c00kies Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 What if, when released, you find out hes going to be your next door neighbor? He's going to be somebody's neighbor. Not necessarily, as a lot of severe schizophrenic sufferers end up homeless, especially due to the stigmatization of the term which makes it hard to get a job or seek help. I don't know Vince's living conditions prior to the incident, so I'm not sure if he'll be able to return to where he was living prior to the incident. Schizophrenia is a "hard cure" in that if you do go off your meds, you can return to previous,problematic states. The meds help with the positive symptoms of schizophrenia, so that includes hallucinations and delusions, so without the meds Vince could have further hallucinations or delusions, which is what everyone is afraid of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucklehead Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Tough call. The guy was suffering from a severe form of schizophrenia to the point that he actually thought killing and eating a man would help him. He couldn't fully understand the true nature of what he was doing. With that, I don't think it is fair for him to spend his life in a cell, but I wouldn't be okay with him being fully discharged from the justice system. There needs to be some safeguards in place to ensure that he takes his medications regularly to ensure this doesn't happen again, something like a sort of "life-long conditional release". Start him off with daily visits with health care professionals who can monitor him. If he proves reliable in taking his medication, they could even wean the meetings off a little, every second day, every week, whatever. A fair compromise to ensure Li gets a chance, while there is still a concern for public safety. I'm all for this, provided you will agree to let him live in your basement for one year.The victim's mother, however, said Li should remain locked up for life."I don't think it should matter whether you're mentally ill or not mentally ill. If you kill someone, you should lose your freedom, period." DeDelley said outside the hearing."I'm standing out here by my damn self for six years now, and they're going to ultimately let this person free. And if he re-offends, (they'll say), Oh well, statistically it shouldn't happen. But guess what? It does, and it does and it does." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 As some other intelligent posters have said, this is a tough case. It's not cut and dry, black or white. I live about 45 minutes from Selkirk, and go there quite often (drive by the Pyschiatric Hospital where Li resides). Though I do not work with those that are mentally ill, I do have a few friends that suffer from mental illness and I do volunteer and sit on one board in my community involving those that are mentally ill. I absolutely feel for those that suffer day in and day out. The stigma attached to those that have a mental illness is even more difficult to break as we can never really know what it is like to be those people. I don't make the decision on this, and as Offensive Threat said, I'm glad that I don't have to be the one that does, as I'm not qualified. Whatever the decision, though, he will still be monitored daily for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 And some Brazilian guy was arguing with me that Canada has it right and deals with their criminals properly... You can argue mental faculties all you like. Bottom line is this time bomb went off in a big way and killed and ate someone on a moving bus. This is NOT a safe human being who deserves freedoms. This is a person who needs and deserves to be locked up and monitored. A doctor stabbed his two beautiful children to death in a fit of jealous rage. He is also free and while being re-tried had gone back to work. He was let off because he was not mentally coherent at the time and it was a crime of passion. Enough of these nonsense convictions and babysitting sentences. Human beings as a race need to know that if you do, bad will happen. Horrific crimes do not deserve more freedom. Horrific crimes deserve punishment As a father of two young girls I ask any of you, hell all of you to try imagining being ok with more freedoms for someone who has horribly murdered someone you love or someone so defenseless as to be completely unbelievable. Li does not deserve more freedoms. he deserves to be safely locked away for life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimberWolf Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 He's already proven he isn't safe amongst people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 For anyone who says he should be freed should answer the question, would you feel comfortable sitting beside him on a 24 hour bus ride? probably not so he should be locked and monitored in a mental facility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arowind Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Everyone complains the justice system is there to punish not to rehabilitated when they actually attempt it every one is still mad. Cant Win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rypien37 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Man...do I feel for the family of the victim. I know if it was my family member that this happened to...the first time Li would be granted "unescorted leave" he would be taken care of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatsPajamas Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 CDC is one of the dumbest forums I've ever been on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShakyWalton Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 If he is rehabilitated then he should get a second chance at life. Kinda like the guy he decapitated and ate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theminister Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Everyone complains the justice system is there to punish not to rehabilitated when they actually attempt it every one is still mad. Cant Win Not so... The criminal justice system exists for four main reasons: 1) Punishment - The criminal is told what they did is unacceptable 2) Rehabilitation - The criminal learns why what they did was unacceptable 3) Public Example - The public learns why what the criminal did was unacceptable 4) Public Safety - The criminal is removed from the population Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jägermeister Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I don't think people here really understand how Schizophrenia and other pervasive mental disorders