[Discussion] How to get Montreal's Unprotected 1st round Pick in 2023

[Guest]

Rumours were there that some teams were interested in JT Miller.  

 

JT Miller for Paul Byron and a 1st round pick unprotected could probably be done, but it would probably cost Benning his job. 

[4petesake]

It won’t be easy to recreate Pollock and his “Guy Lafleur Caper” with Bergevin being wise to us from the get-go. I think a scheme like this is going to require a “P” tape to be successful.

[Guest]

BTW what's happening with Drouin?  

 

Is he allowed to just leave and be put on LTIR?  

[NewbieCanuckFan]

1 hour ago, Warhippy said:

This is a simple discussion.

 

How do we get Montreal's 2023 1st round draft pick?

 

It would be a trade that needed to happen within the next 9 months.

 

My premise is that with price on the downswing, much of the Habs' roster older vets right now, no significant depth and Weber possibly done the Habs will slide.  More so with Covid ending and the league going back to traditional divisions.  I sincerely believe that the US east has almost no significant gaps and that the Sens will overtake Montreal within the next season or two.  The Devils are making serious gains.  CBJ may slide but Detroit will be the basement dweller for a time.

 

I am seriously being a degenerate gambler here but I am going to put myself on paper as stating the Habs will suffer over the next two seasons and I want to know what the forum thinks it will take to get that 2023 pick.

 

Numbers and contracts to be found here for homework purposes

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/canadiens

I'm halfway there myself being only a degenerate.

[Cromeslab]

Prices contract is starting to look stale,see how the Habs manage it

[Elias Pettersson]

Bergevin had his fun.  I think next year reality sets in.  Weber will be gone and that defence will be shaky.  Kotkaniemi isn't really what people thought he would be.  Caufield is tiny and it will be tough for him to get through a full regular season unscathed.  Price is getting older and is injury prone.  Toffoli will come back down to Earth and score at his 20 goal pace again.  They may lose Danault in free agency.

 

Montreal will have a hard time making the playoffs next year.  I think they should rebuild through the draft.  But Bergevin will want to save his job so he will probably make some trades to keep the team competitive.  He may look to trade some of his 2021 picks to do that.

[goalie13]

2 hours ago, Warhippy said:

This is a simple discussion.

 

How do we get Montreal's 2023 1st round draft pick?

Take Bergevin's lucky red suit as a hostage.

[Krinjer33]

What’s the possibility of taking back Weber with some money retained? 

That’s a hefty contract but if he is on LTIR does it really matter?

BC boy and might be open to coming home. 
Also, if he can still play he would make a great mentor for Bo and our young defenceman. He’s still an effective player if used in limited minutes. 

[Warhippy]

2 hours ago, qwijibo said:

Montreal’s depth is what carried them through the playoffs. They were able to roll 4 lines almost equally.  And their prospect pool was rated top 10 last year.  Not to mention their best offensive players are all 21 and under. I don’t think they’re in nearly as much trouble as you suggest. The fly in the ointment for them is they’re playing in the toughest division 

That depth is paper thin.  Much of those prospects are on the roster and while played heavy minutes down the stretch were able to do so in more support rolls.

 

Price was a large part of that reason and Weber that steadying hand on the tiller.  Weber is possibly done, Danault is possibly leaving, Price is not getting younger and will suffer either burn out or injury.

 

There is a serious potential to swoop in the same way Colorado did Ottawa and net the return and I sincerely think there is a large come down on the horizon for the Habs

[Warhippy]

1 minute ago, Krinjer33 said:

What’s the possibility of taking back Weber with some money retained? 

That’s a hefty contract but if he is on LTIR does it really matter?

BC boy and might be open to coming home. 
Also, if he can still play he would make a great mentor for Bo and our young defenceman. He’s still an effective player if used in limited minutes. 

Talk is he;s not coming back next season and there may be some serious LTIR implications because of it based on his contract due to his ankle/foot injuries.

[Krinjer33]

Just now, Warhippy said:

Talk is he;s not coming back next season and there may be some serious LTIR implications because of it based on his contract due to his ankle/foot injuries.

Yea I get there could be some cap recapture penalties? But this could be discussed in the trade negotiations that he would not be looking to retire. Providing that Montreal would allow Vancouver to discuss that with Weber’s agent. 

[BPA]

2 hours ago, VancouverHabitant said:

Rumours were there that some teams were interested in JT Miller.  

 

JT Miller for Paul Byron and a 1st round pick unprotected could probably be done, but it would probably cost Benning his job. 

Miller for 1st 2023 + 2nd 2021 + Romanov?

 

But it would be a step back for the Canucks as they'd lose a 1st line winger (top 6F).

[qwijibo]

5 minutes ago, BPA said:

Miller for 1st 2023 + 2nd 2021 + Romanov?

 

But it would be a step back for the Canucks as they'd lose a 1st line winger (top 6F).

Hahaha. Montral wouldn’t touch that. 

