[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[MeanSeanBean]

18 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Lol ok doctor.  I come from the perspective that no professional athlete should have mom and dad relay messages to media.  If you think Hodgson and Brule are the role models for Byram, then so be it.

Lol defensive much? I said I understood more about both athlete and healing from head injuries, which I do, not that I'm a doctor.

[HKSR]

17 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

You're basing it off of "family situations" from the past, but you have no idea what's up with him and his family. With that logic Quinn shouldn't have his parents involved in anything regarding him and his brothers. It doesn't sound to me like your point is we shouldn't trade for him but that he's a mentally weak professional. 

If Quinn's dad came out and said Quinn and his brothers are at home resting and drinking lots of fluids as they deal with covid, then I'd probably think the same way.  But reality is the only times they really talk to their mom/dad is when they ask them about how proud they are.  That's normal.  Talking about a player's illnesses or injuries on behalf of a professional athlete is never a good thing.  What happens if the team's medical staff don't diagnose Byram the way they hoped?  We've seen where that goes.

[Jester13]

Just now, HKSR said:

If Quinn's dad came out and said Quinn and his brothers are at home resting and drinking lots of fluids as they deal with covid, then I'd probably think the same way.  But reality is the only times they really talk to their mom/dad is when they ask them about how proud they are.  That's normal.  Talking about a player's illnesses or injuries on behalf of a professional athlete is never a good thing.  What happens if the team's medical staff don't diagnose Byram the way they hoped?  We've seen where that goes.

I believe you, but I still disagree with the "man up" type of mentality. 

[HKSR]

6 minutes ago, Shayster007 said:

Lol defensive much? I said I understood more about both athlete and healing from head injuries, which I do, not that I'm a doctor.

Never argued with you about his head injury, nor did I even argue about how I believe he does have a severe concussion.  However, I personally know of 2 people that have had concussions, and they have no trouble speaking for themselves.  That's just me though.

[HKSR]

1 minute ago, Jester13 said:

I believe you, but I still disagree with the "man up" type of mentality. 

That's fine... I don't expect everyone to agree with me lol

[Jester13]

1 minute ago, HKSR said:

That's fine... I don't expect everyone to agree with me lol

You know people who have had a concussion before, but have you ever had one? 

[Coconuts]

1 hour ago, HKSR said:

No issues there, but like I said, as a professional athlete with a multi-million dollar contract, you've gotta look and act the part.  Having dad come out to say everything YOU should have said to the media doesn't look good.

It's one thing to acknowledge that acquiring Byram at this point is a risk, which is something most of us agree on, and another to imply Byram lacks any sort of fortitude because he's not dealing with the media while recovering from a concussion. 

 

Who gives a $&!# what Crosby did? That shouldn't even enter the equation because all concussions aren't alike. Also, Crosby and Byram are different people and there's absolutely nothing wrong with either of them handling things differently. I'm familiar with brain injuries, concussions are similar in that no single concussion is alike. 

 

There's nothing wrong with leaning on your support network, professional or not, and it shouldn't be interpreted as a lack of anything imo. In a world where machismo has continued to have negative impacts on athletes both young and older I applaud his doing so. 

 

It's not my job to change your mind, or even change your opinion, but the blowback you're getting for your stance is pretty easy to understand. 

[HKSR]

Just now, Jester13 said:

You know people who have had a concussion before, but have you ever had one? 

Nope, not sure why that is relevant.  That's the same as the flying helicopter analogy.  I've never flown a helicopter, but I know it's not supposed to crash into a tree. 

I've never had a concussion, but I know that people can still talk when they have a concussion.

[Fanuck]

18 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Lol ok doctor.  I come from the perspective that no professional athlete should have mom and dad relay messages to media.  If you think Hodgson and Brule are the role models for Byram, then so be it.

I've been trying, without success, to find the original story where the author who published the comments from Byram's dad said he did so by phoning the dad at his home and soliciting information from him.  In that article, which I'm sorry I can't find just yet, the original author says at the time he had the dad's permission to post the article, but upon further reflection the dad asked that he take it down and the author did so, but you can't 'un-ring the bell' so to speak and the info was out there including Bowen's comments to his parents which he believed were confidential.    The dad told the author that in hindsight he believes that Bowen himself should've been the one to speak to any media, if that's what he wanted to do, so he was essentially saying he overstepped a boundary there.  The author was clear that he solicited the information and took it down when the dad was uncomfortable with it being out there - dad wasn't going around 'speaking for his kid' like some are trying to describe - at least that's not how the author of the story describes it anyway. 

