[Updated-Report] Canucks place Sven Baertschi on Waivers

[the grinder]

7 minutes ago, mll said:

Double edge sword - the Canucks need his cap space too.  He won't get claimed because of that extra year so it will probably lead to a buyout in June or a trade à la Spooner-Gagner.  Both not ideal cap wise.

 

he can stay in pressbox in Utica next year too  , loui is getting bought out  before baer is 

[mll]

5 minutes ago, the grinder said:

the canucks aren't losing any merit in keeping loui   , they are just burning one more year off his contract and then buyout or he retires  , you don't hear loui's agent saying anything do you ???   right ?  

Eriksson is a 5.8M buyout cap hit next season.  His agent was in the media this summer talking about needing a trade and how it helps no one to send Eriksson to Utica - they found no trade partners.

 

Edited December 15, 2019 by mll

[mll]

1 minute ago, the grinder said:

he can stay in pressbox in Utica next year too  , loui is getting bought out  before baer is 

Why would he be sitting in the press-box.  He has been excellent for the prospects in Utica.  He has a great attitude and has earned plenty of praise for being professional and engaged in helping the prospects down in Utica.  

[the grinder]

1 minute ago, mll said:

Eriksson is a 5.8M buyout cap hit next season.  His agent was in the media this summer talking about needing a trade and how it helps no one to send Eriksson to Utica - they found no trade partners.

 

ya that's why im thinking loui is going to be retiring  , keep him  around  then retire next season 

[the grinder]

1 minute ago, mll said:

Why would he be sitting in the press-box.  He has been excellent for the prospects in Utica.  He has a great attitude and has earned plenty of praise for being professional and engaged in helping the prospects down in Utica.  

sure he was all that till his agent ruined that now  , I wouldn't want baer or his agent  anywhere near Utica now 

[ktcy2]

Honestly I don’t get this crap. We have Schaller in the lineup for heaven sake and can’t slot in baertschi? 

[ktcy2]

Heck even Eriksson should be in the lineup over guys like Schaller, MacEwan and etc. I just don’t like this 4th liners do what 4th liners do BS. 

[mll]

2 minutes ago, the grinder said:

sure he was all that till his agent ruined that now  , I wouldn't want baer or his agent  anywhere near Utica now 

I doubt it bothers anyone in Utica.  They know he wants to get back to the NHL.  He has said it since he got demoted but insisted that as long as he is down there he will do all his possible to help the prospects and be a good role model.  He's not whining or sulking at all.  

[Quantum]

2 minutes ago, ktcy2 said:

Honestly I don’t get this crap. We have Schaller in the lineup for heaven sake and can’t slot in baertschi? 

Schaller can play C and W. Baertschi can only play W. Schaller is also on an expiring contract, it's better to showcase him in case there's trade interest. I know Boston fans were puzzled by Schaller's disappearing act last season but I feel like he's been okay this season.

 

Baertschi deserves a new team but I just don't see the fit in Vancouver anymore with JT Miller and Tanner Pearson as Top 6 fixtures and Leivo as a good utility Top 9er.

[JamesB]

1 hour ago, Toews said:

I never liked the strategy of "bridging the age gap", acquiring prospects that other teams knew were not in their plans. Leivo is the best of the lot and we got him for likely a career AHLer (Carcone). Moves that are made with the idea of "accelerating" the rebuild rarely work out. The assets that were moved out would now have provided us with considerably more depth at all levels of the organization and at a fraction of the cost. Disappointing but it is what it is. You have to accept the good with the bad. Elite players are what drive this league and we look like we have a few of those.

 

10 minutes ago, Sbriggs said:

really left JB with no choice

 

1 hour ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Could be the caption for that sweet sig of yours. 

 

When hockey teams at any level win their championships, I get emotional and it’s hard to hide. 

I respect how difficult of a journey it is for the team and each of its components, plus all of their individual sacrifices, like you say here. 

 

When you lose or have your career ended, that’s also a place I deeply respect.

Interestingly, we can look in any NHL Talk player retirement thread and see which posters are there to pay those respects. 

 

Sven has acted with dignity and integrity throughout this process. 

 

I don’t forget how difficult it must be for him as a person, especially going from modelling hats for the franchise to Utica... which I work back into my point on using him like that, despite him being a transitional asset on a rebuilding team the past few years. (Could have spared the guy, I’ve thought, with going from poster boy to stick boy)

 

 

If Baer is picked up on waivers, for me it the be final chapter in the "acceleration" story mentioned by Toews.

