Goodbye Hong Kong. Nice knowing you....

[sam13371337]

2 hours ago, CBH1926 said:

"The enemy has begun to employ a new and most cruel bomb, the power of which to do damage is, indeed, incalculable, taking the toll of many innocent lives. Should we continue to fight, not only would it result in an ultimate collapse and obliteration of the Japanese nation, but also it would lead to the total extinction of human civilization." 

 

I will take the emperor Hirohito's word over your opinion.

 

Also battle of Okinawa took place in 1945 and claimed atleast 250 thousand lives. Anyone who thinks that mainland invasion was not going to kill millions is out to lunch.

 

Japanase were going to fight to death once invasion took place and they had plenty of weaponry to do so.

 

As far as naval blockade goes in summer of 1945 kamikaze were still able to sink US battle ships. 

 

Soviets entered the war after first atomic bomb was dropped in an attempt to seize the moment. 

 

it wasn't a pure coincidence that the guy got to keep his crown (unlike every other defeated government in ww2 that got decapitated)  

 

Japan was completetly defeated and was facing a soviet invasion from the north.  The guy knew his country faced complete anahilation and occupation by a soviet/American army. and a brutal death and end to to monarchy.   

 

he also had fanatical military officers who didn't even have the word "surrender" in their vocabulary and were ready to coup the emperor out of power and fight to death regardless.  

 

he made a deal that basically gave japan up in its entirety to the US. this kept him in power, put down the generals who woudlve killed him, and saved his country from soviet invasion.  this nuclear bomb was a simple face saving excuse. Tokyo firebombings by conventional aircraft killed more in a single night then the atom bombs put together. 

[sam13371337]

1 hour ago, canuckistani said:

The fact that they are recognized by the UN , especially South Sudan, says otherwise. Sudan did not recognize the secession of South Sudan before the UN did.

 

its also rich for Pro-PRC lobbyists to cite UN rules when it suits them. Tell us what the UN charter on human rights state, something China is signatory to and its stance towards it. 

 

World is now noticing Chinese duplicity towards its citizens and its neighbourhood and sooner or later, China will have to answer.

 

There isn’t anything propagandist about democracy to Hong Kong. It was promised by China, including its autonomous status during the handover. If China impinges on its promise, HK has legal right to terminate said agreement. 

What world power ?? I am a fan of Putin myself but to say that he’s turned Russia into a world power is cuckoo. Russian military is at its weakest, so is its economy, in 50 years. 

And Putin is a dictator due to voting fraud. Nobody wins elections by 90% margins, ever, without fraud. 

Or get their independence.  China has been brought to its knees in the past before, it can be done again and most of Asia will rejoice in that way more than the west. You act like propaganda is coming only from our side, when reality is PRC is the King Kong of propaganda.  

you obviously seem to have some sort of anti-china vendetta.  

 

I personally have no dog in this fight  

 

but I call out bull$&!# when I see bull$&!#. and this is 100% bull$&!#.  Hong kong is soverign Chinese territory.  china has actually give hong kong enormous autonomy not enjoyed by any other region. eventually though the plan was always going to be full re-integeration with the mainland.  China pronlonged this to make it a soft transition.

 

the british have as much legal authority over hong kong as Botswana (exactly 0). they have no right to meddle. period.  There is nothing legal in any capacity to support this. 

 

those 2 states you cited were extremely weak states that tried but simply couldn't hold on to them by force. they both accepted the loss. Kosovo is a far more relevant example and precedent setter. where a foreign entity went in. split a state up into many pieces and carved out an artificial state of "kososvo" out of soverign Serbian lands. 

 

Serbia has never recognized this, despite their current government being HEAVILY dependent on the same countries that took it from them.  (it simply politicial suicide for any politician to even think about it)   Russia cited this as the reason their Crimean annexation is legal. Kosovo is far more relevant then sudan or east timor.   and If you think in practical terms china is on the same level as sudan and east timor…. then you are delusional. LOL 

 

a weak failed state not being able to hold on to sessionist territory despite trying.  Has 0 relevance to the hong kong situation. they accepted their defeat and recognized it.  superpower china is not going to let tiny hong kong and  a bunch of stupid stundents strip away internationally recognized Chinese territory. despite whatever wishful thinking fantasy you may have. 

 

these dead enders are nothing but stooges of foreign intel agencies and propaganda media.  playing a very old and tired game.  

 

 

[sam13371337]

 

 

burn your way to democracy and  freedom! 

 

I wonder how the media would treat heros who torch government buildings if it was happening in their own house?  Would you be able to lead a mob and break into the white house  or congress to protest?   wouldn't you get shot and be labelled a terrorist? 

