Veterans & Rookies Overall Play

[coolboarder]

After watching them blowing 3rd period leads or lose a last-minute goal.   Also, PP is non-existence and allowed a SH goal.   Majority of those mistakes are made by veterans.   Rookies did make a few mistakes but they learned fast.   Some untimely penalties made by veterans.  

The team is literally carrying by the rookies so far in this young season, it's not even funny anymore.   Yes, the team has a good mixture of rookies and veterans but one thing stood out for me is that the veterans is costing us a few games so far by some careless play made by veterans, not the rookies.  Surprise, surprise, rookies have not costed us a game so far.   

This is the reason why Miller called out yesterday and when I heard that, it's about time for the management to do something with the veterans.    Without the play by the rookies, the Canucks will not be the 2nd place in the division at this point of the year.   To fix this, bold moves are needed to keep their head above the waters.   I am just a fan but I could see some moves need to be made.  I would suggest  a few areas, named defence, powerplay, 5 on 5 play, and discipline:

Defence:
- To shore up the defence, promote Hutton to the top 4 and allow him to play PP1 unit.  Demote Edler out of PP1 and play with PP2 units.   

- I would trade a veteran forward for a veteran defenseman is what I would do.  We have plenty of young players stepping up so far this year.   That is the only way to improve a defense corps.   There are no other option to shore up.  We have guys in minors ready to step up, guys such as Gaunce, Kenins and Shinkaruk waiting for a call-up.  Shinkaruk could join the team mid-season or after the trade deadline if he keeps up racking up the points in the AHL.  So the veterans on this team are redundant because we have someone in the system doing the same role and their play is effective and the veterans are not effective on their role anymore.

- Promote Biega and drop Weber.   Weber has nothing to contribute to the team except for his shot and his shot is not good this year so far.   Weber is not dangerous and I would waive him for Biega.   I would shed some defenseman veterans if possible.   Edler is a keeper but belongs to the second pairing of the corp.  Biega is a better player than Weber or Sbisa and deserve a few games and see if he can keep it up and climb up the depth chart over Weber, Sbisa, Bart and demote Hamhuis as I see he has lost a step so far.  Maybe an injury that is not known to us could linger in Hamhuis' play.  This is my speculation.

Powerplay:

- Split up the Sedin on the powerplay but keep them together on 5 on 5.  For a good reason, Daniel is not a shooter anymore and he was not the same after 2012 season.  The PP used to be in top 5 in the league but now, they are not anymore.   So to Sedins can be split up for PP, giving them the half-board, control the puck and have some snipers on both units, Vrbata and McCann.  Virtenan can provide a presence in the net.  They have had 5 minute major and that's the game.   This tells us that it is time to shake up the PP units and split up the Sedins.   This is not related to this game but the overall PP system is not working.  If they don't split up, they will be at bottom in the PP conversion rate.  Also promote Hutton on PP1 with the Sedins before making a move to split up the unit.   

- Who controls the PP2 half-board, Burrows?  Higgins?   No way they are the elite playmaker on this team so the philosophy of loading up the PP1 might worked in the past will not work well this year because of the lack of the experience on PP2 unit.   What's the worse thing: they could not even score 5 on 3, and 5-minute major penalty this year.   Hence the reason to split up the Sedins to both units.   

PP1 unit led by the Sedins has dried up.  They may be in slump but their possession is based on the perimeter play but no penetration to the dirty area for greater effect.  The drop passes in the neutral zone MUST go because they takes away 10-15 seconds off the clock.  If we had 10-15 extra seconds on the offensive zone, it will be a difference maker to whether a PP2 unit able to score a dying seconds.   

5 on 5 play:

- Goals created by the Canucks are not the problem, the problem here is preventing some goals and give up scoring chances.  This is an issue from the day 1, giving up grade "A" scoring chances.  This is far apparent on the team so far.  This is attribute to the defensive corps.  Edler and Tanev are not the problem here, the problem is one defensive player miss his assignment far too often.  Also, a few veterans forward making turnovers trying to be cute when this is not necessary and contribute to a loss.   This is up to coach and management to identify this.  

Discipline play:
I do not like Dorsett's behavior on this team so far and it's not helping when he took away a PP time off when he was hit by a Penguins.  What's more, he has not been doing well with his discipline so far.  We have Prust so I would cut Dorsett off from the team via trades whenever possible.    Some of you claim that he is good with the youth but I digress,   To be a good influence, it must be above reproach and his stance on the team is not acceptable.   Fights, or rough play by scrum is ok, as long as it does not cost us anything or take us off from PP.   He picked fight with Tootoo and caused some silly things on the ice is not acceptable.  He let the emotion get best of him.  

