Jared McCann Appearance on Podcast

[Law of Goalies]

On 7/7/2023 at 3:02 PM, viking mama said:

He appears to have matured far better, over-time, than “Tuna” did. I suspect one of the worst things possible for Jake’s development was NOT sending him out-of-town to play in Utica with other hungry  progressing Pros, away from his local possee. Then again, maybe that wouldn’t have been enough or even mattered, regardless.
 

McCann seems to have developed some good sense between the ears & the wisdom to talk the talk, if not walk the walk, as a representative of his current NHL team. We shall see if he continues to haunt the Canucks as a pesky divisional player, for years to come. 
 

 

But they did. He lost so much weight and matured a bit more when he went to Utica for a whole year. After he came back, he just fell back into his local possee.

[Canucks_fo_life]

LOL what a loser this guy is 

[AnthonyG]

On 7/7/2023 at 8:45 AM, Coconuts said:

All they had to do was be patient with him and Virtanen, rushing them both was awful for this franchise. Who's to say what could have been if Jake had had time away from his boys, time to grow up around others putting in work over in Utica, or what could have been if we'd been patient with McCann. But they had to rush the shiny new toys.

 

Not pickin on you, but just kind of a general reply to your statement and several others here…

Who’s to say they were rushed? Who’s to say they didnt earn a spot out of camp with the lack of competition? You guys all assume they just handed spots out to these teenagers over guys who should have had a spot. Just because they played in their d+1 season, doesnt mean we just threw shiny new toys into the lineup. We had nothing in the system to keep them back. Its why JB built a heavy veteran presence, to help with sheltered development at the NHL level because almost every single 1st round pick we made for 6 straight seasons, was good enough to earn a spot out of camp.

Horvat, Virtanen, McCann, Boeser, Pettersson, Hughes, Podkolzin, Hoglander*
literally no one stood in their way and made it extremely difficult for them. 
 

I wish this fan base could get this around their head…

If there is nothing in the farm system and almost nothing on the NHL team… WHO IS GOING TO BEAT THEM OUT??? Which team needs to be filled first?? The NHL team with 70% soon to retire veterans and some plugs here and there, or the AHL team that has a bunch of busts like Gaunce, Jensen, Shinkaruk, Cassels etc etc….

 

Why were d+2/3/4 guys unable to earn a spot over them?

 

Benning was never going to be here long enough to build a contender, there were far too many holes in the system to deal with it all at once and in under 10 years. We had to replace an entire team AND build a farm system. That takes 10-15 years to go through the trials and tribulations of draft picks not panning out, or taking time to develop. This fan base couldnt handle the first 5 years of Bennings term and completely lost their minds in the few seasons after ‘19-20. Their is no logic or understanding from the large majority of this fan base. 

[shiznak]

On 7/8/2023 at 7:09 AM, NewbieCanuckFan said:

It's not different when the Pens dealt Sutter for Bonino.  Not that they thought Sutter was garbage/ready for the glue factory.  But he became too expensive for their cap structure (eg., pay their primo players the big money & try to make do with what's left to fill-out the rest of the roster).  That's what alot of people seem to disregard.  The Pens let McCann go not because they thought he was a failure.  It was the opposite.  He played well enough to make himself too expensive to keep.  Happened with Bonino as well (remember how well he worked with Kessel in the post-season?).  Bonino priced himself out of their roster from his (good) play.  He's not a core player but still was a solid player.  So he had to go just like McCann had to go.  And of course, why Sutter had to go in their lineup.

 

Reason why Horvat had to go (especially with the year he was having).  Too expensive to re-sign so you deal him.  Imho, he's not a 'core player'.  Hughes, EP & JT are core players.  You open the vault for those guys.  Then try to "fill-out" the roster with what's left.  If you give Horvat a mega-contract, there won't be enough cap left to do that (as you're bound to make at least one mistake eating cap space as everyone makes mistakes).

It’s odd that you think Horvat wasn’t a core player, considering he was drafted by us, played 8 seasons here and was named captain of the franchise; versus a guy who was traded here by the previous regime. 

Edited July 12, 2023 by shiznak

[canuck73_3]

6 hours ago, shiznak said:

It’s odd that you think Horvat wasn’t a core player, considering he was drafted by us, played 8 seasons here and was named captain of the franchise; versus a guy who was traded here by the previous regime. 

Core players can be that no matter how they end up on the team, but saying Bo wasn't one is stupid and revisionist history at best. 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

21 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said:

Core players can be that no matter how they end up on the team, but saying Bo wasn't one is stupid and revisionist history at best. 