[Lancaster]

17 minutes ago, sam13371337 said:

 

 

burn your way to democracy and  freedom! 

 

I wonder how the media would treat heros who torch government buildings if it was happening in their own house?  Would you be able to lead a mob and break into the white house  or congress to protest?   wouldn't you get shot and be labelled a terrorist? 

The last time I checked, the US has one form of democracy.  

 

The same can't be said about HK and especially China.  Their version is as saying you can choose any colour as long as it's black (or in this case, Red).  

[canuckistani]

28 minutes ago, sam13371337 said:

you obviously seem to have some sort of anti-china vendetta.  

 

I personally have no dog in this fight  

Neither do I. If you think I obviously have anti China vendetta, then I can easily say you have pro China apologism. It’s clear from you terming British annexation of Hong Kong as unfair but silence on Chinese annexation of Tibet and Dzungaria.

Quote

 

but I call out bull$&!# when I see bull$&!#. and this is 100% bull$&!#.  Hong kong is soverign Chinese territory.  china has actually give hong kong enormous autonomy not enjoyed by any other region. eventually though the plan was always going to be full re-integeration with the mainland.  China pronlonged this to make it a soft transition.

And I call BS on that. The terms of Power transfer to PRC was permanent ‘one nation two systems’ policy, where Hong Kong would never be subject to PRCs socialist system and Hong Kong’s economic system would remain unaltered till 2047. Its part of the Hong Kong declaration that PRC agreed to and PRC’s sovereignty claims on Hong Kong hinges on it.

Quote

 

the british have as much legal authority over hong kong as Botswana (exactly 0). they have no right to meddle. period.  There is nothing legal in any capacity to support this. 

I am not saying they have legal right to meddle right now. I am saying British conquest of Hong Kong was equally valid as Chinese conquest of Tibet and Dzungaria.

Quote

 

those 2 states you cited were extremely weak states that tried but simply couldn't hold on to them by force. they both accepted the loss. Kosovo is a far more relevant example and precedent setter. where a foreign entity went in. split a state up into many pieces and carved out an artificial state of "kososvo" out of soverign Serbian lands. 

 

Serbia has never recognized this, despite their current government being HEAVILY dependent on the same countries that took it from them.  (it simply politicial suicide for any politician to even think about it)   Russia cited this as the reason their Crimean annexation is legal. Kosovo is far more relevant then sudan or east timor.   and If you think in practical terms china is on the same level as sudan and east timor…. then you are delusional. LOL 

 

a weak failed state not being able to hold on to sessionist territory despite trying.  Has 0 relevance to the hong kong situation. they accepted their defeat and recognized it.  superpower china is not going to let tiny hong kong and  a bunch of stupid stundents strip away internationally recognized Chinese territory. despite whatever wishful thinking fantasy you may have. 

 

these dead enders are nothing but stooges of foreign intel agencies and propaganda media.  playing a very old and tired game.  

 

 

These ‘dead enders’ as you call them are holding PRC ACCOUNTABLE for their end of the secession agreement, which PRC is violating. LOL at superpower. China may become a super power, but right now the world only has one superpower and its USA. CHINA is a dominant regional power that can’t even conquer an island 100 Km’s from its coast despite threatening to do so. USA will not let China rise to superpower-dom. Already they are leveraging India against PRC and it will accelerate, as USA has granted ROI special status for arms and tech transfer. USA isn’t going to stop China’s rise, they are going to simply arm India to the teeth to keep Asia multipolar and China on the Back foot in the Indian Ocean, curtailing it to a regional power status. And for that, PRC has nobody but itself to blame, thanks to it eating up ROI territory and antagonizing the only nation that can match it this century.

Edited July 3, 2019 by canuckistani

[sam13371337]

1 hour ago, Lancaster said:

The last time I checked, the US has one form of democracy.  

 

The same can't be said about HK and especially China.  Their version is as saying you can choose any colour as long as it's black (or in this case, Red).  

"democracy" in geopolitics is  basically "US approved government" 

 

when you begin to understand this reality, is when everything in the world starts to make sense.. 

 

virtually no country has "democracy" all countries have various ways of giving some power  or the illusion of power to people,   Just because your allowed to go put a vote in a ballot box doesn't really mean you have any control over your government.   Its just an illusion.   the best description ive seen of modern pre-trump western politics is a WWE fight. 

 

where they are literally acting like they are enemies, while they both are serving the exact same interests. its virtually the exact same dominant interest groups that buy off the "mainstream left/right" politicians and dominate government decision making.  they each have such gaping flaws and holes in them you can drive a semi-truck sized interest group into them. 

