[Proposal] VAN and DAL

[BigTramFan]

To DAL: Dermott + Joshua

 

To VAN: Khudobin + 2023 2nd round pick

 

Dallas are a legit contender this season. But they are up against the cap (only $600k space) with a 21 man roster of 12 forwards + 7 defensemen + 2 goalies.

 

They could use an abrasive and versatile bottom 6 forward who can play C or W (such as Joshua) and a depth Dman that can play both sides (Dermott) in order to bolster their roster heading into the playoffs.

 

Khudobin is currently waived to the AHL and costs them $2.2m in dead cap (full contract is $3.33m which ends this season). If we take him on, then they have space to add Dermott and Joshua to their lineup and have a full 23 man roster. Joshua is signed for next season and Dermott is RFA, so neither are strictly rentals for DAL, which may make it more appealing.

 

Thoughts?

[NUCKER67]

The more I think of this, the more difficult a decision it is for me. I don't think they'd trade Joshua, he brings quite a bit at a cheap cost, but trading Dermott would be okay (considering his injuries). Adding another 2nd would sure be nice, and a old goaltender who's contract expires in a few months wipes out some more cap. It could be a good move. 

 

I've also liked Stillman's game lately. The guy has decent size and he uses it, throwing the occasional big hit. Gets shots on net. Curious what they do with Rathbone.

 

 

[Phil_314]

I guess.  Agreed that Joshua's been underrated but to flip him as part of a package for a 2nd would be a win IMO.  We can always keep Lockwood/ Di Giuseppe up with the big club and move DJ (maybe there's another sandpaper guy that we can sign?) and Dermott is another run-of-the-mill fringe D-man, so trading both of them to get another pick would be good (added bonus if Khudobin can become something again late in his career).

Of course, optimally moving Boeser or Garland for that cap space would be optimal and these depth guys have brought good value at their cap hit, but if the big tickets can't be moved for futures, moving depth works in my books too.  Props to OP for an original idea. 

[VancouverHabitant]

20 minutes ago, BigTramFan said:

To DAL: Dermott + Joshua

 

To VAN: Khudobin + 2023 2nd round pick

 

Dallas are a legit contender this season. But they are up against the cap (only $600k space) with a 21 man roster of 12 forwards + 7 defensemen + 2 goalies.

 

They could use an abrasive and versatile bottom 6 forward who can play C or W (such as Joshua) and a depth Dman that can play both sides (Dermott) in order to bolster their roster heading into the playoffs.

 

Khudobin is currently waived to the AHL and costs them $2.2m in dead cap (full contract is $3.33m which ends this season). If we take him on, then they have space to add Dermott and Joshua to their lineup and have a full 23 man roster. Joshua is signed for next season and Dermott is RFA, so neither are strictly rentals for DAL, which may make it more appealing.

 

Thoughts?

I'm not saying that Dallas would give up a 1st round pick (they traded it away), but we would need more then one measly 2nd round pick to give up Dakota and also take on Khudobin's salary.  

 

Rick Tocchet seems to be in love with Joshua, so that's another con...  however it would be a trade that makes sense for both teams in principle.  

 

 

[VancouverHabitant]

12 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

 

I've also liked Stillman's game lately. The guy has decent size and he uses it, throwing the occasional big hit. Gets shots on net. Curious what they do with Rathbone.

 

 

Starting to see a cheaper version of Tyler Myers...  we'll see, I'll have to give Riley a fresh slate here, he's starting to look better. 

[Coconuts]

I'd do it, can always bring in another banger in the offseason, another bottom pairing guy too if necessary. 

 

I'd want like.. a 2nd and a 4th or 5th though. 

[Alflives]

Isn’t taking back their dumperoo worth more than a second? And we add two useful players both on good contracts. Change Dermott to Myers. Then it’s fair. 

[Bob.Loblaw]

21 minutes ago, Phil_314 said:

I guess.  Agreed that Joshua's been underrated but to flip him as part of a package for a 2nd would be a win IMO.  We can always keep Lockwood/ Di Giuseppe up with the big club and move DJ (maybe there's another sandpaper guy that we can sign?) and Dermott is another run-of-the-mill fringe D-man, so trading both of them to get another pick would be good (added bonus if Khudobin can become something again late in his career).

