2023 NHL Entry Draft

[wildcam]

3 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Reinbacher is good; Sandin-Pellikka is an absolute trainwreck in his own zone and is incredibly unlikely to ever learn how to play defence at a level that will be acceptable to an NHL team.

If he is such a train wreck how did he make 2023 U20 world JR team as a 17 years old??? He is a decent player.. Not many D man make WJ U 20 at 17 and Sweden always has a good team..

[Smashian Kassian]

I wouldn't be upset with Yager. His tools are incredible & projects to have top 6 TWF upside. 

[King Heffy]

Just now, wildcam said:

If he is such a train wreck how did he make 2023 U20 world JR team as a 17 years old??? He is a decent player.. Not many D man make WJ U 20 at 17 and Sweden always has a good team..

And he was absolutely dreadful in the tournament.  He'd be #1 on my do not draft list.

[wildcam]

1 minute ago, King Heffy said:

And he was absolutely dreadful in the tournament.  He'd be #1 on my do not draft list.

Played in 7 games at world JR tournament? Top 3 D man in this draft

[Warhippy]

3 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

And he was absolutely dreadful in the tournament.  He'd be #1 on my do not draft list.

Jordan Schroeder was absolutely amazing as was Cody Hodgson and Olli Juolevi.  We gotta stop drafting or not kids based on one tournament

[Smashian Kassian]

I like Sandin-Pellikka, seems like both a smart player & a good skater, but likely limited upside. (Thinking 2nd pair D, which is still a good player).

 

I'd prefer Reinbacher & I think Simashev. 

 

 

[hammertime]

12 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

And I think you know full well that the draft is the best possible place to get exactly what we need at the cost we pay at that time and not an inflated cost later.

 

if we are drafting two players we will be waiting on.  one a winger, one a defenseman.  What right now is the most glaring and critical need?  What about 3 years on?  We can find wingers, fairly easily.  Centres (rhc) and defense (rhd) not so much.  if we are not looking towards the future in our drafts than we are failing the players we have now

 

IE; If we are picking between Sale and Dvorsky.  Both say 2 years out.  Which one is the more glaring need based on our structure right now ?  What if it's between Yager and Cristal?

Ahh man. Probably go Barlow in that case. 

[HighOnHockey]

Just now, Warhippy said:

And I think you know full well that the draft is the best possible place to get exactly what we need at the cost we pay at that time and not an inflated cost later.

Yeah and playing the lottery is the best possible way to get what you want in life. A house? A car? For just 5 bucks!? Wow! Why bother paying that inflated price when you can get anything you want for a 5 dollar lottery ticket.

[wildcam]

1 minute ago, Warhippy said:

Jordan Schroeder was absolutely amazing as was Cody Hodgson and Olli Juolevi.  We gotta stop drafting or not kids based on one tournament

I agree and if drafting between #8 and #10 , I really like Reinbacher 6'2 RD

[stawns]

Cosentino has him #10, which is about where I said he'd be picked.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/sportsnets-2023-nhl-draft-prospect-rankings-march-edition/sn-amp/

[HighOnHockey]

12 minutes ago, hammertime said:

I'm not understanding your point. Is that a counter argument. We have an opportunity to take a player that would fill an ongoing need for our club. You can't play cards with a deck full of jacks. 

My point is we're having two separate conversations. I'm talking about the current team and this year's draft. You're talking about the team history.

[Odd.]

Any one of Reinbacher, Benson, Smith, Dvorsky, or Yager would be great.

 

Personally, if Reinbacher is off the board, I wouldn’t mind Dvorsky. Reminds me of Kopitar.

[wildcam]

1 minute ago, Odd. said:

Any one of Reinbacher, Benson, Smith, Dvorsky, or Yager would be great.

 

Personally, if Reinbacher is off the board, I wouldn’t mind Dvorsky. Reminds me of Kopitar.

Sure hope Reinbacher 6'2 is around between #8--#10 pick so hard to find young RD ..Dvorsky 6'1 C  would be a  good pick 

[Smashian Kassian]

I feel like I'm not as high on taking Smith as others.

 

He's got talent & awareness with the puck but not sure about his skating, shooting ability or defensive game as 'elite' skills. 2nd line playmaking C is what I see here, and I'm not sure that's what we need - what do others think?

[Warhippy]

18 minutes ago, HighOnHockey said:

Yeah and playing the lottery is the best possible way to get what you want in life. A house? A car? For just 5 bucks!? Wow! Why bother paying that inflated price when you can get anything you want for a 5 dollar lottery ticket.

