone hates patriot fans. Lol never any a good WR, well except those 3-4 years you had a top 5 WR ever to play the game on your team, oh and Welker who has been a nightmare in slot, oh and the those duel tight end sets that d-coordinators feared. That fact is Brady has a lot of talent to throw to over his years, just as good as Mannings(excluding this year obv).

Amedola was just a bad pick up in my eyes, as a Pats fan if he plays 10 games for you this year you should ecstatic. He's had a history injuries, and not just freak ones but a few soft tissue injuries. Its a bit brash that you expect that to disappear as soon as he wears a pats jersey(not you specifically but pats fans in general I mean).

And just a personal pet peeve can we please stop with the Bilichek is the greatest in history talk and is a god etc. He is a fantastic coach yes, but not even top 5 in most experts eyes

Edited September 13, 2013 by pdc

[Tre Mac]

IMO Manning has had the better supporting cast over the years: Harrison and Wayne are HoF's, Clark, James(RB), Pollard are his top 5 targets of all time. Compare that to Moss, Welker, T. Brown, K. Faulk(RB), Branch. It's close for sure, but look at the list that has played for Manning both currently and in the past and he gets the edge.

And Belichick is a great coach. I wasn't around for Lombardi, Walsh, or Brown but much like hockey I think these old coaches are overhyped. When he calls it a career he should be top 5 easy.

And Patriots wont do anything in the playoffs if they don't pick up a veteran receiver, period.

[CanucksSayEh]

I'm seriously screwed on RB position.

I better hope Sproles runs for 100 and catches for a 100, and gets 4 TD's.

I hear that, Sproles is my only starter worth a damn. After that, Bilal Powell, Knowshon Moreno, Jaquim Bell.....

[CanucksSayEh]

Demaryious Thomas didn't learn to catch until recently, Decker still can't and Denvers doing fine. Pats might be okay... hope not though..

Edited September 13, 2013 by CanucksSayEh

[TheRussianRocket.]

Other than that '07 year, Brady hasn't had a good wide receiving group and the Pats just started the 2 tight end scheme a few years ago...traditionally it's been 1 TE but now they've evolved it to using 2 of them...might even go back to 1 when Gronk comes becuase it's clear Brady is not comfortable with the TE he has right now.

...if they simply invest Brady with 3 WRs (slot, midfield, and deep threat), it'd be game over...the one time they came close to giving Brady that they had 2 of the 3 (slot receiver in Welker and a deep threat in Moss) and they broke records.

...say what you want and this is why you hate Pats fans, but why would we be afraid of voicing our opinion which is right...give Brady the WRs Peyton has and has had and we have more than 3 rings guarantee. Peyton always has had 2 star receivers and ontop of that he has solid ones...

Manning top receivers:

1998 - 2000: Harrison (deep threat), Pathon (slot), Wilkins (mid receiver), Dilger (this guy was Gronk at the time)

2001 - 2007: Harrison (deep threat), Wayne (all around),

Pathon (slot), Wilkins (mid receiver), Pollard (replaced Dilger for TE and was phenomenal), Ismall (slot), Clark (one of the best TEs to ever play the game), Stokley (all around),

2008 - 2010: Harrison (deep threat), Wayne (all around), Garçon (all around), Clark (one of the best TEs ever), Collie (mid receiver)

2012-current: Decker (all around), Stokley (all around), Thomas (deep threat), Thomas (phenomenal TE), Welker (slot receiver)

...compare that to the receivers Brady has had and it's soo lopsided the talent of receivers Manning has had. These guys listed above are raw talent receivers. They were always good and didn't need time to adjust to the QB. Look at Brady and the receivers he's had, it's pathetic. Most the guys he has had production with he made them look good and I can honestly say Tom has only had 4, tops 5 receivers who had raw talent and despite that, even though he has them, it was all he had as he never had an all around group to throw to, like the ones Manning has had and has.

[TheRussianRocket.]

Now I'm not complaining, but I'm just pointing out the facts and the obvious. If anyone here were to say Brady has had good WR groups throughout his career, you'd be a fool.

...I just wonder that if he were ever given a solid group, what damage he'd do...it'd be unheard of..

[NucksPatsFan]

If his receivers caught 50% of the balls they dropped he would have won that game convincingly

Smith's receivers dropped passes in the middle of the field. Brady's receivers dropped touchdown passes. If Brady's receivers caught half of the balls they dropped THEY would've won convincingly. Dobson's long bomb drop - 7 points. Thompkins drop in endzone- 7 points. Dobson running wrong route while wide open in endzone - 7 points. Gostkowski shanking a 40 yard field goal, 3 points.

