[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[BPA]

10 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Schmidt is not a difference maker.  Just ask Winnipeg.  Heck, we know that.  So the plan is to trade draft picks away for players other teams don't want?

That is literally how the Canucks got Miller.

[Alflives]

18 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Schmidt is not a difference maker.  Just ask Winnipeg.  Heck, we know that.  So the plan is to trade draft picks away for players other teams don't want?

We were very lucky to get our third back and not have to retain n Schmidt.  

[HKSR]

21 minutes ago, BPA said:

That is literally how the Canucks got Miller.

And how many Miller's have been acquired like that?  Let's be real, Miller was a lottery win.  Nobody thought he'd be as good as he is now.  Many, many, many times draft picks are moved and the player is mediocre.  

[HKSR]

14 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We were very lucky to get our third back and not have to retain n Schmidt.  

Exactly.  I'd say more often than not, when picks are moved for a project player, it doesn't work out as well as the Miller trade 95% of the time.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, HKSR said:

Exactly.  I'd say more often than not, when picks are moved for a project player, it doesn't work out as well as the Miller trade 95% of the time.

I’m hoping there is a team out there who will give us equal return to what we gave up for Miller.  I doubt it, but I’m hopeful.  I think what happens though is we (wrongly) re-sign him to a big Zibinijad like contract.  

[HKSR]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I’m hoping there is a team out there who will give us equal return to what we gave up for Miller.  I doubt it, but I’m hopeful.  I think what happens though is we (wrongly) re-sign him to a big Zibinijad like contract.  

You know my thoughts Alf.  If Miller wants over $9m, we trade him for what we can get.  If he wants under $8.5m I rather we re-sign him.  He's just too darn valuable.  There's likely 4 or 5 good years left in him.  

[Elias Pettersson]

So we can't re-sign Miller because he's going to screw up our cap but we will get a major return for him so he can screw up another team's cap?   

 

You can't have it both ways, CDC.  Either you sign your top scorer and pay the guy or you trade him for a lesser return than you think because the other teams would be thinking the exact same thing.  And no the Rangers aren't gonna give up the farm to get Miller for one year, they either think he's in their long term plans or they pass unless it's a great deal for them.  Why would the Rangers pay Miller similar to Zibanejad when they already have Zibanejad?  

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, HKSR said:

You know my thoughts Alf.  If Miller wants over $9m, we trade him for what we can get.  If he wants under $8.5m I rather we re-sign him.  He's just too darn valuable.  There's likely 4 or 5 good years left in him.  

And we have Demko signed to his excellent cap hit for four years.  

Miller is excellent.  That’s obvious.  But if we extend him at 8.5 what happens to Bo and (or) Petey?  Can we spend 8.5 on 

Miller, 7 on Bo and 7.25 on Petey?  Might have to move Bo.  

[Elias Pettersson]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And we have Demko signed to his excellent cap hit for four years.  

Miller is excellent.  That’s obvious.  But if we extend him at 8.5 what happens to Bo and (or) Petey?  Can we spend 8.5 on 

Miller, 7 on Bo and 7.25 on Petey?  Might have to move Bo.  

Wouldn't the Rangers and every other team be thinking the same thing?  Why do people think some team is going to sell the farm to get Miller when his salary will also affect their cap space as well?

 

Can you name one team that is a Stanley Cup contender that can fit Miller under the cap long term?  We are not going to get a major haul for him as a rental at the deadline.  All we will get is picks and prospects.  Teams that are competing for a Cup are not going to trade valuable assets that are already on the team for a rental.

[HKSR]

5 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And we have Demko signed to his excellent cap hit for four years.  

Miller is excellent.  That’s obvious.  But if we extend him at 8.5 what happens to Bo and (or) Petey?  Can we spend 8.5 on 

Miller, 7 on Bo and 7.25 on Petey?  Might have to move Bo.  

I know you like Boeser a lot, but I would move him to create some cap room.  Either that or Garland.  I think it'd be wise to have 3 strong centres down the middle.  Not many teams could match the centre depth the Canucks have when Petey, Bo, and Miller are all on their game.  It's the competitive advantage the Canucks have over most teams. 

[Rackdawg]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And we have Demko signed to his excellent cap hit for four years.  

Miller is excellent.  That’s obvious.  But if we extend him at 8.5 what happens to Bo and (or) Petey?  Can we spend 8.5 on 

Miller, 7 on Bo and 7.25 on Petey?  Might have to move Bo 

? Who of the 3 is the most important player to the team next 5 yrs..myself personaly think its Bo ..id move miller.

[aGENT]

31 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

So we can't re-sign Miller because he's going to screw up our cap but we will get a major return for him so he can screw up another team's cap?   

