Jim Benning has placed offer for 1st overall; impressed by local prospect Reinhart

[nuckster33]

 

I completely get the idea of having to overpay for the #1 pick, I just think its a terrible idea. Judging by some of the proposals out there, I believe many are discrediting the #6 pick. I rather the Canucks keep the pick and develop their young players instead of trading them away

exactly...just because someone else will overpay (ie if Toronto rumors are correct)...doesn't mean we should be stupid enough to do so as well! All this accomplishes is making our riches someone elses!

End of the day, assuming we can swing a good deal with Anaheim, who I believe will be very motivated to trade for Kesler given LA's performance over the past few years, and realize LA and Anaheim actually have a serious rivalry, this matters to their fans as well, beating LA...and Kes is the guy that gives them the best chance to fight that beast of a team, no doubt.

Strength at Center and Goal are the 2 biggest keys to winning in hockey, this is common knowledge.

There are no other centers available with Kesler's abilities, size, fit, cap hit, etc right now. Anaheim will be stupid not to overpay at this point, and if Getzlaf and Perry have a say, they will be begging.

Soo...

Say we can get a Smith Pelly, 10th, and another prospect be that Vatanen or Theodore

End of the day

Tanev, Smith Pelley, the Prospect, and six and ten are worth in any combination of 2-3 more than one player.

First does not mean we get a superstar and we could get a superstar at 6 and 10, perhaps two!!!

Just because some other team is stupid to overpay, doesn't mean we should.

[Brocklovich]

 

exactly...just because someone else will overpay (ie if Toronto rumors are correct)...doesn't mean we should be stupid enough to do so as well! All this accomplishes is making our riches someone elses!

End of the day, assuming we can swing a good deal with Anaheim, who I believe will be very motivated to trade for Kesler given LA's performance over the past few years, and realize LA and Anaheim actually have a serious rivalry, this matters to their fans as well, beating LA...and Kes is the guy that gives them the best chance to fight that beast of a team, no doubt.

Strength at Center and Goal are the 2 biggest keys to winning in hockey, this is common knowledge.

There are no other centers available with Kesler's abilities, size, fit, cap hit, etc right now. Anaheim will be stupid not to overpay at this point, and if Getzlaf and Perry have a say, they will be begging.

Soo...

Say we can get a Smith Pelly, 10th, and another prospect be that Vatanen or Theodore

End of the day

Tanev, Smith Pelley, the Prospect, and six and ten are worth in any combination of 2-3 more than one player.

First does not mean we get a superstar and we could get a superstar at 6 and 10, perhaps two!!!

Just because some other team is stupid to overpay, doesn't mean we should.

While I agree its stupid to overpay that proposal was something that could be tweaked accordingly. It was a decent template.

Maybe Benning keeps dsp but gives tanev 6 10th

I also thought van needed another piece if shipping out both kes and tanev still thought the proposal was a decent start

[nuckster33]

While I agree its stupid to overpay that proposal was something that could be tweaked accordingly. It was a decent template.

Maybe Benning keeps dsp but gives tanev 6 10th

I also thought van needed another piece if shipping out both kes and tanev still thought the proposal was a decent start

I understand what you are saying about tweaking but look at what you/others are proposing even here..

You would remove Kesler, Tanev, 6th and 10th overall from our team

For

Smith Pelley and Reinhart?

Really man? Really?

You can't ever convince me that this makes any sense -its absolutely ludicrous!!

By implication such silly ideas are suggesting that Smith Pelley, Tanev and whomever we would draft at 6 and 10 are worth less than Reinhart!!!!

People here are overvaluing first because its first its first its first!!! with complete ignorance to what they have suggested we give up to get that first!!

You potentially give up a:

Clearly top 4 NHL calibre defenseman who has done nothing but rapidly exceed expecations in only 2 years and who is a calming influence on a group that handles the puck like its a grenade

A potential power forward who has shown he can compete at the NHL level in Smith Pelley

then two players who are just as much of a crap shoot as number 1 as drafts are anything but guaranteed, and its not like we aren't drafting in the best tier (top 10).

This to me makes zero sense and is really really ludicrous, I am sorry if stating the obvious is offensive to some but really, people need to think a bit first before they propose

Its not as I said NHL 14 where you just keep adding players and picks to get the guy you want, something about value for what you're giving up needs to be added to the equation.

