sampy Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 People need to stop putting Vey as a 4th liner only because there isnt anywhere else to fit him. Look at his AHL numbers and tell me that he was brought in here to play 4th line minutes. Please. He's a scorer and needs to be given the chance to score in order to justify the deal. He will be in the top 9, if not top 6. Agreed. He is an offensive player and will be fighting legitimately for a top 6 spot. Benning has done great so far. I think we can give him some trust and that's what he said about Vey. LA didn't want to trade him. I like Miller for 2-3 years max. Trade Lack, groom Marksrom/Demko. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brick Tamland Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Miller will sign tomorrow in Vancouver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plum Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 For more first round picks and more prospects? Absolutely. Much better than having them leaves as free agents and getting nothing for them. Miller to Demko is how it should play out. From the sounds of it, we're going in that direction. No. You roll with your starting goalie and when someone else is ready to take over then you trade him. Not sign a UFA then trade your young backup. You go with your young NHL ready goaltender, play him and then when another goalie is ready to take over you can either place him as a backup if he doesn't have value or trade him. Demko won't be in the NHL for atleast another 5 years, 2-3 years in the NCAA and then another 1-2 years in the AHL then another year in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleednucksblue Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Agreed. He is an offensive player and will be fighting legitimately for a top 6 spot. Benning has done great so far. I think we can give him some trust and that's what he said about Vey. LA didn't want to trade him. I like Miller for 2-3 years max. Trade Lack, groom Marksrom/Demko. If he doesnt then the trade was a waste and they should've just taken the fast slipping 18 year old D that everyone on here wanted who according to the CDC scouts will be the next big thing in the NHL. With his history with Willie, I bet he gets a chance to set up and play with Bonino, who has proven he can finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horvat x 53 Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Where does this Iginla thing factor in? Anyways, I wouldn't mind Miller if he was to sign for 2-3 years roughly under 5-5.5. Would not do anything above. Take a discount since the ducks and sharks don't seem to want him anymore ( Rumours ) and i doubt he goes to EDM/CGY. Heck his wife can get a acting job on Arrow. Filmed right near rogers. Him and lack could go 52/30 ish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Internal competition is a good thing believe it or not. TSN will try and spin it as a goalie controversy, but the best years of goaltending we've ever had were with Luongo and Schneider. If Lack is playing lights out, he'll continue to get games. If he struggles, Miller would be there to take over. That's the beauty of being strong in net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustapha Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Give it a rest man. Miller is an elite goalie. Anyone who argues otherwise doesn't know what they're talking about. Average goalies don't win the Vezina, and carry their teams to the gold medal game. He's as good as Lu, and has been on a bad team for most of his career. If we can get him on a 2-3 year deal, it will be great for the team. We better not hear you whining about it if it does get done. Just deal with it. Ryan Miller is not the goalie he was 4 seasons ago. He looked shaky on a defensively stacked Blues team, so let's can the 'team was bad, so free pass' argument. He may be able to turn it around in Vancouver, but unless he has a Vanbiesbrouck-like renaissance, odds are he won't get to the level he was once at. He could return to 'elite' form, but as it stands now, he isn't elite. It's not to say he wouldn't be an asset in Vancouver, as he is still an established NHL goalie with a winning pedigree. However I would make it abundantly clear to him that he will have to fight for his icetime just like any other roster player. I don't want another scenario where the Canucks have a veteran goaltender who feels entitled to starts due to his previous reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Soldier Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 No. You roll with your starting goalie and when someone else is ready to take over then you trade him. Not sign a UFA then trade your young backup. You go with your young NHL ready goaltender, play him and then when another goalie is ready to take over you can either place him as a backup if he doesn't have value or trade him. Demko won't be in the NHL for atleast another 5 years, 2-3 years in the NCAA and then another 1-2 years in the AHL then another year in the NHL. At which point Miller can ride off into the sunset and the net will be ready for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dKs89 Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Honestly if we sign miller and iginla we could be contenders. Sedin sedin kassian Jensen bonino iginla Higgins matthias burrows Richardson Vey Dorsett Hamuis edler Sbisa bieksa Stanton tanev Miller Lack That is a pretty good line up. I sincerely hope you don't think two FAs will just