zombieksa Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Nashville matches regardless of whether it's Philly or Canucks letterhead. Moot point. Philly's was the 14 year deal that Nashville is currently hit with for the rest of his career. Vancouver's offer was for 1 year which, matched or not, meant Weber was a UFA the following season. Not a moot point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksSayEh Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Lets just blame Torts, it's clearly his fault for asking Edler to be a competent defenseman. We shouldn't have to coddle a 28 year old 5million dollar man. If he can't carry a pairing, he needs to go. We already have enough complementary pieces. Cheaper and better ones at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Philly's was the 14 year deal that Nashville is currently hit with for the rest of his career. Vancouver's offer was for 1 year which, matched or not, meant Weber was a UFA the following season. Not a moot point. Still no guarantee he comes to Van after that 1 year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombieksa Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Still no guarantee he comes to Van after that 1 year... Also no guarantee he doesn't Also no guarantee Nashville matches after he signs it. 4 first round picks for a player that signed a one year offer sheet just to become UFA the following season? Seems like the smarter choice if that were the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Philly's was the 14 year deal that Nashville is currently hit with for the rest of his career. Vancouver's offer was for 1 year which, matched or not, meant Weber was a UFA the following season. Not a moot point. And Weber chose to sign the lifetime deal before the new CBA knocked them down a peg. Could he have got more dollars as a UFA? Nope because term and other restrictions became a consideration in the new CBA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Also no guarantee he doesn't Also no guarantee Nashville matches after he signs it. 4 first round picks for a player that signed a one year offer sheet just to become UFA the following season? Seems like the smarter choice if that were the situation. You think trading 4 first round picks for a guy who can walk to any team one year later is a smart choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70seven Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I think Sami Vatanen would be a real nice PMD and PPQB to play beside Edler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Also no guarantee he doesn't Also no guarantee Nashville matches after he signs it. 4 first round picks for a player that signed a one year offer sheet just to become UFA the following season? Seems like the smarter choice if that were the situation. This: And Weber chose to sign the lifetime deal before the new CBA knocked them down a peg. Could he have got more dollars as a UFA? Nope because term and other restrictions became a consideration in the new CBA ...and that: You think trading 4 first round picks for a guy who can walk to any team one year later is a smart choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riviera82 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Why would we need to trade away any of our D? This lineup looks pretty slick to me. Hamhuis-Bieksa Edler-Tanev Garrison-Corrado Stanton All that lineup is missing is a #1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 What does Linden see in Edler we all don't? I don't get it. Well speaking personally, I'm glad he seems to think we can get him back to his best. For me he never recovered his relationship with Tortorella after he humiliated him on the bench. His form plummeted from there, as did the team's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kragar Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 There have been many comments blaming Torts for Edler's play last year... comments I am on board with. Did anyone pay attention to him in the Olympics? I didn't watch much so I can't comment, but it would be interesting to see how well he did compared to his teammates under a different coach, presumably one who can appreciate his style and skill set. Just a thought... I don't know either way. I just thought it could give an interesting perspective to how much impact the coach has on him and the style he was asked to play. I've got my fingers crossed for a bounce-back year for a number of the guys, especially Edler. If he returns to what he can be, and Garrison figures out how to put shots in the net rather than too many feet away from it, our D would be quite solid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonz Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Normally you can't blame the coach but Torts set a lot records for the team last season and they weren't good records. Too many players had off season, he either has the worst luck or his style of play just didn't work well with the majority of the team. The only players I hear praising him is Hamuis and Tanev. Which shouldn't be a surprise. How many times we see hamuis get first pp unit without producing any points at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.53 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 There have been many comments blaming Torts for Edler's play last year... comments I am on board with. Did anyone pay attention to him in the Olympics? I didn't watch much so I can't comment, but it would be interesting to see how well he did compared to his teammates under a different coach, presumably one who can appreciate his style and skill set. Just a thought... I don't know either way. I just thought it could give an interesting perspective to how much impact the coach has on him and the style he was asked to play. I've got my fingers crossed for a bounce-back year for a number of the guys, especially Edler. If he returns to what he can be, and Garrison figures out how to put shots in the net rather than too many feet away from it, our D would be quite solid. I thought he played great in the olympics. I remember coming to the conclusion that it most likely was Torts fault because he played great. Kind of suspicious that he sucks, then plays well as soon as Torts isn't his coach, and then sucks again when he is. Torts is the kind of coach who needs certain players because he makes players adapt to him. Edler, and the Canucks for that matter, need a coach that adapts to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurgerKing Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Lets just blame Torts, it's clearly his fault for asking Edler to be a competent defenseman. We shouldn't have to coddle a 28 year old 5million dollar man. If he can't carry a pairing, he needs to go. We already have enough complementary pieces. Cheaper and better ones at that. None of those guys are as good offensively as Edler. Even after a horrific year he was tied for most goals by a d on this team, despite playing 19 less games than Garrison. It makes no sense to trade him now, his stock is likely at an all-time low. Not everyone is born with the right mindset to be successful on their own, if he requires a bit more attention to be a great player it's not a big deal. There are only a handful of guys in the NHL who are that big, fast and offensively gifted; that's why he gets 5 mil a year and that's why you give him every opportunity to turn it around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 There have been many comments blaming Torts for Edler's play last year... comments I am on board with. Did anyone pay attention to him in the Olympics? I didn't watch much so I can't comment, but it would be interesting to see how well he did compared to his teammates