[Discussion Build a 2020-21 Roster

[Provost]

Stuck at home (like most everyone), and whiling away the time playing with the capfriendly GM tool.

 

This thread is for a place to come up with your cap compliant roster, since so much is up in the air, an arbitrary framework needs to be in place so things aren't crazy all over the place and totally ridiculous like moving out all our bad contracts and replacing them with good ones

Roster Rules:

- Assume a completely flat cap the same as this year

- Assume 1 compliance buyout

- You can only trade one current roster player out and bring one in (so we don't see fantasy rosters with bunches of impossible moves)

- You can sign any number of UFAs (though it is limited by not being able to move out a ton of guys based on the rule above)

- You can sign any of our RFAs

 

My kick at the can:

- Buy out Eriksson

- The one allowed trade is Virtanen plus non roster assets (as per the rules) for a young RHD like Severson who earns between $4-5.25 million and can play top 4 minutes
- Bury Sutter if Ferland actually comes back, or have him as depth forward if Ferland ends up on LTIR again before the season starts

- Keep Baertschi buried, bury Benn

- Tanev and Motte not re-signed
- Sign Markstrom, Tryamkin, MacEwan, Hoglander, Leivo, Stecher
 

 

Miller-Petterson-Toffoli ($5.5 million x5 years)
Pearson-Horvat-Boeser
Hoglander-Gaudette ($1.25 million x2)-MacEwan ($1 million x2)

Roussel-Beagle-Leivo ($1.75 million x2 years)

Ferland/Sutter

 

Hughes-Severson ($4.166

Edler-Stecher ($2.5 million x 2)
Rafferty-Myers

Tryamkin ($2 million x 3)

Markstrom ($5.5 x4)

Demko

Total, approx $80.35 million which leaves some space for pushed ELCs from this year we probably have to fit in.  The number includes the Luongo and Spooner money as well as the remaining buried cap hits from the veterans
We have incorporated a couple young guys to develop, and have backups in Sutter, Ferland, and Benn in case the kids falter or fail out of training camp and need to be demoted

We have lost useful players to free agency, but that is unavoidable with cap realities

An excellent top two lines, with a 3rd "kid" line that will have energy and can also score, though they would need to be sheltered

Veteran 4th line who should be able to be used defensively primarily in matchups that Horvat doesn't get
Defence isn't really improved much, but a downward trending Tanev replaced by a much younger guy... Tryamkin and Rafferty are the wildcards for hopes of improvement over Benn/Fantenberg.  There just isn't cap space to make the defence as good as it needs to be, so trying to hold the line is what I tried to do and hope to fix the defence in another year after we have seen what Rafferty and Tryamkin are and might have some more cap flexibility.  Having Hoglander in the lineup is a bit aspirational and a nod to the fact we might have to try to outscore our defensive shortcomings and can't afford to have two defensive shut down lines.

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Provost

[Angry Goose]

Sounds like fun.  I'll add a roster after work

 

***

 

Ok so I played around with the idea last night.  I'll let the numbers people chime in, I'll just put the roster that I'd like to see and that I think roughly might fit under the cap.  

 

Will try consider chemistry/special teams when it comes to lines, and realistic somewhat.  

 

Miller EP Toffoli

Pearson Horvat Leivo

Ferland Gaudette Virtanen

Motte/Roussel Beagle MacEwan

Roussel/Motte

 

Hughes Myers

Edler Rafferty

Tryamkin Stetcher

Benn

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

***

 

I would definitely like to see Leivo re-signed, possibly even 2-3 years if they can work out a fair deal.  Toffoli inked to a deal too.  Markstrom re-signed.  Jake is causing me a headache.  He could just as easily be moved depending on what sort of deal he's aiming for.  Going to assume Ferland is going to come back based on Dhaliwal's reports, but maybe he goes ltir after the first concussion related injury.

 

Eriksson compliance buy out.  Sutter & Baertschi traded.  Ok maybe that's rose coloured glasses but with Boeser being moved, maybe that allows them to move some money along with him, with salary retained etc. if needed.  In return, I'd like to see them get some help on the blue line, ideally a younger d man.

