jdatb Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Miller got an NTC? Wow. I am shocked that Benning didn't learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canucks1527 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Anyone who doesn't line what benning has done with the organization has unrealistic expectations. Kessler wanted out, benning didn't want someone here who didn't want to be here. All things considered, we got a decent return for him. Much better than puttsburgh offered at the deadline. He freed up tons of cap room, brought us a solid starting goalie, brought in grit, drafted very well, and changed the look of this team. I haven't been this excited to watch Canucks hockey since 2011. And as far as a Ntc for miller, it's on a 3 year contract! He didn't pull a gillis and offer up 5 years at millions more than a player deserves with a Ntc. You haters watch, in 3-4 years we will be a contender again and the hockey between now and then will be much more exciting to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuongo Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 You really have no idea what you're talking about. I'm going to take a wild guess and say that Benning knows more about hockey and how to run a team than you do. Congratulations on reaching 'legendary' status on NHL14 btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ugli Fruit Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I also don't get the point of signing Miller. Signing what seems to be more or less an American Luongo? It conflicts with the team's future based signings and moves Guess we will see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goalie13 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I really feel that GMMG was fired prematurely and wished he was given at least 1 more year. At least until after the draft.... I really feel that GMMG was fired at the right time. Keeping him for another year risked having him make a bunch of ludicrous desperation moves just to keep his job. The best time to fire a coach or GM is at the end of the season in order to give the new team the best opportunity to set things right before the next season starts. While I agree that the team did turn around initially after his hiring, I disagree that he had the right vision for this team. He lucked out when Sundin turned down his &10M 2-year offer. Had Sundin accepted that offer, our genius GM may not have had the cap space in order to re-sign the Sedins the following year. He dodged a bullet there. The rest of Gillis' time here seemed more like trial and error than having vision. As for Miller, I mostly like that deal. I don't feel Lack was ready for full-time NHL starter duties. The only part of the Miller signing I don't like was the dollars. I think he would have been a better deal at $4M, giving JB a little more cap space to play with for the rest of the team. The goalie is the most important position on the team and he just signed the best goalie available to a reasonable length contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 When your argument stated: "I was never happy with MG's firing and I think it was too early". You lost all credibility right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.53 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Miller got an NTC? Wow. I am shocked that Benning didn't learn. When you are trying to sign big time free agents, NTCs are par for the course. (Is that the right phrase?) I actually don't really fault gillis that much on his NTCs. Gillis had a million and a half problems, but signings was one thing he was decent at, and really, when you're chasing FAs, just like how they get to sometimes name their price, they can call for a NTC. And if you don't give it to them, then you can kiss that signing goodbye. Oh but btw, Miller has a limited NTC. If asked, he has to submit a 5 team list that he will agree too, which I think isn't bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I trust these guys more in their opinions about the Hockey Business and they say Benning has done a good job as the GM so far https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnwq3b7J8N8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthecivil Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I am amazed any player wants to play here what with all the drama. I thought a few days to cool off would get the lemmings from tossing themselves over the cliff back under control but I guess not. The team is going to get worse before it gets better. Deal with it. Kesler had to go. Deal with it. There was no chance that we were going to trade up to number one in the draft. Deal with it. Lack was not ready to start 82 games. Markstrom isn't ready to start any. We needed a goalie. Deal with it. Guys fresh from the draft are not going to be stepping into the lineup and filling gaps by the start of the season. If they do it's a miracle. Deal with it. We are starting to fill the bank up with young players. So there's hope one day. It's just not this season. Deal with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erkayloomeh Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I agree with OP to some extent. People around here are too hard on Gillis and are prematurely giving tl and gmjb to much praise. It will take time to really assess them. I was wondering the other day what Jim Benning would have done with the luongo signing at the time. Could he have signed him to a better contract? Seems to me lou held all the cards on that one and if gmmg had of let him walk you'd all be bitching till this day. people are far to critical of gillis and dont consider the circumstances surrounding some of the things he did. That said, so far I like the mentality of the type of players the current regime is bringing in (with the exception of miller). If there is a plan in place to get a really good asset for lack then maybe maybe Miller makes sense. Otherwise that 6 million could have gone towards a scoring forward. say what you want about vanek but the guy can put the puck in the net and for only another 500 k.what could he have done for our