Provorov declines pre-game pride night skate

[Bad_BOI_pete]

42 minutes ago, babych said:

Suggesting being gay is a choice is certainly based in ignorance. 

 

I don't really have a comment on the religion part. 

 

As for the rest, we can be civil and respect that we see it differently. Also we agree that his stance is wrong.

 

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

He called being gay a "choice" (it's not) and his very public decision to actively not participate in a simple LGBTQ+ equality/tolerance/inclusivity (ie: nothing to do with religion) event, is in fact defacto support of the opposite. It's not neutral. It's actively making a point of being unsupportive.

 

I think it's hilarious people keep bringing up "attacking him for his religion". I've seen very few if anyone do so. I haven't ever even brought up religion once in this topic other than responding to people's posts about it. He's not being "attacked" (actually challenged) for his religion, he's being challenged for his bigoted views.

 

being naturally predisposed to enjoy something does not mean you do not have the choice to act on it. there are many people that enjoy kinks and persuasions that do not act on them because they are deemed unacceptable. no one is doomed to their sexuality because of genetics. However, being a sexual member of the LGBTQ+ society is not unlawful and is generally accepted by most north americans. Let us be happy that all of us humans can control our urges as long as we stay mentally well

 

I want to remind many of you that sexual preferences that are accepted in society change and adapt with time. and I have been preaching in this thread that Societal changes takes Generations and generations of time before they become accepted (especially because many older generations do not change their views).

 

Furthermore, certain societies will take longer to adapt to changes than others, for good example take members of the Russian orthodox church. Why? because their country was communist up to 1991 and was a very exclusive society that did not accept western ideologies. 5% of Russia still supports communism. We cannot expect changes to occur to peoples views and ideologies overnight and frankly shaming them has the reverse effect so infact what you are doing is slowing down change. people that shame these individuals are slowing down change and in fact are hurting pride movements

[Bad_BOI_pete]

Cancel culture is inherently wrong because it slows down change.

 

shaming people often has the effect of causing the person to feel less apart from society, and generally does not teach anything to that individual. infact the same thing that you are accusing people of "intolerance" is the same act that you are doing. again, an eye for an eye leaves us both blind.

[stawns]

3 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

Cancel culture is inherently wrong because it slows down change.

 

shaming people often has the effect of causing the person to feel less apart from society, and generally does not teach anything to that individual. infact the same thing that you are accusing people of "intolerance" is the same act that you are doing. again, an eye for an eye leaves us both blind.

and what does cancel culture mean to you?

[Bad_BOI_pete]

3 minutes ago, stawns said:

and what does cancel culture mean to you?

it has many different meanings for different types of the punishment's handed out.

 

for this instance i consider it shaming a person for not growing up in the same society as their own.

 

you probably wouldnt go to North Sentinel Island and be very popular.

[stawns]

1 minute ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

it has many different meanings for different types of the punishment's handed out.

 

for this instance i consider it shaming a person for not growing up in the same society as their own.

 

you probably wouldnt go to North Sentinel Island and be very popular.

Sorry, but IP is not being "shamed" for being from another culture.  

[CanucksJay]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

His actions are condoning intolerance towards LGBTQ+ people. So perhaps not concentration camps but yes, it is condoning inequality, intolerance and mistreatment of them. 

 

I understand it just fine, thanks.

 

 

Clearly you don't because you keep using the wrong word "intolerance" when I pretty mucb gave you the definition of the word. 

[Bad_BOI_pete]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

Sorry, but IP is not being "shamed" for being from another culture.  

he isnt? oh is he being celebrated?

[stawns]

1 minute ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

he isnt? oh is he being celebrated?

not for being from another culture he isn't, no

[Nucker 67]

Would you trade OEL for Provorov? 

[Bad_BOI_pete]

Just now, stawns said:

not for being from another culture he isn't, no

but in his culture it does not teach and preach acceptance of pride movements to the same degree as ours. maybe you might think that he was raised differently than us? what should we do to change that? Shame him until he relents?

[aGENT]

Just now, stawns said:

not for being from another culture he isn't, no

The tap dancing... first it was his religion, now it's his culture.

 

No, folks...he's rightfully getting called out for being an intolerant (just for you @CanucksJay ) bigot.  Religion and culture have nothing to do with it.