This topic discussion is about the contrast between veterans and rookies.  It is like a big difference between the sun and the moon.    This is no doubt that the youth movement is effective but the veterans has not caught on yet and it can be frustrating when they cost us a few games so far.   When Miller calls out the team, you listen because he knows a thing or two from his youth days with Buffalo.   He did not speak until yesterday because he gave them chances to fix this defensive issues.  The core has not impress me so far, neither so is Miller   The core has not really adjust to the youth movement yet.  This is my theory. 

 

[desiboynux4lifee*******]

Moves need to be made, I hope they do make the right moves this year, and Miller calling out the team was a bad mistake because this team looked dis-interested in playing for him tonight; also, if this team continues to struggle then will Miller keep his mouth shut? History shows Miller knows how to be a drama queen(buffalo days)  and if Miller doesn't keep his mouth shut then those clowns on team1040 are just celebrating because of the amount of the stories and publicity they can create from Miller lol. Miller has to keep his mouth shut and if this team continues to lose, then you know the media in Vancouver will do everything in there power to get him to say something negative and build on it.

[King Heffy]

We need Dorsett unless you want Prust to be the only guy who can stand up for the youth.  I'd rather undisciplined penalties than not pushing back at all.

[Pickly]

What do fans expect? This team is not that good and the veterans are past their best before date. It's a positive sign that the rookies and younger players are stepping up and playing more consistently as this young season progresses but it should be no surprise the vets can't get it done when it matter most. The Sedins simply are a step behind where they were even as early as last season as we are witnessing uncharacteristic plays and chances blown by them more and more regularly. Vrbata is getting chances but history shows he has been streaky throughout his career so his slump shouldn't come as much of a surprise.  Elder, Hamhuis, and Burrows have all peaked and are on the down slope of their respective careers. I for one want this team to experience a down year as it'll make management's decision of moving more vets much easier and help pave the way for what seems to be a very promising future.

[Alflives]

What do fans expect? This team is not that good and the veterans are past their best before date. It's a positive sign that the rookies and younger players are stepping up and playing more consistently as this young season progresses but it should be no surprise the vets can't get it done when it matter most. The Sedins simply are a step behind where they were even as early as last season as we are witnessing uncharacteristic plays and chances blown by them more and more regularly. Vrbata is getting chances but history shows he has been streaky throughout his career so his slump shouldn't come as much of a surprise.  Elder, Hamhuis, and Burrows have all peaked and are on the down slope of their respective careers. I for one want this team to experience a down year as it'll make management's decision of moving more vets much easier and help pave the way for what seems to be a very promising future.

and we will get a top pick!  I'm just pissed we will end up in the middle again.  I know we got McCann at 24, but that was fluke luck that the other teams were just stupid.  We need to be good or bad, but not this middle stuff.

[coolboarder]

and we will get a top pick!  I'm just pissed we will end up in the middle again.  I know we got McCann at 24, but that was fluke luck that the other teams were just stupid.  We need to be good or bad, but not this middle stuff.

Top pick are not guaranteed.  Look at history of top pick busts so it's not guaranteed that they will make this team better.   Just keep on building on what they have built but it needs to be fixed so that the winning culture can go on while Benning can draft that will help this team in a few years.   The rookies already contributing to this team in a huge way.  It's the veterans and defence are a huge letdown so far.   We don't want to be Edmonton 2.0 with too many veterans on this team and once they retire, the team would have a losing culture because of their influence.  if the veterans are not stepping up, they could creep in a bad habit to the group of rookies.

[Alflives]

Top pick are not guaranteed.  Look at history of top pick busts so it's not guaranteed that they will make this team better.   Just keep on building on what they have built but it needs to be fixed so that the winning culture can go on while Benning can draft that will help this team in a few years.   The rookies already contributing to this team in a huge way.  It's the veterans and defence are a huge letdown so far.   We don't want to be Edmonton 2.0 with too many veterans on this team and once they retire, the team would have a losing culture because of their influence.  if the veterans are not stepping up, they could creep in a bad habit to the group of rookies.

not all teams are Edmonton.  Look at the Hawks and Kings.  That's the last five Cups.  Would Macdavid have looked good on our team, or Chychrun next year?  Top picks do make a difference, unless it's the Oilers.

[wallstreetamigo]

not all teams are Edmonton.  Look at the Hawks and Kings.  That's the last five Cups.  Would Macdavid have looked good on our team, or Chychrun next year?  Top picks do make a difference, unless it's the Oilers.

Eventually those top picks will make a difference for the Oilers too. It is just a matter of time.

I would much rather endure a couple of terrible seasons to draft a top player or two. Because at the end of the day not very many of the best teams have gotten a cup without having taken that route.

We need a true all around beast #1 dman. And we need a true franchise #1 dominating center. We arenèt getting either anywhere but the draft.

