[Report/Rumour] Elias Pettersson Contract Talks

[rekker]

6 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

also cant stand Rick. I have very little faith in him. I

I'm a huge fan of Tochett and how he is operating so far, same with the assistants. Should make for an interesting season for sure. 

[Citizen Erased]

11 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I'm not sure.

 

Seems par for the course, dont think on paper we look too much better than the start of last season. That said, our core is great and will have another year of development under their belt. 

I also cant stand Rick. I have very little faith in him. I cant wait for the season to start so that i can be proven wrong. I'm pretty sure that has happened at least once or twice in my life, but I cant quite remember. 

I’m sorry you feel that way, but I believe that the free agent signings should vastly improve the penalty kill and overall goals against deferential, in combination with the sound defensive structure Tocchet has implemented. 
 

Don’t get me wrong. It might not be enough to make the playoffs, but I think the team will definitely be better.

[RWJC]

We still have moves we can make during the season to shore things up too. It’s not like this roster is set in stone yet, and if the opportunity presents we could improve this club over the course of the season enough to perhaps make the playoffs, but just as important, to set a real foundation for what we have going into the next few seasons with QH and Demko still potential under market value. 
 

I don’t expect playoffs, I want them, but I do expect major growth and identity.

[Gawdzukes]

2 minutes ago, rekker said:

I'm a huge fan of Tochett and how he is operating so far, same with the assistants. Should make for an interesting season for sure. 

 

Me too!

 

I loved Tocchet as a player, even though I hated the Flyers. Played every single second, played the game the right way, tougher than nails, ornery, and could score too. What's not to like?

 

I also love what he has done in Vancouver and the things he's said and done. Exactly the type of tough love coach, fair, who is focused on player relationships, that I completely respect, and would go to the wall for.

 

Some people are critical of the gambling thing which I think is ridiculous. If only everyone in pro sports and on this board had their worst moments recorded for all to see I think we'd find that RT looks pretty favorable or no worse than anyone else. All he did was skirt around the law which was bullshit to begin with and now is perfectly legal with all sorts of famous people benefitting from it. It's like when I argued with my mom for 20 years about smoking weed and now I'm her best friend's edibles (health problems) dealer. 

 

Anyways, go Rick go, you have my seal of approval.

 

  

[ilduce39]

I think Drance was saying it’s hard to move the needle from the bottom of the lineup, and I’d normally agree with that, but our bottom 6 / PK was *such* a weak spot these additions have to help.  
 

From last season, we’ve lost Bo but added Hronek, Suter, Bleuger, Cole and Soucy.  
 

Perhaps most importantly, we should have a healthy Demko to start the year as well. It has to be better than last year.  The biggest hurdle has to be finding some chemistry early after all the turnover. 
 

Like others have said - playoffs? Not sure.  But we certainly look like a much more complete team.

[AnthonyG]

7 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

You are a super optimistic guy which is cool but you should temper that with reality too.

 

Calgary moved Toffoli but they still finished 10 points ahead of us, and had a down year. They could easily be better ... new coach too.

Edmonton finished 26 points ahead of us, regardless of the PP

LAK made some major moves and look to be on the rise (my biggest upward mover), only goaltending is a question, but is solvable.

SJS ... we'll see lol, could take some points off teams.

ANA ... will be strong soon but probably not this year

SEA ... very well rounded, well coached, lunchbox team (like CAR) they should be strong again.

VAN ... finished 12 points out ... remade d core and 2 middling bottom 6 centers. lost 31 goal center.

 

Correction: We are competing with VGK, EDM, LAK, SEA, CGY

 

It's possible but usually when I see people trying to downgrade others to make themselves better it's more of an indication of hopeful thinking than a reflection of reality.

 

I think the top 3 are going to be out of reach and we'd be awfully lucky to grab a wildcard.

nearly 1/3 of Edmontons goals were on the PP. 89/325. They dropped to 4th in scoring at 5v5 with 191GF. They drop to 6th in scoring at ES.

