Attn..The Patience-Queue Starts Here

[IBatch]

8 hours ago, Provost said:

Sure a retool "could" potentially work... ours objectively hasn't, and we really haven't even tried that.  Now that basically all our prospects have graduated to the team we will again have one of the worst prospect pools in the league... basically DiPietro and this year's 1st rounder as likely to become material NHL calibre and the rest just hopefuls and depth pieces.  We will still have a bad roster as well even with all those high picks playing.  We can hope for internal improvement from enough of them to make the team better.  Based on his history of signings and inefficient contracts... I have zero faith in Benning being able to build around that core effectively.

Miller is a good player... but if we are a losing team his entire tenure under club control here (as Benning even suggests we likely will be... that he hopes we are competitive in Miller's last contract year), then making that move was premature and it was a bad decision.  If he didn't think we were ready to compete, you don't trade away a 1st round pick for a veteran to be on a losing team.  We had plenty (too many) veterans already to "insulate" the kids. 

We didn't need "tweeners" in the system so spending futures to get them didn't make sense, especially when you were also signing a bunch of veterans as well.  What does an "age gap" mean if you are rebuilding and those players will be over the hill by the time you are ready to compete?  That was the management marketing line, but it made no sense.  There are always veteran players left without a good contract offer as free agency goes along... you don't need to give up important rebuilding assets to trade for "tweeners" who aren't any better but just happen to be 2-3 years younger.  Signings like Vanek, Vrbata, Schaller were ideal "rebuilding" signings.  Short term, market value or less, solid veteran presence... can be flipped for assets (like Motte) at the deadline if we are still bad that year.  Staying with that as a plan and repeating that until we crept out of the cellar (Toronto did it like that) would be totally defensible.  Signings like Ferland, Roussel, Sutter, Holtby, Beagle to more money and term than other teams were willing to spend put us backwards because we needed to insulate the kids were just bad decisions that cost us a chance to build on any successes.

We then have Toffoli, Stecher, and Tanev could have been signed to efficient under market contracts.  If you really need to have veteran "pro's" to help guide the kids, why let Tanev go who was referred to by all the kids as "Dad" and was absolutely the key veteran leadership on defence?  How about Stecher who was trotted out to the media after losses as one of our key young leaders and would chew through a wall to win?  Signing the most expensive veteran backup possible (even though his stats were already poor), a perennial project in Virtanen, and chasing OEL was worth not signing any of those guys? 

The veteran character leadership is only a line they trot out when it suits them... they turn around the next time it suits them and say we had to let other veterans go because we need to get younger.... sometimes in the same interview.  It is absolutely inconsistent.  Heck this year he says we need more speed in our forward group, but used almost all his available cap space (after extensions to the kids) on Pearson who does not have speed and isn't going to be getting faster as he ages to the wrong side of 30.  The line was that he is good in the dressing room... well that wasn't very important 6 months before when players who were publicly touted by their team mates as being key in the dressing room weren't even given the courtesy of a contract offer to consider.

In the end the lack of vision has left us with bad results.

I actually really like Green as a head coach.  He says he wants to play a relentless forechecking aggressive speed game.  He wants players that love to play the game and "want to be here". That is why players like Hoglander and Motte can excel under his systems... it is also why the bottom 6 veterans and guys like Eriksson get destroyed, they just don't fit that style.  They don't have the wheels and can't make the passes to transition quickly.

The only thing wrong with our team is waiting a year for contracts to go away.   Even with OJ and Hogs graduating, and no early picks last year our pool still managed 14th this year - respectable.   I don't want to see our picks this year traded if that's something your inferring. THN feels 4 of our top five prospects will play in the NHL next year (MD being the outlier at 3).   Lind is 6th and Gads didn't make their top ten.   In other words it's part of what happens, personally i'm glad our pool is becoming middling,  means our players are graduating. 

 

Guess we will just have to see how it goes.   12 million in the sidelines was a bad thing, for sure could have meant a lot of those 1 goal plus 1 empty net games we could have won.   And yes that leftover money saved from last year, not signing Tanev and trying to shoe horn TT in is going to sign our future without whittling away the support players left in our pool.    Back when it was Gaunce, Hutton and Cannaughton etc our pool was 30th ... we saw how that went didn't we.   14th is still respectable.    Like us to do what JB done since he got here, just keep drafting and developing well above our ADP - and hopefully like he said last off season, the days of having to go to free agency to fill vital roster spots is over.   

[Nuxfanabroad]

It's good to wait for the right time to strike. Timing is important in building a solid team. Patience is valuable.

 

TO(for example) tried to rush things. Let's not go there.

[Nuxfanabroad]

Hope we're patient enough to not use picks chasing after older assets.

 

Wouldn't mind a slight trade-down, provided we get more drafting kicks at the can.

[thrago]

To me we are in a win win situation.  We make the play-offs great, we miss the play-offs we get another good pick.  Until JB came here we were one of the worse if not the worse drafting teams ever.  I remember for years in the 90's everyone talking about Holden who was our top prospect for years, he still hasn't made the team. This team reminds me of the one PQ build in the early 90's with Bure and Linden etc.  We are about to turn the corner with this team and then watch out this is going to be a great ride.