all of a sudden make us contenders. The Canucks are just not going to be contenders with this core group of players. That time has passed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustapha Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Honestly if we sign miller and iginla we could be contenders. Sedin sedin kassian Jensen bonino iginla Higgins matthias burrows Richardson Vey Dorsett Hamuis edler Sbisa bieksa Stanton tanev Miller Lack That is a pretty good line up. Iginla would have to play really badly to lose top line minutes to Kassian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigturk8 Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 People need to stop putting Vey as a 4th liner only because there isnt anywhere else to fit him. Look at his AHL numbers and tell me that he was brought in here to play 4th line minutes. Please. He's a scorer and needs to be given the chance to score in order to justify the deal. He will be in the top 9, if not top 6. My understanding is that Bonino is considered a very good 3rd line center or a fringe second line center. So do you think that Vey could be a better fit in the 2C roll, knocking Bonino and Matthias down respectively? Also, on topic, I like the look of that line-up as far as talent goes, my only worry is 2C which I've asked about above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down by the River Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Torts ruined Lack by running him into the ground. As long as Miller understands that he is there as a mentor and not a true number 1, I'm okay with a 2-3 year deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxiebrown Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Give it a rest man. Miller is an elite goalie. Anyone who argues otherwise doesn't know what they're talking about. Average goalies don't win the Vezina, and carry their teams to the gold medal game. He's as good as Lu, and has been on a bad team for most of his career. If we can get him on a 2-3 year deal, it will be great for the team. We better not hear you whining about it if it does get done. Just deal with it. Miller has had one "elite" year in his 9 year career. Literally every other year he has been average. His career numbers are much worse than Luongo's, Lundqvist's. Price's and Rinne's. I already addressed this, but I want to make it clear. You simply cannot explain Miller's average numbers by saying that he played for poor teams. It's actually only very recently that Buffalo became a terrible team, and Miller's performance has not been noticeably affected by the strength of the teams in front of him. Look at Buffalo's record, and Miller's numbers for his career: 05/06 - Buffalo 110 points, Miller .914 save % 06/07 - 113 points, .911 save % 07/08 - 90 points, .906 save % 08/09 - 91 points, .918 save % 09/10 - 100 points, .929 save % 10/11 - 96 points, .916 save % 11/12 - 89 points, .916 save % 12/13 - 48 points (equivalent of 82 points), .915 save % 13/14 - Buf - 52 points (lol), .923 save % 13/14 - Stl - 111 points, .903 save % As you can see, there is no correlation between Buffalo's record and Miller's performance. In his early career, Buffalo was a competitive team, and Miller posted mediocre numbers. As the Sabres have declined, Miller's performance has continued to been average. Even on the excellent, defensively sound Blues, he did not post great numbers. Miller was truly excellent in 2010, and deserved the Vezina that year. But he was not elite before that, and he has not been elite since then. He has been very average since then, and expecting him to repeat that performance at the age of 34 is foolish. Also, Jose Theodore, Jim Carey and Olaf Kolzig have all won the Vezina. So yes, average goalies do win the Vezina! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleednucksblue Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Miller has had one "elite" year in his 9 year career. Literally every other year he has been average. His career numbers are much worse than Luongo's, Lundqvist's. Price's and Rinne's. I already addressed this, but I want to make it clear. You simply cannot explain Miller's average numbers by saying that he played for poor teams. It's actually only very recently that Buffalo became a terrible team, and Miller's performance has not been noticeably affected by the strength of the teams in front of him. Look at Buffalo's record, and Miller's numbers for his career: 05/06 - Buffalo 110 points, Miller .914 save % 06/07 - 113 points, .911 save % 07/08 - 90 points, .906 save % 08/09 - 91 points, .918 save % 09/10 - 100 points, .929 save % 10/11 - 96 points, .916 save % 11/12 - 89 points, .916 save % 12/13 - 48 points (equivalent of 82 points), .915 save % 13/14 - Buf - 52 points (lol), .923 save % 13/14 - Stl - 111 points, .903 save % As you can see, there is no correlation between Buffalo's record and Miller's performance. In his early career, Buffalo was a competitive team, and Miller posted mediocre numbers. As the Sabres have declined, Miller's performance has continued to been average. Even on the excellent, defensively sound Blues, he did not post great numbers. Miller was truly excellent in 2010, and deserved the Vezina that year. But he was not elite before that, and he has not been elite since then. He has been very average since then, and expecting him to repeat that performance at the age of 34 is foolish. Also, Jose Theodore, Jim Carey and Olaf Kolzig have all won the Vezina. So yes, average goalies do win the Vezina! You make