Calgary lost their top scorer AND has a long list of guys who demanded a trade out. There is dysfunction in that locker room, sure they got rid of Sutter, but now they are going to learn new systems which they say it takes roughly 2/3 of a season to figure it all out. Sure Sutter was a large part of the trade demands, but that tells me that team is extremely frustrated and on edge. Huberdeau needs to bounce back and at some point the writing is on the walls for Backlund, Mangiapanne etc, they will want a chance to win a cup, they will look around and see the team is a bit older, going in the wrong direction and struggling to compete.

 

Just remind yourself…. We finished 12 points out, with a 3.99GAA from Martin and our collective GSAA was -55….  The worst in the league. When Demko came back and Horvat was traded, we had a very strong record 16-7-3. JT went back to C and it was like we didnt notice Horvat was gone. That was good enough to have the 7th best win% in the league. Just think about that for a minute…. If Demko came back when he was originally supposed to and didnt suffer any set backs, how much closer to playoffs would we have been? If Demko didnt miss 1/2 the season, where would this team have finished?

 

There is only 1 team in that list that has a game breaker(s) and thats Edmonton. Vancouver has what is projected to be a top 3 scorer next year Pettersson = game breaker

Hughes = game breaker

Demko at his peak performance = game breaker

I dont see many if any teams in our div that have all 3. A Petey a Hughes AND a Demko. VGK makes a case with Eichel and Theodore, but Hill? He’s been a backup up until they decided to run with him in the playoffs. What will a full season look like?

 

I see last season as the 07-08 season and this upcoming season is going to be the 09-10 season.

 

 

[stawns]

16 hours ago, Citizen Erased said:

That’s exactly what it would be.

not if you got roster players (or combination of roster players, picks, cap dumps) back it wouldn't.  I tink they could easily have a quick turnaround

[stawns]

38 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

You are a super optimistic guy which is cool but you should temper that with reality too.

 

VGK ... Cream of the Comference

Calgary moved Toffoli but they still finished 10 points ahead of us, and had a down year. They could easily be better ... new coach too.

Edmonton finished 26 points ahead of us, regardless of the PP

LAK made some major moves and look to be on the rise (my biggest upward mover), only goaltending is a question, but is solvable.

SJS ... we'll see lol, could take some points off teams.

ANA ... will be strong soon but probably not this year

SEA ... very well rounded, well coached, lunchbox team (like CAR) they should be strong again.

VAN ... finished 12 points out ... remade d core and 2 middling bottom 6 centers. lost 31 goal center.

 

Correction: We are competing with VGK, EDM, LAK, SEA, CGY

 

It's possible but usually when I see people trying to downgrade others to make themselves better it's more of an indication of hopeful thinking than a reflection of reality.

 

I think the top 3 are going to be out of reach and we'd be awfully lucky to grab a wildcard.

Vegas is a bit of an enigma.......if the grind of the season wears Stone down, they could be vulnerable.

[rekker]

Just now, stawns said:

Vegas is a bit of an enigma.......if the grind of the season wears Stone down, they could be vulnerable.

Yip, and does their goaltending contine like it has or do they get Binningtoned? Almost all Western teams have some question marks, obviously some more than others. Some daggers here or there and it could be interesting. 

[Citizen Erased]

8 minutes ago, stawns said:

not if you got roster players (or combination of roster players, picks, cap dumps) back it wouldn't.  I tink they could easily have a quick turnaround

Mayhaps you are right. Good point.

[Citizen Erased]

4 minutes ago, stawns said:

Vegas is a bit of an enigma.......if the grind of the season wears Stone down, they could be vulnerable.

Not only that but the fatigue from having played so much playoff games since their inception into the league. It has to catch up to them at some point, even with roster turnover.

