kingofsurrey Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 Wish we would have moved Hank and Danny after 2011. Holding on to all those vets and denying the rebuild till 2017. Looks like this strategy has now cost Benning his job. Father time stands still for no one. Canucks needed to get younger a long time ago. Should have listened to Torts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knucklehead91 Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 On 1/24/2018 at 9:04 PM, EdgarM said: Why is it when guys like you come forward you always have the same lines as bolded above but NEVER state the obvious: They will be 38-39 years old next year. Their offensive numbers are on a steady decline(not getting better) Their defense is atrocious and it is making harder and harder for the coach to shelter their minutes. Their passing and shooting strength is seriously noticeable. There is 2 of them that MUST play on the same line The cap space saved by not signing them could make a big impact for this team moving forward. They deserve the 17 great seasons they had here but it is time to move on now. Why is it we need to rush any one single prospect into a rebuilding team? What is one more year for guys like Pettersson, Lind, Gadjovich, Gaudette, Goldobin, Dahlen or Lockwood (if he recovers and can effectively change his playstyle after surgery) to spend one more season grooming before being brought up. The Sedins are still capable of putting up 50-60 points effectively. Who carried the load when Horvat, Baertschi and Sutter went down? The Sedins were putting up a point a game without them. With reduced ice-time they have been effective and putting up .65pts/game. Which I believe would be higher if Horvat didn't go down and were facing lower level of defensive shutdown lines. 55-60 points would have been good enough to be in the top 50 last year 60 points was top 40. Considering only one player broke 100 points last year and that was McDavid, the next closest was Crosby at 89. Having two 55pt players on your second or perhaps 3rd line next year is not going to hinder the success of the team or stall the rebuild. So you want to get rid of two players capable of 55-60 point pace at a 1 year deal low dollar value, when the whole purpose of them resigning is to groom the crop for one more season because this is a REBUILD. Comparing players +/- 5 points of the Sedins on better teams, better quality of linemates, contract lengths and value, I dont think the Sedins are doing all that bad or need to hang them up. When you are missing 2/3 of your top line, and your top 2 centres, its not hard to shut down Boeser and the Sedin line. Matthews: 41GP 22g 15a 37pts 1st overall Toffoli: 49GP 18g 12a 30pts Ehlers: 50GP 19g 18a 37pts Mantha: 46GP 16g 14a 30pts Aho: 45GP 16g 21a 37pts Arvidsson: 45GP 15g 15a 30pts Zuccarello: 49GP 8g 29a 37pts J. Staal: 49GP 14g 16a 30pts Couture: 44GP 20g 16a 36pts whats his issue? Fiala: 46GP 13g 17a 30pts Zucker: 49GP 19g 17a 36pts J. Bratt: 47GP 12g 18a 30pts Rakell: 45GP 18g 18a 36pts Hoffman: 47GP 12g 18a 30pts Landeskog: 44GP 17g 19a 36pts D. Sedin: 48GP 11g 19a 30pts E. Kane: 49GP 16g 20a 36pts B. Little: 50GP 10g 20a 30pts C. Keller: 50GP 14g 22a 36pts Steen: 45GP 10g 20a 30pts J. Thornton: 47GP 13G 23a 36pts 38 years old. D. Stepan: 50GP 9g 21a 30pts R. Smith: 48GP 12g 24a 36pts Lucic: 49GP 9g 21a 30pts 5 more years of that and declining very fast LOL. W. Nylander: 51GP 10g 26a 36pts O. Palat: 46GP 8g 22a 30pts E. Haula: 44GP 17g 18a 35pts Simmonds: 49GP 16g 13a 29pts D. Brown: 49GP 15g 20a 35pts Hornqvist: 47GP 15g 14a 29pts Vanek: 44GP 14g 21a 35pts K. Connor: 44GP 15g 14a 29pts J. Schwartz 31GP 14g 21a 35pts Perreault: 38GP 15g 14a 29pts Schmaltz: 45GP 13g 22a 35pts Hertl: 48GP 14g 15a 29pts P. Stastny: 51GP 11g 24a 35pts A. Henrique: 49GP 13g 16a 29pts J. Neal: 48GP 22g 12a 34pts T.J. Oshie: 43GP 11g 18a 29pts Tkachuk: 47GP 16g 18a 34pts Dadonov: 39GP 10g 19a 29pts F Forsberg: 37GP 15g 19a 34pts Okposo: 47GP 9g 20a 29pts -17 Pavelski: 48GP 10g 24a 34pts K. Turris: 43GP 8g 21a 29pts Marner: 51GP 7g 27a 34pts Hischier: 49GP 8g 21a 29pts Gourde: 49GP 17g 16a 33pts Kadri: 49GP 17g 11a 28pts R. O'Reilly: 48GP 13g 20a 33pts Zibinejad: 41GP 14g 14a 28pts Heinen: 43GP 11g 22a 33pts Galchenyuk: 49GP 12g 16a 28pts Debrincat: 49GP 17g 15a 32pts D. Brassard: 47GP 12g 16a 28pts Toews: 49GP 14g 18a 32pts R. Johansen: 44GP 5g 23a 28pts Buchnevich: 49GP 13g 19a 32pts E. Lindholm: 48GP 14g 13a 27pts Kerfoot: 45GP 12g 20a 32pts Janmark: 50GP 13g 14a 27pts JT Miller: 50GP 11g 21a 32pts T. Pearson: 49GP 10g 17a 27pts Zetterberg: 48GP 6g 26a 32pts H. Sedin: 48GP 2g 30a 32pts Pacioretty: 49GP 16g 15a 31pts Nugent-Hopkins: 46GP 16g 15a 31pts 1st overall, never broke 60 points, rushed early and injured. J. Skinner: 49GP 15g 16a 31pts M. Backlund: 49GP 9g 22a 31pts J. Williams: 49GP 9g 22a 31pts Getzlaf: 26GP 6g 25a 31pts van Riemsdyk: 50GP 19g 11a 30pts Ferland: 48GP 19g 11a 30pts some other guys that missed the 5 point spread . Bozak: 50GP 8g 18a 26pts Drouin: 44GP 7g 19a 26pts MINUS 22 P. Marleau: 51GP 16g 9a 25pts *2nd overall draft pick* 38 years old, 2 more years at 6.25mil. Guentzel: 41GP 15g 10a 25pts MINUS 15 RICK NASH: 50GP 15g 10a 25pts MATT DUCHENE: 47GP 11g 14a 25ts -8. *3rd overall draft pick* COREY PERRY: 39GP 8g 17a 25pts Pierre-luc Dubois: 49GP 10g 12a 22pts *3rd Overall draft pick* Jason Spezza: 49GP 7g 14a 21pts *2nd Overall draft pick* 34y/o Pominville: 49GP 9g 11a 20pts 35y/o Hartnell: 33GP 7g 4a 11pts *6th Overall pick* 35y/o. Vrbata: 35GP 5g 8a 13pts 36y/o PATRICK SHARP: 45GP 6g 7a 13pts 36y/o Now for those young prospects that have been rushed into the NHL. Max Domi: 50GP 3g 18a 21pts this season. 