[Signing] Josi extended 8 years

[theo5789]

36 minutes ago, gurn said:

Do you have many examples of these types of contracts being good ones?

As mentioned Giordano is signed until 38. He just won a Norris at age 35.

 

Ryan Suter is sign until he's 39, still a ways ago, but he's been their (and the entire league) top minute man pretty much for the duration of the contract so far. 7.5 million is not bad for a #1 dman. If he drops off a bit in the next few years, 7.5 million will be around top 4 money anyway in a few years.

 

Nicklas Lidstrom was getting shorter 2 year deals at around 7.5 million when he was 36 and older. Don't have numbers before 2006.

 

Zdeno Chara signed a long term deal with full NMC at age 33 that took him to age 40. And he's still going.

 

What do these guys have in common with Josi? Top end dmen. Consider the fact that UFAs were getting 10+ million deals. Josi at 9 million a season even today is a great contract. It might balance out by the end of it assuming he will drop off a bit, but they're likely getting full value for at least 6 of the 8 years of that contract and with the cap going up, 9 million won't look that bad. He's been quite healthy thus far, so barring things going south quickly, this contract should hold well IMO.

[Canuck Surfer]

2 hours ago, Monty said:

Oh yeah. My favourite thing about Roman Josi that I heard years ago? The pick the Preds used on him was one the Leafs traded to them  

What did Toronto receive?

[mll]

6 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

What did Toronto receive?

Nashville traded with Phoenix to move up at the 2008 draft.   Phoenix had received that 2nd round pick (and Brendan Bell) from Toronto at the 2007 TDL for Yanic Perrault and a 5th round pick.

 

[Nuxfanabroad]

They owed this cat after ripping him off previously. So they dump Subban, but squander cap savings on Duch? Has Poile in Music City lost the tempo?..stay tuned

[theo5789]

2 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

They owed this cat after ripping him off previously. So they dump Subban, but squander cap savings on Duch? Has Poile in Music City lost the tempo?..stay tuned

They had Fabbro ready. Save cap on defense to upgrade up front. IMO this Josi deal is still a good one because if he hit the UFA market, he likely gets more.

[mll]

4 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

They owed this cat after ripping him off previously. So they dump Subban, but squander cap savings on Duch? Has Poile in Music City lost the tempo?..stay tuned

Poile said he would have not traded Subban if not for Fabbro showing so well in the 10 games he played and at the Worlds.  Duchene has been very good for Nashville - he's their Fs with the most points so far.   Poile had been trying to add Duchene for a while now - tried several times to trade for him.  

[Nuxfanabroad]

1 minute ago, theo5789 said:

They had Fabbro ready. Save cap on defense to upgrade up front. IMO this Josi deal is still a good one because if he hit the UFA market, he likely gets more.

Yeah, still don't even think I've seen that kid play yet? I'd say DP was smart to deal Subban. Funny with Nashville, they always seem to be missing something, to get them over the hump.

 

Can Duch & RyJo lead 'em all the way? I don't know..some might question the character.

[Nuxfanabroad]

6 minutes ago, mll said:

Poile said he would have not traded Subban if not for Fabbro showing so well in the 10 games he played and at the Worlds.  Duchene has been very good for Nashville - he's their Fs with the most points so far.   Poile had been trying to add Duchene for a while now - tried several times to trade for him.  

Also got my own theory on that..I think Poile is polite & pc for the press.

 

In truth, bet they discovered PK had a high PITA factor, & probably upset the balance(personalities & cap %) in (what had been) a fairly tight room. For example, looking back on what should have been a celebrated franchise-peak(long Spring run to Finals), gets sidetracked by this guy playing childish media-games with Sidney/Listerine. Do teammates look back on such antics amusingly?

[mll]

Just now, Nuxfanabroad said:

Also got my own theory on that..I think Poile is polite & pc for the press.

 

In truth, bet they discovered PK had a high PITA factor, & probably upset the balance(personalities & cap %) in (what had been) a fairly tight room. For example, looking back on what should have been a celebrated franchise-peak(long Spring run to Finals), gets sidetracked by this guy playing childish media-games with Sidney/Listerine. Do teammates look back on such antics amusingly?

Subban was appreciated in Nashville - seems very close with Josi.  Poile regretted having to trade him but it's a cap world.  

 

[GhostsOf1994]

1 hour ago, theo5789 said:

As mentioned Giordano is signed until 38. He just won a Norris at age 35.

