J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 8 hours ago, Hindustan Smyl said: Trading Markstrom would be a terrible move in my opinion. The cons of “throwing Demko to the wolves” would likely significantly outweigh whatever late first or early 2nd round pick we’d get for Markstrom. Demko needs to get his feet wet and get in some solid games as a back-up. Once Demko develops a bit at the NHL level, then you can start exploring options. I agree with you to a larger extent.... Just trading Markstrom for the sake of trading him would not be good However, if Benning feels that there is a short term replacement for Markstrom I would not be upset...….we sign Ryan Miller a couple of years back, and it worked out great Maybe too great! LOL I just point out that the possibility exists, and leave it at that, and will watch what Benning does It should be interesting I do wonder what he does approaching the expansion draft, where I would think Markstrom will be exposed Personally, the Canucks have a history of trading low, why not now when he has some credibility Who really knows what Markstrom shows up......I mean he has only really had 1 good season Which is what Colorado may be saying as well...…?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 11 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said: I really tried to stay away from making a trade proposal here, and only pointed out the possibility, to illustrate what Benning could do...…….. There very well may be players that hold no value in any case, but that is not for me to say, I only bring up the possibility, but there could easily be more that one that fit that scenario...…...I am not privy to JB's phone calls, I just do not want to rule anything out, and point out the possibility exists. Well that's the problem, to suggest that it's a possibility when there aren't really any options doesn't make it a reality. Putting the perception that for example Schaller can be utilized in this way so simply when there aren't really many options only fuels those "fire Benning" types when a deal doesn't happen. Schaller IMO hasn't been what was expected really of him and I don't really see him being traded unless for negative value. He only has one more year on his deal though, so I'd just ride out his contract at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 8 hours ago, Hindustan Smyl said: I would be wary of taking long term undesirable contracts since it would likely cause us future cap problems when we have to reup Pettersson and Hughes. However - I’d be willing to take on short term undesirable contracts. I’d also be willing to take on undesirable long term contracts IF we have a team a slightly less undesirable contract (with the expectation that we’d be upgrading a pick). For example - a possible Eriksson + 10th for Lucic + 8th. You see, I do really see that as a upgrade and more a lateral move...sure the 8th allows us the right to pick first, but Benning may be looking at someone entirely different that both Edmonton and Anaheim I am thinking more in the form of an extra 1st or 2nd, as part of taking a high cap hit from a team..... It could be someone we have never considered.....who knows????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 10 hours ago, janisahockeynut said: You know, you are right we have talked about this many times Spook, but as I realized that, I started thinking that maybe Benning has been thinking about it for awhile also, and he is just waiting for it to unfold. I mean, he did move out cap, and he has moved out some NTC, and positioned himself in a decent position, all the while, building his team. Those that feel Benning needs a Capoligist, are probably right, but that is not to say he hasn't got a decent handle on it, himself. Like I said earlier, I will wait and see. We are not going to get rich, but maybe richer. We 30 Million this year, as we speak, with Brock and Edler getting 12 MIllion of it, and Pettersson and Hughes getting more of it next year, so he has to be careful, but if he moves out some, he should have 12 or 14 Million to play with, which could definitely improve the team going forward...…. There is a lot of moving parts....it intrigues me! Absolutely Jan. Lets see how it unfolds, but he is definitely in a far better position than he was a few years back. He may still wait til next year, when Eriksson should be easier to move. Agree It’ll be very interesting to follow, how it unfolds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, theo5789 said: Well that's the problem, to suggest that it's a possibility when there aren't really any options doesn't make it a reality. Putting the perception that for example Schaller can be utilized in this way so simply when there aren't really many options only fuels those "fire Benning" types when a deal doesn't happen. Schaller IMO hasn't been what was expected really of him and I don't really see him being traded unless for negative value. He only has one more year on his deal though, so I'd just ride out his contract at this point. I think you are focussing on the wrong thing...…..it is the idea that some of our spare parts may be used that way is more important than who for argument of my thread.... You and I may have a opinion on a certain player, and either one of us could be right or wrong. Don't get fixated on a certain player, I wasn't, which is why I did not put a proposal together...…. I have absolutely no idea, who Benning will trade and for what. Do you?. In saying that, sure Schaller probably won't be that guy, but I am not a 100% sure that won't happen. My post was really about the opportunity these team present......cause they are in trouble, and will cost to clear their problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 59 minutes ago, Baer. said: Why would Colorado be interested in Markstrom when they traded for Grubauer who will likely be their #1 next year? You might want to change your thread title because your OP doesn't once mention any of the 4 teams in the thread title. I was hoping for an analysis on how screwed they are or possible ways to dig themselves out, but no, just more ramblings from CDC's top rambler. Thank you for your glowing endorsement...….But I am doing ok, not all feel the same way you do...