pp? The sedins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viking mama Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Regarding OP's comments on Miller's contract: I so agree. It was clearly an over-payment when VAN had all of the leverage....not the player. Benning gave a patronage-contract to a friend, here...let's not kid ourselves. And - where the heck was Laurence Gilman when all of this was going down?! Out of town?! Couldn't he have talked some sense/cents to these guys?! Apparently, JB & Trev think they can just burn money or something! All of that extra CAP-room earned off the backs of those home-town discounts & thrown-away players.. like Garrison & Santorelli...and they end-up making a decision like that! A couple of million a year off of Miller's gift-contract... would have helped to pay for some sorely-needed additional-scoring... either now or later. When I heard the terms....compared to Hiller's in CGY...this was my reaction, too. BTW: Props to all of you..coming to the defense of Ryan's gorgeous wife. That line of attack on CDC is despicable... & will likely be reported. Clean-up your act - mickleson...or enjoy the ban. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcbigdawg Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 It seems obvious here, that many do not understand the rebuild process. Linden and Benning use words that are purposely meant to help mitigate the pain of the statement "REBUILD". I don't like it either, but it is what it is and I am eagerly excited to see what the future has in store. Let's be honest here, Benning is a GM with experience in the rebuilding process, he knows what it takes and understands that the process takes time. I think people need to accept that management, and thank god! is not going to waste the time and future of this team on overpaid free agents and meaningless trades. We have become accepting of this from the previous landlords of this team that started back before Gillis. lets have a quick look into the process of a good rebuild in Los Angeles as an example of what we should expect in the next 5-6 years. LA, Boston, Pittsburgh, Anaheim, have all gone through this process and look what it got them in return and there fans. I just included major pieces LA Kings Drafting: 2003 - Dustin Browne 2005 - Anze Kopitar 2005 - Jonathen Quick 2007 - Alec Martinez 2007 - Dwight King 2008 - Drew Doughty 2009 - Kyle Clifford 2010 - Tyler Toffoli 2012 - Tanner Pearson Trades 2008 - Jarret Stoll 2009 - Justin Williams 2010 - Aquired pick for Tyler toffoli 2011 - Mike Richards 2012 - Jeff Carter 2014 - Marion Gaborik Free Agent signings Dustin Penner - Really the only significant free agent signing at draft or during free agency My point is, all of the last several Stanley cups were built and not bought through good scouting, drafting, and timely trades to fill holes that drafting and internal development could not address. Its just been to long since we have seen this process to understand it is in fact what is needed and I say bring it on and give me some hope for the future of this franchise. Im all in and ready to support this team and the young group that is going to need it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinatcc Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Regarding OP's comments on Miller's contract: I so agree. It was a clearly an over-payment when they had all of the leverage....not the player. Clearly Benning gave a patronage-contract to a old friend ,here. And - where the heck was Gilman when all of this was going down?! Out of town?! Couldn't he have talked some sense/cents to these guys?! Apparently, JB & Trev think they can just burn money or something! 6 Million for 3 years is fair, both have equal amount of leverage. Miller is declining and so is Vancouver, yet Miller could have landed to another team (Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, even Pittsburg or Washington). 6 Million is an ok cap and only for 3 years and by that time expectation is Lack will be a NHL starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.53 Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 A big thing here that I don't think people realize in GMing, is that it's a two way street. People have this video game, arcade like understanding of what GMs can do. They come out and say, go get this guy or that guy, but don't realize the other guy also has to pick our offer in a field of 15 other offers. Yes, we wanted a top 6 winger, but here's the thing, so do 29 other teams. And there were like 6 or 7 available. We had little to no chance at getting any of them because they simply do not want to come here. Our situation in being one of the bottom feeders starting to go into a rebuild. Tough to find big name free agents itching to come to that situation. Just because we have a bunch of cap space, doesn't mean we can just buy whoever we want. No, all we can do is try and convince the player, give him a contract and hope he bites. Sometimes they do, but most of the time they don't. For all you guys saying we shouldn't have gotten Miller, ok then what do you do with that cap space? We had other offers out, for example, Jarome Iginla. They didn't take. I'd much rather spend the money upgrading our decent goaltending, than not use it at all. It would be nice if we could just hand out contracts as we see fit, but unless the player has a reason to come to Vancouver, there really isn't much Benning can do. We didn't make playoffs last year, and we're not booming with potential so why would someone like Paul Stastny, or Matt Moulson sign here? I like the Miller signing purely because he is the best impact player we could get, that actually had significant mutual interest in getting a deal done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck luck Posted July 2, 2014 Author Share Posted July 2, 2014 TC's opening post immediately reminded me of the type of people who call in to the TEAM 1040 to complain. Benning has done a great job in changing the culture and structure of this team in a very short period of time. No one knows how this team will perform come October, so for you to