[HKSR]

Just now, Coconuts said:

It's one thing to acknowledge that acquiring Byram at this point is a risk, which is something most of us agree on, and another to imply Byram lacks any sort of fortitude because he's not dealing with the media while recovering from a concussion. 

 

Who gives a $&!# what Crosby did? That shouldn't even enter the equation because all concussions aren't alike. Also, Crosby and Byram are different people and there's absolutely nothing wrong with either of them handling things differently. I'm familiar with brain injuries, concussions are similar in that no single concussion is alike. 

 

There's nothing wrong with leaning on your support network, professional or not, and it shouldn't be interpreted as a lack of anything imo. In a world where machismo has continued to have negative impacts on athletes both young and older I applaud his doing so. 

 

It's not my job to change your mind, or even change your opinion, but the blowback you're getting for your stance is pretty easy to understand. 

All good.  I don't think leaning on your support network is an issue, but part of being a professional athlete is speaking to media.  Not having mom and dad do it for you.

[HKSR]

Just now, Fanuck said:

I've been trying, without success, to find the original story where the author who published the comments from Byram's dad said he did so by phoning the dad at his home and soliciting information from him.  In that article, which I'm sorry I can't find just yet, the original author says at the time he had the dad's permission to post the article, but upon further reflection the dad asked that he take it down and the author did so, but you can't 'un-ring the bell' so to speak and the info was out there including Bowen's comments to his parents which he believed were confidential.    The dad told the author that in hindsight he believes that Bowen himself should've been the one to speak to any media, if that's what he wanted to do, so he was essentially saying he overstepped a boundary there.  The author was clear that he solicited the information and took it down when the dad was uncomfortable with it being out there - dad wasn't going around 'speaking for his kid' like some are trying to describe - at least that's not how the author of the story describes it anyway. 

That's fair.  If the background is indeed what  you say, then I take it all back... but for now, I just see a dad getting in the middle of the media discussions on behalf of his boy.  I've just seen it happen before with Hodgson and Brule, and it never goes well.

[stawns]

5 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

You know people who have had a concussion before, but have you ever had one? 

I'd say I'm into double digits, as I played when they didn't know what a concussion is.........I'm lucky though, not much in the way of issues

[Coconuts]

Just now, HKSR said:

All good.  I don't think leaning on your support network is an issue, but part of being a professional athlete is speaking to media.  Not having mom and dad do it for you.

And you're right in that, speaking to the media is typically part of the job description, but we don't live in a black and white world. Where do the semantics end? If one of our players were to be concussed, took a leave of absence, didn't speak to the media, and a team rep took over the whole sharing of information bit would you respond the same way? Or is it simply the mom and dad thing? 

 

There needs to be a degree of flex when it comes to other people and their personal lives because we're all more than our occupation. A rigid approach to x must do x because that's the norm is silly, norms change all the time and the world and people's lives are often better for it.

[PlanB]

4 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

I've been trying, without success, to find the original story where the author who published the comments from Byram's dad said he did so by phoning the dad at his home and soliciting information from him.  In that article, which I'm sorry I can't find just yet, the original author says at the time he had the dad's permission to post the article, but upon further reflection the dad asked that he take it down and the author did so, but you can't 'un-ring the bell' so to speak and the info was out there including Bowen's comments to his parents which he believed were confidential.    The dad told the author that in hindsight he believes that Bowen himself should've been the one to speak to any media, if that's what he wanted to do, so he was essentially saying he overstepped a boundary there.  The author was clear that he solicited the information and took it down when the dad was uncomfortable with it being out there - dad wasn't going around 'speaking for his kid' like some are trying to describe - at least that's not how the author of the story describes it anyway. 