 

In short, this is going to be a hell of an off season, whenever that is.

Edited April 5, 2020 by SILLY GOOSE

[wildcam]

4 hours ago, Provost said:

Stuck at home (like most everyone), and whiling away the time playing with the capfriendly GM tool.

 

This thread is for a place to come up with your cap compliant roster, since so much is up in the air, an arbitrary framework needs to be in place so things aren't crazy all over the place and totally ridiculous like moving out all our bad contracts and replacing them with good ones

Roster Rules:

- Assume a completely flat cap the same as this year

- Assume 1 compliance buyout

- You can only trade one current roster player out and bring one in (so we don't see fantasy rosters with bunches of impossible moves)

- You can sign any number of UFAs (though it is limited by not being able to move out a ton of guys based on the rule above)

- You can sign any of our RFAs

 

My kick at the can:

- Buy out Eriksson

- The one allowed trade is Virtanen plus non roster assets (as per the rules) for a young RHD like Severson who earns between $4-5.25 million and can play top 4 minutes
- Bury Sutter if Ferland actually comes back, or have him as depth forward if Ferland ends up on LTIR again before the season starts

- Keep Baertschi buried, bury Benn

- Tanev and Motte not re-signed
- Sign Markstrom, Tryamkin, MacEwan, Hoglander, Leivo, Stecher
 

 

Miller-Petterson-Toffoli ($5.5 million x5 years)
Pearson-Horvat-Boeser
Hoglander-Gaudette ($1.25 million x2)-MacEwan ($1 million x2)

Roussel-Beagle-Leivo ($1.75 million x2 years)

Ferland/Sutter

 

Hughes-Severson ($4.166

Edler-Stecher ($2.5 million x 2)
Rafferty-Myers

Tryamkin ($2 million x 3)

Markstrom ($5.5 x4)

Demko

Total, approx $80.35 million which leaves some space for pushed ELCs from this year we probably have to fit in.  The number includes the Luongo and Spooner money as well as the remaining buried cap hits from the veterans
We have incorporated a couple young guys to develop, and have backups in Sutter, Ferland, and Benn in case the kids falter or fail out of training camp and need to be demoted

We have lost useful players to free agency, but that is unavoidable with cap realities

An excellent top two lines, with a 3rd "kid" line that will have energy and can also score, though they would need to be sheltered

Veteran 4th line who should be able to be used defensively primarily in matchups that Horvat doesn't get
Defence isn't really improved much, but a downward trending Tanev replaced by a much younger guy... Tryamkin and Rafferty are the wildcards for hopes of improvement over Benn/Fantenberg.  There just isn't cap space to make the defence as good as it needs to be, so trying to hold the line is what I tried to do and hope to fix the defence in another year after we have seen what Rafferty and Tryamkin are and might have some more cap flexibility.  Having Hoglander in the lineup is a bit aspirational and a nod to the fact we might have to try to outscore our defensive shortcomings and can't afford to have two defensive shut down lines.

 

Like your team...I am a big fan of Severson, would make team even more mobile and hard to play against..

[Outsiders]

Miller-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli(5.5x4)

Ferland-Gaudette-Virtanen

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Rafferty

Hughes-Tryamkin

Juolevi-Myers

Benn

 

Marky

Demko

 

 

Trade Roussel

Dont resign Tanev

 

[Pears]

Compliance buyout: Eriksson

Trade: Sutter with 50% cap retained to for a 4th round pick

 

Re-sign: 

 

Toffoli $6Mx5

Markstrom $5.5Mx4

Tanev $4.5Mx3

Virtanen $2.5Mx2

Gaudette $2Mx2

Leivo $2Mx2

 

Remaining cap: $249,295

 

Miller - Pettersson - Boeser

Pearson - Horvat - Toffoli

Höglander - Gaudette - Virtanen

Ferland - Beagle - Leivo

Roussel/MacEwen

 

