Jim Rutherford press conference

[whcanuck]

1 hour ago, Gurn said:

Was that before, or after Caleb poked his eye out?

Hahaha way before, that was the Halloween episode in season 2

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Kage17 said:

Personally I don’t think there is any chance it can happen. This team is rotten and needs a big overhaul, Horvat wants out and who knows if Petty wants out. If I were in their position I wouldn’t be resigning until I actually saw some good progress not just talk of it.

 

If management messes up this Horvat situation because they want young NHL players in return (which I think is unlikely in season) and they don’t trade him and he walks this team won’t recover for a long time.

There is no way our owner will let Bo go.  Bo will get extended, and so will Petey.  Reallocating cap on the supporting group is creating more cap to sign the core guys.  Miller, Bo, and Petey.  That’s the directive from the owner.  JR basically said as much today.  No rebuild.  Retool around existing core.  

[86Viking]

25 minutes ago, copperlynx said:

"We’re not moving toward a rebuild, I prefer the term retool,” says Rutherford."

 

I am hearing this nonsense since the last Stanley Cup final game that I attended.

Your not wrong but saying it with an aging core like the Sedins, Luongo, Bieksa, Burrows is a lot different than now with a younger core of Demko, Pettersson, Hughes. 2 of those are both elite players that this franchise has rarely if ever had at their given positions...

 

So to me retooling with the Sedins was a mistake where retooling with EP and Hughes is much easier to stomach as a Canuck fan

[24K PureCool]

God can it be March already?

 

At least when JR make this move we have something concret to levie charges on him or vindicate him. 

[Kage17]

Just now, Alflives said:

There is no way our owner will let Bo go.  Bo will get extended, and so will Petey.  Reallocating cap on the supporting group is creating more cap to sign the core guys.  Miller, Bo, and Petey.  That’s the directive from the owner.  JR basically said as much today.  No rebuild.  Retool around existing core.  

If Horvat is tired of this $hit show of a team  and wants out it won’t matter what the owner wants.

[Harold Drunken]

One has to wish that with all the doom and gloom and seeing that this club just can't catch a break....could this be the year we finally draw #1 overall? 

[86Viking]

6 minutes ago, Kage17 said:

Personally I don’t think there is any chance it can happen. This team is rotten and needs a big overhaul, Horvat wants out and who knows if Petty wants out. If I were in their position I wouldn’t be resigning until I actually saw some good progress not just talk of it.

 

If management messes up this Horvat situation because they want young NHL players in return (which I think is unlikely in season) and they don’t trade him and he walks this team won’t recover for a long time.

Horvat has ever right to chase the $ and sign with a team who makes the playoffs if he so chooses. For me, he has played at a Selke level, or been a consistent enough scorer and point producer to warrant a long term deal near or over 8m per season.

 

Long term I think it is right for the Canucks to trade Bo if he is wanting to get paid for what he is doing this season and not as a whole over his career to date. I remember far too often overpaying players never living up to their new contracts be it 4th liners or bottom pair D men the list is long for every team making those mistakes and the Canucks have done that enough already to get us in our current cap situation making it hard to pay Bo what his value is at right now...

[Alflives]

7 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Jacksonville did just fine firing Urban Meyer.  Rutherford is stupid enough to openly propose creating yet more dead salary.  When you have someone who is not only grossly incompetent, but also completely unwilling to act like a professional, you can't keep them around the organization.  There is simply no excuse for continue to employ a scumbag like Rutherford, and it is our duty as fans to drive him out of town before he does more damage by ensuring the ownership understand s he is not welcome here.

Sorry King, but JR is doing what ownership wants.  Imagine Alf is Aquilini.  Guess which character is JR?

 

[RWJC]

23 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Rebuild vs Retool:  Ok, so we tried to retooll in like 2013.  Benning was hired; we tried a retool on the fly for 2-3 years.  We then tried to do it again in like 2020.  Now we hear we are going to do it again.  Why?  With the 28th rated prospect pool in the entire league and bottom 5 for like 6 of the last 8 years.  Look at Anaheim since 2019.  LA since 2018.  How do they look?  Now look at Montreal over the last 18 months post covid SCF finals.  The amount of rebuilding they have done in 3 years or less vs what this has done to retool since 2014 is absolutely insane.  We don't just go pick up and acquire NHL ready players and pretend it's ok because depth and the lack of depth is what killed us from 2009-2013 when we were the best team in the league.