 

You can't have it both ways, CDC.  Either you sign your top scorer and pay the guy or you trade him for a lesser return than you think because the other teams would be thinking the exact same thing.  And no the Rangers aren't gonna give up the farm to get Miller for one year, they either think he's in their long term plans or they pass unless it's a great deal for them.  Why would the Rangers pay Miller similar to Zibanejad when they already have Zibanejad?  

Are we in the same position as a team like the Bruins/Penguins/Capitals/Predators etc?

 

Are people really this blind to how the league works in regards to team cycles that this needs explaining? Again?

 

Teams looking to win now, or whose windows are closing, don't care what his cap hit/performance are in 4+ years. They'll be rebuilding. We will have our young core players at their peak, right in the middle of their window. These aren't the same things.

 

If you can't see how those situations are entirely different...

 

Now if only you folks would see that he can't both be an indispensable piece of the Canucks, AND willing to take a major discount vs his comparables AND worth next to nothing in trade.

 

You can't have it all three ways.

 

You guys are like the Kings of straw men.

 

That's how I know you guys are wrong 

Edited April 12, 2022 by aGENT

[Elias Pettersson]

49 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Are we in the same position as a team like the Bruins/Penguins/Capitals/Predators etc?

 

Are people really this blind to how the league works in regards to team cycles that this needs explaining? Again?

 

Teams looking to win now, or whose windows are closing, don't care what his cap hit/performance are in 4+ years. They'll be rebuilding. We will have our young core players at their peak, right in the middle of their window. These aren't the same things.

 

If you can't see how those situations are entirely different...

 

Now if only you folks would see that he can't both be an indispensable piece of the Canucks, AND willing to take a major discount vs his comparables AND worth next to nothing in trade.

 

You can't have it all three ways.

 

You guys are like the Kings of straw men.

 

That's how I know you guys are wrong 

Please explain to me like I'm in kindergarten how Boston, Pittsburgh, Washington or Nashville are going to fit a 8.5x7 Miller contract into their salary cap and what assets we would be getting in return.  I am patient so I can wait for awhile...  

[aGENT]

8 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Please explain to me like I'm in kindergarten how Boston, Pittsburgh, Washington or Nashville are going to fit a 8.5x7 Miller contract into their salary cap and what assets we would be getting in return.  I am patient so I can wait for awhile...  

 

Same way any team fits in big dollar players.

 

Top men.

[Elias Pettersson]

51 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Same way any team fits in big dollar players.

 

Top men.

Nice way to not give an answer.  

 

Boston has $4 million in cap space and need to re-sign Bergeron.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Pittsburgh has $30 million in cap space but only 12 players signed.  And they need to re-sign Malkin and Letang.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Washington has $9 million in cap space and need to re-sign half their defencemen.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Nashville has $27 million in cap space with 14 players signed.  You should probably start pumping the Miller to Nashville rumours as that may be the only team that can actually fit him under the cap.  

 

Here, I'll make it easier for you and pump up a trade proposal right now.

 

To Nashville:

 

JT Miller

 

To Vancouver:

 

Cody Glass

Dante Fabbro

Yakov Trenin

2023 1st round pick

 

[mll]

24 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Nice way to not give an answer.  

 

Boston has $4 million in cap space and need to re-sign Bergeron.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Pittsburgh has $30 million in cap space but only 12 players signed.  And they need to re-sign Malkin and Letang.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Washington has $9 million in cap space and need to re-sign half their defencemen.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Nashville has $27 million in cap space with 14 players signed.  You should probably start pumping the Miller to Nashville rumours as that may be the only team that can actually fit him under the cap.  

 

Here, I'll make it easier for you and pump up a trade proposal right now.

 

To Nashville:

 

JT Miller

 

To Vancouver:

 

Cody Glass

Dante Fabbro

Yakov Trenin

2023 1st round pick

 

 

Except Nashville are in a re-tool - Poile even initially called it a re-build.  They traded away Ellis who was a top pairing D as well as Arvidsson for prospects/futures.  He talked of how they weren't competitive enough to have such a veteran roster and have changed course with a focus on getting younger and building back up their prospect pool.  

 

They also felt that they had lost their way.  Poile talked of how they relied too much on skills and whenever plays didn't got their way they quit, and needed to get back to being a hard working team that never gives up.

 

 

 

 

[Gollumpus]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Nice way to not give an answer.  

 

Boston has $4 million in cap space and need to re-sign Bergeron.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Pittsburgh has $30 million in cap space but only 12 players signed.  And they need to re-sign Malkin and Letang.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Washington has $9 million in cap space and need to re-sign half their defencemen.  Who are they trading to fit Miller under the cap?