12th overall draft pick. 190gp 111pts career. Not bad career wise, but terrible this season.. Nail Yakupov: 42GP 9g 6a 15pts....... 1st Overall draft pick. Nolan Patrick: 40GP 3g 6a 9pts..........2nd Overall draft pick. Jesse Puljujarvi: 32GP 9g 6a 15pts 4th Overall draft pick Tyson Jost: 37GP 4g 11a 15pts 10th overall draft pick Lawson Crouse: 83GP 6g 7a 13pts 11th overall draft pick Sam the 18y/o Bennett: 208GP 37g 43a 80pts 4th overall draft pick .34pts/game average. Jake Virtanen: 108GP 13g 11a 24pts 6th overall draft pick Jared McCann: 132GP 15g 22a 37pts 24th overall draft pick Oh and Duclair, having a hard time on the Coyotes and is off to his 3rd team. 39GP 10g 9a 19pts between ARZ and CHI. And you want two vets off the team to.....See what? Another prospect like Virtanen and McCann rushed, who are having hard times contributing offensively. You wanna turn Pettersson into Yakupov? Gaudette into Nolan Patrick? Lind into Puljujarvi? Lets not rush our prospects and ruin their confidence. Give them another year to adapt to NA style of hockey/ice size.Let the Sedins continue to play 12-14 mins a game putting up .65pts/game pace on the second or third line for one more year and let them sign their last contract. They have earned the right to do so and deserve to go out on their terms not the fans, owners or management, just to put young guys in a spot to fail. They are still capable of playing at this level and being effective. Dont turn a rebuild into what has taken Edmonton... well they are still continuing their rebuild and those contracts they gave Draisaitl and McDavid along with the 6 million dollar man Lucic, are going to put them even further back on rebuilding until they can afford D or goaltending. Clearly they arent done rebuilding. Then there is Colorado who has also taken awhile and struggled in the basement for a very long time with good draft picks rushed right out of the draft or D+1. Toronto has also taken an eternity to get back into a competitive spot. Not every draft pick that is thrown in right away struggles to produce at a high rate, but the large majority of them do. Confidence is key, some guys lose it quickly and never find it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 On 1/28/2018 at 3:28 AM, alfstonker said: So what you are saying is the Twins are only there to promote professionalism as a culture (whatever that means) to players expected to become leaders? I doubt that is what we need. I honestly think all the mentoring and "professionalism" guff is just self perpetuated rumour, heresay and myth. There are plenty of great professionals in this team. We also lost some recently in Burr, Bieksa, Hamhuis, Hansen, Dorsett. We need to move on. As I said before, there is more to mentoring than telling someone to sit up straight at the table. There is a whole area involving how you handle yourself, how you stick up for your team mates, how you set an example with push back and grit, how when there is nothing left you find a way - even if it means answering the bell. I do not see much if any of that in the Twins and that is why this team needs a new identity. Joe Sakic - zero NHL fights Steve Yzerman - zero NHL fights Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 On 1/26/2018 at 11:25 AM, TheGuardian_ said: KHL teams will accept a buyout. This management group should have known that the Tryamkin's didn't like where they lived and helped find other accommodations. This time around there should be no problem. He did find other accommodations - in home sweet home Russia. He wasn't living on skid row here. I thought he had a place in Yaletown. He was simply unimpressed with our "drug city". As in people smoking pot everywhere. What area doesn't have pot smokers? Particularly downtown. Even at that, when did it become managements job to babysit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Balboa Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Baggins said: Joe Sakic - zero NHL fights Steve Yzerman - zero NHL fights Sakic had 2. Yzerman had 9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Baggins said: Joe Sakic - zero NHL fights Steve Yzerman - zero NHL fights Yippee you found 2 great players neither of which, as far as I know lacked push back or indeed allowed their faces to be speed bags. Does this look like a fight in the NHL to you? The point is he had a line. The Twins don't apparently. At the risk of sending you off to look for another gif this also seems to be a "fight" Not much of one I grant you but there would have been a parade in the city if Danny had done even