10pavelbure96 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, Lionized27 said: I can't remember when I've seen such an epic meltdown of CDC. Maybe when Bure was dealt? Lol not sure if sarcasm but when Bure was dealt I'm pretty sure CDC message boards weren't around 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westcoastcanucks777 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Hope the Canucks can sign this guy he sounds like a cool guy! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionized27 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, 10pavelbure96 said: Lol not sure if sarcasm but when Bure was dealt I'm pretty sure CDC message boards weren't around Totally hyperbole...but if they were you could imagine the ire raised. The fact remains that not signing a FREE AGENT by Canucks management has resulted in this blow up is laughable. There's a plan. People just need to remain calm and have faith in those in the position to make the actual decisions know what it takes to take this current roster to the next level will do so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 I wanted Toffoli signed, but I thought it'd take $5 mil per, which the cap crunch wouldn't allow. The fact that Benning couldn't match $4.25 just speaks to his ongoing ineptitude. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10pavelbure96 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, Lionized27 said: Totally hyperbole...but if they were you could imagine the ire raised. The fact remains that not signing a FREE AGENT by Canucks management has resulted in this blow up is laughable. There's a plan. People just need to remain calm and have faith in those in the position to make the actual decisions know what it takes to take this current roster to the next level will do so. Ya toffoli was injured more often than not while we had him so what we are losing in him is luxury really, demko and holtby is an upgrade on markstrom imo. We are really going to miss Tanev but hes another one who is often injured so have we really taken that far of a step back? Every team in our division though has gotten better. Calgary, Edmonton, have gotten a bit better, nothing crazy though. And Vegas just took a huge step with Petro. So we have to do something. We have no depth right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bad alice french Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Starting to look like management and owners see next year as a reset year. Looks like the focus is down the line a bit when Hogs and Podz etc. are full time and the centerpieces are all in their early to mid 20's. All these $&!#ty contracts will have run out and it will be time to go shopping for "pieces". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 I don't agree with the 'our guys' were plan B or C storylines. The reason being - Markstrom's contract - and whether it required a NMC - was a massive factor in the entire decision-making process imo. Had Markstrom been willing to sign without that - the team would not have been 'forced' to predetermine Demko's future here. The secondary factor that played in - was the Ekman-larsson interest in coming here. Those two things would seem to have been co-determined to some extent. If the team was willing to commit to a NMC for Markstrom and take on his friend - Ekman-larsson, who also holds a NMC - then the team was relatively 'all in' in the present....The either/or nature of the contingency was not only determined by the NMC, but apparently the expectation to include Demko in the deal was reported to factor into Arizona declining the deal when he wasn't. If those two deals go through - then presumably the team does what is necessary to follow through and keep their short term 'asset-base' intact - probably take the extra steps to re-sign Tanev, Toffoli....Presumably Eriksson would have been packaged into that deal, setting the ground to get more aggressive clearing cap.... That was quite a tall order to accommodate - and a huge divergence in consequences. The reality is that those conditions are overlapping with preconditions (ie Luongo recrap) and the expansion draft (where one would be exposed)....Markstrom, understandably wasn't willing to sign with the contingency of being exposed - he chose security in Calgary instead as I see it. And if you don't take those steps, to retain Markstrom with the NMC and OEL - then it doesn't necessarily make sense to 'force' the subsequent steps - they all have to be taken into consideration in the context of a plan 1a and 1b in a sense. They are now working on plan 1a - which is the Demko plan - the timeline of the team post-Markstrom and without OEL (plan 1b?). They can/will/are still looking to improve, but might now look at things like overage/bonus differently - as more realistic priorities / something to be cleared out as much as possible....? Or they could be reserving their leverage for situations that fit their needs better (a Tampa deal?).....In either event they're still likely to be active in the market - but it doesn't necessarily imply that 'our guys like Tanev, Toffoli, or Stecher were plan B, or C - I think plan 1b could possibly have included one or two of them?...can't say - but also can't reduce them to plan B or C as if callously discarded - it may not be that simple (a number of things overlapping, which is likely what Benning implied when it appeared Markstrom was the first 'chip' that had to fall/be determined.... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Lionized27 said: I can't remember when I've seen such an epic meltdown of CDC. Maybe when Bure was dealt? McCaan trade. Shinkaruk trade. Hodgson trade. Edited October 12, 2020 by Warhippy 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 5 hours ago, Attila Umbrus said: Maybe Benning feels it's time to take the next step forward and let some of these young guys finally play and earn roster spots. They have been brewing on the farm for a couple years now. Hell yeah! A proven 25 goal scorer, and a key component on PP1 gone. But let's promote Lind, and sub him in automatically on the 2nd line. That should be great for the Canucks fortunes, plus for Lind's development! Or do you want Jake on line two, when Green didn't even trust him enough to start him in the playoffs, despite several injured forwards? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 It should be very apparent and seriously obvious that at tis point in time the one single mitigating factor in all these signings of Canuck UFAs has been term Look at the current economic situation of the NHL under covid. over 50% of league revenue is gate driven. We're up for an expansion team and a new tv deal and there's actually talk about potential cap retraction. There's a clear and concise reason that the organization has watched UFA's walk and been unable to sign some other UFAs in the first flurry of free agency. Term being the most important. Economy being the 2nd. The angst and endless meltdowns over the team essentially moving sideways at this stage and having the prospects and depth to cover the current losses has been amusing but it's getting old. We've stockpiled prospects enough that they can in fact possibly cover the losses. A lot of them are essentially completely unknown to most on here as evidenced by the hand wringing and angst filled posts. There's a bigger picture here a lot of people are either unwilling or unable to see. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, Barry_Wilkins said: Hell yeah! A proven 25 goal scorer, and a key component on PP1 gone. But let's promote Lind, and sub him in automatically on the 2nd line. That should be great for the Canucks fortunes, plus for Lind's development! Or do you want Jake on line two, when Green didn't even trust him enough to start him in the playoffs, despite several injured forwards? Oh, off season ended today? We can't make anymore moves. Panic panic panic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Ridiculous. Whatever hope their was for the next season has been dashed this past week. Ridiculous we gave up four assets for him, including two second round picks. And we simply let him walk. This franchise has does such things since inception and there's a reason why they haven't won a championship. This franchise and dumbassery are synonymous.. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Just now, Tortorella's Rant said: Ridiculous. Whatever hope their was for the next season has been dashed this past week. Ridiculous we gave up four assets for him, including two second round picks. And we simply let him walk. This franchise has does such things since inception and there's a reason why they haven't won a championship. This franchise and dumbassery are synonymous.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, Barry_Wilkins said: Hell yeah! A proven 25 goal scorer, and a key component on PP1 gone. But let's promote Lind, and sub him in automatically on the 2nd line. That should be great for the Canucks fortunes, plus for Lind's development! Or do you want Jake on line two, when Green didn't even trust him enough to start him in the playoffs, despite several injured forwards? There's 4 teams in the east right now that are going to be forced to trade promising young players to maintain cap compliance. 3 in the west (4 now with the AP signing) Maybe, patience? Just because the first flurry of free agency is winding down doesn't mean that the moves have been made that matter 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavel the Bure Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 (edited) He said...she said.....Toffoli said he want to play close to LA because his wife working for Dodgers ...last as I check, Montreal Far Far Away from LA... Demko-reason we let Marky go Tanev-no way we can have 4 years term, he was a warrior but lets be honest here, he declining Stecher-love his Story and local boy, replaceable Toffoli- we have no idea how negotiation went, what was offering to him. Edited October 13, 2020 by Pavel the Bure 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 1 minute ago, canuck73_3 said: I know; my standard isn't mediocrity.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Sad to see Tofu go but his new contract does not fit the new reality. Part of this new reality that I have not seen discussed yet is that the AHL is not planning to play this season and the effect that could have on JB & Co's decision-making processes right now. One of the realities of team-building is deciding where to place the yutes so they can develop properly, and the AHL does a great job of providing one huge such place, that is, up until Covid. We (the Canucks) have many prospects on AHL contracts and most likely wanted to put more down in the "A" again now, and in the future. Teams are actively trying to find spots for their prospects to play and talent is being forced down, and out by the AHL being closed. We have a number of guys not on AHL contracts thankfully, and some guys with contracts have stayed, or gone to Europe etc, but the spots are filling up fast. So what do you do with your AHL Yutes? Maybe play them on the big club? JB said he is going to honour the contracts they have signed and I take this to mean, including and especially the young guns, and now perhaps, our AHL (top) players. These next two seasons will be unlike any we have ever experienced. It is the perfect time to get our house in order. Cover the kids' bonuses. Cut the chaff. Do not extend or sign anyone over a certain age. Run out the old expensive contracts. Sign only the young guns. Get lean and mean. Take advantage of teams that have not adjusted. Steal a #1 RHD from someone. I thought this year's Cup might earn an asterisk, but I think the next two will be even more abnormal. The NHL is fighting for its life right