[Gawdzukes]

10 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

I think Drance was saying it’s hard to move the needle from the bottom of the lineup, and I’d normally agree with that, but our bottom 6 / PK was *such* a weak spot these additions have to help.  
 

From last season, we’ve lost Bo but added Hronek, Suter, Bleuger, Cole and Soucy.  
 

Perhaps most importantly, we should have a healthy Demko to start the year as well. It has to be better than last year.  The biggest hurdle has to be finding some chemistry early after all the turnover. 
 

Like others have said - playoffs? Not sure.  But we certainly look like a much more complete team.

 

Drance is a fool (my contract says I must state this every time I see his name).

 

Haha just joking but you make a good point. I think sometimes the smaller things can lead to greater success. The PK was so deflating that being solid there can lead to more confidence and pride all around. Add that to a more stable defence and consistent third line and everything starts to work a little bit better. It then gives the top 6 better starting positions. Maybe that's the push we need to get roiling? That chemistry you mention starts with things like banding together to kill off penalties.

 

I'm definitely way more positive and hopeful then I have been in 6 years.

[IBatch]

48 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

You are a super optimistic guy which is cool but you should temper that with reality too.

 

Calgary moved Toffoli but they still finished 10 points ahead of us, and had a down year. They could easily be better ... new coach too.

Edmonton finished 26 points ahead of us, regardless of the PP

LAK made some major moves and look to be on the rise (my biggest upward mover), only goaltending is a question, but is solvable.

SJS ... we'll see lol, could take some points off teams.

ANA ... will be strong soon but probably not this year

SEA ... very well rounded, well coached, lunchbox team (like CAR) they should be strong again.

VAN ... finished 12 points out ... remade d core and 2 middling bottom 6 centers. lost 31 goal center.

 

Correction: We are competing with VGK, EDM, LAK, SEA, CGY

 

It's possible but usually when I see people trying to downgrade others to make themselves better it's more of an indication of hopeful thinking than a reflection of reality.

 

I think the top 3 are going to be out of reach and we'd be awfully lucky to grab a wildcard.

It's tough to say.   Every year there are a few surprises,  and a few underperformers.   But this is pretty much bang on. 

[stawns]

3 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

Drance is a fool (my contract says I must state this every time I see his name).

 

Haha just joking but you make a good point. I think sometimes the smaller things can lead to greater success. The PK was so deflating that being solid there can lead to more confidence and pride all around. Add that to a more stable defence and consistent third line and everything starts to work a little bit better. It then gives the top 6 better starting positions. Maybe that's the push we need to get roiling? That chemistry you mention starts with things like banding together to kill off penalties.

 

I'm definitely way more positive and hopeful then I have been in 6 years.

Fixing the pk would be a huge shift for the fortunes of the team........easy to say, not so easy to do when you look at the pp's of some of the teams they have to jump

[stawns]

7 minutes ago, rekker said:

Yip, and does their goaltending contine like it has or do they get Binningtoned? Almost all Western teams have some question marks, obviously some more than others. Some daggers here or there and it could be interesting. 

I didn't their goaltending in the playoffs was any great thing.......I think they just play a solo d two way game and are great at limiting high percentage scoring chances 

[Gawdzukes]

7 hours ago, AnthonyG said:

nearly 1/3 of Edmontons goals were on the PP. 89/325. They dropped to 4th in scoring at 5v5 with 191GF. They drop to 6th in scoring at ES.

Calgary lost their top scorer AND has a long list of guys who demanded a trade out. There is dysfunction in that locker room, sure they got rid of Sutter, but now they are going to learn new systems which they say it takes roughly 2/3 of a season to figure it all out. Sure Sutter was a large part of the trade demands, but that tells me that team is extremely frustrated and on edge. Huberdeau needs to bounce back and at some point the writing is on the walls for Backlund, Mangiapanne etc, they will want a chance to win a cup, they will look around and see the team is a bit older, going in the wrong direction and struggling to compete.

