Daniel needs a Center who can cycle: That's Vey

[*Buzzsaw*]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Is Vey quick enough to keep good defensive position as a centre against top guys?  McCann is a way quicker skater, so he can get to the d side of his responsibility against the top players.  I really don't think Vey skates well enough for that.  When we have the puck he would be fine, it's when we don't there is a problem. IMHAO

Yeah, Vey is a little slower, but he has shown himself to be more defensively responsible this year... (I'm not going to point at the 'own goal' as a definition for his whole season... that goal was as much Edler's fault as Vey)

But while Vey may sacrifice a little in speed getting back, he is better on the boards than McCann, and a better cycler of the puck down low... which is Daniel's strong game.  And I think it is more important to give Daniel the opportunities in the offensive zone than to worry about defensive coverage.  After all, Henrik and Daniel are not exactly the fastest scaters either, but that doesn't mean you break up the Sedins because you worry one of them is not going to get back in time.  That's why you have Hansen on the line, he is the guy who can cover for them with his speed in getting back.  Vey has more speed than Henrik.

But the whole discussion is somewhat academic now, since it is likely Sutter will be back for next game, and I am fairly certain he will center Daniel and Hansen.

[JamesB]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Is Vey quick enough to keep good defensive position as a centre against top guys?  McCann is a way quicker skater, so he can get to the d side of his responsibility against the top players.  I really don't think Vey skates well enough for that.  When we have the puck he would be fine, it's when we don't there is a problem. IMHAO

Good question. I don't know the answer. When he was acquired most of us expected him to be really good skater -- maybe like Baertschi or Hansen. But, while he is a good skater, that is about the most you can say. He is a step down (literally) from Hansen, Baertschi, Virtanen, McCann, and Etem. And Bo has certainly passed him in skating ability as well, and Sutter is also a better skater. But hey, isn't it great to have 6 or 7 excellent skaters among the forwards. If Vey is your 8th or 9th best skater then you've got a pretty fast team.

I agree that his ability to play good positional D against top players is important. I do not have a good enough eye to real see how that is working out on the ice, especially on TV. But his overall game looks a lot better. 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

Yeah, Vey is a little slower, but he has shown himself to be more defensively responsible this year... (I'm not going to point at the 'own goal' as a definition for his whole season... that goal was as much Edler's fault as Vey)

But while Vey may sacrifice a little in speed getting back, he is better on the boards than McCann, and a better cycler of the puck down low... which is Daniel's strong game.  And I think it is more important to give Daniel the opportunities in the offensive zone than to worry about defensive coverage.  After all, Henrik and Daniel are not exactly the fastest scaters either, but that doesn't mean you break up the Sedins because you worry one of them is not going to get back in time.  That's why you have Hansen on the line, he is the guy who can cover for them with his speed in getting back.  Vey has more speed than Henrik.

But the whole discussion is somewhat academic now, since it is likely Sutter will be back for next game, and I am fairly certain he will center Daniel and Hansen.

It's because of his poor skating that He needs to get a lot stronger, before we match him up against the top guys.  IMHAO, Vey is just one of those guys who's not physically a fast skater, and he's not tough either.  I don't mean drop em and go tough.  I mean Henrik tough - able to take a beating and still hang on to the puck, and stay upright on D.  I guess I see him as a fringe NHL player, career AHL guy.  

[canuckleheads fan]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

It's because of his poor skating that He needs to get a lot stronger, before we match him up against the top guys.  IMHAO, Vey is just one of those guys who's not physically a fast skater, and he's not tough either.  I don't mean drop em and go tough.  I mean Henrik tough - able to take a beating and still hang on to the puck, and stay upright on D.  I guess I see him as a fringe NHL player, career AHL guy.  

There have been lots of guys in the league over the years who weren't big and weren't that fast, but because they had high hockey IQ they were successful players, Tony Tanti, Brendan Morrison, Hank and Dank all come to mind. Not saying he's in that stratosphere, but there are lots of such examples. The key is how fast he sees and thinks the game. He is probably the best passer on the team not named Sedin and recognizes and stays in the flow of the play really well.

[Alflives]

6 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

There have been lots of guys in the league over the years who weren't big and weren't that fast, but because they had high hockey IQ they were successful players, Tony Tanti, Brendan Morrison, Hank and Dank all come to mind. Not saying he's in that stratosphere, but there are lots of such examples. The key is how fast he sees and thinks the game. He is probably the best passer on the team not named Sedin and recognizes and stays in the flow of the play really well.

those are some pretty big names to compare Vey with.  Tanti and Daniel are wingers, so let's cross them off.  Morrison was actually an exceptional skater, so cross him off.  Henrik is crazy tough, and physically a lot stronger than Vey.  its not the offensive zone while we have the puck where Vey is a concern.  It's all over the ice on loose pucks and when the other team has it where the problem lies.  Yes he's a smart player, but that doesn't make up for his being: soft, weak, and slow.  