Of course, optimally moving Boeser or Garland for that cap space would be optimal and these depth guys have brought good value at their cap hit, but if the big tickets can't be moved for futures, moving depth works in my books too.  Props to OP for an original idea. 

Dermott is a serviceable bottom pairing D-man... when healthy.  And he usually isn't.  I don't even think Vancouver will try to re-sign-him because of his injuries.  I think you'd have to offer Stillman, who is a 7/8 D-man but one who seems healthy enough to suit up.

 

5 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Isn’t taking back their dumperoo worth more than a second? And we add two useful players both on good contracts. Change Dermott to Myers. Then it’s fair. 

An expiring contract for a 1st?  Not even close.

[BigTramFan]

1 hour ago, VancouverHabitant said:

I'm not saying that Dallas would give up a 1st round pick (they traded it away), but we would need more then one measly 2nd round pick to give up Dakota and also take on Khudobin's salary.  

 

Rick Tocchet seems to be in love with Joshua, so that's another con...  however it would be a trade that makes sense for both teams in principle.  

 

 

One measly 2nd round pick? Haha love it.

 

To put it into context though, Joshua is a 4th line player averaging 10 mins a game. He has 13 pts this season and is a -14. He hardly PKs and when he does he's not that good. Let's not inflate his value, he is not worth a 2nd on his own. And VAN should be able to find a replacement player who can actually kill penalties for next season, I would target Hathaway and/or Acciari.

[BigTramFan]

59 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Isn’t taking back their dumperoo worth more than a second? And we add two useful players both on good contracts. Change Dermott to Myers. Then it’s fair. 

Taking on an expiring contract for a few months is not worth more than a 2nd. If we did so at the start of the season - then YES

[Alflives]

Just now, BigTramFan said:

Taking on an expiring contract for a few months is not worth more than a 2nd. If we did so at the start of the season - then YES

But we are adding two NHL players. Why include Dermott and Joshua at all? We take their cap dumperoo goalie and they add a second. 

[BigTramFan]

Just now, Alflives said:

But we are adding two NHL players. Why include Dermott and Joshua at all? We take their cap dumperoo goalie and they add a second. 

I would put the value of taking on Khudobin at this stage at around a 4th round pick. Adding two (arguably fringe) NHL players and taking on the cap is what brings the value to a 2nd imo.

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, BigTramFan said:

I would put the value of taking on Khudobin at this stage at around a 4th round pick. Adding two (arguably fringe) NHL players and taking on the cap is what brings the value to a 2nd imo.

Oh, I understand now. Plus, your idea gets us two more contract spots out of the 50 for signing college guys. 

[Bad_BOI_pete]

I agree this is a good proposal,

 

I think it would be a good idea to definitely call them and at least discuss the possibility of aquiring Khudobin.... let them know that we are looking to trade a forward first but if it falls through we be willing to make a trade...

 

I like the thought of trading Boeser @50% +schenn for Khubodin + Hakanpaa/Miller plus a value of picks.... that could be another starting point...

 

I will admit im a bit of a homer for Hakanpaa though... 

[VancouverHabitant]

19 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

I agree this is a good proposal,

 

I think it would be a good idea to definitely call them and at least discuss the possibility of aquiring Khudobin.... let them know that we are looking to trade a forward first but if it falls through we be willing to make a trade...

 

I like the thought of trading Boeser @50% +schenn for Khubodin + Hakanpaa/Miller plus a value of picks.... that could be another starting point...

 

I will admit im a bit of a homer for Hakanpaa though... 

Hakanpaa simp 

 

[VancouverHabitant]

1 hour ago, BigTramFan said:

One measly 2nd round pick? Haha love it.

 

To put it into context though, Joshua is a 4th line player averaging 10 mins a game. He has 13 pts this season and is a -14. He hardly PKs and when he does he's not that good. Let's not inflate his value, he is not worth a 2nd on his own. And VAN should be able to find a replacement player who can actually kill penalties for next season, I would target Hathaway and/or Acciari.