 

Core vs Supplementary Players:  Our core has been the core since 2018/2019.  Since then we have finished bottom 10 in the league almost exclusively.  That's about 5 years with the same people with what success? We can win with this core if we just add supplementary players?  Kind of seems that we've tried that for half a decade with zero success.  the last GM that managed to trade and sign quality supplementary players was Gillis.  At what point in time does this core need to be looked at and fixed?  Rutherford has seen this core in person for a year but also as a former GM for a few years as well.  He knows it isn't working but won't change things.

 

Picks vs Prospects:  Picks are GOLD.  We have zero depth and the 28th overall rated prospect pool.  We constantly trade picks because why not.  Dickinson needs to go?  Add a pick.  Hey lets spend a 3rd to get him but a 2nd to get rid of him.  The issue with this mentality of buying 20-21 year old prospects who may not be working out is crazy.  Dach cost the 13th OA pick while our 9th oa pick and some single year cap hits net us OEL and Garland.  What we need is well known to every single GM in the league and acquiring those players like Dach, Dobson, Nemec etc are going to cost us FAR more than the single draft pick we would use to draft them at their position.  This comment makes and made absolutely zero sense.  Teams will NOT do the Canucks any favours at all.  Oh you need an RHD that isn't working out here?  Hmm...we'll need something back plus a pick that cool?  

We also then STILL have zero credible or quality depth in development because we have not drafted them because we have expended our draft picks on Veys and Clendennings.  This comment should have been shouted down and absolutely called out for the short sighted view it is

 

Buyout vs Retention:  Buyouts are insane.  Buying out JT Miller right now would see the Canucks paying a MINIMUM of $1.5 million until 2037.  OEL $2.4 million until 2031.  Garland $1.9 million through 2029.  If we are to retain that $2.4 million on OEL we have half the league asking about him and we are only retaining that $2.4 million until 26/27 saving 4 years of cap space issues.  Miller?  $6.5 million miller is now wanted by everyone in the league and saves us 7 years of cap issues.  The absolute INSANITY of suggesting this as a viable option for any of our higher priced players is shamefully bad business management.  That retention vs buyout dead cap makes the players we claim as being unmovable more than moveable but highly valuable.  VS adding years upon years of dead cap.  I don't get it at all and the suggestion of it makes me nauseous both as a fan but also a a business owner.  Even Myers as a buyout is adding .333 million to our cap for an additional year vs retaining say .5 million or even 1 million and making him a viable asset for teams to want to trade for.

 

This is insulting and I think Boeser looks like potential target of a buyout and wouldn't that be peachy

 

Trades vs Cap and Assets:  He said he can't trade.  Contracts are impossible to move.  Can't do it.  No cap space.  But he signed 3 forwards to $20 million worth of contracts thus ensuring he can't do anything.  Wearing handcuffs of his own making.  Our best assets right now are in order Horvat, Kuzmenko and Schenn.  Horvat would bring back a quality return, Kuzmenko is found money and teams are rumoured to be all over him.  That's the kind of move you make for the future regardless of how good he's playing.  You make the trade and circle back in July.  Schenn as well.  He is at the helm of what could be the kick starting of a fast turn around for this team but will most likely wait until the absolute last minute.  There's a part of me that weeps at the idea of Kuzmenko pricing himself out of Vancouver and then having his rights flipped for nothing.

 

I don't wanna lose any of them but for the long term future of this team, the cap space needed to facilitate long term moves and Rutherford's statements of "the cap will go up so it won't be an issue in a few years" it has to happen.  2 of those assets need to move which would allow us some small amount of retention on other assets to ensure better returns.  The saddest part of everything today is that this took place when we should have been honouring Odjick.  But this is only followed closely by how insultingly short sighted and contradictory every statement Rutherford made was.

 

Minor surgery now major.  Core is great but we need major changes.  Can't make trades due to cap but the cap isn't an issue because it will go up.  Have no depth or assets but will look to bargain bin shop again.

 

Like...what the absolute hell, we literally just did this for almost 8 years.  Can't we just stop being so short sighted and actually do what literally every fan of the team, of the sport, every player and analyst and manager in the league knows needs to be done?

 

So sick and tired of having management and ownership treat the fan base like gd toddlers and pretending we won't do x or y because it's not their way.  We'll stop spending our dollars and see who blinks first

100%.

 

to a degree I also hold some in the fanbase accountable for this. We’ve been accepting of a marginally average  product for years all while being asked for patience and loyalty and of course, our support aka money. 
and we’ve provided it.
 