[canuck2288]

Vey cycle? Are you serious? He would be knocked on his rear faster than he could score an own goal. 

Sutter in, Vey on the farm. Period

[canuckleheads fan]

1 hour ago, canuck2288 said:

Vey cycle? Are you serious? He would be knocked on his rear faster than he could score an own goal. 

Sutter in, Vey on the farm. Period

I feel sad for you that you feel it necessary to demonstrate your utter lack of lnowledge on a public forum. You obviously have not watched any of the past fifteen games, yet feel your opinion somehow important enough as to create an account, log on and yell at the top of your keyboard, "HEY CDC I'M A FREAKING IDIOT!" Both of Burrows recent goals came off the cycle with Vey and Etem. Your mom is calling you for dinner. Go troll somewhere else.

[canuck2288]

8 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

I feel sad for you that you feel it necessary to demonstrate your utter lack of lnowledge on a public forum. You obviously have not watched any of the past fifteen games, yet feel your opinion somehow important enough as to create an account, log on and yell at the top of your keyboard, "HEY CDC I'M A FREAKING IDIOT!" Both of Burrows recent goals came off the cycle with Vey and Etem. Your mom is calling you for dinner. Go troll somewhere else.

If you truly think Vey will ever be a top 3 line NHL player you are sadly mistaken. Small weak players can't cycle. You need muscle...and talent. Willie's pet will be back on the farm or waived soon

Burrows time has also come and gone and he will be gone by the trade deadline 

I have actually played the game unlike you and clearly have a far superior knowledge of the game than your couch perspective 

 

 

 

[canuckleheads fan]

2 hours ago, Alflives said:

those are some pretty big names to compare Vey with.  Tanti and Daniel are wingers, so let's cross them off.  Morrison was actually an exceptional skater, so cross him off.  Henrik is crazy tough, and physically a lot stronger than Vey.  its not the offensive zone while we have the puck where Vey is a concern.  It's all over the ice on loose pucks and when the other team has it where the problem lies.  Yes he's a smart player, but that doesn't make up for his being: soft, weak, and slow.  

I said in my post that I was NOT putting him on the same level, just giving some some examples off the top of my head of some very siccessful NHL players who weren1exactly the fastest skaters. 

You're not watching the games are you? Vey has not looked soft, weak or slow. He, Etem and Burrows have been working a pretty effective cycle. Whatever power skating and strength building program he was on over the summer has obviously worked. He's never going to be a big hitter, but his line has been playing big minutes against Bergeron, Crosby, etc. and has not looked at all out of place. In fact his +/- over that period is better than Bo's. He backchecks, makes great decisions with the puck in his own zone (no bad giveaways) and has been tough on the boards and in the corners. Not weak, not slow, not at all soft.

[Alflives]

14 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

I said in my post that I was NOT putting him on the same level, just giving some some examples off the top of my head of some very siccessful NHL players who weren1exactly the fastest skaters. 

You're not watching the games are you? Vey has not looked soft, weak or slow. He, Etem and Burrows have been working a pretty effective cycle. Whatever power skating and strength building program he was on over the summer has obviously worked. He's never going to be a big hitter, but his line has been playing big minutes against Bergeron, Crosby, etc. and has not looked at all out of place. In fact his +/- over that period is better than Bo's. He backchecks, makes great decisions with the puck in his own zone (no bad giveaways) and has been tough on the boards and in the corners. Not weak, not slow, not at all soft.

I'm glad you like him as a player.  I just see him as any part of a quality team.  He's not talented enough for a top nine role, whe Sutter and Hank come back, and he's certainly not the physical guy for the fourth line.  Where does he fit?

[canuckleheads fan]

3 minutes ago, canuck2288 said:

If you truly think Vey will ever be a top 3 line NHL player you are sadly mistaken. Small weak players can't cycle. You need muscle...and talent. Willie's pet will be back on the farm or waived soon

Burrows time has also come and gone and he will be gone by the trade deadline 

I have actually played the game unlike you and clearly have a far superior knowledge of the game than your couch perspective 

 

 

 

Lol, you played mites, and your career ended when the bars replaced their air hockey games with pool tables. Vey is NOT small, 6' - 189 according to NHL.com and 200 according to hockeydb.

He played smaller last year, but if you would watch a game this year, you would see that Vey has been hard on the boards and in the corners and his line has had an effective cycle game. As I said, Burrows two most recent goals came off the cycle with Vey and Etem.

