Elias Pettersson | #40 | C

[R.Dahlin26]

5 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Who replaces Tanev while we wait 3-4 years for that mid 1st defencemen to develop?

There's plenty of 2nd pairing d-men in FA we could sign as stop gaps. 

 

Why would it take 3-4 years? With good drafting and identifying qualities in the d-man that will make him successful in today's game, shouldn't take more than 2 years.

[ilduce39]

4 minutes ago, R.Dahlin26 said:

There's plenty of 2nd pairing d-men in FA we could sign as stop gaps. 

 

Why would it take 3-4 years? With good drafting and identifying qualities in the d-man that will make him successful in today's game, shouldn't take more than 2 years.

Is Tanev easily replaceable by a 2nd pairing UFA or is he worth a mid round 1st?  Because I don’t see a lot of those being tossed around at the TDL.

 

I also don’t agree that your mid 1st D man is going to be able to effectively carry 2nd pairing minutes as a 19/20 year old.  

 

To be honest, I think long and hard if a team floats a 10-20 OA 1st for Tanev... but as the only guy under 30 who I think can play top pairing minutes you’re leaving the rest of the roster in a very tough position.

[RetroCanuck]

1 minute ago, ilduce39 said:

Is Tanev easily replaceable by a 2nd pairing UFA or is he worth a mid round 1st?  Because I don’t see a lot of those being tossed around at the TDL.

 

I also don’t agree that your mid 1st D man is going to be able to effectively carry 2nd pairing minutes as a 19/20 year old.  

 

To be honest, I think long and hard if a team floats a 10-20 OA 1st for Tanev... but as the only guy under 30 who I think can play top pairing minutes you’re leaving the rest of the roster in a very tough position.

The argument would be that Tanev isn't having that large of an influence anyways. Sure he helps keep a few extra pucks out of our net but we are still losing. Plus he seems to be injury prone and not contributing full years anyways. Best way forward is to trade him for a prospect defensemen and pick. Dermott+1st or Liljegrin+2nd

[Rob_Zepp]

Is this still the EP thread or the 2018 draft proposal thread?

[R.Dahlin26]

16 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

Is Tanev easily replaceable by a 2nd pairing UFA or is he worth a mid round 1st?  Because I don’t see a lot of those being tossed around at the TDL.

 

I also don’t agree that your mid 1st D man is going to be able to effectively carry 2nd pairing minutes as a 19/20 year old.  

 

To be honest, I think long and hard if a team floats a 10-20 OA 1st for Tanev... but as the only guy under 30 who I think can play top pairing minutes you’re leaving the rest of the roster in a very tough position.

With or without Tanev this is a tire fire team. It'll be in the basement for the next few years as well. So if you can get could value for Tanev( Mid-round first) then you do it. Especially in this type of draft where you could draft a defenceman in that spot and get the same result as the defenceman that goes in the 6-15 range.

 

We could get Ryan Merkley, K'andre Miller, Alex Alexeyev with that first and with proper development could become better than Dobson and Bouchard.

 

So we could come out of this draft with 

 

A Zadina/Tkachuk/Wahlstrom and a Ryan Merkley/K'Andre Miller. 

 

Then we could use our 2nd round pick which should be in the 30-40 range and you might get a great prospect. Kind of like Colorado who got Conor Timmins last draft.

 

Then use the Picks from Vanek and Gudbranson on Defenceman as well.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 29, 2018 by R.Dahlin26

[NuckForReal!!!]

9 minutes ago, R.Dahlin26 said:

With or without Tanev this is a tire fire team. It'll be in the basement for the next few years as well. So if you can get could value for Tanev( Mid-round first) then you do it. Especially in this type of draft where you could draft a defenceman in that spot and get the same result as the defenceman that goes in the 6-15 range.

 

We could get Ryan Merkley, K'andre Miller, Alex Alexeyev with that first and with proper development could become better than Dobson and Bouchard.

 

So we could come out of this draft with 

 

A Zadina/Tkachuk/Wahlstrom and a Ryan Merkley/K'Andre Miller. 

 

Then we could use our 2nd round pick which should be in the 30-40 range and you might get a great prospect. Kind of like Colorado who got Conor Timmins last draft.

 

Then use the Picks from Vanek and Gudbranson on Defenceman as well.

 

 

 

 

I want atleast a 1st and 2 2nds for tanev. I think hamonic should be a good comparable.

[Isam]

13 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Is this still the EP thread or the 2018 draft proposal thread?