work. Let me ask all you against giving him a second chance this: If you were heavily drugged without your knowledge, and killed somebody while on some sort of intense hallucinogenic high, and had no recollection of doing it whatsoever, you wouldn't feel like you were responsible would you? For the record, in Canada you probably wouldn't be convicted in that scenario. Similarly, Mr. Li didn't ask to hear and see what he did. He doesn't remember commiting the crime. He in himself is not some deranged killer. I understand the fear of letting him out on the basis that he might not stay on his meds, and I do think he should be monitored to ensure that he does, but if his treatments continue to work he is no risk to public safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzle Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Man...do I feel for the family of the victim. I know if it was my family member that this happened to...the first time Li would be granted "unescorted leave" he would be taken care of. That says a lot about you. You're not Canadian. Our system runs on rehabiliation and confinement. If you want revenge, go live in America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazzle Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I don't think people here really understand how Schizophrenia and other pervasive mental disorders work. Let me ask all you against giving him a second chance this: If you were heavily drugged without your knowledge, and killed somebody while on some sort of intense hallucinogenic high, and had no recollection of doing it whatsoever, you wouldn't feel like you were responsible would you? For the record, in Canada you probably wouldn't be convicted in that scenario. Similarly, Mr. Li didn't ask to hear and see what he did. He doesn't remember commiting the crime. He in himself is not some deranged killer. I understand the fear of letting him out on the basis that he might not stay on his meds, and I do think he should be monitored to ensure that he does, but if his treatments continue to work he is no risk to public safety. The thing is, he has shown clear remorse for his actions. He has understood what he has done and has admitted that no matter what he does, the incident will always be with him. If he's showing progress and he's shown remorse, I think the next step is to give him baby steps to living a normal life again. Perhaps he can do something good for society by raising awareness of what schitzophrenia or mental illness is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surtur Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I don't think people here really understand how Schizophrenia and other pervasive mental disorders work. Let me ask all you against giving him a second chance this: If you were heavily drugged without your knowledge, and killed somebody while on some sort of intense hallucinogenic high, and had no recollection of doing it whatsoever, you wouldn't feel like you were responsible would you? For the record, in Canada you probably wouldn't be convicted in that scenario. Similarly, Mr. Li didn't ask to hear and see what he did. He doesn't remember commiting the crime. He in himself is not some deranged killer. I understand the fear of letting him out on the basis that he might not stay on his meds, and I do think he should be monitored to ensure that he does, but if his treatments continue to work he is no risk to public safety. difference being in one occurrence that someone else had to mastermind in giving you the drugs and one has a high chance of reoccurring due to no second party involvement since it all occurred in his own mind. No matter how similar the end result was with how the mind reacted to the drugs or the schizophrenia I will not argue if he should be let loose on society or not but my personal opinion is he shouldn't I will not argue why it is just my personal opinion and how I feel. Sorry for grammar issues typing on my glitchy phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverpig Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I think it would be a great outcome if Li could be rehabilitated, properly medicated, released, and to live a long, productive, happy, crime-free, and to whatever extent is appropriate, remorseful life. He has an illness which affects a lot of Canadians, one that you don't get by choice. If he can be treated for it so that he can live a normal life, that should be the right outcome. What is the alternative? The alternative would be a message to all of those suffering from mental illness that it will never get better and society will never accept them. Here's something to think about: schizophrenia often shows up later in life. Any one of you is "one voice away" from killing someone too. Should we all be locked up as a preventative measure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baka Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 CDC is one of the dumbest forums I've ever been on. That's its charm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heisenberg Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Who to say he's really ''cured'' some quack psychologist? he could be faking it, you just don't know. I understand wanting to be a progressive do gooder and feel good about yourself for caring about the poor murderer and everything but how do we know he is actually never going to harm anyone again, and NO he is not the same as any other person because most people do not cut up and eat random people and never will, thats a .000001% of the population special kind of incredibly screwed up person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horny Manatee Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 Who to say he's really ''cured'' some quack psychologist? he could be faking it, you just don't know. I understand wanting to be a progressive do gooder and feel good about yourself for caring about the poor murderer and everything but how do we know he is actually never going to harm anyone again, and NO he is not the same as any other person because most people do not cut up and eat random people and never will, thats a .000001% of the population special kind of incredibly screwed up person. I bet you he's not a virgin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heisenberg Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I bet you he's not a virgin. uhh have you seen him? Im guessing he is. Also he's like twice my age but that time I won't be if I'm still one at 35 I'm paying to lose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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