[Discussion] Getting the Right Hand Defenseman we need..........(discussion)

[J.I.A.H.N]

Well, another season has passed, and quite a season it was. What became so evident to me was exactly how much we need that #1/#2 RHD man. IMO, we need a veteran, who can help Quinn Hughes. IMO, it is the single biggest single acquisition we need to go after.

 

Instead of actually, making a proposal and getting blown out of the water, I would like to make a few player suggestions and see who you like the best, or is it someone else? I would really like to see him be with Hughes for more than a year or 2, so without further ado, here are some of the guys I would like to go after.

 

In no particular order....................

 

A.             Jacob Trouba                  27 years old, 6'3" 209 lbs              $8,000,000 X 5 years

B.             Adam Larson                   28 years old, 6'3" 208 lbs              $4,100,000 (UFA)

C.             Erik Cernak                     23 years old, 6'3" 233 lbs              $2,950,000 X 3 years

D.             Dougie Hamiton              27 years old, 6'6" 229 lbs              $5,750,000 (UFA)

E.             Josh Manson                   29 years old, 6'3" 224 lbs              $4,100,000 X 1 year

 

 

Now, with Jacob Trouba, he has a NMC, but the Rangers are flush with RHD, and Trouba has been replace with Adam Fox, as the number one RHD, Trouba also carries a nice big 8 million dollar contract, which down the road is going to be a problem for the Rangers, as their young crop start loosing their ELC's. It is coming and the know it, They have Brandon Schneider, and Nils Lundkvist, coming soon, not to mention Antony Deangelo, who will most probably be bought out this summer. But regardless, of loosing Deangelo, the Rangers will not have a problem filling their RHD for years to come.

 

Adam Larson, is becoming a UFA this summer, but I am sure with the playoff experience that the Oilers are tasting, they will want to re-sign Larson, if they have the budget to, and with Tyson Barrie saying he would like to test the waters this summer in UFA, Edmonton will not be ready to loose 2/3's of their starting right side. IMO, they let Barrie walk, and try to fly with Evan Bouchard and Ethan Bear. I do not think Larson makes it to market.

 

Erik Cernak is a interesting target, as Tampa may not be able to protect all their defensemen. Top Dman Victor Hedman, along with McDonagh, and Segachev will be protected, unless Tampa can pull another rabbit out of a hat ( Never count them out on that one!), but certainly one of Cernak and Cal Foote will be exposed, if not both. Maybe Foote will be available?

Is he good enough to be considered help for Quinn Hughes? I don't think so, short term.

 

I am a Dougie Hamilton pusher, as it is not often you get a chance to sign a perennial all-star. But the price tag might be too big. (IMO, it starts at $8,000,000) if he even gets to market?

I am not sure there is much more to say about Hamilton, except his contract demands will surely include being a 6 to 8 year deal. Someone asked me in another thread, would I really want him at 36 years of age? Well maybe not, but IMO, a the contract could be structured with a declining salary that is buyout convenient." IF" we can find the money and "IF" he is available, he would impact out team favorably.

 

I love Josh Manson, but he is only under contract for 1 more year, and you have to wonder how much he would want to re-sign for, and how much the trade cost would be? He is also slowing down, so as much as I like him, is he aging out? 

 

These guys would all help the Canucks and Quinn Hughes, but would the cost be too much? I am not sure.

 

Do you have a particular player in mind? What would you give up? It is a tough position to fill, and I am not sure how many teams are really willing to lets good defensive players go, at least not without a Kings ransom.

 

Here is a couple random thoughts about this problem. If I am Benning, I am looking to see who is not protected and see if any one those players might fill the bill. Also, I think I am talking to Seattle and posing a deal for a solid RHD. Both idea's are related to the Expansion draft, and would be good options.

 

Another thing that might be worth considering and is a hail-mary, is moving our 2022-2023 1st rounder for a younger defenseman, who would not ordinarily be on the market, but might be considered, if a team was soft on who they would protect between their #3 and #4. This could be the way to get Cernak ???? I can imagine Tampa maybe wanting to hedge their chances at Bedard. Again this is only if they are going to lose one or the other anyways.

 

Hey, these are only a few of the Dmen out there that might fit the bill. (These are 5 of the ones I came up with). Can you think of any one else? IMO, he has to be someone that will help Hughes, and be around long term.

 

PSS..on a totally separate note. I hope Benning goes heavy on RHD.............I would consider getting Ceulemans and Morrow a win, even Ceulemans and one of Mailloux or Schmidt. It's time to stock those RHD prospects.

