morrissex95 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Baer. said: It's like saying Canadians and Americans aren't very different. He's not lying. Doesn't mean it isn't their land. Judaism is not the only religion native to that area. Israel is an unrecognized nation and it's people are banned from over 100 countries. Damn, this thread is gonna get locked in 3...2...1... Islam comes from the Arabian peninsula and it's not exactly clear where Christianity is from. It's not our fault that lots of countries don't recognize Israel. I don't know how to explain why we don't have global recognition but the reality is that we have the right to exist as a nation and if you don't agree with that I'm not getting into a debate with you. Edited July 28, 2019 by morrissex95 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baer. Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, Alflives said: Judaism is the first of the Abrahamic faiths. It predates Christianity by 1000 years. Interesting. There's more than that too, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baer. Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, morrissex95 said: Islam comes from the Arabian peninsula and it's not exactly clear where Christianity is from. It's not our fault that lots of countries don't recognize Israel. I don't know how to explain why we don't have global recognition but the reality is that we have the right to exist as a nation and if you don't agree with that I'm not getting into a debate with you. Agree to disagree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boeserker Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, morrissex95 said: Islam comes from the Arabian peninsula and it's not exactly clear where Christianity is from. It's not our fault that lots of countries don't recognize Israel. I don't know how to explain why we don't have global recognition but the reality is that we have the right to exist as a nation and if you don't agree with that I'm not getting into a debate with you. Can you expand a bit and drop some knowledge? I am pretty ignorant when it comes to the plight of Jewish people. Banned in 100 countries? That sounds crazy. I get the basic premise of what happened after WWII but why have they suffered so much hatred all along? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, morrissex95 said: Islam comes from the Arabian peninsula and it's not exactly clear where Christianity is from. It's very clear where Christianity is from. It's an off-shoot of Judaism. Basically the founding Christians are Jews who believed that the promised messiah had come and they splintered off and created Christianity, and then 200-300 years later after orders from a Roman Emperor, a New Testament. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBH1926 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 18 minutes ago, Baer. said: It's like saying Canadians and Americans aren't very different. He's not lying. Doesn't mean it isn't their land. Judaism is not the only religion native to that area. Israel is an unrecognized nation and it's people are banned from over 100 countries. Damn, this thread is gonna get locked in 3...2...1... Unrecognized by whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 6 minutes ago, CBH1926 said: Unrecognized by whom? I'd have to Google his claim about being banned in over 100 countries, but he's not wrong about Israel having countries that refuse to recognize it as a nation. Not surprisingly though that roughly half are from the Arab League. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Israel#Present_situation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Scottish⑦Canuck Posted July 28, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted July 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, morrissex95 said: Islam comes from the Arabian peninsula and it's not exactly clear where Christianity is from. It's not our fault that lots of countries don't recognize Israel. I don't know how to explain why we don't have global recognition but the reality is that we have the right to exist as a nation and if you don't agree with that I'm not getting into a debate with you. Israel has the right to exist as a nation. It does not have the right to treat the Palestinian people the way that they have been treated. It doesn't have the right to seize land that doesn't belong to it. It doesn't have the right to treat Arabs, in many cases, as second-class citizens. I sympathise with the Jewish people that are being targeted in Europe and elsewhere. That goes without saying. The normalisation of antisemitism and the far right is indeed concerning. Hell, the idea of anyone being discrimated against or attacked because of their race or religion is ridiculous. But Netanyahu is no better than the subjects of this article and has himself stoked anti-Arab and anti-Palestinian prejudices. Taking football as an example, as an Arab, to go and watch Beitar Jerusalem, a team he openly supports, is impossible. They signed two Chechen Muslim players not long ago and they were subject to such extreme racist and sectarian abuse from fans that they didn't even last 3 months at the club. I do recognise that Netanyahu's views don't represent all Israelis and Israel itself certainly doesn't speak for all of Judaism, but the country does have a serious problem that many in the international community are reluctant to call out in the fear of being labeled antisemitic. 2 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsAllOursBoys Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 15 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said: It's very clear where Christianity is from. It's an off-shoot of Judaism. Basically the founding Christians are Jews who believed that the promised messiah had come and they splintered off and created Christianity, and then 200-300 years later after orders from a Roman Emperor, a New Testament. Actually, without getting into a huge debate here, the Roman Emperor had nothing to do with the formation of the Christian New Testament. By 135-145AD, 26 of the 29 New Testament books were accepted as part of the Christian canon. There are so many New Testament references in the writings of the early church fathers of the early 2nd century that by 145AD you could reconstruct all 29 books of the New Testament. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBH1926 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 11 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said: I'd have to Google his claim about being banned in over 100 countries, but he's not wrong about Israel having countries that refuse to recognize it as a nation. Not surprisingly though that roughly half are from the Arab League. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Israel#Present_situation Great countries like Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan, North Korea, Venezuela, Bangladesh etc. Can not wait to take my next vacation there. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal.view Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 1 hour ago, morrissex95 said: As a Jew this make me really sad. Made it's time we all moved to Israel no stay where you are there are enough of us that will stand up for you some of us know history and will do whatever it takes to ensure there is not a repeat 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) 26 minutes ago, ItsAllOursBoys said: Actually, without getting into a huge debate here, the Roman Emperor had nothing to do with the formation of the Christian New Testament. By 135-145AD, 26 of the 29 New Testament books were accepted as part of the Christian canon. There are so many New Testament references in the writings of the early church fathers of the early 2nd century that by 145AD you could reconstruct all 29 books of the New Testament. I apologize. I should have been more clear. The books were written of course but it was during the First Council of Nicaea a few hundred years later where the accepted canon was separated from the apocrypha and where the bishops decided/confirmed that Christianity was in fact monotheistic rather than polytheistic (holy trinity). You caught me being lazy. Edited July 28, 2019 by SabreFan1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 7 minutes ago, CBH1926 said: Great countries like Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan, North Korea, Venezuela, Bangladesh etc. Can not wait to take my next vacation there. To be honest though, I'd bet my bottom dollar itwould be more if the US hadn't thrown it's support behind Israel. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 27 minutes ago, ItsAllOursBoys said: Actually, without getting into a huge debate here, the Roman Emperor had nothing to do with the formation of the Christian New Testament. By 135-145AD, 26 of the 29 New Testament books were accepted as part of the Christian canon. There are so many New Testament references in the writings of the early church fathers of the early 2nd century that by 145AD you could reconstruct all 29 books of the New Testament. 18 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said: I apologize. I should have been more clear. The books were written of course but it was during the First Council of Nicaea a few hundred years later where the accepted canon was separated from the apocrypha and where the bishops decided/confirmed that Christianity was in fact monotheistic rather than polytheistic (holy trinity). You caught me being lazy. Whoops. I caught myself. It's been well over 30 years since my Sunday school days. I double checked the canon/apocrypha at the council. It was discussed of course but had already been mostly decided by then and wasn't finalized until after the council disbanded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsAllOursBoys Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said: I apologize. I should have been more clear. The books were written of course but it was during the First Council of Nicaea a few hundred years later where the accepted canon was separated from the apocrypha and where the bishops decided/confirmed that Christianity was in fact monotheistic rather than polytheistic (holy trinity). You caught me being lazy. No problem, it's always good to have a friendly discussion. That being the case, your above statement is really only half correct. The New Testament Canon was already firmly established by the time the Council of Nicea came along in 325AD. Since there was no email, internet, social media, post mail, phone calls, fax etc.... it took a while before any official documentation or wide-spread agreement was known. For the most part, the agreement was there, knowledge of agreement, well....that's another story. The Christian Councils never establish/created church doctrine, they declared in official ceremony and documentation what the Christian doctrine always was. At the Council of Nicea, over 300 Bishops met to deal with a small, but powerful sect called the "Aryans" who arose out of the Gnostic sects of the 2nd century. Arius, the leader of the Aryans was attempting to push the Gnostic belief that Jesus was not divine, but only a man. The Nicean Council just officially confirmed what the church always believed about the divinity of Jesus and thus, "officially" condemned Arius and his followers as heretics. The Council didn't create the doctrine of the divinity of Jesus, they just officially upheld it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, ItsAllOursBoys said: No problem, it's always good to have a friendly discussion. That being the case, your above statement is really only half correct. The New Testament Canon was already firmly established by the time the Council of Nicea came along in 325AD. Since there was no email, internet, social media, post mail, phone calls, fax etc.... it took a while before any official documentation or wide-spread agreement was known. For the most part, the agreement was there, knowledge of agreement, well....that's another story. The Christian Councils never establish/created church doctrine, they declared in official ceremony and documentation what the Christian doctrine always was. At the Council of Nicea, over 300 Bishops met to deal with a small, but powerful sect called the "Aryans" who arose out of the Gnostic sects of the 2nd century. Arius, the leader of the Aryans was attempting to push the Gnostic belief that Jesus was not divine, but only a man. The Nicean Council just officially confirmed what the church always believed about the divinity of Jesus and thus, "officially" condemned Arius and his followers as heretics. The Council didn't create the doctrine of the divinity of Jesus, they just officially upheld it. Look at my above post. I already caught my mistake. My decades old Sunday school came rushing back and bugged me enough to fact check the canon/apocrypha. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 1 hour ago, morrissex95 said: I still hate his guts and would hurt him in a second if I had a time machine and I could go back in time to stop something Hard to believe this game is over 20 years old: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baer. Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 53 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said: I'd have to Google his claim about being banned in over 100 countries, but he's not wrong about Israel having countries that refuse to recognize it as a nation. Not surprisingly though that roughly half are from the Arab League. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Israel#Present_situation Sorry, the correct word was expelled. I have edited my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 46 minutes ago, CBH1926 said: Great countries like Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan, North Korea, Venezuela, Bangladesh etc. Can not wait to take my next vacation there. I hear a Somali cruise is is a "can't miss" holiday.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabreFan1 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, Baer. said: Sorry, the correct word was expelled. I have edited my post. I'll have to take your word for how many countries Jews have been expelled from. Nothing that I've read comes immediately to mind as to a number. Most of what I can think of is that historically Jews were basically chased from one nation to another. It's one of the reason why I laugh when people b*tch and complain about Jews being in historically rich and powerful positions like banking and other financial industries. It was and still is to an extent in some countries by necessity. If you're part of a group that is persecuted, you'll do everything you can to insulate yourself. Money and the power that comes with it are two of the best ways to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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