ItTakesAnArmy Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 13 hours ago, Kosmo Kramer said: I would delve into a tree of the Kesler effect but I would like to mention he handcuffed the team with basically 1 real destination. Hard to get value in that position. Another fantasy. Did he refuse to come to camp or report? The team did not HAVE to trade him then, he was under contract for another two years. Show me where the rules state that if a player wants to be traded the team HAS to do that trade? All this crud about being handcuffed by this mysterious HAVE TO TRADE stuff is again just Benning showing weakness and giving in to player demands without provocation. see; Eriksson's contract and other over 30 vets deals. What do think the team could have got if they had waited until the trade deadline and included some cap retention? That Benning did trade him is JB being nice, a nice guy. Nice guys finish last, Over a 4 year period that has been a truth. Just remember, the did not have to trade Kesler then and there. He was under contract. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Kramer Posted October 17, 2019 Author Share Posted October 17, 2019 Just now, ItTakesAnArmy said: Another fantasy. Did he refuse to come to camp or report? The team did not HAVE to trade him then, he was under contract for another two years. Show me where the rules state that if a player wants to be traded the team HAS to do that trade? All this crud about being handcuffed by this mysterious HAVE TO TRADE stuff is again just Benning showing weakness and giving in to player demands without provocation. see; Eriksson's contract and other over 30 vets deals. What do think the team could have got if they had waited until the trade deadline and included some cap retention? That Benning did trade him is JB being nice, a nice guy. Nice guys finish last, Over a 4 year period that has been a truth. Just remember, the did not have to trade Kesler then and there. He was under contract. Valid point. I think GMs want to maintain a reputation of being player friendly. Like the Biega situation where instead of sending him down he traded him somewhere he may stay in the league. If a trade is requested/demanded then they ship them off no matter what. But it isn't always to the benefit of the team. Sakic in Colorado held onto Duchene forever, didn't cave and got himself a good return in the end. How it should be done. If your a competitive team, playing in a city like Vancouver, I think players would want to be here regardless of if you submit to players requests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 The guys in the room have the most direct line to this stuff so if someone speaks out from that position, it tends to hold more water than just something fans dream up (like they've done with Jake). Could have just been a personal thing between the two, so to be taken with a grain of salt. Not everyone gets along with everyone else. But I bet you'd be hard pressed to find any of Jake's teammates who found a personal/attitude issue with Jake. I believe his "issues" are more that he's just slower to digest things and then to apply them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItTakesAnArmy Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Alflives said: One of the mothers commented about McCann’s attitude too. It’s a team game. McCann was (could still be) a me first guy. Have none of you ever been competitive or on a competitive team? You think these guys just happen to be really good by accident? It is called attitude, ATTITUDE. When a player is not satisfied to average, they have to believe that they are superior, better than their peers, work harder and try harder and not give up. They fight for icetime. That is one reason Tryamkin could not understand ice time given out. They will break you to be what they want, that used to be the way and still is in the "wannabe" leagues like the AHL. Those players are close and will do almost anything to make the show giving the coach an enormous amount influence, truly a career or not. The "me first" stuff goes Waaaay back. Linden refuses to report to camp over a contract negotiations - he is selfish and puts himself before team Nedved refuse to sign - he is only concerned with himself, not a team mate Bure threatens to sit, he only thinks of himself, he is a loser and should be traded Mitchell refuses to resign, he is a self centered weakling according to AV Hodgson, reported to be a cancer in the dressing room after only 40 games, a spolied kid that uses his back as an excuse, again an AV comment. Kesler, a selfish cancer that must be removed at all costs, a load of crap, he is under contract for two more years McCann, Tryamkin, .... The common thread is that all these accusations fed the media for weeks if not months and all are "leaks" to the media from management. Having 20 guys all fighting for more icetime I would think is more preferable to 20 professionals giving just a good enough showing for a nights entertainment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10pavelbure96 Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 Pearson >>> McCann and age is irrelevant. We have lots of young guys. You need players of all ages throughout your line up. Vets journeymen and rookies. Pearson is much more valuable to the Canucks than McCann is to the penguins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 15 hours ago, Kosmo Kramer said: Gudbranson has come and gone, thankfully it turned into Pearson who is doing well for us, but I thought it would be interesting to examine the bigger picture and see what your thoughts are. We gave up Jared McCann 2016 2nd round pick ( Rasmus Asplund ) 2016 4th round pick ( Jonathan Ang ) We may have picked other players, but this is what those picks turned into. We recieved Gudbranson 2016 5th round pick ( Cole Candella ) And ultimately Tanner Pearson. At a quick look at the 3 prospects involved, don't look like they will make the NHL, so not much loss there. McCann 2018-2019 19G 16A - 37P - 78GP 2019-2020 2G 1A - 3P - 6GP Pearson as a Canuck 2018-2019 9G 3A - 12P - 19GP 2019-2020 2G 2A - 4P - 5GP McCann is 4 years younger at 23. Pearson is 15lbs heavier Same height. I don't watch Pittsburgh so I don't know exactly how McCann is doing but it seems he is averaging 15 minutes of ice time, same as Pearson. In hindsight, would you make the trade all over again? Should we have kept McCann instead? Who ended up with the best player? Also would McCann be a better version of Gaudette or will the hockey Gaud be better? I didn't think up a good ending for this thread, I usually just lurk lol. Please share your thoughts on the trades now that we have the power of hindsight. 