 

Ryan Suter is sign until he's 39, still a ways ago, but he's been their (and the entire league) top minute man pretty much for the duration of the contract so far. 7.5 million is not bad for a #1 dman. If he drops off a bit in the next few years, 7.5 million will be around top 4 money anyway in a few years.

 

Nicklas Lidstrom was getting shorter 2 year deals at around 7.5 million when he was 36 and older. Don't have numbers before 2006.

 

Zdeno Chara signed a long term deal with full NMC at age 33 that took him to age 40. And he's still going.

 

What do these guys have in common with Josi? Top end dmen. Consider the fact that UFAs were getting 10+ million deals. Josi at 9 million a season even today is a great contract. It might balance out by the end of it assuming he will drop off a bit, but they're likely getting full value for at least 6 of the 8 years of that contract and with the cap going up, 9 million won't look that bad. He's been quite healthy thus far, so barring things going south quickly, this contract should hold well IMO.

Not all the same, Lidstrom is the best d man ever.

 

Chara was elite for a long time, another freak athlete.

 

Suter has the experience and pedigree, another freak athlete.

 

Giordano is a fantastic d man, he deserves every penny.

 

Josi has played 574 games and has 360ish points, the duration of his new contract at 8 yrs.

That will add 8years x 82gp= 656gp if he stays healthy.

More games to play then his career to date, will josi get 300+ points over the next 8 years?

 

Josi is good but i think this is too much just like p.k. subbans 9mill.

[Pickly]

25 minutes ago, GhostsOf1994 said:

Not all the same, Lidstrom is the best d man ever.

 

Chara was elite for a long time, another freak athlete.

 

Suter has the experience and pedigree, another freak athlete.

 

Giordano is a fantastic d man, he deserves every penny.

 

Josi has played 574 games and has 360ish points, the duration of his new contract at 8 yrs.

That will add 8years x 82gp= 656gp if he stays healthy.

More games to play then his career to date, will josi get 300+ points over the next 8 years?

 

Josi is good but i think this is too much just like p.k. subbans 9mill.

It may be too much but it’s what top D command in today’s NHL. People around here were willing to shell out close to 11 million/season for Karlsson in the summer .

[mll]

36 minutes ago, GhostsOf1994 said:

Not all the same, Lidstrom is the best d man ever.

 

Chara was elite for a long time, another freak athlete.

 

Suter has the experience and pedigree, another freak athlete.

 

Giordano is a fantastic d man, he deserves every penny.

 

Josi has played 574 games and has 360ish points, the duration of his new contract at 8 yrs.

That will add 8years x 82gp= 656gp if he stays healthy.

More games to play then his career to date, will josi get 300+ points over the next 8 years?

 

Josi is good but i think this is too much just like p.k. subbans 9mill.

LeBrun polled executives and agents last week - 9M is on the lower end.  With teams talking about the importance of playing a possession game - he's the best puck skating D out there.   Not only was he the best in zone exits and zone entries with possession, and it's really not close, he was also the D that had the puck on his stick the most in the o-zone. 

 

 

[Gaudette Celly]

2 hours ago, mll said:

Poile said he would have not traded Subban if not for Fabbro showing so well in the 10 games he played and at the Worlds.  

If Benning had pulled that here the roof would have blown off.

[GhostsOf1994]

1 hour ago, Pickly said:

It may be too much but it’s what top D command in today’s NHL. People around here were willing to shell out close to 11 million/season for Karlsson in the summer .

And that's why SJS won't win a cup with Karlsson unless the salary cap goes to 100mil.

1 hour ago, mll said:

LeBrun polled executives and agents last week - 9M is on the lower end.  With teams talking about the importance of playing a possession game - he's the best puck skating D out there.   Not only was he the best in zone exits and zone entries with possession, and it's really not close, he was also the D that had the puck on his stick the most in the o-zone. 

 

 

All Nashville dmen going back to suter/weber are always involved in the play, and thus pad stats. Inflating salaries etc. 

[mll]

1 minute ago, GhostsOf1994 said:

And that's why SJS won't win a cup with Karlsson unless the salary cap goes to 100mil.

All Nashville dmen going back to suter/weber are always involved in the play, and thus pad stats. Inflating salaries etc. 