Get over yourself Mr. Orr. I've been involved in hockey as a player, referee, coach and of course a fan for over 50 years. Yes, cycling requires stability and strength, which is why Vey's line cycling successfully has been a pleasant surprise.

Burrows might be gone at the TDL, but playing on Vey's wing has helped him find his offensive game. I suspect that Vey will be centering the third line through the end of the year. He'll finish with about 20 points, and an opportunity to make the team out of camp again nest year.

As I've said elsewhere Mr. Gretzky, management (JB & TL) has said their goal is the playoffs, and they obviously believe that calling Vey up, playing him and keeping him gives the team the best chance to win. Pretty sure they know a little more about hockey than you do Mr. Bowman.

[canuckleheads fan]

16 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I'm glad you like him as a player.  I just see him as any part of a quality team.  He's not talented enough for a top nine role, whe Sutter and Hank come back, and he's certainly not the physical guy for the fourth line.  Where does he fit?

He's no less physical than McCann who has been one of our regular 4th liners.

When Sutter returns hell play RWing with Hank or on Bo's line. I've read that it can take a long time to regain abdominal strength after a sports hernia surgery, so even if he can skate and play, I'm not sure they want to expose him to the rigors of face offs. If he can take draws, Hank has obviously struggled in the dot for over a month, and I'm sure his recent injury won't help things, so he can take draws for Hank. Bo stays with Baer and Vey stays with Etem, as both sets have shown good chemistry.

[Googlie]

6 hours ago, Fred65 said:

. Plus if you recall his first couple of months in Utica he was a none event, he took the hump. Vey has a way to go to prove his readiness for the NHL IMHO but I hope he manages

HUH???

Did you even bother to look at the stats for his stint in Utica?

He centered Shinkaruk, and was a huge part of Shink's early success (notice how Shink has stalled sine he lost Vey?)

In every league he has played Vey has made his wingers better - a large measure of how successful a center can be.  Medicine Hat with Etem then Shinkaruk, Manchester Monarchs with Toffoli and Carter.  Sure last season was a disappointment, getting bounced around on various lines, sometimes as a center, often as a winger.  Had his best moments on the PP.

But this season he has been "real good" since getting called up.  Elsewhere I laid out his stats on defensive zone face offs (best on our team).  He's not going anywhere as he gives us a legitimate scoring-threat 3rd line center (but I agree, not suited for a 4th line role)

[canuck2288]

8 minutes ago, canuckleheads fan said:

Lol, you played mites, and your career ended when the bars replaced their air hockey games with pool tables. Vey is NOT small, 6' - 189 according to NHL.com and 200 according to hockeydb.

He played smaller last year, but if you would watch a game this year, you would see that Vey has been hard on the boards and in the corners and his line has had an effective cycle game. As I said, Burrows two most recent goals came off the cycle with Vey and Etem.

Get over yourself Mr. Orr. I've been involved in hockey as a player, referee, coach and of course a fan for over 50 years. Yes, cycling requires stability and strength, which is why Vey's line cycling successfully has been a pleasant surprise.

Burrows might be gone at the TDL, but playing on Vey's wing has helped him find his offensive game. I suspect that Vey will be centering the third line through the end of the year. He'll finish with about 20 points, and an opportunity to make the team out of camp again nest year.

As I've said elsewhere Mr. Gretzky, management (JB & TL) has said their goal is the playoffs, and they obviously believe that calling Vey up, playing him and keeping him gives the team the best chance to win. Pretty sure they know a little more about hockey than you do Mr. Bowman.

If you believe NHL posted stats for players you are truly clueless gramps. News flash, Vey is NOWHERE near 6' 

it was a dumb move taking him off the Kings scrap heap and lets see how long his career lasts...if you can hang in the seniors home long enough

He is nowhere near where he needs to be with his defensive game and after Willie is fired there will be nobody favouring him. 

That said, given our injuries and the poor play of Prust etc I have zero issue with him in the lineup right now. He is just not part of the future of the team. 

[canuckleheads fan]

1 hour ago, canuck2288 said:

If you believe NHL posted stats for players you are truly clueless gramps. News flash, Vey is NOWHERE near 6' 

it was a dumb move taking him off the Kings scrap heap and lets see how long his career lasts...if you can hang in the seniors home long enough

He is nowhere near where he needs to be with his defensive game and after Willie is fired there will be nobody favouring him. 

That said, given our injuries and the poor play of Prust etc I have zero issue with him in the lineup right now. He is just not part of the future of the team. 

You don't watch the games do you? Do a Google image search, I see him standing next to 6'1" Vrbata and they're about the same height, and standing next to 6'3" Edler and is about three inches shorter. 

By the way, Junior, Google is a search engine. Your mommy might have put parental controls on your little tablet, so ask her to do the search for you.