now financially, and one way we can help is by being strong ourselves. Another thing not really discussed much is that this Covid Crunch is shrinking seasons (and playoffs perhaps?); e.g. if the NHL starts the season in January (or even Feb now), I am sure they are going to want to shorten it up so that they can get back to a normal schedule as quickly as possible. So I think 20/21 will be shorter and 21/22 will be shorter, and maybe by 22/23 we might be back on track, but maybe not too. All this hockey, crammed into super-tight schedules, and rushed playoffs are going to take a toll on the players as well as coaches and staff. If we are not "cup-contenders" (as if any of you can say for certain we are or we are not, lol) during this period, so be it. As long as we are solid as a team and everybody works hard, we can be proud of our team and enjoy their efforts (and need I say, the games themselves). There are more important things than signing this or that winger, like everyone's health, for example. And, we just might win it all anyway; lots of teams are going to have lots of their own problems. Along the same lines, what are the bubble considerations going to look like for next season and the future? Is there going to be a Canadian Bubble? If so, would more players like to move or return to Canada to get away from the awful mess in the USA? Most people are looking at forgiving any thought of gate revenue for 20/21, but maybe this goes on for 21/22 as well. For example, if the NHL can wrap up 20/21 by say July or August (and I don't think the NHL gives a hoot for the Olympics right now), have a quick break, training camp and exhibition, and back at 21/22 by say Nov/Dec, we still may not have a cure or vaccine for Covid even by then. Then what? Other leagues, that have opened up the gate revenue are having to shut some teams back down and this type of reaction will have further complications for scheduling. If the players have to 'bubble' for the whole season, will they want to again for the playoffs? And again another season, and playoffs? Not saying this will happen, just that we should appreciate the depth of these types of issues and be thankful our management group is taking it seriously, and more seriously than just whether we could have signed Tofu if we hadn't signed Beags or whatever nonsense if being shuffled around. The blood has only begun to be let. The financial realities have only begun to roost. Many people are in much poorer (health and finances) condition than pre-pandemic. The global economic effects have only begun to hit; governments are rushing to try to save it all with massive money-inflating schemes and negative interest rates, or at least to hide the true effects from the general public as long as they can. As these strictures come to bear on pro sports and the NHL, there will be personal bankruptcies of team owners, event venues (hockey rinks), peripheral vendors and related businesses etc. Season ticket holder bases will also be impacted and corporate box revenue should decline. In Vancouver, in BC, in Canada, we will most likely be ok and in fact may weather these storms better than most. But overall, the NHL is in trouble as are all pro sports. For right now, we see teams like our Canucks, not giving out new contracts, further term, no-trade/no-move clauses, or any other over-payments due to changed conditions. I believe this is only the beginning. All players who signed before Covid are thanking their lucky stars and hoping the league/team stays solvent long enough for them to get paid. Soon players will be scrambling to take what they can get. At least the young guys will be. The old guys will not suffer the bubbles as easily, nor fight off Covid as well as the young guys, and will be more easily satisfied with what they have already earned. So, I think the Canucks are looking at this year's decisions in light of the prospect of long-term no-gate-revenue business and perhaps NHL Team Owners Bankruptcies, bringing to mind what to do with borderline viable franchises like Arizona, Florida, Edmonton (where would they be without McDavid), when the money dries up? How many players are going to become desperate for a contract of any kind? How many are going to opt out and say, "Enough is enough, I'm out."? Previously I posted that the two greatest assets for teams right now were young players and cap space; now I would like to add short-term, no clause, and cheap contracts to that list. If Toffoli had wanted to stay, he probably could have done so on a short-term contract. There is no reason for all this whinging. Be thankful we have a team, a league, hockey to watch, and our health to enjoy it. We (the Nux) are going to be ok, possibly even very good. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Just now, Tortorella's Rant said: I know; my standard isn't mediocrity.. Neither is mine. But I'm not going to panic 3 months minimum before the season starts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionized27 Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 1 minute ago, canuck73_3 said: Oh, off season ended today? We can't make anymore moves. Panic panic panic You realize that you can use that same bogus "deferral" non-argument for any move or non-move, right? Even people who are angered by this trade still defer to Benning, as in, "there must be something up Benning's sleeve". I can only go by the moves he's actually made. And it's not shaping up very well, is it? Or do you think losing your elite goalie, top line RW, top 4 Dman, and #5 Dman, only replacing that with an inferior tandem goalie, is countered by "we can still make moves". Well, sure Benning can make moves, but, to be as objective as possible, do you really see any move he could make at this point recouping even a fraction of what he's given up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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