Weber doesn't skate the puck - reason why he was moved.  They felt they were playing more defence than offence.  As Hitchcock explains in the new NHL you defend by playing in the offensive zone.  The more you play in the o-zone the less likely you will get scored on.  

 

Last season Josi skated the puck out 627 times - 127 times more than the next in the league.  That's having a real effect on the game - not just padding stats.  Nashville's offence starts with the ability of their Ds to skate the puck out.

 

Hitchcock was explaining that you can't have long term success if you are playing board and out.  You need to be able to use the middle of the ice and Josi is elite there.

 

[theo5789]

2 hours ago, GhostsOf1994 said:

Not all the same, Lidstrom is the best d man ever.

 

Chara was elite for a long time, another freak athlete.

 

Suter has the experience and pedigree, another freak athlete.

 

Giordano is a fantastic d man, he deserves every penny.

 

Josi has played 574 games and has 360ish points, the duration of his new contract at 8 yrs.

That will add 8years x 82gp= 656gp if he stays healthy.

More games to play then his career to date, will josi get 300+ points over the next 8 years?

 

Josi is good but i think this is too much just like p.k. subbans 9mill.

Not comparing the players at all. I was asked about long term contracts for players that go into their late 30s. Seems like top end dmen age well and in some case like Giordano find new legs even at 35. There's no reason to not believe Josi could be one of these type of players. He logs the big minutes in all situations, isn't overly physical and is a good skater. I can't predict the future, but I don't think that this contract will be horrendous (at the tail end) as some believe.

[mll]

15 minutes ago, Gaudette Celly said:

If Benning had pulled that here the roof would have blown off.

Nashville had 3 legit top pairing Ds in Josi, Ellis and Ekholm.  A bit of a risk but Nashville has also been working closely with Fabbro ever since they drafted him.  

 

They are very present in player development.  They obviously won't comment on systems but have been teaching him how to play a NHL game as soon as they drafted him - puck protection, stick positioning etc.  They go to his games and have weekly contacts.  They even have an internal website where players can log in and get a breakdown of all their shifts with suggestions for improvements.   

 

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

Have to wonder how much longer we’ll see teams go with the “big” UFA extensions. With the sea change that’s happening around RFAs and locking up players to huge extensions through the prime years of their twenties, I could see teams eventually moving away from handing out max term deals to players entering the declining phase of their age curves. Would not be surprised if the norm eventually becomes giving out huge deals to RFAs and then giving shorter term or even year to year deals, still at high dollars, to UFAs, and just paying them market value on short deals. UFAs in general are overpaid, but some of that was rewarding players who’d been underpaid through their ELC and RFA years. Now that there’s been a market adjustment around the RFA deal, I’d imagine a UFA adjustment may be on the horizon.

Edited October 30, 2019 by SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME

[Canuck Surfer]

1 hour ago, mll said:

Weber doesn't skate the puck - reason why he was moved.  They felt they were playing more defence than offence.  As Hitchcock explains in the new NHL you defend by playing in the offensive zone.  The more you play in the o-zone the less likely you will get scored on.  

 

Last season Josi skated the puck out 627 times - 127 times more than the next in the league.  That's having a real effect on the game - not just padding stats.  Nashville's offence starts with the ability of their Ds to skate the puck out.

 

Hitchcock was explaining that you can't have long term success if you are playing board and out.  You need to be able to use the middle of the ice and Josi is elite there.

 

He could suggested that to some of his D in Edmonton? 

 

I don't disagree with this statement.  But Hitchcock was becoming less, and less relevant as the years passed by...

 

Wasy for him to say what Nashville was doing well. But he could not?

[Nuxfanabroad]

22 minutes ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Have to wonder how much longer we’ll see teams go with the “big” UFA extensions. With the sea change that’s happening around RFAs and locking up players to huge extensions through the prime years of their twenties, I could see teams eventually moving away from handing out max term deals to players entering the declining phase of their age curves. Would not be surprised if the norm eventually becomes giving out huge deals to RFAs and then giving shorter term or even year to year deals, still at high dollars, to UFAs, and just paying them market value on short deals. UFAs in general are overpaid, but some of that was rewarding players who’d been underpaid through their ELC and RFA years. Now that there’s been a market adjustment around the RFA deal, I’d imagine a UFA adjustment may be on the horizon.

Agree with this. Mid-career now being more treasured than end-career. Forget rivalries..will intergenerational-wars turn these puck showdowns into an existential, sort of Logan's Run?!