 

Nashville has $27 million in cap space with 14 players signed.  You should probably start pumping the Miller to Nashville rumours as that may be the only team that can actually fit him under the cap.  

 

Here, I'll make it easier for you and pump up a trade proposal right now.

 

To Nashville:

 

JT Miller

 

To Vancouver:

 

Cody Glass

Dante Fabbro

Yakov Trenin

2023 1st round pick

 

I don't quite see the issue with Miller going to Pittsburgh.

 

Sure, the Penquins haven't re-signed Malkin, but do they really want to re-sign him? Is he still a good player? Yes, when he can play, and he has had a diminishing game count over the last while, with correspondingly lower point totals. He would also be covered under the 35+ clause, which would reduce interest by teams (I did not say negate, merely reduced). If Pittsburgh can't re-sign Malkin to a more conservative figure deal/term, and if they did acquire Miller, I would not be surprised to see Malkin go UFA.

 

If I were Pittsburgh, I would be more concerned over losing Rust (edit: or Rakell) to free agency than letting Malkin leave. Letting Malkin walk, trading/extending Miller (for the proposed $8.5 million?) and putting the remainder of the Malkin money towards re-signing Rust could be do-able, no? The remaining signing could (probably) be handled by various player moves, and shipping contracts out to make cap room.

 

Where it could get tricky is with Letang. Assuming Pittsburgh wants to re-sign Letang, the money from that could (probably) come from the trade of a forward (eg. Kapanen - again or Carter+ - draft pick), or they let Rakell walk.

 

                                                       regards,  G.

 

 

Edited April 12, 2022 by Gollumpus

[mll]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Please explain to me like I'm in kindergarten how Boston, Pittsburgh, Washington or Nashville are going to fit a 8.5x7 Miller contract into their salary cap and what assets we would be getting in return.  I am patient so I can wait for awhile...  

 

Contenders are probably trading for him as a 1 year rental.  His value to these teams was 2x playoffs runs where he provided significant surplus value for his cap hit.  Won't necessarily be the case on his next deal.  

Wonder if he's not going to end up a bit in the Taylor Hall situation.  Was asking the moon but never really got the deal he was hoping for in free agency.  The contending teams already had their core identified ahead of him.  

 

A team like Philadelphia might be willing to offer the most - as a return + contract wise.  Fletcher is under pressure to contend and they also want to shake up their team.

 

[mll]

18 minutes ago, Gollumpus said:

I don't quite see the issue with Miller going to Pittsburgh.

 

Sure, the Penquins haven't re-signed Malkin, but do they really want to re-sign him? Is he still a good player? Yes, when he can play, and he has had a diminishing game count over the last while, with correspondingly lower point totals. He would also be covered under the 35+ clause, which would reduce interest by teams (I did not say negate, merely reduced). If Pittsburgh can't re-sign Malkin to a more conservative figure deal/term, and if they did acquire Miller, I would not be surprised to see Malkin go UFA.

 

If I were Pittsburgh, I would be more concerned over losing Rust to free agency than letting Malkin leave. Letting Malkin walk, trading/extending Miller (for the proposed $8.5 million?) and putting the remainder of the Malkin money towards re-signing Rust could be do-able, no? The remaining signing could (probably) be handled by various player moves, and shipping contracts out to make cap room.

 

Where it could get tricky is with Letang. Assuming Pittsburgh wants to re-sign Letang, the money from that could (probably) come from the trade of a forward (eg. Kapanen - again or Carter+ - draft pick), or they let Rakell walk.

 

                                                       regards,  G.

 

 

 

Friedman says it's an evidence that Malkin will be extended - both sides want it and aren't at all worried about getting a deal done.  Discussions with Letang have gotten off to a rough start per Friedman - he wants a 5 year deal (that brings him to 40) at above 7.5M.  Hard to see any team offering him 5 years though.

 

Carter was just extended for the next 2 seasons and was given a full NMC.   

[Gollumpus]

5 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Friedman says it's an evidence that Malkin will be extended - both sides want it and aren't at all worried about getting a deal done.  Discussions with Letang have gotten off to a rough start per Friedman - he wants a 5 year deal (that brings him to 40) at above 7.5M.  Hard to see any team offering him 5 years though.

 

Carter was just extended for the next 2 seasons and was given a full NMC.   

Yeah, I just noticed the Carter NMC. Good catch. 

 

The thing that gets me about some of the various teams/players in this part of the discussion, is that the players which are being mentioned as a "must sign" talent are all in that older side of their careers, being in the 35+ category, or getting really close to it. Some people around here mention that they think the team should re-sign a guy who is 27/28 and it's thought of as the dumbest move ever.

 

                                                       regards,  G.