Nothing personal here mate because I absolutely love how insightful and well thought out your analysis of the draft is.  What you bring to this board is incredible.

 

But that is a short sighted response and kinda comes across a bit...I dunno aggressive? in how it seems.  If I've pissed ya off at some point, my bad.  I do that frequently because I don't tend to think before i post or respond and most of it is entirely just response based and in no way personal.  But I am not sure I deserve that level of snark

 

In 2016 we could have drafted Hronek but instead we traded our pick.  A mere second and he was ours.  Instead, 7 years later we are trading a potential top 15 or undecided pick for him.  In 2016 we were screaming we need RHD like nothing else, and D in general.  We drafted OJ great, didn't work out.  But now, 7 years later we still need RHD and instead of simply drafting for it.  Since then we've drafted 40 players and only 3 of them RHD all while RHD remains for 7 consecutive seasons the single largest point of need for this club both on the roster and in the minors.

 

So you know.  Instead of simply paying for it up front.  Why not just buy high!  hell, Bitcoin at $70k, Gamestop at $380!  Buy high!!!

 

Honestly.  You will NEVER fix a problem if you don't address it at its source and the source for us lies at the draft and it has laid at the draft since 2006.  The foundation will crumble while you attempt to board up walls or replace windows and that's what we are looking at.  If we're not looking at the future, the long term future of this club than we're deluding ourselves in it's ability to compete.

 

And again, if I've somehow rubbed you the wrong way, my bad.  But in my opinion only.  We need to look towards the future because that's what the draft is for and about

Edited March 16, 2023 by Warhippy

[HighOnHockey]

2 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Nothing personal here mate because I absolutely love how insightful and well thought out your analysis of the draft is.  What you bring to this board is incredible.

 

But that is a short sighted response and kinda comes across a bit...I dunno aggressive? in how it seems.  If I've pissed ya off at some point, my bad.  I do that frequently because I don't tend to think before i post or respond and most of it is entirely just response based and in no way personal.  But I am not sure I deserve that level of snark

 

In 2016 we could have drafted Hronek but instead we traded our pick.  A mere second and he was ours.  Instead, 7 years later we are trading a potential top 15 or undecided pick for him.  In 2016 we were screaming we need RHD like nothing else, and D in general.  We drafted OJ great, didn't work out.  But now, 7 years later we still need RHD and instead of simply drafting for it.  Since then we've drafted 40 players and only 3 of them RHD all while RHD remains for 7 consecutive seasons the single largest point of need for this club both on the roster and in the minors.

 

So you know.  Instead of simply paying for it up front.  Why not just buy high!  hell, Bitcoin at $70k, Gamestop at $380!  Buy high!!!

 

Honestly.  You will NEVER fix a problem if you don't address it at its source and the source for us lies at the draft and it has laid at the draft since 2006.  The foundation will crumble while you attempt to board up walls or replace windows and that's what we are looking at.  If we're not looking at the future, the long term future of this club than we're deluding ourselves in it's ability to compete.

 

Apologies but I have no interest whatsoever in your second paragraph. And on the third paragraph, that's all fine and good, but as I've been saying to Hammer, that's the past. Not really relevant to the draft this year.

 

What I am interested in is the bolded part, and you're exactly correct. The source is always the draft. Draft more valuable assets than the other teams and the world is your oyster.

[EastCoastNucks]

15 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Nothing personal here mate because I absolutely love how insightful and well thought out your analysis of the draft is.  What you bring to this board is incredible.

 

But that is a short sighted response and kinda comes across a bit...I dunno aggressive? in how it seems.  If I've pissed ya off at some point, my bad.  I do that frequently because I don't tend to think before i post or respond and most of it is entirely just response based and in no way personal.  But I am not sure I deserve that level of snark

 

In 2016 we could have drafted Hronek but instead we traded our pick.  A mere second and he was ours.  Instead, 7 years later we are trading a potential top 15 or undecided pick for him.  In 2016 we were screaming we need RHD like nothing else, and D in general.  We drafted OJ great, didn't work out.  But now, 7 years later we still need RHD and instead of simply drafting for it.  Since then we've drafted 40 players and only 3 of them RHD all while RHD remains for 7 consecutive seasons the single largest point of need for this club both on the roster and in the minors.

 

So you know.  Instead of simply paying for it up front.  Why not just buy high!  hell, Bitcoin at $70k, Gamestop at $380!  Buy high!!!