'It is what it is' McCann is a good player but redundant with Gaudette emerging. Pearson is a keeper and will be a 20 plus goal guy for us.. I for one am happy McCann is gone, he was a constant reminder that JB missed Pasternak. Lol the JV vs Nyalnder BS.... the player we missed is racking up goals in Boston on a good contract. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Kramer Posted October 17, 2019 Author Share Posted October 17, 2019 10 minutes ago, Phat Fingers said: 'It is what it is' McCann is a good player but redundant with Gaudette emerging. Pearson is a keeper and will be a 20 plus goal guy for us.. I for one am happy McCann is gone, he was a constant reminder that JB missed Pasternak. Lol the JV vs Nyalnder BS.... the player we missed is racking up goals in Boston on a good contract. While I don't disagree, lots of teams missed on Pasta. There's always a gem other teams missed out on. We have Petey playing like a first overall, you win some you lose some. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruilin96 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 The most ideal situation for us would be drafting David Pastrnak instead of Jared McCann in the 2014 draft. But this is hindsight, and at the time McCann was consider a steal at where we drafted him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoneypuckOverlord Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Looks like he's back down to earth. Gudbranson looked solid with the Penguins after the trade. (of course Pearson looked great for us too 38 goal pace last year) so far hes dressed for 4 out of Penguins 7 games, healthy scratched in 3, and whenever he did play his ice time is rock bottom number 6 dman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilduce39 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Pearson fits the team a whole lot better than anything we gave up in the process of acquiring him so I think JB made out well, all things considered. Landed a cost effective top 6 winger who adds some jam to the lineup... didn’t lose anything of equal or greater value. I’ll take it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook007 Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 Could care less about McCan... Pearson fits this team perfectly... Team is getting bigger and heavier... Like it lots.. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted October 18, 2019 Share Posted October 18, 2019 On 10/17/2019 at 12:56 AM, Kosmo Kramer said: Gudbranson has come and gone, thankfully it turned into Pearson who is doing well for us, but I thought it would be interesting to examine the bigger picture and see what your thoughts are. We gave up Jared McCann 2016 2nd round pick ( Rasmus Asplund ) 2016 4th round pick ( Jonathan Ang ) We may have picked other players, but this is what those picks turned into. We recieved Gudbranson 2016 5th round pick ( Cole Candella ) And ultimately Tanner Pearson. At a quick look at the 3 prospects involved, don't look like they will make the NHL, so not much loss there. McCann 2018-2019 19G 16A - 37P - 78GP 2019-2020 2G 1A - 3P - 6GP Pearson as a Canuck 2018-2019 9G 3A - 12P - 19GP 2019-2020 2G 2A - 4P - 5GP McCann is 4 years younger at 23. Pearson is 15lbs heavier Same height. I don't watch Pittsburgh so I don't know exactly how McCann is doing but it seems he is averaging 15 minutes of ice time, same as Pearson. In hindsight, would you make the trade all over again? Should we have kept McCann instead? Who ended up with the best player? Also would McCann be a better version of Gaudette or will the hockey Gaud be better? I didn't think up a good ending for this thread, I usually just lurk lol. Please share your thoughts on the trades now that we have the power of hindsight. It's a good, fair question imo. For me, McCann was/is one of those 'young- minded' guys that you're probably not really going to know what you have until they're at or beyond waiver eligibility = not unlike Goldobin in that sense (although different kinds of players in some senses). Haven't seen Pitts yet this year either, but McCann's outcomes: 3 pts in 6 games, +1 43.9% in the faceoff circle - at 23 that's not bad, but you'd hope it upticks at some point or he might make a good winger conversion 44% ozone starts, 43% corsi - not bad, pretty much a saw off in differential. Pretty comparable to what he did in a larger (but still small) sample last year in Pitts. A bit easier imo to produce solid numbers in Pitt than Florida, but still, he's not playing easy minutes, so credit where it's due. Pearson has been more productive, is more physical, and has been good on our penalty killing unit as well - but is older and costs more. Overall = not a bad 'hockey trade' in the end - not one that either team would lose sleep over - and both with assets that seem to fit well and work for them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmo Kramer Posted October 18, 2019 Author Share Posted October 18, 2019 Not many people have bit on my Gaudette question. I realize he is not part of this deal, curious to know if people think we still have our McCann in Gaudette? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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