[Kevin Biestra]

The way they're blowing 3rd period leads, you'd think they were exhausted from being played 40 minutes a night by Tortorella, and that it was game 75 of the season.

Instead, they can't get through a third period or overtime and haven't been able to since five games into the season.

I hope they prove otherwise and find their groove, but the veterans are playing like old men with no stamina when the chips are down late in the game.

And whatever they have been planning and executing in 3-on-3 overtime so far, they need to do the exact opposite.  Immediately.

[Alflives]

Eventually those top picks will make a difference for the Oilers too. It is just a matter of time.

I would much rather endure a couple of terrible seasons to draft a top player or two. Because at the end of the day not very many of the best teams have gotten a cup without having taken that route.

We need a true all around beast #1 dman. And we need a true franchise #1 dominating center. We arenèt getting either anywhere but the draft.

yup.  But our owner is a penny pincher.  He must be getting in the way of a full on rebuild.  Can you imagine if we do like the leafs did for the last 40 years?  I'm okay with our young guys taking bigger roles, and let the picks fall where they may.

[puckdontlie]

yup.  But our owner is a penny pincher.  He must be getting in the way of a full on rebuild.  Can you imagine if we do like the leafs did for the last 40 years?  I'm okay with our young guys taking bigger roles, and let the picks fall where they may.

Our owner a penny pincher? He's paying severance to 2 coaches, a former GM, a few assistant GM's and scouts that were let go this year... I think even the trainer was replaced. He's even paid for sleep doctors and a star chef to do catering at games. The owner is a younger version of Mr. Burns.

[Alflives]

Our owner a penny pincher? He's paying severance to 2 coaches, a former GM, a few assistant GM's and scouts that were let go this year... I think even the trainer was replaced. He's even paid for sleep doctors and a star chef to do catering at games. The owner is a younger version of Mr. Burns.

then why not bite the bullet, and go for the top picks, and reload the gun with some bigger shells?

[shazzam]

I hope we can turn some of those vets into picks. Vrbata and Hamhuis should both be moved for picks at the deadline.

I don't see us re-signing Vrbata so we shouldn't lose him for nothing. 

Defenseman will be a high commodity come trade deadline and Hamhuis can definitely land at least a first

[Alflives]

I hope we can turn some of those vets into picks. Vrbata and Hamhuis should both be moved for picks at the deadline.

I don't see us re-signing Vrbata so we shouldn't lose him for nothing. 

Defenseman will be a high commodity come trade deadline and Hamhuis can definitely land at least a first

if we could get a couple of late firsts for those two, and we have a 10 pick, could we use those three to get Chychrun?  

[EdgarM]

not all teams are Edmonton.  Look at the Hawks and Kings.  That's the last five Cups.  Would Macdavid have looked good on our team, or Chychrun next year?  Top picks do make a difference, unless it's the Oilers.

or Buffalo, or Florida, or Columbus, or Colorado or............................

[Alflives]

or Buffalo, or Florida, or Columbus, or Colorado or............................

yup.  But there were better players available, and they took the wrong guys.  Sam Bennet instead of Reinhart.  Monahan instead of barkov, Jones instead of McKinnon.  I can't figure Columbus.  They are oilers stupid.  We would need to draft the right guys, and JB has proven he's good at the draft.

[coolboarder]

or Buffalo, or Florida, or Columbus, or Colorado or............................

Right.  Vancouver had 2 top 3 picks and some late first rounder and it took them 12 years to reach to the Stanley Cup finals.   So on average, it takes time for top pick to dominate the league a decade later unless you have a great group of supporting cast early in their career.  Most of the time, it doesn't happen.   Top pick such as Ovie hasn't had the opportunity to play in SCF yet.   So this is not guaranteed pick.  You need a surplus of a strong farm team to translate to a strong NHL team.   Also a few strong draft years will take this team to Stanley Cup contender, see the Blackhawks.  

[LOL_dre]

yup.  But there were better players available, and they took the wrong guys.  Sam Bennet instead of Reinhart.  Monahan instead of barkov, Jones instead of McKinnon.  I can't figure Columbus.  They are oilers stupid.  We would need to draft the right guys, and JB has proven he's good at the draft.

You do know Calgary is doing bad as well right...

[Alflives]

You do know Calgary is doing bad as well right...

I hate Calgary, and want them to suck, but I do believe Monahan and Bennett were the better choices.  Yuk!  I just threw up in my mouth.  Yuk.

nope I can't do it.  You're right!  I'm terribly wrong.  It's not worth complimenting Calgary players to support my point.  I feel better now!

[BanTSN]

It's another close game that could have gone either way.  That means minor adjustments are needed, not major ones.

Major changes take time anyway.  It's not like GM's are knocking down Benning's door to give him all their good players.

The season has been entertaining so far, the team is in the playoff hunt, and they're also getting some new young players to watch.  Things are on track.