SamJamIam Posted May 27, 2013 Share Posted May 27, 2013 "Intangibles" ...........Ah the last resort of someone who has realised his bias hasn't taken him as far as he thought it would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangler696969 Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 He only tried because it was a contract year. He will probably have less production next year. Dump his rights for picks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Well, no. How many assists or goals does a rugged, complementary forward on Keslers line need? Because that is the replacement plan, somebody to clear the way for Kesler, not the other way around. Stats serve little purpose here. Matt Greene has horrible "stats" he will never win the Norris based on "stats", but he is exactly the kind of D man the Canucks should employ. Raymond doesn't offer intangibles, he is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 He only tried because it was a contract year. He will probably have less production next year. Dump his rights for picks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Also to argue this point... There are people that are listed at a certain position but actually play another position. Like Higgins playing centre? so now we are going to count Higgins production as a centre and compare him to wingers. Same as Burrows for that stint he played centre. Same as Roy who played from centre to wing... You can't simply ljust look at LW because listed position is not the same position as what they are playing so the best way would be to compare him to forwards in general. There's 30 teams and 90 1st line positions. Theres then 90 2nd line positions. This year was a very good indication of Mayray's performance Mayray averaged 0.48 pts per game so theoretically, his points per game average should put him at 135th spot on all forwards (if we are to say he is an average forward on 2nd line). Howevever, he is at 200 which is then mixed with 3rd liners. Now keep in mind some players only played a small number of games and their stats are inflated. However, this has the same affect on both sides of the average Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 LW is where Raymond and Higgins play the majority of their games. Burrows plays the majority on the RW. Roy played the majority of his games at C. Raymond played some center as well. The position listed is where a player spends the majority of his time. This is common throughout the league. I have no idea what list you're looking at, but Raymond was in fact tied for 133rd spot among all the leagues forwards this past season in points. Even tossing in d-men he sits tied for 160th. This is per NHL.com. So did you simply make up 200th thinking nobody would check? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tearloch7 Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 I could care less about regular season statistics in the overall scheme of things .. unless you can bring it in the playoffs, you dinna deserve a raise, MayRay .. veering to the corner, turning the puck over and THEN falling down? .. those are all things a League Minimum player can do .. with aplomb!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 I think all this is moot. MG is not going to re-sign Mayray. He chose Higgins over him with the limited cap space and I for one am THRILLED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 I think all this is moot. MG is not going to re-sign Mayray. He chose Higgins over him with the limited cap space and I for one am THRILLED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksJay Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Higgins has been giving a good impersonation of the "invisible man" in the last two playoffs. I suppose it's only par for the course that Gillis would give him a new improved contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 He only tried because it was a contract year. He will probably have less production next year. Dump his rights for picks People say this and it's, honestly, the dumbest thing ever. Generally, athletes love their job...they'd likely play even if they weren't getting paid. So to suggest their only motive in playing well is a pay raise is ridiculous...once you're "in" the game, you compete because it's in you. If you're at the point that you don't care anymore, most would likely pack it in at that point. He had a pretty significant setback and it's taking time to find his groove again, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkeeterHansen Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 People say this and it's, honestly, the dumbest thing ever. Generally, athletes love their job...they'd likely play even if they weren't getting paid. So to suggest their only motive in playing well is a pay raise is ridiculous...once you're "in" the game, you compete because it's in you. If you're at the point that you don't care anymore, most would likely pack it in at that point. He had a pretty significant setback and it's taking time to find his groove again, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BananaMash Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Hard to argue against some players having career years, in a contract year though. Could be coincidence, could be for the hefty raise. There isn't a doubt in my mind that some players are in it just for the paycheck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Bieksa used to be somewhat like that, I think he's fixed that a bit though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangler696969 Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 People say this and it's, honestly, the dumbest thing ever. Generally, athletes love their job...they'd likely play even if they weren't getting paid. So to suggest their only motive in playing well is a pay raise is ridiculous...once you're "in" the game, you compete because it's in you. If you're at the point that you don't care anymore, most would likely pack it in at that point. He had a pretty significant setback and it's taking time to find his groove again, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 No. You are simply wrong "super moderator". Look throughout the League. A countless amount of players start to stink once they get their big pay day, when the season before they were on fire. Coincidence?? Rick Nash? David Booth? Bieksa? Cammalleri? I could go on and on. It is so ignorant and wrong to actually think that there isn't a correlation between contract years and "heart" or motivation. You need to get real. Players reach a point where they have played so much hockey where its only really the money that motivates them. I doubt Raymond is any different. This was Raymond's year to prove himself, and he actually put up decent numbers, at least decent enough to get him a 3mil+ contract for 3 years that he's always strived for. Once he gets that i'm sure he'll be back to the 35-40 point area. Then the third year will hit and he will have a break out year because he will have to play for another contract and prove that he earned it. Generally when you discuss a new deal, only the most recent year is dissected and analyzed. Sports are a business of "What have you done for me lately?". Get it? It is so comical that a "super moderator" of this board can have such a simplistic view of today's NHL and sports in general. Raymond fits this team no longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bite me Burr Posted May 28, 2013 Author Share Posted May 28, 2013 "Intangibles" ...........Ah the last resort of someone who has realised his bias hasn't taken him as far as he thought it would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bite me Burr Posted May 28, 2013 Author Share Posted May 28, 2013 Wouldn't that depend entirely on who replaces him? Without knowing who his replacement is you can't say who would make the team better. Somehow I don't think your suggestion actually makes the team better than Raymond does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangler696969 Posted May 29, 2013 Share Posted May 29, 2013 I love how you mention 4 and say countless. Cammalleri........2010-11 He then missed a month of play when he suffered a separated shoulder after being crosschecked into the boards Bieksa........lost his best friend in tragic circumstances in 2011 He still put up record points in season 2011-12 This season he was plagued with injury and line changes. David Booth.........We all know his injury history and it is still happening Rick Nash.........the year after his raise 2010-11 he scored 1 point less in one less game. This year he was on schedule for 79pts. The intervening season the whole team dipped and remember we are talking about Columbus. So maybe you should think before you call someone "ignorant" or wrong. I would totally agree that there would be no reason for a player to let his form dip. In any case you have so many other things to factor in. The team's form, his partner's form, is he being asked to do too much in a team not performing, is he fit? Possible external factors. I'm sure there are just as many cases where the opposite has happened. Bobby Ryan for instance or Anse Kopitar or Brent Burns. Not content with insulting the lady you accuse her of "having a simplistic view" when in fact not only does your view seems prejudiced but it could be argued more simplistic to the point where you rule out all other factors that may affect a players performance. Even something so simple of trying too hard or even good or bad luck. We are all entitled to our opinions, even you but it serves no purpose to appear to be trying to belittle someone for their heartfelt views. I would suggest an apology might be the gentlemanly thing to do now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luongo_01 Posted May 29, 2013 Share Posted May 29, 2013 11/12 55 gp 10g 10 a 20pts +4 in a contract year. Took a pay cut. So much for your theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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