some faily compelling points with facts to back them up so I give you credit for your effort in research and I wish more posters on here would use this tactic in arguing so props to you. There are things that have to be looked at outside numbers though to determine performance and I for one do not think average and Ryan Miller fit together. He has been an upper echelon netminder for a lot of his career and I think most "experts" would agree. Is he that now? Probably not. Can he play a very specific role here in VAN and be a very good stop gap in allowing Lack to ease into the #1 role??! I beleive so. I think with the smoke around the story him signing now is likely and my concern is term. More than 2 years and I dont much like it. I dont mind the Canucks being garbage for a few years and developing their young players, but Im not sure that applies here. 1) Proven cases as to what rushing a young goaltender can end up (thinking Andrew Raycroft) and I am sure the Canucks dont want that to Lack, who still needs time to become a 65 game per year #1 goalie. 2) Even with a possibly young forward corp made up of Jensen, Vey, Kassian, Horvat, Matthias, Bonino, and down the line Shinkaruk, Virtanen, and Gaunce, steady veteran goaltending can ease that curve and keeping a young team in games every night is critical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxiebrown Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 You make some faily compelling points with facts to back them up so I give you credit for your effort in research and I wish more posters on here would use this tactic in arguing so props to you. There are things that have to be looked at outside numbers though to determine performance and I for one do not think average and Ryan Miller fit together. He has been an upper echelon netminder for a lot of his career and I think most "experts" would agree. Is he that now? Probably not. Can he play a very specific role here in VAN and be a very good stop gap in allowing Lack to ease into the #1 role??! I beleive so. I think with the smoke around the story him signing now is likely and my concern is term. More than 2 years and I dont much like it. I dont mind the Canucks being garbage for a few years and developing their young players, but Im not sure that applies here. 1) Proven cases as to what rushing a young goaltender can end up (thinking Andrew Raycroft) and I am sure the Canucks dont want that to Lack, who still needs time to become a 65 game per year #1 goalie. 2) Even with a possibly young forward corp made up of Jensen, Vey, Kassian, Horvat, Matthias, Bonino, and down the line Shinkaruk, Virtanen, and Gaunce, steady veteran goaltending can ease that curve and keeping a young team in games every night is critical. Thanks. I agree that the key thing is term. If we sign Miller at a 2 year term, I will not agree with the deal, but it will be very low risk. I don't anticipate us contending in the next two years, so it won't matter in the long run anyways. If we sign him for a longer term deal, though, I'd be extremely worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeddingCrashers Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I don't get why we want Miller? are we trying to compete or are we trying to give our young players a chance to play (er, get a good draft pick for rebuild) why ice a 'half pregnant' team... again? don't sign him. play lack. lose dramatically with a young roster, get a good pick This is what I thought we were doing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Undrafted Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I have to admit, I thought Lack should have been given the opportunity to start and preferred the idea of signing a reliable veteran backup. Plus, I wasn't sure of what kind of teammate Miller was and whether he'd be much of a mentor to Lack, if that was part of the equation. However, after doing a little digging on the interweb, it turns out all of his (ex-)teammates have nothing but good things to say about him. Best thing I read about Miller's attitude as a teammate was an old article from Sochi: it said that he did do his best to help out Jonathan Quick with advice on the big ice, even though it was clear that Quick was going to be the starter for the USA throughout the tournament—there was no sense of entitlement because of what he did in 2010. So at this point, I'd have no problem with the Canucks signing Miller: my only sticking point might be term, just because of his age. On the other hand, if he doesn't have a problem playing a secondary role as he gets older, even that might not be a issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I sincerely hope you don't think two FAs will just all of a sudden make us contenders. The Canucks are just not going to be contenders with this core group of players. That time has passed. As is the core. Kesler and Garrison gone, Hansen and possibly Burrows next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmployeeoftheMonth Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Wait... People are silly enough to question Ryan Millers Talent? Are you the same people who called Luongo a plug by chance? I don't really want Miller but wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~shiznak~ Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Do people actually want Ryan "freaking" Miller? The same Ryan Miller who threw his own teammates, under the bus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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