Many of the those same fans that have provided that blind loyalty express it on this message board. I respect it but not when it is used to condemn or classify others in the fanbase who have been vocal over the last few years about exactly what JR stated today. 
 

I commend the folks here who have routinely voiced their opinion and been objective about the reality of this club and it’s potential. Here’s to you all. Although what was conveyed today is in no way anything to celebrate, it is still a small prize for those of us who have been waiting for this franchise to either truly embrace real change/methodology with regards to our direction, or to finally exhaust everything in an attempt to keep this club together. Hopeful this attrition will have been worth it.
 

to the diehard loyalist fans who feel both dejected and disappointed, I’d like to propose that you use those emotions constructively and find a way to voice it. 

personally, as a longtime fan, I’d really like to see some pushback on ownership and a social media trend started whereby fans directly speak to the Aqualini group and hold them accountable.  Almost an ultimatum…we will continue to support this club in lean years, so long as you commit to a rebuild now.  
 

this team belongs to this city and is a strong market. The NHL will not allow it to be relocated. As supporters, we can protest a lot of things, but a trend where committed fans ask ownership to sell  the team or lose our support is one that could be quite powerful. We’ve given this ownership group lots of time…how many more years before their tenure is considered a failure? I’d like to see Aqualini in the hot seat for once rather than the blame be placed anywhere below. I will commend these owners for spending without limit to try and buy the right fit, but it hasn’t worked and it can no longer be our practice.

 

We require overhaul from the top down.

Aqualini should be next man up for the press.

[Baratheon]

1 minute ago, Harold Drunken said:

One has to wish that with all the doom and gloom and seeing that this club just can't catch a break....could this be the year we finally draw #1 overall? 

Works for me!  Hometown hero leads a tormented franchise to the promised land?  Why not?  Why can’t we be the Disney movie for once!?

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, Kage17 said:

If Horvat is tired of this $hit show of a team  and wants out it won’t matter what the owner wants.

Bo has his home here.  His wife and two young kids live here.  This is where he’s raising his family.  Bo wants to stay as much as our owner wants him to.  There will be a contract soon enough for Bo.  He will take a bit less to make sure his wife and kids can remain in their home.  

[King Heffy]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Sorry King, but JR is doing what ownership wants.  Imagine Alf is Aquilini.  Guess which character is JR?

 

No one in their right mind looks at the BS Rutherford is pulling and considers him fit for continued employment.  If he is actually allowed to continue destroying the franchise, I'm out.  Time to hit Aquaman in the wallet if he lets this worthless sack of **** continue to waste Vancouver's oxygen.

[King Heffy]

2 minutes ago, RWJC said:

100%.

 

to a degree I also hold some in the fanbase accountable for this. We’ve been accepting of a marginally average  product for years all while being asked for patience and loyalty and of course, our support aka money. 
and we’ve provided it.
 

Many of the those same fans that have provided that blind loyalty express it on this message board. I respect it but not when it is used to condemn or classify others in the fanbase who have been vocal over the last few years about exactly what JR stated today. 
 

I commend the folks here who have routinely voiced their opinion and been objective about the reality of this club and it’s potential. Here’s to you all. Although what was conveyed today is in no way anything to celebrate, it is still a small prize for those of us who have been waiting for this franchise to either truly embrace real change/methodology with regards to our direction, or to finally exhaust everything in an attempt to keep this club together. Hopeful this attrition will have been worth it.
 

to the diehard loyalist fans who feel both dejected and disappointed, I’d like to propose that you use those emotions constructively and find a way to voice it. 

personally, as a longtime fan, I’d really like to see some pushback on ownership and a social media trend started whereby fans directly speak to the Aqualini group and hold them accountable.  Almost an ultimatum…we will continue to support this club in lean years, so long as you commit to a rebuild now.  
 

this team belongs to this city and is a strong market. The NHL will not allow it to be relocated. As supporters, we can protest a lot of things, but a trend where committed fans ask ownership to sell  the team or lose our support is one that could be quite powerful. We’ve given this ownership group lots of time…how many more years before their tenure is considered a failure? I’d like to see Aqualini in the hot seat for once rather than the blame be placed anywhere below. I will commend these owners for spending without limit to try and buy the right fit, but it hasn’t worked and it can no longer be our practice.

 

We require overhaul from the top down.

Aqualini should be next man up for the press.