Edler - Myers

Hughes - Tanev

Benn - Rafferty

Juolevi

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

With this scenario I was only allowed to re-sign our players which in the long run, is ok. That is a dynamite forward group. I wasn’t sure what’s gonna happen with Ferland so I just left him in. Which would kind of hurt because that means Motte would have to go. 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Pears

[Provost]

22 minutes ago, Pears said:

Compliance buyout: Eriksson

Trade: Sutter with 50% cap retained to for a 4th round pick

 

Re-sign: 

 

Toffoli $6Mx5

Markstrom $5.5Mx4

Tanev $4.5Mx3

Virtanen $2.5Mx2

Gaudette $2Mx2

Leivo $2Mx2

 

Remaining cap: $249,295

 

Miller - Pettersson - Boeser

Pearson - Horvat - Toffoli

Höglander - Gaudette - Virtanen

Ferland - Beagle - Leivo

Roussel/MacEwen

 

Edler - Myers

Hughes - Tanev

Benn - Rafferty

Juolevi

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

With this scenario I was only allowed to re-sign our players which in the long run, is ok. That is a dynamite forward group. I wasn’t sure what’s gonna happen with Ferland so I just left him in. Which would kind of hurt because that means Motte would have to go. 

I like it, but does the math still work out adding in the 50% Sutter retained, plus Luongo and Spooner's money as well as buried money for Baertschi?  It seems like it adds up too high

[Pears]

32 minutes ago, Provost said:

I like it, but does the math still work out adding in the 50% Sutter retained, plus Luongo and Spooner's money as well as buried money for Baertschi?  It seems like it adds up too high

I used CapFriendly to help

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Pears
typo

[Lazurus]

A team for ONE year only?

Or taking into consideration expansion?

And all players accepting what is offered?

 

Well first I need to take care of numerous FA's and a massive cap crunch.

Markstrom, Tanev, Toffoli, Leivo all have to go, not want but need this team is 10 mil over the cap already.

Then other contracts, Ferland, Baerstchi, I want to know a player is there for a year playing hard hockey, these guys have glass jaws.

Stecher, a bit of a question mark, just not enough, mehh.

 

Horvat 5.25 - 2023 - 28yrs

Boeser 5.85 - 2022 - 25yrs

Miller 5.5 - 2023 - 31yrs

Roussel 3.0- 2022 - 32yrs

Beagle 3.0 - 2022 - 36yrs

Sutter 4.375 - 2022 - 32yrs

Pearson 3.7 - 2022 - 29yrs

Erikkson  6.0 - 2023 - 36yrs

Edler 6.0 - 2021 - 35yrs

Myers 6.0 - 2024 - 34 yrs

 

Over the next two years that is huge money committed to guys 30 and over and a lot of guys also 30 and ove but pretty much stuck with them, clause contracts and lack of performance combined with high cap hits make moving them very difficult.

 

So not having a total all out fantasy, contracts are contracts and honored, not every FA will sign for less and looking to future 10 to 15 million payable Pettersson and Hughes in another year. WITH the hope of getting younger, AGAIN.

 

Odds are if Ollie was ever gong to make a big impression he would have at least one game in four years in the NHL, he hasn't been hurt all four years.

StLouis showed that really big defencemen are vital, but then how anyone forgot about Chara in the playoffs I don't know. All the smaller defencemen and only one Chara but he is remembered for the impact on the game.

 

So build from the back out. Marky or Demko? Both are stars right now,

Marky has had two great years but he is already 30 and will want to get his last big contract.

Demko is only 24 and the team still has some control, he is a west coast boy and could very well be the best young goalie available to Seattle even if they just pick him and use him in a trade.

 

Demko - this solves an issue of giving away assets without good returns and is the goalie of the future with DiPeitro.

 

Unfortunately Markstrom walks but there will be an additional year and a savings of 8+ million over 3 years mimimum.

 

Defence

As noted, Juolevi maybe a 7 or 8 guy.

Hughes will be around for a while, 7 mil 6 years.

