sedinsforever Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 If hank said that we'd all laugh our butts off. The only time I've ever disliked joe was in 2011 conf finals. But in retrospect he was in the 3rd round of playoffs and very injured. Trying to be a jerk was the only strategy he had left. He is a fantastic player and never should have been stripped of a C. SJ management is having a hell of a year and in a bad way. No playoffs, no captain all season, internal controversy between Joe and Doug...yikes. Someone is going to get boot. I have a feeling it'll be the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyhee Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 So...... At the beginning of the season there were those that were adamant that the Canucks were in a "rebuild" and that they had no chance against the Mighty California teams and making the playoffs was slim to none. So........ now we are near the end of the season and the Canucks are in a playoff position while only 1 of the 3 Cali teams are in a playoff position. Considering what the teams win/loss record was prior to last year before Xmas and this years stats, do you believe we are still in "rebuild" mode? I think the teams are constantly trying to improve by trading, resigning, letting go, signing etc. Players on a constant basis instead tearing down and rebuilding in one year. As part of my response I'd like to rely on some words from the response by oldnews, who said in part: "Semantics really. To think this team was rebuilding is to have a very weak conception of relative approaches to managing a roster." I must confess to sometimes using retool and rebuild almost interchangeably. In the sense of tearing down the existing core and starting pretty much from scratch, it was clear the Canucks weren't going to rebuild. Most on CDC wouldn't have been happy to see that done, though that plan certainly has had some advocates. Are the Canucks bad team? No, they are a good team. How good? Who knows? For most of us they've exceeded expectations by a small margin. I expected them to be a playoff bubble team, either just in or just out, and would have predicted perhaps 95-99 pts this season. Should they tear down the core to start over? I never thought they should and my opinion is still that it would be no way to run a franchise. However, on the other side, what I (and probably many others) saw as a problem on the Canucks a year ago was largely the age of the core. Normally the best players on a team are mostly in their mid to late twenties with a few above or below that age group. They form the largest part of the core. There is also a group, mostly early to mid-twenties, to form the next core. Canucks a year ago had an old core, mostly in its thirties. They didn't have a solid group in the mid to late twenties group having taken over as the basis of the core and there was an extreme shortage of player and top prospects in their early to mid-twenties to form the next core. The direction of the current management has been to fill some holes to keep the team competitive (the easiest example being the Vrbata signing) while seeking to fill in the early to mid-twenties group. While we can argue about the wisdom of individual moves, it seems clear that the management has stuck to that direction. We can and do argue about individual moves and the value of individual players, but the future no longer looks as bleak as it did a year ago. Bonino is younger than Kesler, some of the mid to late-twenties players have stepped forward (Edler, Tanev, Lack to give a few examples without trying to name everyone) and the management has made moves to acquire players they view as close to NHL ready such as for example without making an exhaustive list Baertschi, Pedan, Vey, Sbisa and Clendening. Not all of us agree with all the moves but the direction is clear and progress has been made. Is the age issue which gives rise to the retool/rebuild fully dealt with? No, our core is still old. There is still work to be done, but there is much more room for hope and excitement than was the case a year ago. As to the California teams, I expect a bounce back from L.A. next season. Anaheim has had a good regular season and should be good for another year at least and I haven't looked hard enough to comment on what is coming up behind the current group. San Jose management appears to have some work to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 Rebuild to me means replacing the core. In an ideal world, this should be an ongoing process. In reality, teams will ride a talented group of players through their prime years until a point is reached where they begin to decline and teams will actively replace members of their core. The 2011 core consisted of: Sedins, Kesler, Burrows, Hamhuis, Bieksa, Edler, Luongo Kesler and Luongo are gone but who will take their place? Benning added Vrbata and Miller to act as bridge players until some younger players can be developed who will form the next core. I think that most people think that Horvat will be one player to build the new team around. There are players who have the potential to become core but they will need to develop into it. Your faves from the 18-23 year olds perhaps: Kassian, Baertschi, Clendening, Gaunce, Jensen, Clendening, Pedan, Hutton, Cassels, Virtanen, McCann, Demko. Now is a time of transition. It'll take 3 or 4 years for the new team to take shape. Exciting times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 As JB and TL said at the beginning, they wanted to bring in youth but do it with a winning team so that the young players could learn without having their backs to the wall every night. Who knows the damage the Oilers are doing to all these first round picks? In the end they may have trade or watch many of them go because they have been unable to fuse them with seasoned quality players who would help them to win consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 Only oilers fans do that. I don't think their championship videos are in DVD, more like VHS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcon45ca Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 So...... At the beginning of the season there were those that were adamant that the Canucks were in a "rebuild" and that they had no chance against the Mighty California teams and making the playoffs was slim to none. So........ now we are near the end of the season and the Canucks are in a playoff position while only 1 of the 3 Cali teams are in a playoff position. Considering what the teams win/loss record was prior to last year before Xmas and this years stats, do you believe we are still in "rebuild" mode? I think the teams are constantly trying to improve by trading, resigning, letting go, signing etc. Players on a constant basis instead tearing down and rebuilding in one year. Canucks weren't in a "rebuild" mode, but a "re-tool"...they kept the veteran core (something you don't usually see in full rebuilds) and allowed some youth to enter the roster through the player development program, but really Canucks management just added pieces to an existing team structure. Calgary, they did a rebuild, that team looks nothing like the Flames of 2 years ago. Canucks just renovated. Honestly, if the Canucks can win 2 Stanley Cups in 3 years, I wouldn't lose sleep if they missed the playoffs... in fact I just might need the break from all the celebrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 SJ management is having a hell of a year and in a bad way. No playoffs, no captain all season, internal controversy between Joe and Doug...yikes. Someone is going to get boot. I have a feeling it'll be the latter. Joe is just bad news all around, Boston trading him was the best thing they ever did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted April 15, 2015 Author Share Posted April 15, 2015 Joe is just bad news all around, Boston trading him was the best thing they ever did. Joe has all the skills I see to be a great player but lacks the mental toughness. The guy is an unbelievable player when not under pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sedinsforever Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 Joe has all the skills I see to be a great player but lacks the mental toughness. The guy is an unbelievable player when not under pressure. He can be a clutch player when he can, but I haven't seen that ever since he joined San Jose in whenever year. San Jose just doesn't have the right support he needs to be able to perform at a star level, especially playoffs. Don't get me wrong. I respect and admire JT for his career in the NHL. He deserves a Cup, but then again, so do the Sedins. No one deserves anything so let me rephrase that: I WANT JT to have a Cup ring before he retires which is gonna be very soon. Who knows how long he'll be able to keep this up? He might pull a Kesler soon though...hue hue hue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombieksa Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 He can be a clutch player when he can, but I haven't seen that ever since he joined San Jose in whenever year. San Jose just doesn't have the right support he needs to be able to perform at a star level, especially playoffs. Don't get me wrong. I respect and admire JT for his career in the NHL. He deserves a Cup, but then again, so do the Sedins. No one deserves anything so let me rephrase that: I WANT JT to have a Cup ring before he retires which is gonna be very soon. Who knows how long he'll be able to keep this up? He might pull a Kesler soon though...hue hue hue This. Thornton, Ovechkin, and Iginla are the 3 players in the league I want to see win a cup in their careers almost as much as the Sedins, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sedinsforever Posted April 15, 2015 Share Posted April 15, 2015 This. Thornton, Ovechkin, and Iginla are the 3 players in the league I want to see win a cup in their careers almost as much as the Sedins, Thornton, Ovechkin, Iginla, Stamkos ( he wasn't with TB in 2004), Tavares, Sedins, and Marleau. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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