 

Some lobbyist are so strong. like the pharmecautical companies in the US.  that they have bought off politicians and media (fox news) to actually brainswash simple minded americans into believing that a for profit based insurance industry, whos sole purpose is to deny you care to maximize its own profit. and keep 10s of millions of "undesirables" out of insurance coverage.   They have literally brainswashed  a section of the population into beliving this is good for them. 

 

this is 1 example of  a single parasitic interest group actively undermining peoples interests with open corruption.    

 

the only country on earth that comes close to being an actual "democracy" is Switzerland.  one of the few or only countries on earth that the people have actual power over their government decisions. 

[Lancaster]

24 minutes ago, sam13371337 said:

"democracy" in geopolitics is  basically "US approved government" 

 

when you begin to understand this reality, is when everything in the world starts to make sense.. 

 

virtually no country has "democracy" all countries have various ways of giving some power  or the illusion of power to people,   Just because your allowed to go put a vote in a ballot box doesn't really mean you have any control over your government.   Its just an illusion.   the best description ive seen of modern pre-trump western politics is a WWE fight. 

 

where they are literally acting like they are enemies, while they both are serving the exact same interests. its virtually the exact same dominant interest groups that buy off the "mainstream left/right" politicians and dominate government decision making.  they each have such gaping flaws and holes in them you can drive a semi-truck sized interest group into them. 

 

Some lobbyist are so strong. like the pharmecautical companies in the US.  that they have bought off politicians and media (fox news) to actually brainswash simple minded americans into believing that a for profit based insurance industry, whos sole purpose is to deny you care to maximize its own profit. and keep 10s of millions of "undesirables" out of insurance coverage.   They have literally brainswashed  a section of the population into beliving this is good for them. 

 

this is 1 example of  a single parasitic interest group actively undermining peoples interests with open corruption.    

 

the only country on earth that comes close to being an actual "democracy" is Switzerland.  one of the few or only countries on earth that the people have actual power over their government decisions. 

Still better than China.

[canuckistani]

6 hours ago, sam13371337 said:

"democracy" in geopolitics is  basically "US approved government" 

 

when you begin to understand this reality, is when everything in the world starts to make sense.. 

 

virtually no country has "democracy" all countries have various ways of giving some power  or the illusion of power to people,   Just because your allowed to go put a vote in a ballot box doesn't really mean you have any control over your government.   Its just an illusion.   the best description ive seen of modern pre-trump western politics is a WWE fight. 

Nonsense. In many countries the fear of losing mandate has lead governments to bow to populist mandates. That most of the western democracies are lassoes-fairez does not change this.

6 hours ago, sam13371337 said:

 

where they are literally acting like they are enemies, while they both are serving the exact same interests. its virtually the exact same dominant interest groups that buy off the "mainstream left/right" politicians and dominate government decision making.  they each have such gaping flaws and holes in them you can drive a semi-truck sized interest group into them. 

Again, North America centric right vs left is hardly the measure of worldwide democracies. Nothing more than west centric myopia.

6 hours ago, sam13371337 said:

 

Some lobbyist are so strong. like the pharmecautical companies in the US.  that they have bought off politicians and media (fox news) to actually brainswash simple minded americans into believing that a for profit based insurance industry, whos sole purpose is to deny you care to maximize its own profit. and keep 10s of millions of "undesirables" out of insurance coverage.   They have literally brainswashed  a section of the population into beliving this is good for them. 

 

this is 1 example of  a single parasitic interest group actively undermining peoples interests with open corruption.    

 

the only country on earth that comes close to being an actual "democracy" is Switzerland.  one of the few or only countries on earth that the people have actual power over their government decisions. 

And India. And Thailand. And Brazil. And Germany. And Denmark. Your views are just opinions, not shared by many. Reductionist argument as these are steeped in ignorance of actual democratic history of the world.

[jimmyking8888]

 Hongkong has no future.   Those people should immigrate to England or Canada. 

[nuckin_futz]

Hong Kong extradition bill 'is dead' says Carrie Lam

Hong Kong leader Carrie Lam has said the controversial bill that would have allowed extradition to the Chinese mainland "is dead".

In a press conference on Tuesday, Ms Lam said the government's work on the bill had been a "total failure".

 

But she stopped short of saying it had been withdrawn completely, as protesters have been demanding.

 

The bill sparked weeks of unrest in the city and the government had already suspended it indefinitely.

 

"But there are still lingering doubts about the government's sincerity or worries whether the government will restart the process in the Legislative Council," Ms Lam told reporters.