[aqua59]

On 1/24/2016 at 3:37 PM, canuckleheads fan said:

 

I think he's more of a Brendan Morrison. And is already doing a pretty fair impersonation.

lol Don't be insulting Morrison.No slag on Vey here. 

Morrison played how many games in a Canuck uniform? Vey has to put in a few more year before he's a Morrison, plus he doesn't even resemble Morrison's play but hey what would I know I'm still in my mothers basement.

[canuck2288]

On January 25, 2016 at 11:33 PM, canuckleheads fan said:

You don't watch the games do you? Do a Google image search, I see him standing next to 6'1" Vrbata and they're about the same height, and standing next to 6'3" Edler and is about three inches shorter. 

By the way, Junior, Google is a search engine. Your mommy might have put parental controls on your little tablet, so ask her to do the search for you.

How has Vey been doing for you lately gramps? Big tall Linden Vey. Maybe at your advanced age you are having difficulty watching the games so let me tell you he continues to blow opportunities time after time and the latest was a great chance Hansen gave him late in the Nashville game.

oh well once his SHORT NHL career is done I am sure we will see him in the NBA according to you

 

[goblix]

4 hours ago, canuck2288 said:

How has Vey been doing for you lately gramps? Big tall Linden Vey. Maybe at your advanced age you are having difficulty watching the games so let me tell you he continues to blow opportunities time after time and the latest was a great chance Hansen gave him late in the Nashville game.

oh well once his SHORT NHL career is done I am sure we will see him in the NBA according to you

 

Lol your out for lunch man, some people get their opinions and never seem to let up despite facts being shoved into light.

Vey may or may not be a NHL player in the future but honestly right now he's playing pretty good hockey so I'm not sure how you can argue that. He missed a shot... Big whoop sh!t happens, I've seen Daniel miss some gimmes too.

May I remind people baertschi had a bad start, sedins flourished later than usual and overall not every player has to be a superstar and if Vey can continue to be a dependable 3rd or 4th line centre of transition to the wing then I'd say that's a successful 2nd round draft pick used.

[Boddy604]

On Monday, January 25, 2016 at 8:41 PM, canuck2288 said:

If you truly think Vey will ever be a top 3 line NHL player you are sadly mistaken. Small weak players can't cycle. You need muscle...and talent. Willie's pet will be back on the farm or waived soon

Burrows time has also come and gone and he will be gone by the trade deadline 

I have actually played the game unlike you and clearly have a far superior knowledge of the game than your couch perspective 

 

 

 

Well I'm a long time hockey player and I come from a long time hockey family. And I can tell you without a doubt that if Vey puts on another 10 pounds, he's a reliable 3C with 2C potential. His only real knock is strength and training can fix that. He's a lot bigger and stronger than last year too. He's not elite, he's not going to lead a team in points, but he does have a very high hockey IQ and can cycle the puck at a very high level for someone who hasn't cracked the NHL full time, yet. If they played him on wing right now instead of centre, it would make all the difference in what you see. He needs to be stronger as a Centre,  it's less important on wing. If the Canucks invest another year in him, he'll be a reliable and versatile player. I won't be surprised when he moves to wing with Horvat and Baertschi after Vrbata is dealt. And he'll tear it up there too. And really, he cost a 2nd round pick, he's definitely worth that.

[mll]

3 hours ago, Boddy604 said:

Well I'm a long time hockey player and I come from a long time hockey family. And I can tell you without a doubt that if Vey puts on another 10 pounds, he's a reliable 3C with 2C potential. His only real knock is strength and training can fix that. He's a lot bigger and stronger than last year too. He's not elite, he's not going to lead a team in points, but he does have a very high hockey IQ and can cycle the puck at a very high level for someone who hasn't cracked the NHL full time, yet. If they played him on wing right now instead of centre, it would make all the difference in what you see. He needs to be stronger as a Centre,  it's less important on wing. If the Canucks invest another year in him, he'll be a reliable and versatile player. I won't be surprised when he moves to wing with Horvat and Baertschi after Vrbata is dealt. And he'll tear it up there too. And really, he cost a 2nd round pick, he's definitely worth that.

Doesn't really make sense - Baertschi is a play-maker and needs a finisher/goal scorer on his line and that's not Vey.  WillieD said it himself: playmaker in Baertschi, finisher in Vrbata and Horvat that can push the pace.  If Vrbata gets moved I expect Benning to go and find a UFA to play on that line.  

I already said it before but I really doubt Benning is a big fan of Vey - I think that's more a WillieD thing.  Listening to Benning give an update on Utica - he goes down there (with Vey there) and speaks of every notable players but not once does he mention Vey.