Brad Marchand Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 hour ago, RUPERTKBD said: The telling AB for me was Vladdy (again) in the 7th... All of a sudden, he can't catch up to 96 MPH....It's not like there was any deception there....the sliders were all 2 feet off the plate, so he knew the heater was coming.... Pretty much the whole team's hitting approach seems broken. Bichette himself mentioned it last month, guys can't decide what pitches they want to swing at (except maybe Davis Schneider) so they're always late on fastballs or chasing breaking pitches off the plate. It would be one thing if it was just one or two players, but almost the entire team's power numbers are down from last year (home runs, slugging percentage etc). They hit and get on base well enough, but they can't consistently drive in runs and it feels like part of the reason is because they aren't hitting for power nearly enough. The team's management and front office have talked quite a bit about laying off and hitting to the opposite field but most of their players are pull hitters. It's dumb and reductive, but I miss the days when the team encouraged players to take bigger swings and pull the ball more. At least it was more exciting when they lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 12 minutes ago, shiznak said: Ladies and gentlemen, it’s been a privilege playing with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 minute ago, Brad Marchand said: Pretty much the whole team's hitting approach seems broken. Bichette himself mentioned it last month, guys can't decide what pitches they want to swing at (except maybe Davis Schneider) so they're always late on fastballs or chasing breaking pitches off the plate. It's one thing to be caught between pitches, but in this case, the breaking balls were nowhere near the strike zone. Vladdy had to know that the fastball was coming, but he still couldn't catch up to it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 Yep, this season has now reached Derek Fischer territory... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
van_ws Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 The Blow Jays are frauds. The team gets hyped up as WS contenders the last couple of years they haven't even won one f**king playoff game. This year's group is simply unwatchable, at least previous teams were more entertaining and could hit some HRs at least. Give me Bautista/Encarnacion over Bo/Vlad any day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 10 hours ago, van_ws said: The Blow Jays are frauds. The team gets hyped up as WS contenders the last couple of years they haven't even won one f**king playoff game. This year's group is simply unwatchable, at least previous teams were more entertaining and could hit some HRs at least. Give me Bautista/Encarnacion over Bo/Vlad any day. I get the frustration, (and I share it) but I'd argue that the hype going into the season was warranted. The Jays had dramatically improved their team defense and had added another effective starter to the rotation. IMO, there are two things that the pundits could not have predicted for this Blue Jays team....the massive drop in production and the struggles of Alek Manoah. 1 - Manoah was supposed to be the ace of the staff. A Cy Young nominee last season and this year's opening day starter.....it was the biggest regression by a Jays' pitcher since Ricky Romero.... 2 - Right now, Vladdy leads the team in HRs with 22. Twenty two.....who would have thought going into this season that the Jays would not have a single 30 HR guy? Right now, Vladdy is their only player with more than 20.... In this era of specialized relievers and seemingly every team having guys that throw in triple digits, it's harder and harder to win with small ball. You absolutely need the 3 run homers to be successful and this year's Blue Jays have done that far less often than they did last season. We have seen dramatic drop offs from Guererro, Varsho, Kirk, Chapman and to a lesser extent, Bichette and Springer. At this year's Trade Deadline, I was advocating for the Jays to try and trade for Teoscar Hernandez. At the time, it wasn't a popular opinion, because the perception was that Teo was having a poor season in Seattle. But as of today, his batting average and HR totals are exactly what he finished last season with. If he was on the Jays, his 25 homers would lead the team, as would his 88 RBI. In addition, he would be providing some much needed protection for Vladdy. This season has been a mess and like many people here, I place a lot of the blame on John Schneider. Many of his in-game decisions have been inexplicable, especially when he does something completely different the next time he's faced with the same situation. That being said, I still think the optimism at the start of the season was justified. This team should be a contender. They just have too many guys who are performing well below their normal level. In fact, I'd say that other than the pitching staff, (which has generally been very good) the only players who performed at the level we would have hoped this year are Bichette, Merrifield, Jansen and Kiermaier.....and two of those guys have a hard time staying healthy.... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bounce000 Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 Makes you think what really happened to the team morale/chemistry/vibes when they traded away Teo and Lourdes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 50 minutes ago, Bounce000 said: Makes you think what really happened to the team morale/chemistry/vibes when they traded away Teo and Lourdes. Maybe....but they're a mentally weak group indeed, if that were the cause of this season's struggles. They're supposed to be professionals. Players moving in and out is part of the professional game. Always has been. Look at the Braves.... they lost their leader (and former league MVP) and they haven't missed a beat. (granted, trading for Matt Olson to replace him eased the blow somewhat) The Rays have been doing it for decades.... I think some of us might be reading too much into it....I think that too many guys on the roster picked the same year to have bad years offensively. There's the Manoah fiasco as well, but even without him, this pitching staff should be good enough to win with. They just aren't getting the run support..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Monahan Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 hour ago, RUPERTKBD said: the only players who performed at the level we would have hoped this year are Bichette, Merrifield, Jansen and Kiermaier. I’d throw Belt in there too. No complaints about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 2 minutes ago, Sean Monahan said: I’d throw Belt in there too. No complaints about him. His start was awful, but once the summer kicked in, he was everything the team hoped for. I left him off that list because he just can't seem to stay in the lineup long enough to make a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Monahan Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 minute ago, RUPERTKBD said: His start was awful, but once the summer kicked in, he was everything the team hoped for. I left him off that list because he just can't seem to stay in the lineup long enough to make a difference. That’s fair. The fact we’ve been relying on guys like Belt, KK, and the Buffalo crew to be key cogs of the offence says all we need to know anyway. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 minute ago, Sean Monahan said: That’s fair. The fact we’ve been relying on guys like Belt, KK, and the Buffalo crew to be key cogs of the offence says all we need to know anyway. Yep. Just imagine where this team would be without the play of the Buffalo boys.... Here's a little something to put things in a bit of perspective though.... Although Vladdy's poor plate discipline is a big reason for his struggles this year, it's worth noting that he's actually younger than all of the Bisons call-ups. In fact, even though he's in his 5th pro season, he's still the youngest guy on the roster..... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Monahan Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 1 minute ago, RUPERTKBD said: Yep. Just imagine where this team would be without the play of the Buffalo boys.... Here's a little something to put things in a bit of perspective though.... Although Vladdy's poor plate discipline is a big reason for his struggles this year, it's worth noting that he's actually younger than all of the Bisons call-ups. In fact, even though he's in his 5th pro season, he's still the youngest guy on the roster..... Yeah, I saw that the other day and I was a little shocked. It’s definitely premature to say Vladdy will never be anything more than a slightly above average bat based on this season, but I do think it’s fair to question if he’s this generational bat to anchor the middle of the lineup that we thought he might be 2-3 years ago. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mj2345 Posted September 15, 2023 Share Posted September 15, 2023 Blue Jays at 4pm and Dodgers/Mariners on SN1 at 7pm 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mj2345 Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Cleveland beat Texas 12-3 Today.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mj2345 Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Dodgers are up 4-1 on Seattle in the 6th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 20 hours ago, RUPERTKBD said: I get the frustration, (and I share it) but I'd argue that the hype going into the season was warranted. The Jays had dramatically improved their team defense and had added another effective starter to the rotation. IMO, there are two things that the pundits could not have predicted for this Blue Jays team....the massive drop in production and the struggles of Alek Manoah. 1 - Manoah was supposed to be the ace of the staff. A Cy Young nominee last season and this year's opening day starter.....it was the biggest regression by a Jays' pitcher since Ricky Romero.... 2 - Right now, Vladdy leads the team in HRs with 22. Twenty two.....who would have thought going into this season that the Jays would not have a single 30 HR guy? Right now, Vladdy is their only player with more than 20.... In this era of specialized relievers and seemingly every team having guys that throw in triple digits, it's harder and harder to win with small ball. You absolutely need the 3 run homers to be successful and this year's Blue Jays have done that far less often than they did last season. We have seen dramatic drop offs from Guererro, Varsho, Kirk, Chapman and to a lesser extent, Bichette and Springer. At this year's Trade Deadline, I was advocating for the Jays to try and trade for Teoscar Hernandez. At the time, it wasn't a popular opinion, because the perception was that Teo was having a poor season in Seattle. But as of today, his batting average and HR totals are exactly what he finished last season with. If he was on the Jays, his 25 homers would lead the team, as would his 88 RBI. In addition, he would be providing some much needed protection for Vladdy. This season has been a mess and like many people here, I place a lot of the blame on John Schneider. Many of his in-game decisions have been inexplicable, especially when he does something completely different the next time he's faced with the same situation. That being said, I still think the optimism at the start of the season was justified. This team should be a contender. They just have too many guys who are performing well below their normal level. In fact, I'd say that other than the pitching staff, (which has generally been very good) the only players who performed at the level we would have hoped this year are Bichette, Merrifield, Jansen and Kiermaier.....and two of those guys have a hard time staying healthy.... I think the management was so hard pressed on improving the team’s defense, because of the collapse to the Mariners. That they totally forgot, they actually need to score runs first. I mean, what’s defense good for, if you’re trailing in the game? Really all they had to do was trade one of Lourdes or Teo (preferably Lourdes). Sign Kiermaier, Bassitt, and Belt. Trade one of Kirk, Monero, or Jansen for bullpen help. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 3 hours ago, shiznak said: I think the management was so hard pressed on improving the team’s defense, because of the collapse to the Mariners. That they totally forgot, they actually need to score runs first. I mean, what’s defense good for, if you’re trailing in the game? Really all they had to do was trade one of Lourdes or Teo (preferably Lourdes). Sign Kiermaier, Bassitt, and Belt. Trade one of Kirk, Monero, or Jansen for bullpen help. I agree. Before it all went down, I wanted to move Kirk and Gurriel. Keep Teo, because on an expiring contract, his value was likely less than LGs.... I love Kirk, but he's just such a liability on the basepaths....I would have much rather kept Moreno..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Pretty much a perfect day on the out of town scoreboard, with the Rangers, Astros and Mariners all losing.... There's a bit of a reason for optimism, because the Rangers and Mariners still have several games against each other. (7, IIRC) Still, it means nothing if the Jays can't take care of business. They still have games left against the Rays, who all of a sudden look like the team that started the season... The Jays did get the win yesterday, but it was a bit of a mirage. Boston actually out hit them. The reason for the win is because Vladdy ran into one of those three run homers I was talking about yesterday....and Berrios was outstanding.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bounce000 Posted September 16, 2023 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Merrifield has just fallen off a cliff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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