….But all is good, I still love you! The truth is, I looked at pretty much every teams roster and cap, last night and picked 4 or 5 that, will be in some difficulty...…...there are more! I was trying to stay away from a huge, lengthy break down on every team, when it is right on Cap friendly to look at...….. I notice you are only at less than a 48% posting appreciation level, where as I am doing ok, not always but I guess better than you.... I actually post to draw out posters points of view, and start discussion, I try not to judge or personalize it, but sometimes I digress...….. There are way better posters on here than me! Some with great incite. But thanks for posting......any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theo5789 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said: I think you are focussing on the wrong thing...…..it is the idea that some of our spare parts may be used that way is more important than who for argument of my thread.... You and I may have a opinion on a certain player, and either one of us could be right or wrong. Don't get fixated on a certain player, I wasn't, which is why I did not put a proposal together...…. I have absolutely no idea, who Benning will trade and for what. Do you?. In saying that, sure Schaller probably won't be that guy, but I am not a 100% sure that won't happen. My post was really about the opportunity these team present......cause they are in trouble, and will cost to clear their problem Well you were discussing Schaller specifically to what I was responding to and my point is that you're over-simplifying the situation there as there will be more factors than simply them giving up assets to unload cap. Will they find value in the player in return? They may not save as much cap in a different deal and it may cost them slightly more to make the deal, but if the player they are actually getting back in return has more value to their actual on ice team, then they will take that deal. Also what's stopping them from simply waiving their player and burying them in the minors much like we did with Gagner if it's really only going to cost a couple million and the owners are okay with it? The perception is being made to look too simple and it's not simply about whether the numbers work out. There are things to consider for example Vegas has over 5 million in Clarkson that will go on LTIR. They could move him to the lowest buyer or move out Statsny to the higher bidder for a 2nd line center and bring up Glass for example. Washington has 10 million in cap space next year with all the major guys signed already. Pittsburgh could easily find a taker for Kessel and will be able to get a decent return for him and open up enough cap space to fill out their team. Toronto is really the only team that appears to be in the biggest bind right now, but I can think of creative ways for them to make it work (eg explore trading Matthews for defense and depth, using Kapanen or other asset and getting some team to take a Zaitsev dump). They're not in such a cap hell as perceived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billabong Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Target vrana speed and skill fits fits our age bracket vrana-pettersson-boeser thats a dynamic line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal.view Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 janis remember to read the ltir players on teams they are added to a team's cap and require compliance on opening day (only) and then the team can use that contract value to add someone else vegas is not in as bad shape as you suggest but they will likely move 1 contract to free up cap and have another 5 million in ltir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 7 minutes ago, theo5789 said: Well you were discussing Schaller specifically to what I was responding to and my point is that you're over-simplifying the situation there as there will be more factors than simply them giving up assets to unload cap. Will they find value in the player in return? They may not save as much cap in a different deal and it may cost them slightly more to make the deal, but if the player they are actually getting back in return has more value to their actual on ice team, then they will take that deal. Also what's stopping them from simply waiving their player and burying them in the minors much like we did with Gagner if it's really only going to cost a couple million and the owners are okay with it? The perception is being made to look too simple and it's not simply about whether the numbers work out. There are things to consider for example Vegas has over 5 million in Clarkson that will go on LTIR. They could move him to the lowest buyer or move out Statsny to the higher bidder for a 2nd line center and bring up Glass for example. Washington has 10 million in cap space next year with all the major guys signed already. Pittsburgh could easily find a taker for Kessel and will be able to get a decent return for him and open up enough cap space to fill out their team. Toronto is really the only team that appears to be in the biggest bind right now, but I can think of creative ways for them to make it work (eg explore trading Matthews for defense and depth, using Kapanen or other asset and getting some team to take a Zaitsev dump). They're not in such a cap hell as perceived. I understand your argument and don't totally disagree with you but I do not think any team will be doing anyone a favour.....there will certainly be down grades, as I Toronto's case No doubt teams will try to get value when trying to get cap compliant but do you see teams with excess cap doing favours? I don't. I just brought the whole issue as a matter of discussion and hope we are in the mix, somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rocket Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Possible targets from each team that could benefit the Canucks and be cheap due to cap reasons: Vegas: Reilly Smith Pittsburgh: Hornqvist or Schultz Washington: Niskanen or Burakovsky Toronto: Kapanen or Johnson. If jim can get one or two of the guys listed then I think the Canucks are a better team next year. And I think these players will be cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 6 minutes ago, coastal.view said: janis remember to read the ltir players on teams they are added to a team's cap and require compliance on opening day (only) and then the team can use that contract value to add someone else vegas is not in as bad shape as you suggest but they will likely move 1 contract to free up cap and have another 5 million in ltir Good point.....but that Opening day Cap compliance requirement should make some teams squirm Which is what I was thinking...