 

"So, I reiterate here, there is no such plan. The bill is dead."

 

She had previously said the bill "will die" in 2020 when the current legislative term ends.

 

Critics of the legislation argue it would undermine the territory's judicial independence and could be used to target critics of the Chinese government in Beijing.

 

Hong Kong, a former British colony, is part of China but run under a "one country, two systems" arrangement that guarantees it a level of autonomy.

 

It has its own judiciary and a separate legal system from mainland China.

 

Demonstrations continued even after the government had suspended the proposed bill in mid-June, with several protests turning violent.

On 1 July protesters forced their way into the central chamber of Hong Kong's parliament after an hours-long siege.

 

Many of the demonstrators are also calling for Ms Lam to step down, and for police not to prosecute those arrested during the protests.

Thousands took to the streets on 7 July in an area popular with mainland Chinese tourists, in a bid to explain their concerns over the bill.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-48917796

 

 

[Dazzle]

On 7/5/2019 at 4:38 PM, jimmyking8888 said:

 Hongkong has no future.   Those people should immigrate to England or Canada. 

[Lancaster]

The people of HK should keep pushing while the iron is hot.  While I do doubt China will give them full democracy.... this would be a good opportunity to have a more population based electoral system.  

[Chicken.]

On 7/8/2019 at 11:21 PM, Lancaster said:

The people of HK should keep pushing while the iron is hot.  While I do doubt China will give them full democracy.... this would be a good opportunity to have a more population based electoral system.  

The seniors of HK have listened ! 

 

Cool story;

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/5503439/hong-kong-elders-march-protesters-extradition-bill/ 

 

Nearly 2,000 Hong Kong seniors march in support of young protesters

[jimmyking8888]

7 hours ago, Chicken. said:

The seniors of HK have listened ! 

 

Cool story;

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/5503439/hong-kong-elders-march-protesters-extradition-bill/ 

 

Nearly 2,000 Hong Kong seniors march in support of young protesters

LOL

[Ronaldoescobar]

Is Hong Kong still around?

[Scottish⑦Canuck]

On 7/3/2019 at 1:28 AM, sam13371337 said:

you obviously seem to have some sort of anti-china vendetta.  

 

I personally have no dog in this fight  

 

but I call out bull$&!# when I see bull$&!#. and this is 100% bull$&!#.  Hong kong is soverign Chinese territory.  china has actually give hong kong enormous autonomy not enjoyed by any other region. eventually though the plan was always going to be full re-integeration with the mainland.  China pronlonged this to make it a soft transition.

 

the british have as much legal authority over hong kong as Botswana (exactly 0). they have no right to meddle. period.  There is nothing legal in any capacity to support this. 

 

those 2 states you cited were extremely weak states that tried but simply couldn't hold on to them by force. they both accepted the loss. Kosovo is a far more relevant example and precedent setter. where a foreign entity went in. split a state up into many pieces and carved out an artificial state of "kososvo" out of soverign Serbian lands. 

 

Serbia has never recognized this, despite their current government being HEAVILY dependent on the same countries that took it from them.  (it simply politicial suicide for any politician to even think about it)   Russia cited this as the reason their Crimean annexation is legal. Kosovo is far more relevant then sudan or east timor.   and If you think in practical terms china is on the same level as sudan and east timor…. then you are delusional. LOL 

 

a weak failed state not being able to hold on to sessionist territory despite trying.  Has 0 relevance to the hong kong situation. they accepted their defeat and recognized it.  superpower china is not going to let tiny hong kong and  a bunch of stupid stundents strip away internationally recognized Chinese territory. despite whatever wishful thinking fantasy you may have. 

 

these dead enders are nothing but stooges of foreign intel agencies and propaganda media.  playing a very old and tired game.  

 

 

You are such a dinosaur. 

[Kakanucks]

This is ridiculous...

 

[Lancaster]

3 hours ago, Kakanucks said:

This is ridiculous...

 

Again or was it the one from a couple of days back?

 

Part of me wished me and my buddies were there.... we would have curb stomped a whole lot of those white-shirts.  

[Kakanucks]

19 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Again or was it the one from a couple of days back?

 

Part of me wished me and my buddies were there.... we would have curb stomped a whole lot of those white-shirts.  

This was the incident that happened a couple of days ago, but there's been talks about targeting other areas the next few days.

[jimmyking8888]

On 7/24/2019 at 7:03 PM, Lancaster said:

Again or was it the one from a couple of days back?

 

Part of me wished me and my buddies were there.... we would have curb stomped a whole lot of those white-shirts.  

 Don't goto HongKong now. Such a $&!#hole.