 

Benning has a good overall record in the draft. And I think his overall approach has been good for the last two years. But I did not like the Benning "acceleration" strategy in his first 3 years.  That included trading draft picks for older prospects including Linden Vey, Andrey Pedan, and Sven Baertschi, trading just drafted Forsling for Clendening, trading prospect Jared McCann and a second round pick for Gudbranson, trading a third round pick for Dorset, along with various smaller deals and acquiring a bunch of UFAs, who are hard to even remember now. 

 

Out of that list, people could say that at least the Baertschi trade worked out. I said that more than once.  But it didn't work. Right now the Canucks would actually be fortunate if Baer gets picked up on waivers as it will at least clear some cap space. But I think it is not very likely he gets picked up given his cap hit and his concussion history, even though he has been great in the AHL this season and was not bad with Canucks in the brief opportunity he had. But I agree that he is not the kind of player Green wants -- not quite good enough to be a top line scorer and not good enough with defence, physical play, puck battles, etc. to play anywhere in the bottom 9 in the Green system.

 

Some people have made the argument that Baer and others were useful placeholders, I don't see that. Over the four-year stretch up to and including last year, the Canucks had either the worst or second worst aggregate record in the NHL, depending on exactly what measure you use. The Canucks did have a pretty good regular season in Benning's first year thanks in part to veteran UFAs (Miller and Vrbata) and trading for Dorsett along with a rebound for many players from the previous year. But the team was still not close to being good enough for another deep Cup run and it just delayed the rebuild. 

 

Anyway, I like Baer and I hope he does well. But I will be surprised if he gets picked and, in the long run, I suspect he goes back to Europe. 

 

 

[ktcy2]

1 minute ago, Quantum said:

Schaller can play C and W. Baertschi can only play W. Schaller is also on an expiring contract, it's better to showcase him in case there's trade interest. I know Boston fans were puzzled by Schaller's disappearing act last season but I feel like he's been okay this season.

 

Baertschi deserves a new team but I just don't see the fit in Vancouver anymore with JT Miller and Tanner Pearson as Top 6 fixtures and Leivo as a good utility Top 9er.

Schaller has like what, 1 point in his last 25 games? 

[mll]

1 minute ago, JamesB said:

 

 

[...]

 

Anyway, I like Baer and I hope he does well. But I will be surprised if he gets picked and, in the long run, I suspect he goes back to Europe. 

 

 

He has a house in Portland and doesn't even return to Switzerland in the off-season - he met his wife there when he played for the Winterhawks.  

 

Would think that a team would offer him a PTO after he gets bought out by the Canucks in June.  Fwiw cap wise they would be better off to trade him at 50% retained than to buy him out.  

[Me_]

1 hour ago, ktcy2 said:

Schaller has like what, 1 point in his last 25 games? 

It doesn’t work that way.

All teams have their own problematics.

 

The Canucks have the Bärtschi conundrum whereby not only was he surpassed by better players, he can’t stay in the lineup because of repeat concussion problems. Unreliable for the consistency demanded of a top six role.
 

Eriksson signed with the wrong team and went for cash. Result: he’s stuck here until his contract ends because neither he, nor his contract gets better. It is the hopes that when he collects his bonus, he also collects his pension.

 

Schaller was signed along with Roussel and Beagle to bring in some grit. Two out of three ain’t bad. I assume he gets picked up at the deadline or not re-signed by the Canucks.

 

Sutter/Tanev are very good players who bring it every night. However, the amount of injuries those two get every year renders constructing a team around them impossible. They should be counted on as supplementary players; not primary, go-to players. But not one doubt the Canucks are better when they play.

 

Hopefully Ferland doesn’t make this list. We need at least another one of those in the lineup.

 

 

Edited December 15, 2019 by Me_

[Provost]

32 minutes ago, the grinder said:

the canucks aren't losing any merit in keeping loui   , they are just burning one more year off his contract and then buyout or he retires  , you don't hear loui's agent saying anything do you ???   right ?  

They are a absolutely losing credibility about their mantra of earning roster spots by merit and treating players fairly.

 

Do you really think other guys on the fringe aren’t looking at it and saying it is bull$&!# that they are in the minors instead of Eriksson.  They know exactly who is in their way.

[Guest]

Good luck to Baer, he's a good guy.  

I kind of hope that he retires from hockey and lives a healthy rest of his life with a few million in the Swiss Bank  

[canuck73_3]

20 minutes ago, ktcy2 said:

Schaller has like what, 1 point in his last 25 games? 

Schaller has 4 more goals this year than Baertschi at the NHL level can play C or wing and he does it while being a good part of our PK and on the 4th line with a revolving door of linemates. 
 

