[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks

[Timråfan]

39 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Good to see you're fighting the good fight!  I'm entering a busy time of year at work, so I can't help in the battle as much right now lol.

 

I'll just say, when people think the window for the Canucks is within the coming 2 to 7 years, and that Miller is likely gonna be productive for another 4 or 5 years, I don't understand the motive to move him.  I'll take a productive Miller for 4 to 5 years out of the next 2 to 7 window over gambling on the return for him.  If Miller produces at 1/2 his current pace 4 to 5 years from now, he's still a 50pt centre lmao.

Miller relies too much on players around him.

Petey is a much better player and Miller is in his way.

 

Miller could stay if he becomes a betamale, going for max 6 mill a year, instead looking for Peteys advice.

But I guess that won’t happen. 

[Fanuck]

50 minutes ago, JM_ said:

OK but is the problem Miller, or guys like Petan, Hunt, etc. 

What problem are you referring to?  No, I'm not being sarcastic - people have different views about what the issue is with this club. 

[Alflives]

30 minutes ago, JM_ said:

it would be. You just won't convince me that Miller is the problem with this lineup. 

 

We're still suffering from Benning's pro scouting mistakes, but lets not trade our best F and keep the crap. Lets move the crap first. 

Miller is a very good player, but he will be 30 when starting his next contract.  How long into that contract will Miller still be very good?

Can we compete with Petey and Bo as our top centers?  Who plays the 3C role?

Lots of questions.

I'm hoping a Miller trade returns a younger center who can fill that 3C role.

And a Garland trade returns a similar aged (to Garland) right shot D on a similar contract (to Garland) so a hockey trade.

Out: Miller and Garland

In:  Young 3C and RSD.

This might not result in a step back.  It might keep us where we are now but we will have a better future.  

[Gawdzukes]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

It's near to impossible to do a deep rebuild with Demko.  He'd need to be moved.  

I'm hoping we move Miller and Garland. 

That's what I would do. Concentrate on surrounding Petey, Hughes, and Demko with as much talent as possible. Put a definite long term plan into place as opposed to winging it yet again. Garland is good but I don't know that he's a fit in our top 6 moving forward. Size is also an issue. Trading both he and Miller resets our trajectory, gives us much needed cap flexibility, and necessary assets to grow with our core. I'm hoping his ask is astronomical so we're committed to moving him and doing this the right way.

[kloubek]

2 hours ago, JM_ said:

is that any different from 1/2 the teams in the league who rely on good goaltending? 

Most teams rely on good goaltending unless they are so offensively elite they blow the other teams out of the water consistently. 

 

I think what he's getting at is that we don't just expect Demko to be "good", but rather, for us to have a decent record he has to be literally "great" almost every game he plays. It's a lot of pressure to put on one player in an organization, and it's been this way for years. In my opinion, one of the very primary tasks this new management group has to figure out why our goalies face so many high quality scoring chances and to adjust the player or coach accordingly to help reduce that fact.

[aGENT]

8 hours ago, JM_ said:

I think we have a 4 year window with Demko, Miller, Bo (who we also need to convince to stay in 1 year), Petey, Hughes. Blow out as much of the rest as possible and bring in bigger bodies. (keeping Podz and Klim of course)

 

My main issue with the 2 year step back is, that also carries risk, some of it unknown and hard to quantify. Its easy to point at Miller, and criticize him at 34 sure. But what if Lundquist is a bust? Chytil is nothing more than Dickie? then we're into bustaroo land anyway.

 

Then we still have $9m in cap space...

 

8 hours ago, JM_ said:

If the team is really as badly constructed as some here say, then blow it up. Sell anyone not named Petey and Hughes, go full Arizona for 2-3 years and at least get a chance at several top 3 picks. 

The entire team isn't badly constructed. We have plenty of good pieces. Mostly just the right side D and the lack of size/grit. Beyond that, we also lack the organizational depth to cycle through as guys age, or price themselves out. But that's an "organization" not "team" construction issue.