I think its the new draft proposal thread in stealth mode. 

[Isam]

14 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

Is this still the EP thread or the 2018 draft proposal thread?

Or trade propsal thread. Wooo. Aside from that, do you think ep40 has an outside shot at breaking 54 points in a season? He wont break the ppg of nilsson but he might be able to beat the overall point record for u20 players.

[Rob_Zepp]

Just now, Isam said:

Or trade propsal thread. Wooo. Aside from that, do you think ep40 has an outside shot at breaking 54 points in a season? He wont break the ppg of nilsson but he might be able to beat the overall point record for u20 players.

Harder to score in SEL in this era than during Forsberg's (scoring nearly 2 goals per game fewer and about 4 from time of Nilsson) but I actually don't think he will as they are close to running away with first place so I see good management being giving him some rest down the stretch to be fresh for playoffs as he has played a LOT of hockey this year.   I think he is having an amazing year and comparisons to other eras is fun but really isn't meaningful.   

[ilduce39]

21 minutes ago, RetroCanuck said:

The argument would be that Tanev isn't having that large of an influence anyways. Sure he helps keep a few extra pucks out of our net but we are still losing. Plus he seems to be injury prone and not contributing full years anyways. Best way forward is to trade him for a prospect defensemen and pick. Dermott+1st or Liljegrin+2nd

Those are great deals if they’re available, but who’s to say they’re on the table?  That’s a huge return for an injury prone guy who’s impact is limited to keeping a few extra pucks out of the net.

 

Of course, I think he’s worth a decent return as well - but his value to our team which is starved for defence is still huge.  He’s the only real guy on the roster who can slide into a top pairing. I like the idea of keeping him and playing him with Juolevi - two slick, cerebral defenders dominating possession for 25 minutes a game would have a huge impact IMO.

 

13 minutes ago, R.Dahlin26 said:

With or without Tanev this is a tire fire team. It'll be in the basement for the next few years as well. So if you can get could value for Tanev( Mid-round first) then you do it. Especially in this type of draft where you could draft a defenceman in that spot and get the same result as the defenceman that goes in the 6-15 range.

 

We could get Ryan Merkley, K'andre Miller, Alex Alexeyev with that first and with proper development could become better than Dobson and Bouchard.

 

So we could come out of this draft with 

 

A Zadina/Tkachuk/Wahlstrom and a Ryan Merkley/K'Andre Miller. 

 

Then we could use our 2nd round pick which should be in the 30-40 range and you might get a great prospect. Kind of like Colorado who got Conor Timmins last draft.

 

Then use the Picks from Vanek and Gudbranson on Defenceman as well.

With Bo and Brock already here and Gaudette, Pettersson, Demko and Juolevi knocking on the door I disagree.

 

We’re past the fire sale stage of the rebuild: young-ish players who can help the team (which now includes or soon will include the next core) carry a ton of value helping those guys establish themselves as successful NHL’ers.

 

Some vets need to be sold.. but a guy like Tanev who is in his prime, highly effective but has dubious trade value because of injuries, lack of points/physicality isn’t on the top of my list to move.

 

[Noble 6]

I'm very happy with the fact that Pettersson is being used as a center and is still producing. 

[DeNiro]

8 minutes ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

I'm very happy with the fact that Pettersson is being used as a center and is still producing. 

Luckily by the time Pettersson hits his prime the big boys in the Pacific will be done or winding down their careers. He won't be going head to head with the likes of Thornton, Kopitar, Getzlaf, and Kesler. 

 

Plus by that time we'll hopefully have Horvat and Gaudette in their prime ready to go head to head with these teams next young crop.

[TGokou]

I personally think you guys underrate what Tanev would fetch on trade market. He is worth at least a mid round first and a grade B prospect (a prospect that is trending upwards and not someone who was drafted high but has lost favor with their organization). I'm thinking a trade in the lines of Cal Foote plus Tampas 1st or maybe a trade with Colorado for Connor Timmins and their 1st. 

[ReggieBush]

3 minutes ago, TGokou said:

I personally think you guys underrate what Tanev would fetch on trade market. He is worth at least a mid round first and a grade B prospect (a prospect that is trending upwards and not someone who was drafted high but has lost favor with their organization). I'm thinking a trade in the lines of Cal Foote plus Tampas 1st or maybe a trade with Colorado for Connor Timmins and their 1st. 