…. I am sure most will wiggle out it with less damage than I suggest, but when you look at Cap friendly's tables There is a lot of teams very tight to the line......it will be interesting to see how Toronto works it out, amongst others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, The_Rocket said: Possible targets from each team that could benefit the Canucks and be cheap due to cap reasons: Vegas: Reilly Smith Pittsburgh: Hornqvist or Schultz Washington: Niskanen or Burakovsky Toronto: Kapanen or Johnson. If jim can get one or two of the guys listed then I think the Canucks are a better team next year. And I think these players will be cheap Kapanen for Leivo would be great! LOL...……..that would sit the Toronto media on its butt ! Could you imagine! lol No....I do not think that is happening. But I could see something around Goldobin + Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 14 hours ago, janisahockeynut said: Expendables, such as Granlund, Baertschi, Sutter, Leivo, Goldobin, Motte, Schaller, Hutton, and Biega, as well as Markstrom could all be very valuable to the right team this coming year. Top six wingers, shut-down centers, top six Dmen and upper tier goalies are expendable from a team still building? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: Top six wingers, shut-down centers, top six Dmen and upper tier goalies are expendable from a team still building? Totally get your point Rob My perspective has always been the guys I list, for the most part do not fit my idea of a rebuild, as they are either older, redundant, replaceable. For instance......we need a top LW, a 2nd line RWer and a top RHD....I don't see any of the guys listed as such...... I also think Benning will fill one of those spots this year...…….. If I have a problem with any of my opinion, it would be Markstrom, but I am kinda back and forth on him, as to when we let him go, I guess it is "IF" Benning can replace him.....Hutton is some what in the same boat, as if they don't sign Edler, Hutton then becomes important short term...…... But depending on returns...…...I guess everyone is expendable for the right price......Yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 1 minute ago, janisahockeynut said: Totally get your point Rob My perspective has always been the guys I list, for the most part do not fit my idea of a rebuild, as they are either older, redundant, replaceable. For instance......we need a top LW, a 2nd line RWer and a top RHD....I don't see any of the guys listed as such...... I also think Benning will fill one of those spots this year...…….. If I have a problem with any of my opinion, it would be Markstrom, but I am kinda back and forth on him, as to when we let him go, I guess it is "IF" Benning can replace him.....Hutton is some what in the same boat, as if they don't sign Edler, Hutton then becomes important short term...…... But depending on returns...…...I guess everyone is expendable for the right price......Yes? EVERYONE is replaceable but you need these sorts of players as NO team has 23 budding superstars under 23. I think if you sit back and really look at where the Canucks are in terms of their role players, their young players and their pipeline - they are in pretty decent condition in compare to near every team in terms of what the next five years look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: EVERYONE is replaceable but you need these sorts of players as NO team has 23 budding superstars under 23. I think if you sit back and really look at where the Canucks are in terms of their role players, their young players and their pipeline - they are in pretty decent condition in compare to near every team in terms of what the next five years look like. I don't disagree... But what I do think is there will be some older Dman, that we may be able to sign short, that will be pretty close to Hutton's ability I also see a back log on LD at his ceiling, with some of them having close if not more ceiling than him...…...it is not that I don't like him It is that, we are close to being able to play other players at 4/5/6 which is where he is at...…..for instance "IF" Edler signs for 3 more years...we have Edler/Hughes/Juolevi/Brisebois and Rathbone....and I think that Saunter makes a good third pairing Dman...and can play regularly But I could be wrong...just an opinion...…. So, if Edler signs, I think we are able to move Hutton...………...and I think highly of him, probably more so than a lot of others on here......value IMO = 2nd rounder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 how many nhl defensemen do we need to make it through a full season? history seems to say at least 10 or 12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted May 19, 2019 Author Share Posted May 19, 2019 3 hours ago, smithers joe said: how many nhl defensemen do we need to make it through a full season? history seems to say at least 10 or 12. Yes, I agree Joe, but what I think you will see this year, is we have a lot of LHD that can play on the Canucks, and that some will be picked off of waiver wire, if we are not careful. Saunter's is a good example of that. These teams that are tight to the cap will need guys like him and McEneny, so I could see them getting scooped up....I hate loosing things for nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 8 hours ago, The_Rocket said: Possible targets from each team that could benefit the Canucks and be cheap due to cap reasons: Vegas: Reilly Smith Pittsburgh: Hornqvist or Schultz Washington: Niskanen or Burakovsky Toronto: Kapanen or Johnson. If jim can get one or two of the guys listed then I think the Canucks are a better team next year. And I think these players will be cheap This is getting the Ehrhoff vibe an if feels great. Can we have Reilly Smith for Schaller please? I mean Tim is better than... P White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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