 

Correcting those gets much harder when paying Miller $9m through his declining years. And sacrificing that needed organizational depth, to clear the cap required to keep Miller and try to contend the next few years is a non starter IMO. Management has basically already come out and said exactly that. And I don't see us contending without correcting them.

Edited April 11, 2022 by aGENT

[MeanSeanBean]

2 hours ago, JM_ said:

it would be. You just won't convince me that Miller is the problem with this lineup. 

 

We're still suffering from Benning's pro scouting mistakes, but lets not trade our best F and keep the crap. Lets move the crap first. 

He's not the problem in my eyes, but nor has he been the solution. He just played an entre season out of his mind, likely the best hockey of his career. Our team still is falling short of the playoffs. Yes, there has been many factors involved but we still fell short.

 

Imo this team simply isn't good enough and can't afford to make the changes we need paying a 30 year old Miller over 8 million a year.

[HKSR]

18 minutes ago, aGENT said:

 

Then we still have $9m in cap space...

 

The entire team isn't badly constructed. We have plenty of good pieces. Mostly just the right side D and the lack of size/grit. Beyond that, we also lack the organizational depth to cycle through as guys age, or price themselves out. But that's an "organization" not "team" construction issue.

 

Correcting those gets much harder when paying Miller $9m through his declining years. And sacrificing that needed organizational depth, to clear the cap required to keep Miller and try to contend the next few years is a non starter IMO. Management has basically spray come out and said it. And I don't see us contending without correcting them

But what are you gonna do with that $9M in cap space to improve?  It's either (1) Re-sign guys we currently have or (2) Sign UFAs --- 29 or 30 year old guys to 5+ year contracts? Uhhh... what?

[Nucker 67]

What the heck would VAN even be thinking re-signing a 30-year old to $8 for years? This would be great, if the rest of the team was ready to make a run, but they're not.  Demko might be, but you need more than that. 

 

It should be about building around Pettersson, Hughes and Demko. 

 

Miller is a fine player 90% of the time, but I'd rather use that $8 to bring in Top 4 RD (youngish). The best D and goaltender wins. Ask TOR and EDM.

[Gawdzukes]

33 minutes ago, HKSR said:

But what are you gonna do with that $9M in cap space to improve?  It's either (1) Re-sign guys we currently have or (2) Sign UFAs --- 29 or 30 year old guys to 5+ year contracts? Uhhh... what?

For real lol? How about re-signing some of the assets received in a Miller trade, a 3rd line center, some toughness/grit, some PK'ers, an elite player to play with Petey in 2-4 years time, a Pearson replacement for Bo, or a RD to fix our right defence?

 

Are you really going to argue/complain that $9M in cap space isn't useful in the NHL on any player besides J.T. Miller? Uhhh... what is right! 

[Nucker 67]

I think I might know what could happen  (it's another guess anyway)

 

Allvin said that this team doesn't have a superstar. Quite the statement, considering Pettersson, Hughes, Demko and Miller are on the team. But, Allvin is used to have Crosby and Malkin on his roster. JR and Allvin also said that they want the core to get younger, to develop together and have young players pushing for spots. Can't do that by giving Miller $50 million. 

 

I think Allvin will trade Miller at the Draft, to move into the Top 3, so they can draft their superstar. Of course they'll wait until the lottery to see where VAN lands, but I think they could be targeting a Top 3 pick. Would be nice to add Cooley or Nemec to the depth chart. 

 

[HKSR]

11 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

For real lol? How about re-signing some of the assets received in a Miller trade, a 3rd line center, some toughness/grit, some PK'ers, an elite player to play with Petey in 2-4 years time, a Pearson replacement for Bo, or a RD to fix our right defence?

 

Are you really going to argue/complain that $9M in cap space isn't useful in the NHL on any player besides J.T. Miller? Uhhh... what is right! 