That would be the absolute minimum I would take to move Tanev. He is one of those players who has more value to the team, then what he would fetch on the trade market

Edited January 29, 2018 by ReggieBush

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, R.Dahlin26 said:

Look where McAvoy and Karlsson were drafted though, in the teens. Ottawa and Boston were both lucky the way they have developed. 

 

We're talking about a top 8 pick here. If we were drafting outside the top 10, then sure I would look at Dobson, Wilde, Bouchard. But these three d-men project as second pairing d-man. Sure they can become top pairing d-men but why take that risk with a top 8 pick when we have been burned by this decision before. We can't afford to screw up these picks.

 

You have these sure-fire, physically and skill wise NHL ready studs. 

 

Svechnikov - 6'3 200

Zadina - 6'1 192

Tkachuk - 6'3 205

 

Unless we can't come out with Dahlin or Boqvist take one of Svechnikov/Zadina/Tkachuk/Kotkaniemi/Wahlstrom/Farabee

 

Trade Tanev for another first. Use that First on a defenceman.

 

Trade Vanek and Gudbranson for 2nd and 3rd round picks. Use those picks on defencemen.

 

Use our high second round pick on a defenceman.

 

See how this is a better strategy? 

Like I said devil's advocate. 

 

Besides, I'd assume we'd be trading down from say 4th'ish to 10-12'ish in this 'hypothetical'. So we'd have Dobson/Bouchard + some likely pretty good additional assets. 

 

And if they become a 'McAvoy' or 'Karlsson' of this draft, again in this hypothetical plan, is that really a downgrade from a Tkachuck or Zadina..?

 

Not such easy black and white answers....

[TGokou]

18 minutes ago, ReggieBush said:

That would be the absolute minimum I would take to move Tanev. He is one of those players who has more value to the team, then what he would fetch on the trade market

Exactly. We need someone who can teach Juolevi how to make those decisions in his own end and there is no one better than Tanev to do that.

[R.Dahlin26]

47 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

With Bo and Brock already here and Gaudette, Pettersson, Demko and Juolevi knocking on the door I disagree.

 

We’re past the fire sale stage of the rebuild: young-ish players who can help the team (which now includes or soon will include the next core) carry a ton of value helping those guys establish themselves as successful NHL’ers.

 

Some vets need to be sold.. but a guy like Tanev who is in his prime, highly effective but has dubious trade value because of injuries, lack of points/physicality isn’t on the top of my list to move.

 

1

For sure if you don't feel like you're getting proper value for Tanev you keep him. He still 2 more years on his deal. A first round pick and a B+ level prospect would do it for me.

 

Unlike Vanek and Gubranson who I feel should be traded at all costs for the best deal available.

 

[R.Dahlin26]

7 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Like I said devil's advocate. 

 

Besides, I'd assume we'd be trading down from say 4th'ish to 10-12'ish in this 'hypothetical'. So we'd have Dobson/Bouchard + some likely pretty good additional assets. 

 

And if they become a 'McAvoy' or 'Karlsson' of this draft, again in this hypothetical plan, is that really a downgrade from a Tkachuck or Zadina..?

 

Not such easy black and white answers....

If we're fortunate to pick at the 4th spot why make it complicated?

 

Just pick One of Svechnikov/Zadina/Tkachuk/Boqvist and laugh all the way to the bank.

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, R.Dahlin26 said:

If we're fortunate to pick at the 4th spot why make it complicated?

 

Just pick One of Svechnikov/Zadina/Tkachuk/Boqvist and laugh all the way to the bank.

That's likely what would/will happen. 

 

Just saying, how many people would trade Juolevi (or Tkachuck for that matter) for McAvoy +++ right now...?

[R.Dahlin26]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

That's likely what would/will happen. 

 

Just saying, how many people would trade Juolevi (or Tkachuck for that matter) for McAvoy +++ right now...?

But that is using hindsight on McAvoy. No one knew he would be this good.

 

So why take the risk of trading down in the hopes of getting a McAvoy when you could just draft the stud in Brady Tkachuk.

 

Let's take the 2016 draft for example. If we drafted Matthew Tkachuk like we should've and acquired a mid-late first and got Chychrun/Fabbro

 

Tkachuk + Chychrun/Fabbro >>>>>>>>>>> Juolevi

 

Now, look at the 2018 draft. Draft one of Svechnikov/Zadina/Tkachuk/Wahlstrom/Kotkaniemi

 

Aquire a mid-late first. Draft one of Merkley/Miller/Alexeyev/Woo

 

Zadina/Tkachuk + Merkley >>>>>> Dobson/Bouchard.