[King Heffy]

Cal Foote.  No way to moving next year's first.  I like Manson, but I'm inclined to wait until both he and Parayko hit UFA at the same time as our dead cap expires.  Unless we get a bargain, I run with the kids for a year, see what we have, and then go all in on one of those guys.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

Dougie Hamilton is a dream of mine.

 

I have been even wondering if he's available at the expansion draft, if it would be worth talking to seattle what it would cost for them to sign and trade him to us.

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

2 minutes ago, Petey_BOI said:

Dougie Hamilton is a dream of mine.

 

I have been even wondering if he's available at the expansion draft, if it would be worth talking to seattle what it would cost for them to sign and trade him to us.

 

To trade for a signed Dougie Hamilton would cost us big.............more inclined t either sign as a UFA or look other places

 

I would love him too, but not at assets + salary

Edited May 20, 2021 by janisahockeynut

[NewbieCanuckFan]

Seems like Benning’s been looking to add a top 4 right side D since 2014.  Guess he needs more time.  

[J.I.A.H.N]

3 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Seems like Benning’s been looking to add a top 4 right side D since 2014.  Guess he needs more time.  

Well, in all fairness, so have alot of other GM's

[mll]

There’s been plenty of speculation that Tampa will likely make a deal with Seattle.  They don’t have to trade anyone if they agree on the pick.

 

Even if they don’t, they can protect Cernak, Hedman and Sergachev and could even go 4 D to include Foote.  McDonagh is 32 next month and has another 5 years at 6.8M - doesn’t require protecting and probably a contract they wouldn’t mind losing. They have to create cap space but it’s likely not by trading key parts of their future - Brisebois has made it amply known in the off- season that Cernak, Sergachev and Cirelli are not available.

 

Dougie Hamilton wants to stay in Carolina.  He’s asking for Pietrangelo money.  They’ve postponed negotiations till after the playoffs.  

 

Friedman says Anaheim will listen on Manson but the cost is really high because they don’t want to move him.  Any team wanting him will have to overpay.

 

Trouba wanted to go out East for his now fiancée. 

 

Larsson and Edmonton are negotiating a new contract per Friedman.

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by mll

[Bad_BOI_pete]

Just now, janisahockeynut said:

To trade for a signed Dougie Hamilton would cost us big.............more inclined t either sign as a UFA or look other places

would also wonder what it would cost for his signing rights.

 

but is it too early to make a push? probably.

[*Buzzsaw*]

This team should not spend a lot of money on a right hand D who is 32+.

 

This team will not be a Cup Contender for a couple years and that would make an older D too old to play with the younger guys.

 

Team needs a younger guy who can learn with Hughes.  Preferably 23-25.

 

The guys you mention are all legit... but also VERY expensive and would likely require trading one of our top six.

Edited May 20, 2021 by *Buzzsaw*

[J.I.A.H.N]

5 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

This team should not spend a lot of money on a right hand D who is 32+.

 

This team will not be a Cup Contender for a couple years and that would make an older D too old to play with the younger guys.

 

Team needs a younger guy who can learn with Hughes.  Preferably 23-25.

 

The guys you mention are all legit... but also VERY expensive and would likely require trading one of our top six.

OK Buzz

 

But who then?

[*Buzzsaw*]

5 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

OK Buzz

 

But who then?

Needs some smart trading for prospects who would be a match with Hughes.

 

That means scouring the AHL and European leagues for overlooked gems or going after 1st or 2nd year players on other teams.

 

Unfortunately I don't have the confidence Benning can pull those trades off.  He showed with the Nate Schmidt trade he over-estimated his value.

 

Tryamkin was an obvious potential fix from outside the NHL... (although he might not have been a match with Hughes) ...we all know what happened there.

 

The situation is the team no longer has the CAP space to afford big number contracts like those mentioned by the OP.

 

I think the team needs to wait till more salary is cleared off the books before they start making big signings.

[Phil_314]

4 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

Unfortunately I don't have the confidence Benning can pull those trades off.  He showed with the Nate Schmidt trade he over-estimated his value.

I disagree, a 3rd round pick for an RD with versatility to play both sides is a steal, and he was definitely top-4 for Vegas (just needed to go as they wanted Petro and so became a cap casualty).
If Cernak was available for the same price I'd say take it if we can't sign someone like Larsson. 

Edited May 20, 2021 by Phil_314

[*Buzzsaw*]

Just now, Phil_314 said:

I disagree, a 3rd round pick for an RD with versatility to play both sides is nothing to sneeze at, and he was definitely top-4 for Vegas (just needed to go as they wanted Petro).
If Cernak was available for the same price I'd say take it if we can't sign someone like Larsson. 