 

 

[stawns]

Just now, Bad_BOI_pete said:

but in his culture it does not teach and preach acceptance of pride movements to the same degree as ours. maybe you might think that he was raised differently than us? what should we do to change that? Shame him until he relents?

he's being challenged for being homophobic, not for being Russian or Russian orthodox.  I couldn't care less what "culture" he comes from

[aGENT]

33 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

 

being naturally predisposed to enjoy something does not mean you do not have the choice to act on it. there are many people that enjoy kinks and persuasions that do not act on them because they are deemed unacceptable. no one is doomed to their sexuality because of genetics. However, being a sexual member of the LGBTQ+ society is not unlawful and is generally accepted by most north americans. Let us be happy that all of us humans can control our urges as long as we stay mentally well

 

I want to remind many of you that sexual preferences that are accepted in society change and adapt with time. and I have been preaching in this thread that Societal changes takes Generations and generations of time before they become accepted (especially because many older generations do not change their views).

 

Furthermore, certain societies will take longer to adapt to changes than others, for good example take members of the Russian orthodox church. Why? because their country was communist up to 1991 and was a very exclusive society that did not accept western ideologies. 5% of Russia still supports communism. We cannot expect changes to occur to peoples views and ideologies overnight and frankly shaming them has the reverse effect so infact what you are doing is slowing down change. people that shame these individuals are slowing down change and in fact are hurting pride movements

FYI, the discussion isn't about how long bigotry takes to change in less liberal cultures around the world.

 

The discussion is that his publicly, actively choosing to not participate in this event, in the NHL, in North America, is not particularly welcome behavior, and is rightly being challenged for those actions.

[Coconuts]

[Bad_BOI_pete]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

he's being challenged for being homophobic, not for being Russian or Russian orthodox.  I couldn't care less what "culture" he comes from

I disagree. i think he is being challenged for his spirtuality that also does not accept LGBTQ unions. 

 

LOL you used the word challenged, nice. lets not pretend that people are merely challenging him.

 

Honestly, he said he is okay with peoples choices. I think he honours his churches wishes more than the pride movement so when presented the opportunity he chose to respect his religion. Frankly, many LGBTQ+ members do not come out because of fear of retribution from family and friends. we should not expect a member of the russian orthodox church to support pride movements, because it may cause extreme discomfort in his life. not wearing a rainbow hockey stick does not cause the LGBTQ+ community harm.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

FYI, the discussion isn't about how long bigotry takes to change in less liberal cultures around the world.

 

The discussion is that his publicly, actively choosing to not participate in this event, in the NHL, in North America, is not particularly welcome behavior, and is rightly being challenged for those actions.

again you used the word challenged. you are not challenging this man, you actively shaming him

[4petesake]

12 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

it has many different meanings for different types of the punishment's handed out.

 

for this instance i consider it shaming a person for not growing up in the same society as their own.

 

you probably wouldnt go to North Sentinel Island and be very popular.

Well I definitely wouldn’t be very popular on North Sentinel Island if I kept acting on religious or cultural norms that I grew up with while there. However having people challenge or debate my beliefs might be the least of my worries.

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

again you used the word challenged. you are not challenging this man, you actively shaming him

[stawns]

3 minutes ago, Bad_BOI_pete said:

I disagree. i think he is being challenged for his spirtuality that also does not accept LGBTQ unions. 

 

LOL you used the word challenged, nice. lets not pretend that people are merely challenging him.

 

Honestly, he said he is okay with peoples choices. I think he honours his churches wishes more than the pride movement so when presented the opportunity he chose to respect his religion. Frankly, many LGBTQ+ members do not come out because of fear of retribution from family and friends. we should not expect a member of the russian orthodox church to support pride movements, because it may cause extreme discomfort in his life. not wearing a rainbow hockey stick does not cause the LGBTQ+ community harm.

was he punished?  I think challenged is an appropriate word for how he's being dealt with.

 

I fully support his right not to participate, but there are consequences to actions and I hope he faces consequences more severe than he has thus far.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

6 minutes ago, aGENT said:

FYI, the discussion isn't about how long bigotry takes to change in less liberal cultures around the world.

 

The discussion is that his publicly, actively choosing to not participate in this event, in the NHL, in North America, is not particularly welcome behavior, and is rightly being challenged for those actions.

well guess what buckeroo, my guess is he choose to not particpate in the event because of his culture and how he was not indoctrinated into our society from birth. infact he was born into a russian society and raised as a russian orthodox christian. should we throw him in jail because he's diffrent?