Okay calling it a measly second was over the top, but I do feel like we would need another pick for this. 

 

Or else take Dakota out of the equation, much simpler that way. 

[J.I.A.H.N]

I give you an A for the premise, but I honestly think the value is worth more............

 

What did Dermott cost originally?  What is Joshua's value?

 

Then to take on a prorated 3.3 million dollar contract that is just sitting in the minors.......

 

I agree on the 2nd, but want a 4th, as well.........

 

I don't know, it just seems like you are selling us short.

 

I do like the proposal, though!

[hammertime]

4 hours ago, BigTramFan said:

To DAL: Dermott + Joshua

 

To VAN: Khudobin + 2023 2nd round pick

 

Dallas are a legit contender this season. But they are up against the cap (only $600k space) with a 21 man roster of 12 forwards + 7 defensemen + 2 goalies.

 

They could use an abrasive and versatile bottom 6 forward who can play C or W (such as Joshua) and a depth Dman that can play both sides (Dermott) in order to bolster their roster heading into the playoffs.

 

Khudobin is currently waived to the AHL and costs them $2.2m in dead cap (full contract is $3.33m which ends this season). If we take him on, then they have space to add Dermott and Joshua to their lineup and have a full 23 man roster. Joshua is signed for next season and Dermott is RFA, so neither are strictly rentals for DAL, which may make it more appealing.

 

Thoughts?

This is real gud idea. 

 

 

I'm with Jan I want a touch more but the concept is applaudable. Dallas 2nd could be a Rasmusen really like some guys in this range. 

[BigTramFan]

52 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

I give you an A for the premise, but I honestly think the value is worth more............

 

What did Dermott cost originally?  What is Joshua's value?

 

Then to take on a prorated 3.3 million dollar contract that is just sitting in the minors.......

 

I agree on the 2nd, but want a 4th, as well.........

 

I don't know, it just seems like you are selling us short.

 

I do like the proposal, though!

Thanks for the feedback. If an extra 4th round pick was on the table then great. Regardless, I'd do the deal.

 

Agree it's all down to the value of players relative to the value of about a 60th overall pick in a very deep draft.

 

I'd say the value of taking on Khudobin is about a 4th. I'd say Dermott is worth about a 4th (value has dropped significantly since we traded a 3rd for him, has only played 28 games for VAN), and I'd say the value of Joshua is about a 4th round pick (seems like others really value him, but I don't see much value in him).

 

In my opinion Dermott and Joshua are highly replaceable. And I want as many 1st and 2nd round picks this draft as we can get. 

 

So 3 x 4th round picks of value = late 2nd round pick in a deep draft.

 

Anyway that's my thinking. I don't think your opinion is wrong about getting more from DAL, but I'd rather do the deal and get something back for the cap space we now have and for Dermott who we are not even playing and will probably not resign anyway.

[J.I.A.H.N]

5 minutes ago, BigTramFan said:

Thanks for the feedback. If an extra 4th round pick was on the table then great. Regardless, I'd do the deal.

 

Agree it's all down to the value of players relative to the value of about a 60th overall pick in a very deep draft.

 

I'd say the value of taking on Khudobin is about a 4th. I'd say Dermott is worth about a 4th (value has dropped significantly since we traded a 3rd for him, has only played 28 games for VAN), and I'd say the value of Joshua is about a 4th round pick (seems like others really value him, but I don't see much value in him).

 

In my opinion Dermott and Joshua are highly replaceable. And I want as many 1st and 2nd round picks this draft as we can get. 

 

So 3 x 4th round picks of value = late 2nd round pick in a deep draft.

 

Anyway that's my thinking. I don't think your opinion is wrong about getting more from DAL, but I'd rather do the deal and get something back for the cap space we now have and for Dermott who we are not even playing and will probably not resign anyway.

I really disagree on the value you place on Khudobin.......his salary is 3.3 million, and at the TDL, it will still be 1.32 Million........IMHO, that is worth more than a 4th