There is no Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby here. Reinhart is good but he's not 2 players who are emerging in the NHL as serious NHL'ers and two top ten picks good man...

Silly, really

[TheRussianRocket.]

@cyclonetaylor:

"We’ll inquire about trying to move up [in the draft]" - #Canucks GM Jim Benning http://t.co/bY8Eg42Sav http://t.co/GzdnFeiEEB

[Tangerines]

I understand what you are saying about tweaking but look at what you/others are proposing even here..

You would remove Kesler, Tanev, 6th and 10th overall from our team

For

Smith Pelley and Reinhart?

Really man? Really?

You can't ever convince me that this makes any sense -its absolutely ludicrous!!

By implication such silly ideas are suggesting that Smith Pelley, Tanev and whomever we would draft at 6 and 10 are worth less than Reinhart!!!!

People here are overvaluing first because its first its first its first!!! with complete ignorance to what they have suggested we give up to get that first!!

You potentially give up a:

Clearly top 4 NHL calibre defenseman who has done nothing but rapidly exceed expecations in only 2 years and who is a calming influence on a group that handles the puck like its a grenade

A potential power forward who has shown he can compete at the NHL level in Smith Pelley

then two players who are just as much of a crap shoot as number 1 as drafts are anything but guaranteed, and its not like we aren't drafting in the best tier (top 10).

This to me makes zero sense and is really really ludicrous, I am sorry if stating the obvious is offensive to some but really, people need to think a bit first before they propose

Its not as I said NHL 14 where you just keep adding players and picks to get the guy you want, something about value for what you're giving up needs to be added to the equation.

There is no Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby here. Reinhart is good but he's not 2 players who are emerging in the NHL as serious NHL'ers and two top ten picks good man...

Silly, really

Listen Nuckster I believe we got off on the wrong foot. I don't do drugs, and I'm not a stupid little kid throwing out trade proposals out of my @ss. I'm a 36 year old man that really enjoys watching the Canucks, and I want them to succeed as much as you do. I hope we can both celebrate them winning a cup in our lifetime.

I just wanted to explain that we would have to overpay to get the first overall. In my proposal we have Kesler, Tanev, 6th, overall, and DSP going out, and the 1st overall, 10th, and 24th coming back. I also mentioned that this was a starting point. It could be tweaked so we would get something more coming back our way as well. Also maybe we keep DSP and trade the 6th, 24th, Tanev, or the 10th, 24, and Tanev whatever. In the bolded you mentioned that we would remove Kesler, Tanev, 6th, 10th and in return we would get Reinhart, DSP, but you forgot to mention that the 24th overall would be coming our way.

Lastly I just wanted to point out that I didn't say that I would, or wouldn't do this trade and that it was plausable, but in all likelihood this is what it might take to get that pick in a 3 way deal. Of course there are a million other possibilities. I just demonstrated a starting point that included the 3 teams that were involved in the proposal. Iv'e heard the Tanev, 6th, Hansen offer from others and I think thats what it might take if it were just VAN and FLA invoved in a trade.

In the end I believe the question we should be asking ourselves is, is it worth it to go for the number one pick? That I leave in the hands of Jim Benning, and I will trust and support his decesion because after all JB and co. know better than you and I about how to go about making this team into a contender again.

[terrible.dee]

Boston has Krejci and Bergeron down the middle and it's made them a powerhouse. Having both Reinhart and Bo would be very close to that in a few years imo.

I sure as hell hope JB can do it. You need centres to win and this would be a major move which might not cost too much. Reinhart is the best all around player in the draft and has been compared to the likes of John Tavares. Check this out:

Sounds like a game breaker to me. I'm all in to move up for him if the price is reasonable.

C'mon man......you KNOW the price isn't going to be reasonable!

Anyone who thinks we can get Reinhart painlessly, think again.

[Roflcawptur]

Tanev + 6th + 36th/schroeder/cederholm is the most I would go.

[Skead]

There is no Tavares, Stamkos, Crosby here. Reinhart is good but he's not 2 players who are emerging in the NHL as serious NHL'ers and two top ten picks good man...

You know it's kind of funny and ironic you specifically mention Tavares, Stamkos, and Crosby...