[RogersTowell]

This is the "show me" year for Benning.  If we don't see a solid step forward it's time to get somebody who can.  Honestly, I haven't thought he's done too bad a job for the most part in his tenure to date, but at the same time I don't want to be wallowing in mediocrity any longer.  We made the playoffs in the first covid season (albeit partly through the back door).  Last season we didn't in another weird covid season and divisional alignments.  That was ok, some times you take a step backward before a big step forward.  This season is, in my humble opinion, a do or die season for JB.  

 

I've really liked his drafting.  His free agency signings have been lacklustre to say the least.  Overpaid and underperforming efforts from ageing athletes.  His trades have been a mixed bag and some might think he's not done a good job of retaining a few good players lately.  You can't argue against his infusion of young players with the exception of possibly Virtanen.  Hughes, Petterson, Hoglander, Rathbone and many more will make up the team going forward.  Miller, Myers and Schmidt have been good additions.  If his plan starts to come to fruition and we see a solid step forward this year I think he has done enough.  It's nice to see some of the dead weight contracts coming off the books.

[Nuxfanabroad]

There's a lot of crying over the Toffoli matter. Good guy, & he helped us out.

 

Let's move on. Wish him well. I'd love to see the Habs get the Cup, & break this horrible yank-rig. All the best to those players.

 

Not having TT here gave an opportunity for some young wingers in this 2021, annus horribilus, season. Going with youth right now serves the team well.

Plenty of haterz will try to milk this issue. Such hatred has no time for a patient approach.

That's okay too - quite prefer they avoid this queue.

[RU SERIOUS]

On 5/29/2021 at 7:39 AM, Nuxfanabroad said:

A few random musings, & I'll get to the gist.

 

Lots of things went wrong this 56 gamer. No prob..a good time to pocket another nice pick or two.

I hope the twins get into our FO. Devoted, intelligent & trustworthy. Great for the org; & reinforces we were correct to have them play out their careers/stay in Van-city.

 

IF there's no PO's next season? Are you okay with this, as a Canucks fan?

I would be, provided the bulk of our youth keep showing progress. If there are reasons like an insane sched, Covid or mass injuries, I'll understand.

Now should there be a lack of tangible, measurable progress, with no apparent, outside contributing factors, I'd prob be open to JB moving on.

 

But in general, I'm patient with this bunch(realizing their youth), & quite optimistic for the coming decade of Canucks hockey. I'd like to see about a decade of JB at the podium(2014-2024) then hopefully the baton will be handed off to the twins, & perhaps 1 or 2 other exp'd fellows, who are trusted in the Van/BC puck-scene.

 

Get in line if you're a patient Nucks-backer. If it's GOTTA' be Hell-on-wheels next yr, then perhaps this thread ain't for you?..

This thread aint for me - I'll be dead by the time the Canucks make the playoffs let alone win a cup if JB is still at the helm for much longer!  It's been over half a century of waiting!

[Nuxfanabroad]

I've supported JB(a'plenty!), but feel it's time to state this plainly.

 

Personally, Reallly wanna' see the books in order. He seems to screw himself(rather frequently, by biting off more than is chewable); indeed, before even consuming the previous bite!

 

I've seen all kinds of trade spec & musing on the near future.

 

For the love of all that's Holy, let's get the sequencing correct?! Sign our key RFA's & ensure there's space, before anything drastic. You would think this is common-dog, but with events of recent off-seasons, no longer so sure.

 

I've(generally) very much enjoyed JB's drafting. His approach in other areas has certainly left glaring errors which often invite criticisms.

[Nuxfanabroad]

Gonna keep hoping/promoting for this patient approach.

 

Let Edler explore?..Fine & abso-lootly dandy.

 

A 3rd for a great def fwd, near his mid-20's? That's great too.

 

Don't SQUANDER this valuable 9th OA pick. Unless it's for a 100% positive, young D-stud.

[RU SERIOUS]

On 5/29/2021 at 7:51 AM, Provost said:

If there was a consistent direction that had been building over the years towards an identity I would be fine to see it continue.

 

Unfortunately it has largely been reactionary moves since day 1.

 

We want to compete quickly... so let’s sign some veterans... wait we want to get younger... wait we need some veterans to insulate the kids... we will be good in a couple of years... we need some size and toughness... no wait, we need more speed and skill... players need to earn their ice time.... well not these particular guys they get gifted spots... We want to play a fast, relentless style... hey look at all these guys I just signed that have none of those attributes but are good character guys... I know every couple of years I said we would be good in a couple of years, this time I really mean it... wait somehow we have too many veterans so let’s let these good character guys go who are well respected in the room... we need to get younger and faster... so watch me trade a bunch of good draft picks and prospects for instant gratification... wait now we need more veterans again... we will be good in a couple of years... fans need to be patient because these things take time, when I kept saying we could do it in a couple of years, “a couple” really meant 9 years or so... we just need more speed skill, depth, and prospects and then a bunch of new cheaper veterans and all will be good!

Please don't be so truthful !

 

You're killing the fantasy!

 

Thank you!

 

 

[King Heffy]

On 7/17/2021 at 3:41 PM, Nuxfanabroad said:

Gonna keep hoping/promoting for this patient approach.

 

Let Edler explore?..Fine & abso-lootly dandy.

 

A 3rd for a great def fwd, near his mid-20's? That's great too.

 

Don't SQUANDER this valuable 9th OA pick. Unless it's for a 100% positive, young D-stud.

I'm going to be absolutely furious if we give up valuable parts of our future for a quick fix.  Next offseason is when we should be aggressive.