So for $9m, the plan is to sign up:

- A 3rd line centre

- Some toughness and grit

- Some PKers

- An ELITE player in 2 to 4 years time

- A Pearson replacement

- RHD

 

That is some magical cap space manipulation to fit all that in lol

[Gawdzukes]

Just now, HKSR said:

So for $9m, the plan is to sign up:

- A 3rd line centre

- Some toughness and grit

- Some PKers

- An ELITE player in 2 to 4 years time

- A Pearson replacement

- RHD

 

That is some magical cap space manipulation to fit all that in lol

Reading comprehension man. You asked what we would possibly use $9m on. There are lots of things which could be addressed, which I listed. Obviously the $9 million doesn't cover it all which further shows the need for wise spending moving forward. Obviously, or so I thought lol.

[Timråfan]

1 hour ago, HKSR said:

But what are you gonna do with that $9M in cap space to improve?  It's either (1) Re-sign guys we currently have or (2) Sign UFAs --- 29 or 30 year old guys to 5+ year contracts? Uhhh... what?

To have when oppurtunity knocks.

The bit Benning was really bad at…

[HKSR]

Just now, Gawdzukes said:

Reading comprehension man. You asked what we would possibly use $9m on. There are lots of things which could be addressed, which I listed. Obviously the $9 million doesn't cover it all which further shows the need for wise spending moving forward. Obviously, or so I thought lol.

I'd still rather have a top 10 scoring centre on the team over all that 

[HKSR]

Just now, Timråfan said:

To have when oppurtunity knocks.

The bit Benning was really bad at…

Why not trade Boeser and others instead?  Keep what works and move what doesn't.  We made the mistake of moving on from guys like Tanev and Toffoli when we knew they worked well here and how did that turn out?

[Gawdzukes]

Just now, HKSR said:

I'd still rather have a top 10 scoring centre on the team over all that 

Sure, fair enough lol. I wasn't arguing that just pointing out what seems obvious to everyone else. $9m in cap space would definitely be very valuable to the team even if you can't see it.  I'm thankful we have hockey people in place that at least understand the implications of making those decisions.

[Timråfan]

7 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Why not trade Boeser and others instead?  Keep what works and move what doesn't.  We made the mistake of moving on from guys like Tanev and Toffoli when we knew they worked well here and how did that turn out?

Fine by me of Miller is cheap. 
As I said a few times now, without Hughes Millers numbers would be much lower

[EternalCanuckFan]

On 4/1/2022 at 5:40 PM, BigTramFan said:

Pretty sure the Rangers have made their move to upgrade their top 6 (trading for Copp). He cost them a lot less than a trade for Miller, is younger, and will likely resign for an affordable amount. All without trading any top level prospects or 1st round picks. Can't see them interested in Miller any more.

I agree that the Rangers probably have a bit less interest in Miller, but I think there could still be something there.  Copp has fit in well with the Rangers and he'll fit in well if they intend to re-sign Ryan Strome as their 2C.  It's possible they will want to try Copp at C but he has pretty much been a full-time winger at the NHL level for awhile now.

 

They could still be interested in Miller if they're not sold on Strome heading into next season or as a TDL rental.  Not sure what kind of return the Canucks could expect, but wouldn't consider the Rangers to be out of the picture for Miller.

[Fanuck]

24 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

I think Allvin will trade Miller at the Draft, to move into the Top 3, so they can draft their superstar. Of course they'll wait until the lottery to see where VAN lands, but I think they could be targeting a Top 3 pick. Would be nice to add Cooley or Nemec to the depth chart.

I wouldn't be completely opposed to this but I don't see it myself.  If you're expecting a top 3 pick in return you've limited your scope of teams that you're going to trade with, additionally you've got to ask yourself, of the bottom 10 teams in the league (or whatever it is that is eligible to win the drafty lottery and move into that draft position), who would want a player like Miller/why would said team not want their own pick and build around their own 'superstar'/ who could afford to re-sign a player like Miller/ would Miller even want to re-sign with a bottom-feeder team?  These unknowns make this scenario (trade for a top 3 pick) less likely in my view - not zero chance, but less likely than trading him to a contending team trying to 'get over the top'.