[Report] Alex Burrows suspended 3 games

[Pears]

I hate Kreider (after what he did to Price), but it's two different hits. One's a head shot, one's a check from behind.

A hit from behind that was far more vicious and suspension worthy than Burrows basically sneezing on Emelin.

[Salmonberries]

I hope Horvat takes his spot, and not Kassian.

Move Higgins to the right side, and Horvat can play LW/C.

Let's hope they hire the Canadian Brass to play a little fanfare for Bo when he arrives. Nothing ostentatious mind you, just something simple to mark the occasion of his arrival.

[87Crosby]

The league got it right but the problem is it's one of the few it has. If they were consistent with the suspensions we wouldn't be complaining....As Much

[poetica]

He also noted that although Emelin changed his body position Burrows changed his to follow it. I do think Burrows was trying to maintain his line on Emelins shoulder but simply missed. It doesn't change the fact that, as pointed out in the video, the hit simply shouldn't have happened as it was late and Burrows had time to avoid contact completely.

Yes, he does say Burrows changed his position to follow, but I disagree with their assumption that Burrows knew Emelin was stopping rather than Burrows responding to the change in position Emelin's upper body as he was lifting up and turning.

And the hit may have been late, but late alone does not necessitate a suspension, as I pointed out in my response to you in the other thread. According to Wikipedia's list, 2 players were merely fined for "late hits" (with no other noted factors) in 2012. None were fined or suspended last year. If lateness alone warranted a suspension, surely there would have been one since Rome.

[poetica]

I'm all for the first part, but they can determine time by counting the number of frames based on the speed of the film. As far as the determination of late, I know there's the cutoff, but I can't think of any that are 1/10th of a second over the limit they are calling harshly.

The whole point is we don't know, unless you have a way to determine tenths of a second when watching videos of hits. If you do, please share that knowledge with the rest of us. Otherwise, you are trusting the NHL to be honest and consistent with determining what's late enough to use against a player and what isn't. I, on the other hand, don't trust them that much.

[Brick Tamland]

you mean people who are capable of looking at the facts and see a continuous and clear pattern of bias??

You might want to loosen off the tinfoil hat a little, not sure you are getting all the oxygen you need.

[NuckleheadFan]

It's the inconsistency that gets me frustrated.

[mbal23]

He didn't try to avoid the hit at all... Everyone keeps saying he tried but Burr is coming for behind in the Blind Zone, no way the guy had any idea where and if to stop.

[elvis15]

After seeing the suspension video's better angle of the hit I actually do agree with the suspension, albeit reluctantly. While I don't believe Burrows intended head contact, the hit did result in head contact. Even if it was unintentional it, like almost all head hits, probably needs to be a suspension if only to make all players sufficiently mindful at all times of possibly contacting the head of anyone they're hitting, intentionally or not. Player safety has to come first and if that means players need to change how they hit people to reduce the number of head hits, so be it. The only way that can happen, however, is if the NHL is consistent in their punishment of head hits and they just aren't.

That being said, I think you missed the point I believe Tearloch7 was trying to make. While Burrows' hit may have been late, the head contact, either entirely or as the principal point of contact, was very likely only because Emelin stops a fraction of a second before the hit. Had he maintained speed it would have very likely been a shoulder to shoulder hit with incidental or no head contact. In the suspension video, even the NHL agreed that Emelin is stopping when he's hit. They just choose to disregard that as a significant factor contributing to the head contact despite the NHL rulebook requiring them to consider, "Whether the opponent materially changed the position of his head or body immediately prior to or simultaneous with the hit in a way that significantly contributed to the head contact." It seems pretty clear that someone stopping immediately prior to a hit would significantly change the position of their body and yet the NHL determined that it didn't matter. That decision alone, however, takes this hit from what they would likely otherwise deem merely a missed 2-minute call to a 3-game suspension and the NHL making judgement calls like that which can be so easily influenced by outside factors makes me uncomfortable.

I agree that the NHL has to punish headshots, but we've been down this road before where I feel they've been consistent in determining illegal checks to the head (just maybe not the severity of suspensions).

As far as what Burrows could have done, the onus is still on Burrows to setup the hit correctly (not to mention have it not be late. The suspension video shows Emelin is slowing as a part of trying to pass the puck, and continues to slow up after the pass (especially since it was picked off). Burrows can see well in advance Emelin is leaning forward trying to move the puck rather than skating forward and should know that if he doesn't aim to hit more squarely through the body that he could make an illegal hit if Emelin straightens up. I agree, if Emelin stays bent over at almost 90 degrees then Burrows probably does hit his shoulder, but Burrows isn't aiming at all for anything but the very top part of Emelin's body even in that case.

The changing position part of the rule is for when a player lowers his head into a hit, not when a player moves his head away from contact. Burrows is still responsible to hit squarely through the body so any movement (again, apart from Emelin putting his head directly in Burrows' path) Emelin makes to avoid the hit doesn't result in an illegal check to the head. Aside from the lateness, if Burrows aims at the torso of the bent over Emelin instead of his shoulder, then Burrows still hits Emelin through the body even when he straightens up.

He was about to hit shoulder to shoulder and coming in on an angle as emily turned her left foot inward to stop. The slowing down meant Burrows went past her shoulder and hit her pretty face.

