Ghostsof1915 Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 On 2/8/2022 at 7:00 AM, Harold Drunken said: Especially with a team needing offense from the blueline and some PP help. Rathbone is a point per game in the AHL and on a tear, seems if we need someone called up he should be the guy. I'd take the gamble on being a smaller team and have way more confidence with Rathbone than Hunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 One thought on Rathbone...... You don't develop a guy like that by trying to turn him into Chris Tanev. Maybe the reason we can't develop anyone on our farm is because we are trying to turn players into something they aren't instead of encouraging and rewarding them for being the players they are and improving upon the skills that got them drafted in the first place. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 8 minutes ago, hammertime said: One thought on Rathbone...... You don't develop a guy like that by trying to turn him into Chris Tanev. Maybe the reason we can't develop anyone on our farm is because we are trying to turn players into something they aren't instead of encouraging and rewarding them for being the players they are and improving upon the skills that got them drafted in the first place. You also don't completely ignore the problem and run the risk of getting a Rielly or a Barrie who can't play like an NHLer in his own end. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 6 minutes ago, King Heffy said: You also don't completely ignore the problem and run the risk of getting a Rielly or a Barrie who can't play like an NHLer in his own end. I'd much rather have Barrie than a career AHLer with an identity crisis. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Umbrus Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 14 minutes ago, hammertime said: One thought on Rathbone...... You don't develop a guy like that by trying to turn him into Chris Tanev. Maybe the reason we can't develop anyone on our farm is because we are trying to turn players into something they aren't instead of encouraging and rewarding them for being the players they are and improving upon the skills that got them drafted in the first place. Thing is with Rathbone tho, unlike Hughes he isn’t elusive in his own dzone as Hughes is. That’s what is amazing about Huggy. What he does with his time and space in any defensive situation..Rathbone has drool worthy offensive talent, which is quite evident. But when he is pressured in his own d zone he does give into that pressure. He gets caught in his own zone and does have troubles getting it out and dealing with larger bodies. He’s getting much better, and I think is close…but he just needs a bit more work down on the farm and I think he will make an Impact next year. We have to remember we have seen this in dmen on our farm team in the past. Last year it was Rafferty, a few seasons before that it was Jordan Subban…they never learned to defend at and NHL level. Great AHL dmen but that is it. Rathbone is very coachable and I do think has the smarts to learn that side of things. Slow cooking him the farm this season won’t hurt him. imo But if he does get a call from the big club this season it will be well earned. You can tell he’s working hard down there. Very dedicated young man (big diff between Subban or Rafferty). One thing going for him…is his monster shot. Hughes could learn a thing or two there…and I have visions of him and Rathbone feeding it back n fourth on the blue line during a power play, they could be deadly. Elite shot mixed with elite passing….if Rathbone gets a call up this season (which is entirely possible) I hope we will accept some of his defensive miscues, as his offensive gifts out weight his defensive issues even now. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 10 minutes ago, hammertime said: I'd much rather have Barrie than a career AHLer with an identity crisis. Barrie is an AHL quality defenceman. I'd rather have a defenceman who can play defence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 2 minutes ago, King Heffy said: Barrie is an AHL quality defenceman. I'd rather have a defenceman who can play defence. Barries multipul 50+ point seasons would beg to differ. Square peg problem. This is why we have zero NHLers coming from our farm system. Not everyone is going to be a complete player but you can put them in a position to use their strengths. It's easier to put a guy like Shenn beside him than it is to find a 50 point defenseman. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted February 11, 2022 Share Posted February 11, 2022 1 minute ago, hammertime said: Barries multipul 50+ point seasons would beg to differ. Square peg problem. This is why we have zero NHLers coming from our farm system. Not everyone is going to be a complete player but you can put them in a position to use their strengths. It's easier to put a guy like Shenn beside him than it is to find a 50 point defenseman. I don't care how many points you put up, if you're that much of a defensive liability you are not an NHL quality defenceman. There is a minimum standard for what's acceptable and guys like to Barrie never reached it specifically because no one forced them to learn how to play defence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 14 minutes ago, King Heffy said: I don't care how many points you put up, if you're that much of a defensive liability you are not an NHL quality defenceman. There is a minimum standard for what's acceptable and guys like to Barrie never reached it specifically because no one forced them to learn how to play defence. JR's Penguins won multipul cups with no defense. Rathbone is a guy who can keep a teams feet in the fire. But let's turn him into a guy who instead of being elite at offence is good at nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 42 minutes ago, hammertime said: JR's Penguins won multipul cups with no defense. Rathbone is a guy who can keep a teams feet in the fire. But let's turn him into a guy who instead of being elite at offence is good at nothing. JR wants players who can and do play fast. Comes from their feet, or passing, or brains. Bone does all these at hyper speed. He’s perfect for us. Fast ... fast ... fast 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, Alflives said: JR wants players who can and do play fast. Comes from their feet, or passing, or brains. Bone does all these at hyper speed. He’s perfect for us. Fast ... fast ... fast pretty much this. Boudreau wants a puck mover JR wants to add speed yet they let Bone waste in the A because defense. If that aint some Travis green logic. What happened to safe is death or was that just blowing smoke up our collective a$$es. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, hammertime said: pretty much this. Boudreau wants a puck mover JR wants to add speed yet they let Bone waste in the A because defense. If that aint some Travis green logic. What happened to safe is death or was that just blowing smoke up our collective a$$es. Hughes OEL Bone That’s a high end, puck moving left side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Alflives said: Hughes OEL Bone That’s a high end, puck moving left side. Wouldn't want that. Nope nope nope. Need more Hunt! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 1 hour ago, hammertime said: Barries multipul 50+ point seasons would beg to differ. Square peg problem. This is why we have zero NHLers coming from our farm system. Not everyone is going to be a complete player but you can put them in a position to use their strengths. It's easier to put a guy like Shenn beside him than it is to find a 50 point defenseman. "Complete player" is a bit of a stretch. I don't think anyone expects him to be a defensive stalwart. But he does need to be able to play passable defense at the NHL level if he's going to make it. He's got the offensive ability to play here now. Defensively however.... He was a bit of a disaster defensively when he was up here last. He clearly needs to work on it. It's not bad coaching/development to have him doing just that. As for putting him in position to use his strengths, I agree. How do you propose they do that with Hughes and OEL ahead of him? Are you going to put Rathbone on the PP ahead of those guys...? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: "Complete player" is a bit of a stretch. I don't think anyone expects him to be a defensive stalwart. But he does need to be able to play passable defense at the NHL level if he's going to make it. He's got the offensive ability to play here now. Defensively however.... He was a bit of a disaster defensively when he was up here last. He clearly needs to work on it. It's not bad coaching/development to have him doing just that. As for putting him in position to use his strengths, I agree. How do you propose they do that with Hughes and OEL ahead of him? Are you going to put Rathbone on the PP ahead of those guys...? How about call the guy up while Hughes is out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, hammertime said: How about call the guy up while Hughes is out. Remember how many people wanted to trade Hughes last year because he "couldn't play D"? He was Chris Tanev last year compared to Rathbone now. (And would you look at that! Hughes "square pegged" in to a better defensive player this year!). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 (edited) 35 minutes ago, aGENT said: Remember how many people wanted to trade Hughes last year because he "couldn't play D"? He was Chris Tanev last year compared to Rathbone now. (And would you look at that! Hughes "square pegged" in to a better defensive player this year!). I certainly wasn't one of them. Hmm it's almost like allowing him to evolve as a player instead of forcing him to learn defense in the minors allowed him to grow as a player and gain confidence and learn the areas he needed to improve to be effective without shutting down the player he was. I'm not saying he doesn't need to learn to be better defensively. of course he does. But that can happen organically if you don't break the player he is and encourage him to grow. Edited February 12, 2022 by hammertime 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 16 minutes ago, hammertime said: I certainly wasn't one of them. Hmm it's almost like allowing him to evolve as a player instead of forcing him to learn defense in the minors allowed him to grow as a player and gain confidence and learn the areas he needed to improve to be effective without shutting down the player he was. The thing is, players like Hughes and Rathbone want to develop into the best players they possibly can and that means, although being offensively gifted, they have to learn to be proficient in the defensive zone as well. Players like Barrie never learn the defensive game (it's easier to lean on the skill you already have) and end up making less money, top teams avoid signing them and those that do sign them, make it short term. Contenders usually avoid players that can't play the defensive game. Rathbone doesn't have the skill that Quinn has, so the best place for him to learn the defensive game is in the AHL, where the action is a bit slower and he's not under the microscope of a very critical fan base and media. I'm sure the Canucks will have a look at him and see if he's ready for the NHL before the end of the season. No need to rush him. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 29 minutes ago, hammertime said: I certainly wasn't one of them. Hmm it's almost like allowing him to evolve as a player instead of forcing him to learn defense in the minors allowed him to grow as a player and gain confidence and learn the areas he needed to improve to be effective without shutting down the player he was. I'm not saying he doesn't need to learn to be better defensively. of course he does. But that can happen organically if you don't break the player he is and encourage him to grow. Bruh. Love me some 'Bone but he's not at Hughes level. He belongs in the A getting reps and improving his D game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 Just now, aGENT said: Bruh. Love me some 'Bone but he's not at Hughes level. He belongs in the A getting reps and improving his D game. I'm fine with that. Would have liked to see him get rewarded for putting in work with a callup instead of watching Hunt drag his sorry a$$ around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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