this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 3 hours ago, Baggins said: He did find other accommodations - in home sweet home Russia. He wasn't living on skid row here. I thought he had a place in Yaletown. He was simply unimpressed with our "drug city". As in people smoking pot everywhere. What area doesn't have pot smokers? Particularly downtown. Even at that, when did it become managements job to babysit? Yes it must have been a culture shock coming from Yekaterinburg to Vancouver. Vancouver's drugs problem being 6% worse than his home town. Kudos for his ability to spot the difference though - maybe a career as a sniffer dog down the line if the hockey doesn't work out for him. But at least he would have been able to take his wife out at night for a quiet stroll in Vancouver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 hour ago, alfstonker said: Yippee you found 2 great players neither of which, as far as I know lacked push back or indeed allowed their faces to be speed bags. Does this look like a fight in the NHL to you? The point is he had a line. The Twins don't apparently. At the risk of sending you off to look for another gif this also seems to be a "fight" Not much of one I grant you but there would have been a parade in the city if Danny had done even this. 1 hour ago, alfstonker said: Yippee you found 2 great players neither of which, as far as I know lacked push back or indeed allowed their faces to be speed bags. Does this look like a fight in the NHL to you? The point is he had a line. The Twins don't apparently. At the risk of sending you off to look for another gif this also seems to be a "fight" Not much of one I grant you but there would have been a parade in the city if Danny had done even this. I don't know if holding on for dear life when the other guy drops the gloves could be called fighting. lol I guess this counts..... http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/gotta-see-it-komarov-henrik-sedin-roughing-it-up/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyndall2 Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 I won't be disappointed if the Sedins retire or don't get resigned. However, if they are offered another year here are a few caveats I would like to see: 1. They are not on the first line power play. They waste too much time trying to get the perfect passing play only to miss good opportunities to shoot the puck. 2. $2 million a year max 3. The captaincy is given to someone else on the team other than a Sedin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 6 minutes ago, alfstonker said: Yes it must have been a culture shock coming from Yekaterinburg to Vancouver. Vancouver's drugs problem being 6% worse than his home town. Kudos for his ability to spot the difference though - maybe a career as a sniffer dog down the line if the hockey doesn't work out for him. But at least he would have been able to take his wife out at night for a quiet stroll in Vancouver. That's all very nice but it was the smell of pot everywhere he and his wife didn't like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 I can't see Trev NOT re-signing the Sedins. What would be his logic? They're too old and slow? They still put up 40-50 points a season. They're too expensive? Not if they re-signed for one year ($3m each). That's $8m free and clear next season. They can still provide leadership and offence, and with Elias and Jonathan possibly coming up next y year, the Canucks may want to have them here for on more year. Trev respects the Sedins too much to show them the door when they aren't ready to retire. On the other hand, seeing Boeser excel at the All Star game, and having Horvat as the future captain, it's easy to want to move on from the past and look to the future. I hope they give the C to Horvat next season. Horvat - C Henrik - A Daniel - A Del Zotto - A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 11 minutes ago, Baggins said: I don't know if holding on for dear life when the other guy drops the gloves could be called fighting. lol I guess this counts..... http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/gotta-see-it-komarov-henrik-sedin-roughing-it-up/ Sorry but you have to take the gloves off to even get to the starting gate. Hank spent most of his energy complaining to the linesman there too. Apparently Yzerman had 9 fights anyway according to the poster above but I couldn't be bothered looking for any more. Man I wish we had kept Hansen and traded the Sedins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 4 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said: I can't see Trev NOT re-signing the Sedins. What would be his logic? They're too old and slow? They still put up 40-50 points a season. They're too expensive? Not if they re-signed for one year ($3m each). That's $8m free and clear next season. They can still provide leadership and offence, and with Elias and Jonathan possibly coming up next y year, the Canucks may want to have them here for on more year. Trev respects the Sedins too much to show them the door when they aren't ready to retire. On the other hand, seeing Boeser excel at