I'm fine to committing to a rebuild as long as it is conducted by someone competent instead of Rutherford.

[86Viking]

9 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Jacksonville did just fine firing Urban Meyer.  Rutherford is stupid enough to openly propose creating yet more dead salary.  When you have someone who is not only grossly incompetent, but also completely unwilling to act like a professional, you can't keep them around the organization.  There is simply no excuse for continue to employ a scumbag like Rutherford, and it is our duty as fans to drive him out of town before he does more damage by ensuring the ownership understand s he is not welcome here.

I never liked the JR hire, I wanted us to go in a different direction. JR brings a ton of experience and Canucks are stuck with Alvin and JR for at least another couple years. Major changes to the roster are more likely to happen before we see a President and GM get fired. Christ, we are already going to be hiring another coach...another mistake by us bringing in a coach unable to make a roster play a well rounded team game. Canucks have lots of offense but can't rely on a Bubble level of Demko to bail them out all year every year.

 

Canucks need to get the next coaching staff to bring in a system the players will commit to or out the door they go. That for me is the only reason I am in favour of bringing in Tocchet now...is to let him have a month coaching our team with his system and if guys don't backcheck like JT or players who can't defend and cover their man like Myers, OEL, Stillman basically any D not named Hughes (untouchable & Bear ( worth retaining depending on term and $) then the GM is going to seriously try to TRADE those players like a recently signed Miller or Kuzmenko if no new deal is signed by the TDL for example.

 

Then by moving out some players at the TDL and or at the draft it may give us an opportunity to better fill out some roles on our team in FA or via the trade market.

[Baratheon]

Just now, King Heffy said:

No one in their right mind looks at the BS Rutherford is pulling and considers him fit for continued employment.  If he is actually allowed to continue destroying the franchise, I'm out.  Time to hit Aquaman in the wallet if he lets this worthless sack of **** continue to waste Vancouver's oxygen.

If Aquaman fired JR then he’d just hire the next guy and say “hey… your job is to retool around this core”

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, Harold Drunken said:

One has to wish that with all the doom and gloom and seeing that this club just can't catch a break....could this be the year we finally draw #1 overall? 

Imagine how much extra revenue the league will generate with Bedard here as opposed to Arizona or another US city.  We would like

y pump 100+ million into the league.  Those US cities would be a fraction of that, and some non at all.  Be assured Betman will do all he can to see Bedard is a Canuck.  Just like he’s going to make sure Auston (pants down) Matthews will soon be a Coyote.  

[aGENT]

47 minutes ago, shiznak said:

I was more so alluding to the young players/second chance part. It’s hard to find a young roster player that teams are willingly to give up for nothing. Looking at the up and coming RFA class, who may be available. It doesn’t look very promising, especially on the defensive side. 

 

Retooling is fine, but you need to give up a good amount of asset in return for those young pieces. Brandon Hagel is a good example; Tampa gave up two young projects and two first for him. 
 

The inevitable Horvat trade will help a bit, but like I mentioned numerous times. I don’t see him getting us a massive haul (project prospect, a roster player, and a late first).
 

I mean Toews for 2 2nds worked out pretty well for COL. There's numerous examples of guys going on to good careers with new opportunity/change of scenery etc. Vegas was almost an entire team built on them!

 

As I said, hopefully better management, scouting etc can find more "Toews" and less "Veys".

[86Viking]

12 minutes ago, 24K PureCool said:

God can it be March already?

 

At least when JR make this move we have something concret to levie charges on him or vindicate him. 

Agreed, this TDL and upcoming draft and off season is going to be big for the Canucks. If they don't do much and lose some good assets for minimal to no return then the President and GM are going to start getting the majority of the blame. Then honeymoon 1st year is over for JR and PA now it is time to act and make moves to shake up this core and move this team forward...

[Harold Drunken]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Imagine how much extra revenue the league will generate with Bedard here as opposed to Arizona or another US city.  We would like

y pump 100+ million into the league.  Those US cities would be a fraction of that, and some non at all.  Be assured Betman will do all he can to see Bedard is a Canuck.  Just like he’s going to make sure Auston (pants down) Matthews will soon be a Coyote.  

I just have this feeling with all the heat and terrible luck this franchise is having maybe an amazing surprise is coming 

 

[Harold Drunken]

Also...I do respect JR for sitting there and taking his licks. He doesn't bs and answers pretty directly and takes full responsibility.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Harold Drunken