Myers, a large human specimen as a stay at home defenceman

Edler, on multiple one year deals with reduced minutes.

Tryamkin, fairly obvious he will resign, 3.5 for 4 years, there was never anything wrong with his game and not only large but he played large.

Benn, currently a fill in

Fantneberg, no

Rafferty, would have to see before but probably can keep up, we have seen AHL superstars wither in the NHL before

Tanev, just won't have enough money to sign him AND Hughes, Pettersson.

Stecher, maybe just too expensive for what the team gets but being a RFA he has trade value as an add in with a deal.

 

So far;

Demko - DiPietro - No clauses - no need to protect - 4.5 mil

 

Hughes - Myers - no need to protect - 8 mil

Edler - Tryamkin - no need to protect - 9.5 mil

Benn -

 

Horvat = Pearson - Miller - 15 mil

Sutter - Roussel - Beagle - 11 mil

Boeser - JV - Gaudette -

 

JV needs a deal - 5 yrs 3 mil

Gaudette, Motte and MacEwen all need deals -

 

Another approach, first get under the cap

 

Cannot resign any expiring contracts and that will still put the team over the cap. No matter what the league will not prorate bonuses paid for last year or penalties incurred for past decisions.

 

Work in progress yet

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[189lb enforcers?]

Some cool rosters. They look good on paper, but guys, please be realistic. 

 

Firkland is done.

He is an IR mainstay now.

If you want a cap relief / LTIR player, then I get it. 
 

As much as I liked the signing, it came too late in his career and was a pretty big L for Benning. 

[Chris12345]

11 hours ago, Outsiders said:

Miller-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli(5.5x4)

Ferland-Gaudette-Virtanen

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Rafferty

Hughes-Tryamkin

Juolevi-Myers

Benn

 

Marky

Demko

 

 

Trade Roussel

Dont resign Tanev

 

Nice. Where did 51 go?

[Provost]

51 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Some cool rosters. They look good on paper, but guys, please be realistic. 

 

Firkland is done.

He is an IR mainstay now.

If you want a cap relief / LTIR player, then I get it. 
 

As much as I liked the signing, it came too late in his career and was a pretty big L for Benning. 

Except that isn't true or realistic.  He is good to go with no symptoms today, right now.  He has no intention of retiring, as of everything we know right now he will be on our roster and at training camp next year.  Any roster has to account for that and include his money on the books.

Whether he lasts 1 game or 60 games, he is on the team and counts.

[Lazurus]

14 hours ago, Outsiders said:

Miller-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli(5.5x4)

Ferland-Gaudette-Virtanen

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Rafferty

Hughes-Tryamkin

Juolevi-Myers

Benn

 

Marky

Demko

 

 

Trade Roussel

Dont resign Tanev

 

 

3 hours ago, Chris12345 said:

Nice. Where did 51 go?

Okay, how about a 50/50 split on the fantasy, Toffoli doesn't want to stay he signs back home for 6 mil a season, Canucks can't even match., Roussel agrees to get traded, now to who? Ferland plays half a season, that's better than 50/50 as he hasn't played a season in 3 years, Marky signs, for how much? And Demko is happy to be a back up making back up money for the next, how many years? 50/50 on Juolevi, he can turn to the right now that's a 50% improvement and Rafferty CAN play.

3 hours ago, Provost said:

Except that isn't true or realistic.  He is good to go with no symptoms today, right now.  He has no intention of retiring, as of everything we know right now he will be on our roster and at training camp next year.  Any roster has to account for that and include his money on the books.

Whether he lasts 1 game or 60 games, he is on the team and counts.