Compare that to Stephen Hill dropping the ball at their own 40, at midfield, and inside their own 30. Which drops made more of a difference? The only scoring drop the Jets had was the low throw in the endzone in which the receiver couldn't get a handle on the ball and it came out.

Assume that pick in redzone had turned into a touchdown which is being generous, the Jets would have had an extra 7-10 points. The Patriots drops and missed FG resulted in 24 missed points.

[pdc]

Other than that '07 year, Brady hasn't had a good wide receiving group and the Pats just started the 2 tight end scheme a few years ago...traditionally it's been 1 TE but now they've evolved it to using 2 of them...might even go back to 1 when Gronk comes becuase it's clear Brady is not comfortable with the TE he has right now.

...if they simply invest Brady with 3 WRs (slot, midfield, and deep threat), it'd be game over...the one time they came close to giving Brady that they had 2 of the 3 (slot receiver in Welker and a deep threat in Moss) and they broke records.

...say what you want and this is why you hate Pats fans, but why would we be afraid of voicing our opinion which is right...give Brady the WRs Peyton has and has had and we have more than 3 rings guarantee. Peyton always has had 2 star receivers and ontop of that he has solid ones...

Manning top receivers:

1998 - 2000: Harrison (deep threat), Pathon (slot), Wilkins (mid receiver), Dilger (this guy was Gronk at the time)

2001 - 2007: Harrison (deep threat), Wayne (all around),  

Pathon (slot), Wilkins (mid receiver), Pollard (replaced Dilger for TE and was phenomenal), Ismall (slot), Clark (one of the best TEs to ever play the game), Stokley (all around),

2008 - 2010: Harrison (deep threat), Wayne (all around), Garçon (all around), Clark (one of the best TEs ever), Collie (mid receiver)

2012-current: Decker (all around), Stokley (all around), Thomas (deep threat), Thomas (phenomenal TE), Welker (slot receiver)

...compare that to the receivers Brady has had and it's soo lopsided the talent of receivers Manning has had. These guys listed above are raw talent receivers. They were always good and didn't need time to adjust to the QB. Look at Brady and the receivers he's had, it's pathetic. Most the guys he has had production with he made them look good and I can honestly say Tom has only had 4, tops 5 receivers who had raw talent and despite that, even though he has them, it was all he had as he never had an all around group to throw to, like the ones Manning has had and has.

I disagree on a pure talent level, if you don't include mannings bronco years, their receiving core is comparable, Mannings probably a bit better tho. In saying that though you cannot claim New Englands receivers have been crap over the years either, they have been a decent group.

Obviosly adding 3 legit wideouts would help, but let me you ask then where would you take a lesser player than you have right now in order to cap complient? What position, should've they spent less on, and don't give specific player names, because its too easy to look back and say oh so and so was overpaid.

I truly think you are guys are fine, obviously it was going to be a rough week, you lost your 5 top receivers from last year, your best wide out on your team this year and your best receiving running back. Any new player takes a bit to learn a system, especially a rookie. Come end of the season if they get enough reps in they will be fine, and assuming everyone comes back from injury, Pats will yet again be one of the AFC favorites. I mean who else besides the donkeys really poise a threat?

[TheRussianRocket.]

...guess you haven't seen the games of late lol. The offense can't get anything going...that's a sure sign of they won't go far if things change

[pdc]

...guess you haven't seen the games of late lol. The offense can't get anything going...that's a sure sign of they won't go far if things change

Not the first game no, but last nights yes. I thought they looked how I thought they would look. A team with a bunch of new faces on the offense. Dobson and Thompkins had a lot of drops, ran a few wrong routes. The rain didn't help things, but they are rookies and they are certainly going improve throughout the year. It takes time to develop chemistry with your QB and they will most likely be put in a situation where they get plenty of chances to do so.

Bradys safety net in Gronk will be back, I'd guessing week 4, Vereen week 11. Dobson and Thompkins will be better by the playoffs, obvious not your Julio Dez or Calvin class, but say your Hilton or Jones level of production I don't see that being unreasonable. The AFC is not that good, I think your overreacting if you are hitting the panic button already.

[NucksPatsFan]

...guess you haven't seen the games of late lol. The offense can't get anything going...that's a sure sign of they won't go far if things change

Dude. It's been two weeks. Dobson didn't even play with Brady in the pre-season, he played with Mallett and took second team reps during training camp, and he had a hamstring injury leading up to week 1 so the only legitimate reps he took with Brady were during walk throughs on Tuesday and Wednesday. He's not Randy Moss who from the get go only ran 2 routes, the 3 yard slant and the go route, and Brady hit him on those 2 routes every time.

[NucksPatsFan]

Bet $20 on Packers, Ravens and Falcons to win, and Saints to beat Bucs by 4 points or more all on one parlay. Pays $90 plus my $20 back. Feeling confident.