Yup, which is why Burrows should have aimed more squarely through the body - or not have hit him at all since there was time for Emelin to straighten up after making an off balance pass.

[mbal23]

The whole point is we don't know, unless you have a way to determine tenths of a second when watching videos of hits. If you do, please share that knowledge with the rest of us. Otherwise, you are trusting the NHL to be honest and consistent with determining what's late enough to use against a player and what isn't. I, on the other hand, don't trust them that much.

The League does have that kind of tech, its called put the clip in Adobe Premier and look at the timeline.

[elvis15]

The whole point is we don't know, unless you have a way to determine tenths of a second when watching videos of hits. If you do, please share that knowledge with the rest of us. Otherwise, you are trusting the NHL to be honest and consistent with determining what's late enough to use against a player and what isn't. I, on the other hand, don't trust them that much.

That's where I noted they can use the number of frames that have lapsed in the video based on the speed of the film. Mythbusters uses that all the time to determine speed (as well as the distance measured over the striped backgrounds they use).

If you don't trust that determination, that's another thing, but you could independently verify it the same way.

The League does have that kind of tech, its called put the clip in Adobe Premier and look at the timeline.

Or that.

[Baggins]

Yes, he does say Burrows changed his position to follow, but I disagree with their assumption that Burrows knew Emelin was stopping rather than Burrows responding to the change in position Emelin's upper body as he was lifting up and turning.

And the hit may have been late, but late alone does not necessitate a suspension, as I pointed out in my response to you in the other thread. According to Wikipedia's list, 2 players were merely fined for "late hits" (with no other noted factors) in 2012. None were fined or suspended last year. If lateness alone warranted a suspension, surely there would have been one since Rome.

Neither of the late hit fines were also targeting the head. Burrows had two strikes: late hit + illegal contact to the head. Then add in four previous fines (also disciplinary actions). As I previously said, typically a first offense head shot gets 2 games. For Burrows it's: late hit + illegal head shot + four fines. I actually don't have a problem with 3 games. And I have a Burrows jersey which should tell you something.

[Baggins]

That's where I noted they can use the number of frames that have lapsed in the video based on the speed of the film. Mythbusters uses that all the time to determine speed (as well as the distance measured over the striped backgrounds they use).

If you don't trust that determination, that's another thing, but you could independently verify it the same way.

Or that.

Typical is .04 of a second per frame.

[Burgilny896]

All these so called "unbiased" experts showing up on here saying it was fair and deserved.

Even Benning and management were surprised at the length, and I think they have a better grasp and more experts on their team than you, that have a better idea of whats fair and what isn't.

He basically stated that, ok thats their call and we'll have to deal with it.

[sabatoge95]

It was definitely a hit to the head, but still the inconsistency is pretty brutal.

[Hairy Kneel]

Friendly reminder from the league not to be the uppidty team from nowheresville canada you had your 2011 run now git..not an original 6 team, not a big market US team, not a barely surviving losing US franchise...just pay your equalization and shut your trap.

[-DLC-]

Friendly reminder from the league not to be the uppidty team from nowheresville canada you had your 2011 run now git..not an original 6 team, not a big market US team, not a barely surviving losing US franchise...just pay your equalization and shut your trap.

ExACTLY. Mind yer manners.

Just how I feel....I can actually hear them saying it like this.

Bogus. But can't even care anymore...it's reached WWE proportions to me. This league is a joke and they pick and choose. May as well just hand us all the script and we'll read who wins.

[ShakyWalton]

Blessing in disguise CDC!

Sedin Sedin Vrbata

Higgins Bonino Kassian

Matthias Horvat Vey

Dorsett Richardson Hansen

Kass gets top 6 shot

At practice today it was Hansen on the 2nd line with Bonono and Higgins and Sestito draws into the 4th line..I dont think you will see Kass on the 2nd line..its easier to make only 2 moves that affect 2 lines instead of a series of moves that affect 3 lines and WD likes how the 2nd line is going...besides as much as I like Kassian..I doubt he will ever play 2nd line minutes at least on this team.

[coyotecanuck]

Neither of the late hit fines were also targeting the head. Burrows had two strikes: late hit + illegal contact to the head. Then add in four previous fines (also disciplinary actions). As I previously said, typically a first offense head shot gets 2 games. For Burrows it's: late hit + illegal head shot + four fines. I actually don't have a problem with 3 games. And I have a Burrows jersey which should tell you something.

Why do you keep referencing 4 fines? The last of which was almost 5 years ago, none of which involved predatory play on the part of Burrows, as though it should have any relevance to the conversation? Clear NHL propaganda and you bought it hook, line and sinker Baggins.

[BeefcakeBo]

I can't believe how biased most people in this thread are. If you can't see that the hit was late and to the head I'm not sure anyone can help you. As for the league being inconsistent it sucks but it still doesn't make the hit any cleaner. I only expected 1-2 games but 3 isn't terribly unreasonable. Just because some players haven't gotten suspensions doesn't make Burrows any less guilty of a head shot.

I'm of the belief that if you expect Lucic to get suspended for spearing guys from behind in the groin and jock area, then you should also expect Burrows to get suspended for the heads hot. If Lucic gets off free and we have to take a suspension it just makes us the better team anyways. Burrows can hold his head high and not put up with all the other 29 teams saying he gets away with everything.