 

Honestly.  You will NEVER fix a problem if you don't address it at its source and the source for us lies at the draft and it has laid at the draft since 2006.  The foundation will crumble while you attempt to board up walls or replace windows and that's what we are looking at.  If we're not looking at the future, the long term future of this club than we're deluding ourselves in it's ability to compete.

 

And again, if I've somehow rubbed you the wrong way, my bad.  But in my opinion only.  We need to look towards the future because that's what the draft is for and about

We just gotta trade Demko/Millar for who ever gets that first draft pick. Will fix our cap space for years, we can keep Petey and Hughes, Brock and Kuz.

 

[Smashian Kassian]

13 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Nothing personal here mate because I absolutely love how insightful and well thought out your analysis of the draft is.  What you bring to this board is incredible.

 

But that is a short sighted response and kinda comes across a bit...I dunno aggressive? in how it seems.  If I've pissed ya off at some point, my bad.  I do that frequently because I don't tend to think before i post or respond and most of it is entirely just response based and in no way personal.  But I am not sure I deserve that level of snark

 

In 2016 we could have drafted Hronek but instead we traded our pick.  A mere second and he was ours.  Instead, 7 years later we are trading a potential top 15 or undecided pick for him.  In 2016 we were screaming we need RHD like nothing else, and D in general.  We drafted OJ great, didn't work out.  But now, 7 years later we still need RHD and instead of simply drafting for it.  Since then we've drafted 40 players and only 3 of them RHD all while RHD remains for 7 consecutive seasons the single largest point of need for this club both on the roster and in the minors.

 

So you know.  Instead of simply paying for it up front.  Why not just buy high!  hell, Bitcoin at $70k, Gamestop at $380!  Buy high!!!

 

Honestly.  You will NEVER fix a problem if you don't address it at its source and the source for us lies at the draft and it has laid at the draft since 2006.  The foundation will crumble while you attempt to board up walls or replace windows and that's what we are looking at.  If we're not looking at the future, the long term future of this club than we're deluding ourselves in it's ability to compete.

 

And again, if I've somehow rubbed you the wrong way, my bad.  But in my opinion only.  We need to look towards the future because that's what the draft is for and about

 

2 minutes ago, HighOnHockey said:

 

Apologies but I have no interest whatsoever in your second paragraph. And on the third paragraph, that's all fine and good, but as I've been saying to Hammer, that's the past. Not really relevant to the draft this year.

 

What I am interested in is the bolded part, and you're exactly correct. The source is always the draft. Draft more valuable assets than the other teams and the world is your oyster.

 

I kinda agree with Hippy here. 

 

Not that you intentionally draft lesser players, but I think position & play style inherently come into ranking players - hence why drafts are always analyzed in tiers.

 

Much is made about the Juolevi pick but if they had taken a different D (Sergachev / Chychurn / McAvoy) I don't think we would be looking back at 'reaching for position' so poorly. (Though I do think Tkachuk was the last in a consensus higher tier at that point). Jesse Puljujarvi was also in a consensus higher tier, what if it was him that was available at 5 instead of Tkachuk? The correct choice is rarely obvious.

 

As far as the draft being an asset harvest, it is to some extent but trades require partners which the salary cap complicates - and again I don't think its always obvious who the best asset will be down the line. Taylor Hall was a great asset that didn't return commensurate value, whereas guys like Larsson / Ristolainen / Gudbranson / Trouba / exc were premium position players that got their teams great returns.

 

 

[hammertime]

nm 

Edited March 16, 2023 by hammertime

[HighOnHockey]

3 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

 

 

I kinda agree with Hippy here. 

 

Not that you intentionally draft lesser players, but I think position & play style inherently come into ranking players - hence why drafts are always analyzed in tiers.

 

Much is made about the Juolevi pick but if they had taken a different D (Sergachev / Chychurn / McAvoy) I don't think we would be looking back at 'reaching for position' so poorly. (Though I do think Tkachuk was the last in a consensus higher tier at that point). Jesse Puljujarvi was also in a consensus higher tier, what if it was him that was available at 5 instead of Tkachuk? The correct choice is rarely obvious.

 

As far as the draft being an asset harvest, it is to some extent but trades require partners which the salary cap complicates - and again I don't think its always obvious who the best asset will be down the line. Taylor Hall was a great asset that didn't return commensurate value, whereas guys like Larsson / Ristolainen / Gudbranson / Trouba / exc were premium position players that got their teams great returns.

 

 

Well, if the point is that RHD are inherently more valuable then sure, I'll take that argument and you build that into your rankings. It's still about the most valuable asset. Unfortunately these arguments are just all too often so over-simplified and unnuanced.