under a different coach, presumably one who can appreciate his style and skill set. Just a thought... I don't know either way. I just thought it could give an interesting perspective to how much impact the coach has on him and the style he was asked to play. I've got my fingers crossed for a bounce-back year for a number of the guys, especially Edler. If he returns to what he can be, and Garrison figures out how to put shots in the net rather than too many feet away from it, our D would be quite solid. Played very well alongside (surprise!) a talented PMD in Karlsson. Hmmm....that sounds familiar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanucksSayEh Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Well speaking personally, I'm glad he seems to think we can get him back to his best. For me he never recovered his relationship with Tortorella after he humiliated him on the bench. His form plummeted from there, as did the team's.Humiliate is a strong word. All Torts did was chew him out, and he damn well deserved it. Eddie has been slipping for a lot longer than that. Every athlete in the world gets ripped now and then, no matter how good they might be. Mostly in plain sight. If that's all it takes to rattle him, then he's gotta go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckster33 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014   It's no surprise that our defence went down-hill after Mitchell, Salo and Ohlund left this team. When they were all on our team at once we had 3 calm, steady defensive defencemen with Bieksa and Edler bringing the offence (I believe Kraijeck was also on our blueline at the time). That chemistry was hard to match amongst defences and was a big reason we made the playoffs in 2007 and only lost to the Cup winners. Then in 2011, look at our defence: Edler - Salo Hamhuis - Bieksa Ehrhoff - Tanev/Ballard Another perfect mix of offensive defencemen (Edler/Bieksa/Ehrhoff) and defensive specialists (Salo/Hamhuis/Tanev) Now look at our defence of last season: Edler - Garrison Hamhuis - Tanev Bieksa - Stanton Defensive defencemen (Hamhuis/Tanev/Stanton a bit) are playing with each other and offensive defencemen (Edler/Garrison/Bieksa) really don't have that traditional defensive defenceman to play with. Furthermore, guys like Edler, Garrison and Bieksa are particularly nervous defencemen. They aren't young or inexperienced, they just panic a lot and make mistakes which add up and make situations worse, which is how they get scored on often - not just by making one mistake, but by compounding those errors. With calming veterans like Mitchell and Salo, they wouldn't make stupid plays worse, they would fix them up. Now over the last 3 seasons we've seen Edler and Bieksa in particular fall apart. These "nervous" defencemen need someone to calm them down, and I'd hate for that huge responsibility to fall on young Tanev's shoulders.this idea of a 'calming influence' is a fallacy son - maybe its semantics but players aren't 'nervous'. what the issue is, is often players such as some of those you mentioned simply make higher risk plays (Bieksa for instance). If paired with a defensive, mobile player, often that player is able to cover for those errors (Hammer). result, less risk, higher reward if it works (risky pass, jump up the ice, pinch etc). problem is when you don't have that stay at home, mobile guy, well then errors end up in your net. the other issue you are ignoring is systems and forwards. defense is a much easier position if the forwards play a hard 2 way game and are positioned properly not only on the backcheck but as importantly on the break out. often what common fans view as a 'defenseman error / Bieksa /Edler brain fart' actually is the result of hard pressure and the FORWARDS either blowing the zone too early or not being in a lane / position to provide that defenseman with support and an outlet. for example, people often blamed edler for having passes picked off and turned over in our end. but if you look at many of them, they were dumps up the boards when in trouble. they weren't often up the middle into danger zones (and if they were often it was because there was a opposing player on the boards protecting that dump so he had little choice but to try to find a lane to get it out), that folks is a forward issue and system issue not a defenseman. Yes he (edler or any dman) has to recognize that issue sooner (that he has no outlets) but its not always on the dman, he needs a lane to get the puck through. And if his choice is throw it up the middle where a guy will pick it off for sure, or try and push it up the boards where he may have to get it through someone, but at worst be able to play that player physically if it is picked off, what decision do you make? the same one. alot of this falls on coaching and systems as coaches need to recognize their players' strengths and weaknesses/ team strengths and weaknesses. The canucks dont have a Karlsson, a Subban etc. A guy who can elude a hard forecheck and skate it up ice. They have mobile 2 way defenders but not elite skilled defenders. Even then, those teams don't have one of those guys on each pairing! Therefore, you cant have a system that leaves your defenders without multiple outlets / options on the break out. Teams today (watch LA and the NYR are often putting TWO guys in deep to force the one defender with the puck. Forwards need to be back deeper, if they see that, they need to be cognizant of the pressure being placed on their dman and provide support. Just as you the see the Sedins in the offensive zone cycle and support when one of them faces pressure, so too do forwards have to play a similar role for their dmen in the defensive zone. Did any Edler haters see much support last year? Not me! this is why Linden wants to keep him...I played and coached hockey competitively guys, more to it than simple nervousness, or Edler sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrible.dee Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 maybe Benning and Linden know a bit more than you sucky baby Quote of the day!!! haha!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyAL Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Edler has always been inconsistent, one week he'll look good then he's a deer in the headlight for 3 weeks, at 28 years old it's hard to believe that is going to change much. He's probably already told Linden he's not waiving his NTC, last year Murph talked to him about it and Elder's quote was something along the lines of "You don't just sign a 5 year NTC contract just to waive it the first year." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrible.dee Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Humiliate is a strong word. All Torts did was chew him out, and he damn well deserved it. Eddie has been slipping for a lot longer than that. Every athlete in the world gets ripped now and then, no matter how good they might be. Mostly in plain sight. If that's all it takes to rattle him, then he's gotta go. No, humiliate is the right word. That was live on NBC, major network TV all across the continent. He could have sent the message without saying a word, bench Edler for a couple of shifts and leave it at that. I think spasms like that lost the respect of the locker room. I would think most of our veteran team listened to that and thought: "God...we have 6 year old for a coach?" Thrown in the Calgary incident (Which I thought was hilariously entertaining) where I'm sure the team was thinking: "So what if they are starting thier 4th line? start the Sedins and NOTHING will happen!" And you have a team that doesn't trust it's coach, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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