I don't see the Pack losing to the Redskins at Lambeau and starting the season 0-2, I don't see the Browns getting anything done against the Ravens, and I certainly don't see the Rams being able to stop Julio, Roddy and Gonzalez. The only iffy part is the Sainst. They're banged up on D big time, and Revis Island will shut down Colston so it'll be upto Moore and the rest.

[Green Building]

This is exactly why everyone hates patriot fans. Lol never any a good WR, well except those 3-4 years you had a top 5 WR ever to play the game on your team, oh and Welker who has been a nightmare in slot, oh and the those duel tight end sets that d-coordinators feared. That fact is Brady has a lot of talent to throw to over his years, just as good as Mannings(excluding this year obv).

Amedola was just a bad pick up in my eyes, as a Pats fan if he plays 10 games for you this year you should ecstatic. He's had a history injuries, and not just freak ones but a few soft tissue injuries. Its a bit brash that you expect that to disappear as soon as he wears a pats jersey(not you specifically but pats fans in general I mean).

And just a personal pet peeve can we please stop with the Bilichek is the greatest in history talk and is a god etc. He is a fantastic coach yes, but not even top 5 in most experts eyes

[JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo]

i could use some advice .. Ive got rg3 and russel wilson .. who you guys think i should play this week ? im leaning towards rg3 , cause hell be playing a weaker d .. help ?

Russel Wilson and it's not even close. RG3 isn't ready yet and he will be playing on the road at lambeau. That team and their fanbase is pumped coming off that emotional loss to the 9ers. It's going to be a rough day for the redskins.

Wilson is money at home and win or lose on Sunday he will put up good numbers.

[JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo]

wtf man, I'm so pissed off!

Despite the win, it's just awing at how horrible we've played and yet we're lucky to be sitting 2-0. The only bright spot on the team is the defense - which has been under the radar but deserves a hell of an applause - and Brady.

...the receivers are the worst in the NFL, plain and simple. It's so annoying that a guy like Peyton has had a group of excellent WRs throughout his career and he's considered one of the best. Then you have Brady who is better than him who's considered one of or the best and he's had medicore receivers throughout his years and has still got it done. Despite '07 where he had Moss, other than that, that was it. He's had no one else really, Welker yea, but 1 receiver doesn't say anything....Brady has never had a group of solid WRs and it's amazing how much he'a accomplished without them. If he were given all the WRs Manning has had throughout the years, no doubt he would have 5 SBs and possibly more.

....I get BB wants to rebuild and wants youth learning for WRs but it's clearly just not working! ...I never question a move BB makes being the greatest coach in history, but why is it so hard to realize this: Give Brady good wide receivers, and he'll single handily win games.

It's so simple yet he's never done it. Who cares if you get caught up with the cap; shed some other players and bring in a group of solid WRs and Brady will win another Super Bowl guaranteed. Plus this just made me remember that also, Brady has only had 1 deep threat throughout his career and that was Moss, and you can arguably say Brown but he was more of a midfield guy. Manning has had deep threats countlessly, every year he has them, but Brady is always sold short with a cr@p group of receivers and it really pisses me off. No one realizes this but it's the truth and it comes to show why he is the GOAT,

...Give him a good slot receiver, a mid range receiver, a deep threat, and I guarantee he wins a SB. Mad too we let go of Welker, all we had to do was pay him 1 extra million ffs, and Brady took a paycut to get better receivers and yet they demolish the WR group and leave him empty handed with a bunch of rookies who couldn't catch a pass if their life depended on it. Plus Amendola is injured which really sucks though he is good, and Gronk is recovering. If things don't change, I see them losing 1st round of the playoffs easily.

...Love Belichick and all the decisions he's made, but 1 I will never get is why he hasn't given Brady good WRs to work with just boggles me. Give the man a good receiving corpse, and you'll win - it's not rocket science! Just an example of what you give Brady and the Pats win hands down as Brady will lighten up the scoreboard every single game: slot receiver (Welker), mid range receiver (Emmanuel Sanders), deep threat (Greg Jennings), and it's over, no competition...

Don't you think you're being overly simplistic on this one? It sounds to me like you think that all it takes to win is a good qb and receiving core. What about that stout O line that lets Brady stay in the pocket? Do you think they come cheap? What about that defense that you said played well? Do you think they would have won this game without them? I could go on and on. Belichick is considered the best because no matter what happens he manages to put together a competitive team year after year. He seemingly finds players out of nowhere to fill holes and he gets more out of players than most people expect. This will inevitably come to an end at some point, most likely when Brady starts to decline, but for the time being I would just be happy with the 2-0 start.

Oh yeah and for the record people hate Pats fans because they are everywhere and for all the wrong reasons. It's like any sport though, people like to back winners. It's the easy way out.