No shame in being a VERY solid supporting player which he was.  Just not a player you want to hand out a mega contract to (like his current team did).  Something JB failed to do in 7 years.  Without such players, you just get a Laffs or Coilers team.  Top heavy but little else.  And JB couldn't even do that (at least those two teams contend for a playoff spot).

 

Alvin made the right decision (imho) to deal Horvat.

Edited July 12, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan

[canuck73_3]

3 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

No shame in being a VERY solid supporting player which he was.  Just not a player you want to hand out a mega contract to (like his current team did).  Something JB failed to do in 7 years.  Without such players, you just get a Laffs or Coilers team.  Top heavy but little else.  And JB couldn't even do that (at least those two teams contend for a playoff spot).

 

Alvin made the right decision (imho) to deal Horvat.

Mega contract =/= core player either and vice versa. 

[ilduce39]

On 7/7/2023 at 8:21 AM, KoreanHockeyFan said:

Just another example of how prospects were rushed into the NHL during the Benning area. That 2014 draft with the two first round picks the Canucks had was a missed opportunity to quicken the rebuild. 

 

Putting 19 year-olds into NHL lineups, especially in hot Canadian markets is a lot of pressure that's hard to handle for a teenager. Unless they're exceptional talents like Petey, best to make a safe bet and let them marinate in the AHL for a couple of years.

 

Let's hope Allvin and Rutherford don't make similar mistakes. So far, doesn't seem like they are, as we're finally starting to build some prospect depth and Abby's roster next year is certainly intriguing - let's hope this continues. 

I agree previous management fumbled Virt/McCann development particularly.  McCann in particular you could tell he was just on a beginners luck heater and once he hit those 10 games couldn’t be sent back.  It was brutal.

 

On the other hand it’s also amidst a very vocal segment of the fan base who shout “let the kids play” and “let’s see what they can do” ad nauseam. 

[shiznak]

15 hours ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

No shame in being a VERY solid supporting player which he was.  Just not a player you want to hand out a mega contract to (like his current team did).  Something JB failed to do in 7 years.  Without such players, you just get a Laffs or Coilers team.  Top heavy but little else.  And JB couldn't even do that (at least those two teams contend for a playoff spot).

 

Alvin made the right decision (imho) to deal Horvat.

Supporting players can be core players, fyi. 
 

I highly doubt Horvat would have gotten a mega deal, if management made him a priority last offseason. 7m/yr, probably was enough for him to remain a Canucks for life.

 

I don’t agree re-signing Miller was the correct move, even though he’s the better player. I’m not a fan of paying someone in his late-20s huge amount and term. Especially, when we’re about two years away from actually contending for the Cup. The logical decision would have been re-signing Horvat (7m/yr), trading Miller when his value was at his highest, and fixing the defense with the assets we acquired from the Miller trade. 

[canuck73_3]

8 hours ago, shiznak said:

Supporting players can be core players, fyi. 
 

I highly doubt Horvat would have gotten a mega deal, if management made him a priority last offseason. 7m/yr, probably was enough for him to remain a Canucks for life.

 

I don’t agree re-signing Miller was the correct move, even though he’s the better player. I’m not a fan of paying someone in his late-20s huge amount and term. Especially, when we’re about two years away from actually contending for the Cup. The logical decision would have been re-signing Horvat (7m/yr), trading Miller when his value was at his highest, and fixing the defense with the assets we acquired from the Miller trade. 

Alex Burrows was 100% a core player, and never more than a supporting player, same can be said for Kesler minus 2 dominant years.

[kloubek]

I love how in hindsight he now says the Canucks gave up on him too early. We didn't hear him claiming this before, when he was struggling to find his game.

 

The current fact remains: The Canucks didn't give up on him too early. He was a slow developer with confidence and personality issues. For half a decade, his main contributions were using up a roster spot in place of an alternate player who COULD have impacted his team. Only now, 6 years later, is he actually producing as was expected on draft day. Pretty easy for him to pipe up now, isn't it?

 

 

[canuck73_3]

41 minutes ago, kloubek said:

I love how in hindsight he now says the Canucks gave up on him too early. We didn't hear him claiming this before, when he was struggling to find his game.

 

The current fact remains: The Canucks didn't give up on him too early. He was a slow developer with confidence and personality issues. For half a decade, his main contributions were using up a roster spot in place of an alternate player who COULD have impacted his team. Only now, 6 years later, is he actually producing as was expected on draft day. Pretty easy for him to pipe up now, isn't it?

 

 

I found he took ownership on his part. It is revisionist history anyone claiming we let go of a 40 goal scorer, there was no real evidence that was coming anytime soon when we moved him and it didn't happen until 3 moves after.

Edited July 13, 2023 by canuck73_3

[NewbieCanuckFan]

8 hours ago, kloubek said:

I love how in hindsight he now says the Canucks gave up on him too early. We didn't hear him claiming this before, when he was struggling to find his game.