Baertschi went right to the top 9 and was mediocre at best couldn’t and he doesn't have a strong defensive game like Schaller. If you can't see the difference between the 2 players we can't really help you understand why Schaller is on the roster and Sven isn't...

Edited December 15, 2019 by canuck73_3

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Provost said:

They are a absolutely losing credibility about their mantra of earning roster spots by merit and treating players fairly.

 

Do you really think other guys on the fringe aren’t looking at it and saying it is bull$&!# that they are in the minors instead of Eriksson.  They know exactly who is in their way.

Loui has been sat in favour of better players and prospects.  Sven was not better then Loui and I have nothing against Sven.  I was genuinely afraid that Sven would get concussed every time that he would go into a corner with an opposing player.  

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, JamesB said:

Some people have made the argument that Baer and others were useful placeholders, I don't see that. Over the four-year stretch up to and including last year, the Canucks had either the worst or second worst aggregate record in the NHL, depending on exactly what measure you use. The Canucks did have a pretty good regular season in Benning's first year thanks in part to veteran UFAs (Miller and Vrbata) and trading for Dorsett along with a rebound for many players from the previous year. But the team was still not close to being good enough for another deep Cup run and it just delayed the rebuild. 

 

 

Okay, now imagine if we didn't have Baer in those years?  We would be setting league records for the most atrocious team in the history of the NHL.  We needed those placeholders to at least lose with dignity.  I think that it mattered because we still have guys here (Horvat, Edler, etc) whereas those guys might've bolted or refused to resign if we were icing an ECHL lineup + Sedins every night. 

[Toews]

12 minutes ago, Me_ said:

Eriksson sign with the wrong team and went for cash. Result: he’s stuck here until his contract ends because neither he, nor his contract gets better. It is the hopes that when he collects his bonus, he also collects his pension.

This seems like conjecture. He could have had a bunch of offers and signed here because he had performed with the Sedins in international hockey as well as living in a world class city. Moreover I am not sure if he would be much better somewhere else. I never wanted him signed because I knew the last few years would be terrible, I just didn't know it would be terrible from the start. Regardless though I don't see the point in dumping on him by pretending to know his mindset for signing here.

Edited December 15, 2019 by Toews

[canuck73_3]

27 minutes ago, JamesB said:

 

 

If Baer is picked up on waivers, for me it the be final chapter in the "acceleration" story mentioned by Toews.

 

Benning has a good overall record in the draft. And I think his overall approach has been good for the last two years. But I did not like the Benning "acceleration" strategy in his first 3 years.  That included trading draft picks for older prospects including Linden Vey, Andrey Pedan, and Sven Baertschi, trading just drafted Forsling for Clendening, trading prospect Jared McCann and a second round pick for Gudbranson, trading a third round pick for Dorset, along with various smaller deals and acquiring a bunch of UFAs, who are hard to even remember now. 

 

Out of that list, people could say that at least the Baertschi trade worked out. I said that more than once.  But it didn't work. Right now the Canucks would actually be fortunate if Baer gets picked up on waivers as it will at least clear some cap space. But I think it is not very likely he gets picked up given his cap hit and his concussion history, even though he has been great in the AHL this season and was not bad with Canucks in the brief opportunity he had. But I agree that he is not the kind of player Green wants -- not quite good enough to be a top line scorer and not good enough with defence, physical play, puck battles, etc. to play anywhere in the bottom 9 in the Green system.

 

Some people have made the argument that Baer and others were useful placeholders, I don't see that. Over the four-year stretch up to and including last year, the Canucks had either the worst or second worst aggregate record in the NHL, depending on exactly what measure you use. The Canucks did have a pretty good regular season in Benning's first year thanks in part to veteran UFAs (Miller and Vrbata) and trading for Dorsett along with a rebound for many players from the previous year. But the team was still not close to being good enough for another deep Cup run and it just delayed the rebuild. 

 

Anyway, I like Baer and I hope he does well. But I will be surprised if he gets picked and, in the long run, I suspect he goes back to Europe. 

 

 

Baer’s wife’s family is from Oregon and he lives in Oregon in the off season I really doubt he goes to Europe. 
 

Also he was part of the group of placeholderS as the plan was to rebuild but remain competitive which for the last 3 to 4 years we did even with the injuries that piled up.
 

Competitive in the sense we weren't getting blown out on a nightly basis like the god awful Oilers build model. Baertschi was a good part of that and the current top 9 forwards have now surpassed him as was the way the plan was drawn up..