He was good to go last year before signing, he was good to go before his last game in the playoffs the year before, he was good to go after missing from Nov to Jan that year, just let him go, buy him out and save the contract and expansion spot

 

sorry all, too much time on my hands and this virus. BUT why aren't people seeing some of the blatant problems? Sure it would be NICE to see some of this but it appears the costs just aren't being added up or even if there is an ability. IMO this is a all in one off team, this was JB's swan song guarantee of selling the future for a playoff game. The team currently has 89 million in contracts, over 8 million in bonuses and other penalties, this team is going back into a rebuild next year. IMHO

Edited April 5, 2020 by Lazurus

[Provost]

36 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

 

Okay, how about a 50/50 split on the fantasy, Toffoli doesn't want to stay he signs back home for 6 mil a season, Canucks can't even match., Roussel agrees to get traded, now to who? Ferland plays half a season, that's better than 50/50 as he hasn't played a season in 3 years, Marky signs, for how much? And Demko is happy to be a back up making back up money for the next, how many years? 50/50 on Juolevi, he can turn to the right now that's a 50% improvement and Rafferty CAN play.

He was good to go last year before signing, he was good to go before his last game in the playoffs the year before, he was good to go after missing from Nov to Jan that year, just let him go, buy him out and save the contract and expansion spot

 

sorry all, too much time on my hands and this virus. BUT why aren't people seeing some of the blatant problems? Sure it would be NICE to see some of this but it appears the costs just aren't being added up or even if there is an ability. IMO this is a all in one off team, this was JB's swan song guarantee of selling the future for a playoff game. The team currently has 89 million in contracts, over 8 million in bonuses and other penalties, this team is going back into a rebuild next year. IMHO

That is a completely irrelevant rant that also makes no sense.  The rosters provided are cap compliant and show we don't have to tear everything down even with the really strict constraints on trades/dumping money that I included.  Go have a drink or take a walk, being cooped up is getting to you.

If you don't want to participate in a thread aside from trying to hijack it with misplaced whinging, scroll by.

[Lazurus]

25 minutes ago, Provost said:

That is a completely irrelevant rant that also makes no sense.  The rosters provided are cap compliant and show we don't have to tear everything down even with the really strict constraints on trades/dumping money that I included.  Go have a drink or take a walk, being cooped up is getting to you.

If you don't want to participate in a thread aside from trying to hijack it with misplaced whinging, scroll by.

Cap compliant if no bonuses are paid and the cap goes up but not realistic. What about the following year then?, Bonuses subtract from the cap not add so the Canucks start off with over 4 mil less than every other team not paying bonuses.

Toffoli still has a house in California and they have better tax structures plus his wife's job, His wife works in media, as an entertainment coordinator for the Los Angeles Dodgers. Just saying putting him in as a guarantee is not that at all, he is just another UFA, his last year of salary was 4.8 mil.

 

[Provost]

20 hours ago, Lazurus said:

Cap compliant if no bonuses are paid and the cap goes up but not realistic. What about the following year then?, Bonuses subtract from the cap not add so the Canucks start off with over 4 mil less than every other team not paying bonuses.

Toffoli still has a house in California and they have better tax structures plus his wife's job, His wife works in media, as an entertainment coordinator for the Los Angeles Dodgers. Just saying putting him in as a guarantee is not that at all, he is just another UFA, his last year of salary was 4.8 mil.

 

The rosters are cap compliant and any achieved bonuses for next year are going to end up being pushed into the following season.... that is just where we are at, one or both of Petterson and Hughes night have to be on a bridge deal to get over the hump.  Your idea of tearing down the roster and rebuilding instead of building the roster is foolish and not part of the exercise in this thread.  We can manage things over the next two seasons when we get to the point of the overpaid veteran contracts expiring.  Then our problem is too many good young players, and that isn’t hard to get out of... you can always trade them for futures who cost less and then keep the process going. 

 

No one said signing Toffoli is a guarantee, they are made up rosters not a single player on them is guaranteed to be playing for us next year.  Signing him would probably have been more likely if we had gone through a playoff run and he got more invested here.... but him returning to the LA area isn’t a slam dunk like you are suggesting.  Every single hockey wife deals with these moves.  Ryan Miller signed here and his wife was LA based.

 

Stop being a troll and if you don’t want to participate in the exercise... don’t.  Filling up the thread with ra rom crap is just being unpleasant for no reason.

 

 

Edited April 6, 2020 by Provost

[189lb enforcers?]