 

The current fact remains: The Canucks didn't give up on him too early. He was a slow developer with confidence and personality issues. For half a decade, his main contributions were using up a roster spot in place of an alternate player who COULD have impacted his team. Only now, 6 years later, is he actually producing as was expected on draft day. Pretty easy for him to pipe up now, isn't it?

 

 

Drafted July 24, 2014.

Traded:  May 25, 2016

 

How the heck is that not giving up on him too early?  (note that isn't the same as saying 'we gave up on a 40 goal scorer').

 

He was drafted 24th overall.  Of course such a player will often have warts that need to be ironed out.

 

That ain't hindsight.  That's common sense imho.

 

Notice that he played VERY LITTLE in the minors once he was dealt by us.  That suggests to me he showed enough to stick to a NHL club.  And many of those teams were playoff teams.  Not like making the squad of a lottery pick team  & sticking.  Just as I said, warts to be worked out.  I already explained why McCann was cut adrift from the Pens (same reason they eventually cut adrift Sutter, then Bonino).

Edited July 14, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan

[EastCoastNucks]

1 hour ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Drafted July 24, 2014.

Traded:  May 25, 2016

 

How the heck is that not giving up on him too early?  (note that isn't the same as saying 'we gave up on a 40 goal scorer').

 

He was drafted 24th overall.  Of course such a player will often have warts that need to be ironed out.

 

That ain't hindsight.  That's common sense imho.

 

Notice that he played VERY LITTLE in the minors once he was dealt by us.  That suggests to me he showed enough to stick to a NHL club.  And many of those teams were playoff teams.  Not like making the squad of a lottery pick team  & sticking.  Just as I said, warts to be worked out.  I already explained why McCann was cut adrift from the Pens (same reason they eventually cut adrift Sutter, then Bonino).

I think McCann has a good point, and I see all kinds of Canucks fans screaming to trade Brock Boeser but he is another 100+ point guy who is going to get there with us or another team. That being said, I wish we had BB on a 5 million contract, but thats pretty much the same as McCann's contract in USD? . If we had McCann still when the expansion draft happened, they would have taken someone of value to us then who would be even more valuable 2 years later... example, Cole Lind we will be jealous of that one in 3 or 4 years.

[EastCoastNucks]

This is actually a great topic, it gives us hope that Chicago fans and media will ruin Bedard enough that we can trade for him in 2 or 3 years

[NewbieCanuckFan]

18 minutes ago, EastCoastNucks said:

I think McCann has a good point, and I see all kinds of Canucks fans screaming to trade Brock Boeser but he is another 100+ point guy who is going to get there with us or another team. That being said, I wish we had BB on a 5 million contract, but thats pretty much the same as McCann's contract in USD? . If we had McCann still when the expansion draft happened, they would have taken someone of value to us then who would be even more valuable 2 years later... example, Cole Lind we will be jealous of that one in 3 or 4 years.

I'd give Tocchet a bit more time to work on Boeser.  Under his previous "alleged" NHL head coaches, Boeser developed very little, if at all.  He wasn't like Hughes (a franchise type player).  Saying McCann would've gone nowhere as a prospect under Willie D & Travis Green is more an indictment on Benning's hirings (and keeping them for 7 years in total combined).

Edited July 14, 2023 by NewbieCanuckFan

[EastCoastNucks]

11 minutes ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

I'd give Tocchet a bit more time to work on Boeser.  Under his previous "alleged" NHL head coaches, Boeser developed very little, if at all.  He wasn't like Hughes (a franchise type player).  Saying McCann would've gone nowhere as a prospect under Willie D & Travis Green is more an indictment on Benning's hirings (and keeping them for 7 years in total combined).

I think Brock Boeser has been OVER-COACHED for the last 3 years. I see interviews with the prospects and they all say they play better just getting back to being themselves and Brock is going to be himself again soon. The best thing about Tocchet is he has been there and will actually reduce the pressure on BB to perform, help him to ignore the Ian Mcintires of the world and just play pond hockey and love the game.

[EddieVedder]

14 hours ago, EastCoastNucks said:

I think Brock Boeser has been OVER-COACHED for the last 3 years. I see interviews with the prospects and they all say they play better just getting back to being themselves and Brock is going to be himself again soon. The best thing about Tocchet is he has been there and will actually reduce the pressure on BB to perform, help him to ignore the Ian Mcintires of the world and just play pond hockey and love the game.

overcoached how?  he barely moves out there.  his game has always been to try be the open guy and wait for a shot.   that type of game doesnt fly in the nhl anymore.  if you cant play with high energy shift in and shift out you are hurting the team.