This is exactly what I read online as well, the author phoned the dad at his home and got the story that way - Bowen didn't say anything to the media and wasn't trying to use his parents as intermediaries.  And you can keep looking for the story fanuck but you won't find it - it used to be here but as you said, the author took it down:

 

https://coloradohockeynow.com/2022/01/04/why-bo-byram-left-avalanche-for-personal-reasons/

[HKSR]

Just now, Coconuts said:

And you're right in that, speaking to the media is typically part of the job description, but we don't live in a black and white world. Where do the semantics end? If one of our players were to be concussed, took a leave of absence, didn't speak to the media, and a team rep took over the whole sharing of information bit would you respond the same way? Or is it simply the mom and dad thing? 

 

There needs to be a degree of flex when it comes to other people and their personal lives because we're all more than our occupation. A rigid approach to x must do x because that's the norm is silly, norms change all the time and the world and people's lives are often better for it.

I'd have no issue with a team rep doing the talking.  That happens all the time.  What doesn't happen all the time is mom and dad talking about how their baby has a boo boo (ok ok, totally uncalled for, but you know what I mean).  Like I said, I saw Hodgson's dad and Brule's dad get involved with their kid's career, and it just went straight downhill after that.  It's just another reason why I really don't like the idea of trading for Byram unless he's a complimentary piece of the package (Newhook is the guy we want).

[Jester13]

8 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Nope, not sure why that is relevant.  That's the same as the flying helicopter analogy.  I've never flown a helicopter, but I know it's not supposed to crash into a tree. 

I've never had a concussion, but I know that people can still talk when they have a concussion.

False equivalency.

 

If you've never had a concussion then you don't know what it's like to experience it. I had one when I was a teenager and it sent me into serious depression, where I wouldn't leave the house or talk to anyone for a very long time. That's from one while wakeboarding, so it's easier to imagine now what it could be like after three concussions from playing high-level professional hockey. To speak about it like you do is insensitive towards a serious situation. 

 

Now you know three people who have had one before. 

[HKSR]

11 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

I've been trying, without success, to find the original story where the author who published the comments from Byram's dad said he did so by phoning the dad at his home and soliciting information from him.  In that article, which I'm sorry I can't find just yet, the original author says at the time he had the dad's permission to post the article, but upon further reflection the dad asked that he take it down and the author did so, but you can't 'un-ring the bell' so to speak and the info was out there including Bowen's comments to his parents which he believed were confidential.    The dad told the author that in hindsight he believes that Bowen himself should've been the one to speak to any media, if that's what he wanted to do, so he was essentially saying he overstepped a boundary there.  The author was clear that he solicited the information and took it down when the dad was uncomfortable with it being out there - dad wasn't going around 'speaking for his kid' like some are trying to describe - at least that's not how the author of the story describes it anyway. 

It's interesting how in hindsight, his dad believes Bowen should have spoke to the media himself, and that he overstepped a boundary.  That's exactly what I'm getting at.  It simply is unprofessional. 

[HKSR]

6 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

False equivalency.

 

If you've never had a concussion then you don't know what it's like to experience it. I had one when I was a teenager and it sent me into serious depression, where I wouldn't leave the house or talk to anyone for a very long time. That's from one while wakeboarding, so it's easier to imagine now what it could be like after three concussions from playing high-level professional hockey. To speak about it like you do is insensitive towards a serious situation. 

 

Now you know three people who have had one before. 

You're also not a professional athlete.  Part of their job is to speak to media.

 

I lost my dad to cancer a couple months ago.  I am in management and oversee a team of several employees.  No matter how depressed and emotionally broken I was, I still did the things I needed to do (provided directives for my staff in my absence) to keep my work going while I was away for a period of time.  It's called being professional.  I didn't just walk away from my responsibilities.  I sure as heck didn't have my wife send the emails and make the phone calls on my behalf.

 

Edited March 8, 2022 by HKSR

[Fanuck]

1 minute ago, HKSR said:

It's interesting how in hindsight, his dad believes Bowen should have spoke to the media himself, and that he overstepped a boundary.  That's exactly what I'm getting at.  It simply is unprofessional. 

But it's not unprofessional on Bowen's part. 

[Jester13]

2 minutes ago, HKSR said:

It's interesting how in hindsight, his dad believes Bowen should have spoke to the media himself, and that he overstepped a boundary.  That's exactly what I'm getting at.  It simply is unprofessional. 

Sounds like the story is muddy, but it doesn't change the fact that whether it was a parent of Byram himself, it doesn't make much of a difference either way and doesn't make him any less of a professional as a result.