[Warhippy]

1 minute ago, qwijibo said:

Hahaha. Montral wouldn’t touch that. 

Hard to say that 1st and a + wouldn't be done.  Not sure Romanov is available though

 

Miller

 

Montreal 2021 2nd

2022 5th

2023 1st

 

Who knows, maybe that's the work around

[qwijibo]

1 minute ago, Warhippy said:

Hard to say that 1st and a + wouldn't be done.  Not sure Romanov is available though

 

Miller

 

Montreal 2021 2nd

2022 5th

2023 1st

 

Who knows, maybe that's the work around

Montreal’s biggest need is a top 4 PMD.  Their top 6 is pretty solid even with the loss of Danault.  Bergevin screwed up trading a young up and coming D for a top 6 winger.  He’s not going to do thst again. Romanov isn’t a puck mover but he looks to be a big part of their future D. Moving him creates a bigger joke than Miller fills up front 

[qwijibo]

31 minutes ago, Krinjer33 said:

Yea I get there could be some cap recapture penalties? But this could be discussed in the trade negotiations that he would not be looking to retire. Providing that Montreal would allow Vancouver to discuss that with Weber’s agent. 

At this point just about all the recapture is on Nashville.  1 more season and the small amount of recapture for Montreal disappears.  
 

Regardless. It makes no sense for Montreal to pay to take his contract when it will most likely have minimal effect on their cap space.  He’ll either be on LTIR or he retires 

[Krinjer33]

Schmidt + Roussell

for

4 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

At this point just about all the recapture is on Nashville.  1 more season and the small amount of recapture for Montreal disappears.  
 

Regardless. It makes no sense for Montreal to pay to take his contract when it will most likely have minimal effect on their cap space.  He’ll either be on LTIR or he retires 

Fair call, unless they were gaining something out of the trade also. 
Maybe so they can stay competitive?

Someone said the are looking for a PMD for their top 4. Maybe Schmidt fits that role. 
 

Schmidt + Roussell

for 

1st (2023) and Weber

 

I’m terrible at proposals so I’m probably way off in value. Haha. 

 

[qwijibo]

1 minute ago, Krinjer33 said:

Schmidt + Roussell

for

Fair call, unless they were gaining something out of the trade also. 
Maybe so they can stay competitive?

Someone said the are looking for a PMD for their top 4. Maybe Schmidt fits that role. 
 

Schmidt + Roussell

for 

1st (2023) and Weber

 

I’m terrible at proposals so I’m probably way off in value. Haha. 

 

Roussel has negative value. Schmidt is not remotely worth an unprotected 1st.  Weber is either a neutral or a positive asset (depending on if he returns to play after next season).  There’s nothing there that moves the needle for Montreal.  I honestly don’t see Bergevin moving the 1st at all.  The last several years he’s acquired more picks than he’s traded. He has 11 picks in this draft and all his picks next year.  He’s generally known for making 1-1 player trades or moving lower picks for players or bottom 6 players for picks. He’s never traded away his 1st in his 9 year tenure as GM 

[mll]

2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Bergevin had his fun.  I think next year reality sets in.  Weber will be gone and that defence will be shaky.  Kotkaniemi isn't really what people thought he would be.  Caufield is tiny and it will be tough for him to get through a full regular season unscathed.  Price is getting older and is injury prone.  Toffoli will come back down to Earth and score at his 20 goal pace again.  They may lose Danault in free agency.

 

Montreal will have a hard time making the playoffs next year.  I think they should rebuild through the draft.  But Bergevin will want to save his job so he will probably make some trades to keep the team competitive.  He may look to trade some of his 2021 picks to do that.

 

Bergevin has 1 year left and word is that he isn't looking for an extension.  Even at his presser he hinted at it when he said he will honour the final year of his contract.  Doesn't sound like someone looking to come back as GM.

 

Don't see Bergevin changing course.  He's set the structure for them to build through the draft.  All those years where they were under the cap and had plenty of picks with media calling for his head, he has refused to trade picks explaining that they had to draft and develop.  Even last off-season he didn't use up high picks but made hockey trades.

 

[Elias Pettersson]

1 minute ago, mll said:

 

Bergevin has 1 year left and word is that he isn't looking for an extension.  Even at his presser he hinted at it when he said he will honour the final year of his contract.  Doesn't sound like someone looking to come back as GM.

 

Don't see Bergevin changing course.  He's set the structure for them to build through the draft.  All those years where they were under the cap and had plenty of picks with media calling for his head, he has refused to trade picks explaining that they had to draft and develop.  Even last off-season he didn't use up high picks but made hockey trades.

 

I didn't realize Bergevin was on his last year.  If that is the case then most likely Montreal stands pat and keeps all their picks.  They don't re-sign Danault either.  Looks like they are going to start the rebuilding process as soon as next summer.  Too bad they didn't win the Cup.  I don't see them in another final for a long time.