Reinhart actually out produces Stamkos, and is .1 PPG behind Tavares. (.96 PPG behind Crosby)

Take a read, it's an interesting article.

[Off_The_Schneid!]

To Florida:

6th pick

Burrows

Tanev

To van:

1st pick

Jovo cop

Floridas 2nd round pick

[Ghostsof1915]

Let's stockpile picks to get top 5 in 2015, not in a weak draft year.

[Skead]

Let's stockpile picks to get top 5 in 2015, not in a weak draft year.

That would work except the cost of getting potential lottery tickets next year isn't going to be cheap.

Buffalo and co will be either saying they're not trading at all or asking for a kings ransom.

[DeNiro]

When was the last time the 1st overall was even traded? I can;t think of one in the last 20 years...

I feel like we're getting sucked in by hype and something that is very unlikely to ever happen.

I think it's more likely we acquire the 2nd or even 3rd overall if we're going to trade up.

[TheRussianRocket.]

Report: Canucks website article on the possibility of trading up in the draft - By Jeff Angus:

http://canucks.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=722296

The rumor mill has been heating up in recent weeks as the 2014 NHL Draft approaches.

Many writers and experts believe the Canucks are interested in trading up for the 1st overall pick and using it to select Kootenay Ice center Sam Reinhart. The Florida Panthers currently own the pick and it is about that time for the annual Vancouver-Florida blockbuster...but does this move make sense for the Canucks? Do they have the assets available to interest the Panthers? Why Reinhart?

Why Trade Up?

The 1st overall pick has been traded five times in NHL history (and Florida has been the team moving the pick on three of those occasions). Just because the Panthers have experience moving the 1st overall pick doesnt make them any more likely to do it again unless the price is right. Does it make sense to move up for the Canucks? Is Reinhart a clear upgrade on the talent that will be available at 6th overall?

Brian Burke put his stamp on the organization at the 1999 NHL Draft, orchestrating a series of draft day trades that secured Daniel and Henrik Sedin. That trade needed another four or five years to really pay off for Vancouver, but there is no debating that Burkes shrewd dealing set the table for many great years to come in Vancouver. And there is no debating that the talent available at pick one always trumps the talent available at pick six. The past decades top picks have almost all developed into phenomenal hockey players.

The last 10 1st overall picks are as follows: Alex Ovechkin Sidney Crosby Erik Johnson Patrick Kane John Tavares Steven Stamkos Taylor Hall Ryan Nugent-Hopkins Nail Yakupov Nathan MacKinnon

Johnsons progression was slowed in St. Louis by a serious knee injury, but he has gotten back on track as a solid top pairing defenseman in Colorado. The Blues would definitely want a do-over with that pick though. Outside of Johnson (and maybe Yakupov, but it is still very early in his career), every single 1st overall pick has become or will become an elite NHL player.

How have the past 10 6th overall picks fared?

Al Montoya Gilbert Brule Derick Brassard Sam Gagner Nikita Filatov Oliver Ekman-Larsson Brett Connolly Mika Zibanejad Hampus Lindholm Sean Monahan

Not nearly as good, of course. Brassard and Gagner are solid NHL players. Zibanejad, Lindholm, and Monahan have bright futures. Ekman-Larsson is one of the games best defensemen. But Montoya, Brule, and Filatov were all massive disappointments. The jury is still out on Connolly.

Obviously this is a very arbitrary look at past drafts and doesnt really tell us anything about 2014. But does it make sense to do everything you can to turn the 6th pick into the 1st pick? Id say so.

Why Reinhart?

Aside from being arguably the best forward available in this draft class, Reinhart is a Vancouver boy. Canucks fans have been chasing a hometown draft prize for years and years (the argument could be made since trading away one in Cam Neely long ago). Milan Lucic. Brendan Gallagher. Brule. Whenever a player with Vancouver ties becomes available, fans want him as a Canuck. Paul Kariya. Joe Sakic. The list goes on and on. Fans always want to root for one of their own, and Reinhart would give the Canucks a potential cornerstone player with ties to the city.

Here is some of his finest work from the past campaign:

Reinharts two older brothers are both current NHL prospects Max with Calgary and Griffin with the New York Islanders. His dad, Paul, played for the Canucks from 1988 to 1990 and was a very talented offensive defenseman.