On 4/5/2020 at 10:30 AM, Provost said:

Except that isn't true or realistic.  He is good to go with no symptoms today, right now.  He has no intention of retiring, as of everything we know right now he will be on our roster and at training camp next year.  Any roster has to account for that and include his money on the books.

Whether he lasts 1 game or 60 games, he is on the team and counts.

You’ve clarified his “availability” to the roster. 
thanks, Captain Obvious.
 

Not true or realistic?
We should first agree on his health or even the principle of the gamble here. 

 

He’s not going to be anything near vintage Firkland if and when he comes back. There is a long list of examples of players like him who weren’t, but anything is possible, I get that. 

The guy is quite possibly a hit away from the LTIR - a guy who absolutely needs to be physical to be effective as a player. 
 

If it was your money, I doubt you’d have it tied up in Ferland at this point. Nobody would take some unreliable car and attempt to drive it across Canada as a reasonable plan. What makes getting mileage out of this player any less risky? 
 

FTR, I’m of course a huge fan of this player. I wish we had 20 just like him, but healthy. For his sake, I hope he either retires or becomes extremely lucky as to not get another concussion and become like the guys we know of. We’ve lost a lot of tough players due to these symptoms. Belak, Boogieman, etc. He can’t go that way...

 

 

I’m trying to be realistic here when I claim that he is done, or as close to it as makes no difference and I wouldn’t build a team with a known liability on it. Not sure how anyone could argue against that, but whatever, it’s just an opinion. 
 

Wish we’d got him in 2012. 
 

 

 

Edited April 6, 2020 by 189lb enforcers?

[BigTramFan]

Compliance buy out: Eriksson

LTIR: Ferland

Trade: Boeser + Stecher to CBJ for Savard + Anderson

Resign RFAs: Anderson ($3m), Virtanen ($2.8m), Gaudette ($2m), MacEwen ($1.2m), Motte ($1.2m)

Sign UFAs: Markstrom ($6m), Tanev ($5.5m), Toffoli ($5.5m)

Total cap hit = $80.3m (including Luongo recapture penalty, Spooner buyout and Baer buried contract)

 

 

 

[Lazurus]

18 hours ago, BigTramFan said:

Compliance buy out: Eriksson

LTIR: Ferland

Trade: Boeser + Stecher to CBJ for Savard + Anderson

Resign RFAs: Anderson ($3m), Virtanen ($2.8m), Gaudette ($2m), MacEwen ($1.2m), Motte ($1.2m)

Sign UFAs: Markstrom ($6m), Tanev ($5.5m), Toffoli ($5.5m)

Total cap hit = $80.3m (including Luongo recapture penalty, Spooner buyout and Baer buried contract)

 

 

 

 

 

Aren't the media talking about the cap going down now? With one compliance buyout maybe possible?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Lazurus

[Lazurus]

I think I am going to try a longer view team instead of a bunch more bandaids at the cost of more draft picks. Every poster has been reading about how, with a salary cap, draft picks and players in early contracts are worth their weight in gold. It is time this team got many more younger players and some cap space to make trades. Use the team's ability to spend money instead of using draft picks.

This isn't a roster that is young, inexpensive or dazzling the league or can be kept together.

Too many players 30 and over making way too much money with clause contracts handcuffing deals.

Some players are locked in because of that.

This season was the big push and next few years the price has to be paid. Imagine anything you want, from they won a cup to they made the playoffs, the team would still be done after this season.

 

Trade Boeser for a top ten pick this year.

Package Stecher up with Sutter and retention for a late 1rst round pick, 20+ selection

 

Don't be afraid of losing players, Winnipeg lost their top four defence and were in it, Chicago retools just about every year.

 

Retool next year, get two top drafts somehow this year, add them to Hughes, Pettersson, Demko, Virtanen, Horvat, get most of the players close to the same age, three or four starting players under 22 is not a bad goal.

 

Sorry my imagination just isn't good enough to configure a team within the posters guidelines, apology for the derail.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Lazurus

[BertaNuck]

Leafs suck