call Miller a distraction, and a bunch of the other claims you're making are completely unfounded. Gillis did some good things for this organization, made some key signings and drafted some great players for the future. He also set this team back 5-6 years in goaltending by trading TWO starting goalies away for peanuts which became a league-wide joke. Try going on other teams' message boards around the league to see what they think of Gillis and the Canucks then, and how they view this team now under the leadership of Benning and Linden. Complete night and day and these guys have only been on the job for three months or less. I agree....somewhat. I have said it's still too early to tell and I'm trying to give Benning the benefit of the doubt...but from what I've seen so far, things are questionable. I'm not trying to trash B & L... just a summary of things thus far. I still support them and wish them the best, but I will never trash GMMG for his work done or to show support for B & L. One thing for certain is that Miller is a distraction.... he is known for it and also likes to call his teammates out. I've done a lot of reading on Miller lately and this is what I've gathered. I'm not sure what other claims you're talking about so I can't talk about them... You CANNOT blame GMMG for trading both goalies, it was the coaches fault. MG is not responsible for who plays during the games and Loungo is gone because Torts decided to play Lack instead for the outdoor game. Stupid and dumb move...and Torts was hired by the owner not GMMG. If we go back even further, Loungo initially wanted out because AV decided to make Lack the #1 during the Playoffs when it was really unnecessary and uncalled for. Had AV realized that goaltending wasn't the issue than we'd never have been caught up in this goaltending fiasco in the first place. Blame needs to be put on those responsible...not whoever's convenient. And I have gone on other message boards and I still don't care what others think about us... I do know that the perception of GMMG was negative and effected his trading partners/options so I am happy that we have a new GM that others will trade with. I am and was quite content with others hating us ......but lets face it, the hate will return Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viking mama Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 6 Million for 3 years is fair, both have equal amount of leverage. Miller is declining and so is Vancouver, yet Miller could have landed to another team (Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, even Pittsburg or Washington). 6 Million is an ok cap and only for 3 years and by that time expectation is Lack will be a NHL starter. That's not what I meant ...Miller got 6 Million per year....I would have offered 4 Million per year...that would have left 2 extra Million to add to what is already available to pursue additional-scoring as other players are cut & moved as necessary... for their own team's needs. If Miller wanted to nergotiate better than that...they could try. But - 4th highest paid tender in the league @ 6 million per for Miller was ridiculous coming-off a few seasons & a bad play-off run with poor stats & little or no recent success with his 2 previous teams. I was NOT suggesting that they offer Miller 2 Million per,... how did you come to that conclusion? I will edit a fix to that... if my point was not made clear enough. Sorry. Explain Hiller's contract,...and why is it either fair or unfair compared to Miller's then. please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck nit Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 You CANNOT blame GMMG for trading both goalies, it was the coaches fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuck nit Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 That's not what I meant ...Miller got 6 Million per year....I would have offered 4 Million per year.. How does that measure up with the other GM's offers that wanted Miller? Burrows was paid $8m last year and $6.5m this year and he is hardly a top ten NHL winger. http://www.capgeek.com/player/662 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackcanuck Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 The return that Benning got on the Kesler(#2C) trade compared to the return that Murray got on the Spezza(#1C) trade It wasn't even close. Both GM's were under very bad circumstances Murray was actually in a much better position with a long list of teams to deal with Benning had 1 team and under the circumstances did fantastic! Bonnino(#3/#2C/W), Sbisa(#5/#4D),1st Rd pick(McCann) Murray got schooled for Spezza, so much for experience Nill(rookie GM) clobbered Murray Alex Chiasson, who tied for fourth on the Stars in scoring last year with 35 points in 79 games, but was a team-worst minus-21; as well as Nicholas Paul, the 101st player chosen in the 2013 entry draft, and Alex Guptill, who went 77th overall in 2010. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShakyWalton Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 6 Million for 3 years is fair, both have equal amount of leverage. Miller is declining and so is Vancouver, yet Miller could have landed to another team (Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, even Pittsburg or Washington). 6 Million is an ok cap and only for 3 years and by that time expectation is Lack will be a NHL starter. Probably on another team... Does everyone think that Lack will hang around 3 more years as a backup? I personally think he will be traded and Markstrom and Eriksonn will fight for backup, a 2 year contract would have been good enough..probably to much,,Lack needs to play to get better,,not sit on the bench as a backup for another 3 years,,he will be pushing 30 by then...I cant see this ending any other way, dont kid yourself, Miller will want the bulk of the games and will get them at 6 mil per year. I hope this doesnt turn out to be another goalie controversy ,I know Eddie is a nice guy but this move doesnt exactly show confidence in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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