the All Star game, and having Horvat as the future captain, it's easy to want to move on from the past and look to the future. I hope they give the C to Horvat next season. Horvat - C Henrik - A Daniel - A Del Zotto - A I wish people would stop quoting their points and ignoring their defence. Do you realise they have only scored an average of 19 points each in 5 on 5 play? Do you really think we couldn't better that for half their money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 18 minutes ago, Baggins said: That's all very nice but it was the smell of pot everywhere he and his wife didn't like. That's why I said he could get a job as a "sniffer dog" Lets face it the whole pot thing is as lame as a 3 legged horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 4 minutes ago, alfstonker said: I wish people would stop quoting their points and ignoring their defence. Do you realise they have only scored an average of 19 points each in 5 on 5 play? Do you really think we couldn't better that for half their money? This is true as well, they're both -14 and -15, and aren't great defensively. Maybe splitting them up is the way to go? I doubt that happens though, as the Sedins are a bit of a package. But looking at their line mates over the season: Virtanen -2 Boeser -4 Goldobin -8 Granlund -10 Vanek -16 They aren't really making anyone on their line better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Balboa Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 http://www.hockeyfights.com/ http://dropyourgloves.com/ Enjoy wasting several hours watching old fights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 Here is a really negative scenario, Canucks do nothing at the TDL because of cap uncertainty due to no Sedin deal, Benning not resigned and the Sedins' turn down the very small offer from the Canucks and go to a different team that offers a 3 year deal @ 6 mil. Then what? Benning's fault? He would be gone. Linden's? Hopefully management proceeds without worrying about the Sedin situation at the TDL if there is no solution by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 42 minutes ago, TheGuardian_ said: Here is a really negative scenario, Canucks do nothing at the TDL because of cap uncertainty due to no Sedin deal, Benning not resigned and the Sedins' turn down the very small offer from the Canucks and go to a different team that offers a 3 year deal @ 6 mil. Then what? Benning's fault? He would be gone. Linden's? Hopefully management proceeds without worrying about the Sedin situation at the TDL if there is no solution by then. That would be clearly Linden and the Sedins fault imo. If that's what floats the Sedin's boat, good luck to them - at least they wouldn't be on the team and that's all I care about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, alfstonker said: That would be clearly Linden and the Sedins fault imo. If that's what floats the Sedin's boat, good luck to them - at least they wouldn't be on the team and that's all I care about. Linden has already saddled the Sedins with the state of the team via that statement about it being unfair to rebuild while they are here and guaranteeing they could play here as long as they want to keep playing. IMO the Canucks have to resign them because none of the prospects are capable of replacing their point totals and have no NHL experience, Green certainly doesn't seem eager to play rookies, Boeser just doesn't let him sit him but Green stated something along the lines that he would have to sit out during the season when he sat him the first two games. That doesn't bode well for any new prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apollo Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 hour ago, TheGuardian_ said: Here is a really negative scenario, Canucks do nothing at the TDL because of cap uncertainty due to no Sedin deal, Benning not resigned and the Sedins' turn down the very small offer from the Canucks and go to a different team that offers a 3 year deal @ 6 mil. Then what? Benning's fault? He would be gone. Linden's? Hopefully management proceeds without worrying about the Sedin situation at the TDL if there is no solution by then. 3 years 6 mill AAV?! Or we talking 3 years 6 mill, 2AAV? If you think the Sedins make 6 million AAV you're on crack. Then again, Marleau got 6.25 AAV 3 years... so maybe it is possible. Sedins need to re-sign at league min so we can sign Tavares and win the cup next year. If they meant what they said in their interview, that's what they need to do. They said they want to win a cup here, and only here. Time to prove it and cement themselves as the greatest Canucks ever (not that they aren't already... but to further it) Aquaman can give them each 10 million each when they're retired in return for them signing for 750K AAV for 2018-2019 I could see Alfredsons reasons for not doing that with Ottawa, but Aquilini's have took incredibly good care of the Twins and there can't be anything but respect going both ways. Sign for league min and win a cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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