Schmidt is costing the team 6 million a year.

 

For what?

 

He isn't a legitimate 3/4 in my estimation... which means he is over-priced.

 

He was top 4 for Vegas... that's what they planned when they signed him for 6 million... but then George McPhee suddenly realized he wasn't worth it.

 

And credit McPhee... when he makes a mistake, he looks for a way out.

 

That's why McPhee signed Pietrangelo and was so eager to hand Schmidt over to the Canucks.

 

If he was signed for 3.5, then he'd be well worth it... but not at 6 million.

[Phil_314]

8 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

Schmidt is costing the team 6 million a year.

 

For what?

 

He isn't a legitimate 3/4 in my estimation... which means he is over-priced.

 

He was top 4 for Vegas... that's what they planned when they signed him for 6 million... but then George McPhee suddenly realized he wasn't worth it.

 

And credit McPhee... when he makes a mistake, he looks for a way out.

 

That's why McPhee signed Pietrangelo and was so eager to hand Schmidt over to the Canucks.

 

If he was signed for 3.5, then he'd be well worth it... but not at 6 million.

Is there a source for when McPhee "realized he wasn't worth it"?  Also he was playing on the shutdown duo in VGK but still put up around 30 points a game (and I hardly call wanting to upgrade to a true #1 RHD in Petro when the opportunity came up when he went to FA as equating to Schmidt not being worth it or "getting out from under a mistake".  It's a business transaction, and it's not like we're talking about trading Gudbranson to get Pearson to get out from under a mistake, as Schmidt isn't a scrub fronting as a top-4 guy).  

Edited May 20, 2021 by Phil_314

[*Buzzsaw*]

Is Schmidt as good a D as Myers? 

 

They are both getting 6 million.

 

Myers played the 1/2 position... Schmidt played 3/4.

 

I don't think Schmidt is even as good as a 35 year old Edler who played 1/2 shifts most of the year.

[*Buzzsaw*]

Just now, Phil_314 said:

Is there a source for when McPhee "realized he wasn't worth it"?

He dumped him for a 3rd rounder.

[AlwaysACanuckFan]

36 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

OK Buzz

 

But who then?

Hamonic

[Phil_314]

9 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

Is Schmidt as good a D as Myers? 

 

They are both getting 6 million.

 

Myers played the 1/2 position... Schmidt played 3/4.

 

I don't think Schmidt is even as good as a 35 year old Edler who played 1/2 shifts most of the year.

It's apples and oranges when it comes to play style (Myers has shutdown potential due to his size but Baumer had him playing too passively early on so that's knock on him [he got better later and was also good in transition with the puck], while Schmidt made too many turnovers off the rush but got better later on -- I still think each has their role, but Schmidt might be miscast as a shutdown guy since he's not that big either).  Overall Myers did fare somewhat better than Schmidt, but worse than Edler is where we'll have to agree to disagree, Edler's skating is nowhere near where it was.  I think Schmidt needs help on defense but is good, not great as a defender, but given what he showed in Vegas I still think the potential is there given that they get him the right partner.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Phil_314

[*Buzzsaw*]

2 minutes ago, Phil_314 said:

It's apples and oranges when it comes to play style (Myers has shutdown potential due to his size but Baumer had him playing too passively early on so that's knock on him [he got better later and was also good in transition with the puck], while Schmidt made too many turnovers off the rush but got better later on -- I still think each has their role, but Schmidt might be miscast as a shutdown guy since he's not that big either).  Overall Myers did fare somewhat better than Schmidt, but worse than Edler is where we'll have to agree to disagree, Edler's skating is nowhere near where it was.  I think Schmidt needs help on defense but is good, not great as a defender.  

Its sad to say, but Edler fell off the cliff in the second half of the season... in the first half he was on par with last year.

 

Might have been Covid or maybe simply couldn't handle a full season anymore.

 

Still think Edler was better overall than Schmidt considering the roles he was placed in.

 

For me Schmidt is a Meh... he would be fine as a 5/6 but I don't think his offensive talent is enough to make up for his defensive miscues.

 

I think that is why Hamonic ended up with Hughes... he was more reliable defensively and had more grit.

 

Sad to say, but it may be Hamonic again with Hughes unless Jimbo can pull a rabbit out of the hat.

 

I don't see where they have the CAP space to afford anyone on the list by the OP.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

if we dont get Larsson or Hamilton, I would love to bring back short term Hamonic and sign Hakanpaa.

 

He destroys everybody and a lot, kills penalties and blocks shots. all I know is there is not many good options on RD.

 

I don't want to sign savard or montour