According to Jason Botchford of the Province, new Canucks general manager Jim Benning is very interested in Reinhart. I would imagine 29 other GMs would say the very same thing on record Reinhart is a wizard with the puck and could be the best playmaker to come through the draft since Sidney Crosby in 2005. Jonathan Toews is another player who is often brought up as a comparable for Reinhart. The two Canadian centers are similarly-sized (6-1 and 185 pounds for Reinhart, which is more than Toews weighed in at the 2007 NHL Draft). They are both tremendous players with and without the puck as well. Reinhart has also been compared to John Tavares. Not the fastest skaters, but both are very cerebral players with an unlimited arsenal of offensive moves at their disposal.

Heres Peter Sullivan from NHL Central Scouting on Reinhart:

"He has a complete game at both ends of the ice. He does everything well. He won't get you overly excited, but from a coaching perspective, he's the guy you always want on the ice in critical situations. He's your go-to guy and team leader and is just going to be consistent at the junior level, and eventually the pro level."

Reinharts year-to-year progression in the WHL has been both steady and impressive. He had 105 points in 60 games this past season, leading the Kootenay Ice into the WHL postseason. Reinhart then added 23 points in only 13 postseason games for the Ice. He is obviously trending in the right direction, which is why his draft stock has shot up tremendously over the past six months.

The rumor mill has been heating up in recent weeks as the 2014 NHL Draft approaches.

Many writers and experts believe the Canucks are interested in trading up for the 1st overall pick and using it to select Kootenay Ice center Sam Reinhart. The Florida Panthers currently own the pick and it is about that time for the annual Vancouver-Florida blockbuster...but does this move make sense for the Canucks? Do they have the assets available to interest the Panthers? Why Reinhart?

Why Trade Up?

The 1st overall pick has been traded five times in NHL history (and Florida has been the team moving the pick on three of those occasions). Just because the Panthers have experience moving the 1st overall pick doesnt make them any more likely to do it again unless the price is right. Does it make sense to move up for the Canucks? Is Reinhart a clear upgrade on the talent that will be available at 6th overall?

Brian Burke put his stamp on the organization at the 1999 NHL Draft, orchestrating a series of draft day trades that secured Daniel and Henrik Sedin. That trade needed another four or five years to really pay off for Vancouver, but there is no debating that Burkes shrewd dealing set the table for many great years to come in Vancouver. And there is no debating that the talent available at pick one always trumps the talent available at pick six. The past decades top picks have almost all developed into phenomenal hockey players.

The last 10 1st overall picks are as follows: Alex Ovechkin Sidney Crosby Erik Johnson Patrick Kane John Tavares Steven Stamkos Taylor Hall Ryan Nugent-Hopkins Nail Yakupov Nathan MacKinnon

Johnsons progression was slowed in St. Louis by a serious knee injury, but he has gotten back on track as a solid top pairing defenseman in Colorado. The Blues would definitely want a do-over with that pick though. Outside of Johnson (and maybe Yakupov, but it is still very early in his career), every single 1st overall pick has become or will become an elite NHL player.

How have the past 10 6th overall picks fared?

Al Montoya Gilbert Brule Derick Brassard Sam Gagner Nikita Filatov Oliver Ekman-Larsson Brett Connolly Mika Zibanejad Hampus Lindholm Sean Monahan

Not nearly as good, of course. Brassard and Gagner are solid NHL players. Zibanejad, Lindholm, and Monahan have bright futures. Ekman-Larsson is one of the games best defensemen. But Montoya, Brule, and Filatov were all massive disappointments. The jury is still out on Connolly.

Obviously this is a very arbitrary look at past drafts and doesnt really tell us anything about 2014. But does it make sense to do everything you can to turn the 6th pick into the 1st pick? Id say so.

Who to Trade?

From the perspective of the Panthers, trading the pick may make sense. Florida doesnt necessarily need a young center they have a slew of talented young pivots, including Aleksander Barkov, Vincent Trocheck, and Nick Bjugstad. Florida has arguably the top prospect pool in hockey and may be interested in adding more NHL ready talent to their roster instead of another high draft pick.