 

Just remind yourself…. We finished 12 points out, with a 3.99GAA from Martin and our collective GSAA was -55….  The worst in the league. When Demko came back and Horvat was traded, we had a very strong record 16-7-3. JT went back to C and it was like we didnt notice Horvat was gone. That was good enough to have the 7th best win% in the league. Just think about that for a minute…. If Demko came back when he was originally supposed to and didnt suffer any set backs, how much closer to playoffs would we have been? If Demko didnt miss 1/2 the season, where would this team have finished?

 

There is only 1 team in that list that has a game breaker(s) and thats Edmonton. Vancouver has what is projected to be a top 3 scorer next year Pettersson = game breaker

Hughes = game breaker

Demko at his peak performance = game breaker

I dont see many if any teams in our div that have all 3. A Petey a Hughes AND a Demko. VGK makes a case with Eichel and Theodore, but Hill? He’s been a backup up until they decided to run with him in the playoffs. What will a full season look like?

 

I see last season as the 07-08 season and this upcoming season is going to be the 09-10 season.

 

 

 

I hear ya but in my 40+ years of playing and watching I think I've only seen a team sneak in once or twice because the entire set of competition shit the bed and drastically fell off the face of a cliff. They all have a tonne of but what ifs too. These are all hardcore athletes we're talking about here, and they are all as desperate to make it as we are.

 

What you're doing reminds me of what coaches would do when we made the final and had little chance of winning. Compliment all of your players, tell them the opposition sucks, and instill a sense of false confidence that has them come out flying to beat all odds.

 

I personally am pretty happy being in a position that can hopefully compete for a playoff spot. You can think we're a shoe in if it makes you feel happier about the year but I don't think it's as realistic as my assessment, which seems to align with the majority. By all means though I have no problem with you buying your playoff tickets tomorrow. 

Edited September 2, 2023 by Gawdzukes

[rekker]

14 minutes ago, stawns said:

I didn't their goaltending in the playoffs was any great thing.......I think they just play a solo d two way game and are great at limiting high percentage scoring chances 

You really have to admire the D they have assembled as well. Possibly the best six in the NHL.  

[stawns]

4 minutes ago, rekker said:

You really have to admire the D they have assembled as well. Possibly the best six in the NHL.  

solid team, no question.  However, they do have holes and couple bad breaks could swing their season the wrong way.

 

Really, there is such parity in the league, that luck really plays a significant role in the outcome of a team's season.  If the Canucks stay healthy and the Oilers lose McD or LD and Vegas loses a couple key guys, it could end up being Van on top of the Pacific

[rekker]

3 minutes ago, stawns said:

solid team, no question.  However, they do have holes and couple bad breaks could swing their season the wrong way.

 

Really, there is such parity in the league, that luck really plays a significant role in the outcome of a team's season.  If the Canucks stay healthy and the Oilers lose McD or LD and Vegas loses a couple key guys, it could end up being Van on top of the Pacific

So true. Teams have talent, but quality depth is tough to build post cap era. An injury to a key player can sink a season. 

[spook007]

18 hours ago, RWJC said:

Maybe we were close in your eyes, but built to be a playoff team? No chance.

Yes some improvements made for this coming season and Tocchet will also get a chance to prove his presence wasn’t just a bump as well but a lasting overhaul as to how this team views playing a full 60 min sound game at both ends of the rink. 
 

We’re getting there, but our direct competition is also improving at a similar pace. You need to take that into consideration as well. This team is still at the what if stage…they havent proven anything until they make the postseason. 
Then, only then, is it worth reminiscing or relying on how “close” they were as it’s currently moot. They simply didnt make the cut. Other teams suffered droughts, injuries, and their own misfortunes. No more excuses for this group. Mgmt realizes that as well.

 

 

This... they have 2 years to show, what they are made of... otherwise its time rebuild, while we have something worth while trading...