They are currently looking for a top four defenseman, but the Canucks probably arent looking to move one at the moment. And even if they were, would Jason Garrison or Alex Edler interest Florida as a part of a potential return? Trevor Linden is a huge Edler fan and believes that the talented young Swede will turn his game around under a new coach, while Garrison has a no-trade clause and specifically took less money to return home to Vancouver. Would Chris Tanev become available? It all depends on how Florida values Vancouvers roster players, but the Canucks would be smart to hold on to Tanev unless they receive an offer they cant refuse.

Would Vancouver entertain the idea of packaging up Bo Horvat with the 6th overall pick for Reinhart? Horvat may not have Reinharts upside, but moving a really talented young center and a high pick for another talented young center may seem like nothing more than a lateral move. Some scouts question Horvats ultimate upside, but there are few weaknesses in his game and he should be a full-time NHL player for a long time beginning this fall. And wouldnt it be nice to be able to build around a 1-2 punch of Reinhart and Horvat down the middle for the next decade?

At the end of the day, the Canucks will have to pony up if they want to get Florida to meet them at the negotiating table. Is Reinhart worth Horvat and the 6th pick? That is a question that would take a few years to answer. But just as Burke put his stamp on the club at the 1999 NHL Draft, Jim Benning could do the very same in 2014. Having a Vancouver born-and-raised franchise cornerstone would go a long way to improving the future of the Canucks both on and off the ice.

[Skead]

When was the last time the 1st overall was even traded? I can;t think of one in the last 20 years...

I feel like we're getting sucked in by hype and something that is very unlikely to ever happen.

I think it's more likely we acquire the 2nd or even 3rd overall if we're going to trade up.

I dont have the exact source but in history 5 first overall picks have been dealt, the panthers being the team that has dealt 3 of the 5. I believe Vancouver is one (with the Sedin trade) with the Thrashers pick.

[TheRussianRocket.]

I dont have the exact source but in history 5 first overall picks have been dealt, the panthers being the team that has dealt 3 of the 5. I believe Vancouver is one (with the Sedin trade) with the Thrashers pick.

^yep, why it's a good possibility Florida may trade it with them publicly stating they are shopping it. They are in a win now mode and want impact ready players than young players 2-3 years away from making an impact.

"The 1st overall pick has been traded five times in NHL history (and Florida has been the team moving the pick on three of those occasions)."

[Skead]

^yep, why it's a good possibility Florida may trade it with them publicly stating they are shopping it. They are in a win now mode and want impact ready players than young players 2-3 years away from making an impact.

"The 1st overall pick has been traded five times in NHL history (and Florida has been the team moving the pick on three of those occasions)."

I think they're trying to make the most of Luongo and they desperately need butts in seats. Winning games will do that.

[Gyllenhaal]

When was the last time the 1st overall was even traded? I can;t think of one in the last 20 years...

I feel like we're getting sucked in by hype and something that is very unlikely to ever happen.

I think it's more likely we acquire the 2nd or even 3rd overall if we're going to trade up.

Florida traded it in 2002 and 2003. So not to long ago.

[DeNiro]

I dont have the exact source but in history 5 first overall picks have been dealt, the panthers being the team that has dealt 3 of the 5. I believe Vancouver is one (with the Sedin trade) with the Thrashers pick.

They traded down to three to select Bouwmeester.

Has a team ever traded down from 1st more than a couple spots though?

[Junkyard Dog]

They traded down to three to select Bouwmeester.

Has a team ever traded down from 1st more than a couple spots though?

FLA has been having attendance problems for a while.

FLA wants to make the playoffs. It is probably why they traded for Luongo. Trading the 1st for a solid return could help them make the playoffs sooner and make them more of an entertaining hockey club.

Entertaining hockey = More fans = More $$$

I think the only way we get 1st is if a top 4 D goes in a packaged deal, they need one. Garrison has played well there so I would figure that they would want him back(they took Luongo back). All that would depend on Garrison and his damned NTC though.

No deal if no solid roster players go FLA's way.

[Nuxfanabroad]

Simplistic, but may be worth adding...

Reinhart has big-time cachet in our market; whereas Flor fans probably haven't even heard of his Dad. Then D-men are traditionally risky to pick high, & Ekblad's development probably seems like forever, for them.

With JB & TL having played with his Ol'man, Paul, there seem to be a lot of reasons this COULD come together.